Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[...]]

Hi:

 

I have a question. Is there anyway you can do a dry, daily micro taper off 70 mg of Valium? I am doing fine with my K micro, but I don't know if this is possible with Valium. I also don't know if doing this will take me a decade. I want to drop by 5% every two weeks. Thank you.

Bets

 

Sure.  V is one of the better drugs to do that with as it has low potency and comes in 2mg pills.  The smaller the pill dose the better.  Although at higher doses you may not need 2mg pills.

 

If you are at 70mg and want to cut 5% every 14 days that is .25mg per day, which is 1/8th of a 2mg pill.  So you would be going through a 2mg pill every eight days.  I would think a 5mg or even a 10mg would be okay for a while until you get to a much lower dose.  With a 10mg pill you'd go through it in about 40 days...not too bad.  But hey, if you can get 2mg pills why not?  They are more accurate.

[[bu...]]

So if I dissolved 1  .5mg pill in 2mls vodka, added 98mls of water, to reduce by .0015mg per day, that would be a reduction of .3ml per day.  Oh my word, that just took me about 30 minutes to figure out, OUCH!!!  Is that right?

 

Thank you again for being patient with me 

 

Sorry, I modified that post to include this calculation.  Is this right?

 

Thank you (((again)))) 

 

Exactly. 

 

Thank you SG, I just ordered my supplies from Amazon. I know plastic isn't ideal, but I got a plastic 100ml cylinder to travel with, I'm so afraid of a glass one breaking. I did get 2 glass ones for home use (an extra in case one breaks, I would have a heart attack if that happened)  I really appreciate your help 

 

Plastic is fine.  Many Rx-grade benzo liquids are packaged, shipped, and stored in plastic containers.

 

There is some data indicating that IV liquid diazepam administered in PVC IV bags and tubing can degrade.  I know of no other negative data involving other benzo form or other plastics.

[[bu...]]

Hi:

 

I have a question. Is there anyway you can do a dry, daily micro taper off 70 mg of Valium? I am doing fine with my K micro, but I don't know if this is possible with Valium. I also don't know if doing this will take me a decade. I want to drop by 5% every two weeks. Thank you.

Bets

 

Sure.  V is one of the better drugs to do that with as it has low potency and comes in 2mg pills.  The smaller the pill dose the better.  Although at higher doses you may not need 2mg pills.

 

If you are at 70mg and want to cut 5% every 14 days that is .25mg per day, which is 1/8th of a 2mg pill.  So you would be going through a 2mg pill every eight days.  I would think a 5mg or even a 10mg would be okay for a while until you get to a much lower dose.  With a 10mg pill you'd go through it in about 40 days...not too bad.  But hey, if you can get 2mg pills why not?  They are more accurate.

 

Bets-

 

We have discussed this.  Yeah, at 70 mg, a dry taper, even a daily dry taper should work.  But what are you going to do whem you get down to 10-8-5mg, or even 2 mg?

 

You said your doc already agreed to write scrips for liquid V, why not take advangage of it?

[[en...]]

After reading some of these posts, I'm feeling rather dumb. I'm in the early stages of daily micro-tapering. Why do some use a large amount of water when diluting? I dissolve with 1 ml vodka and dilute with 13 ml water. I'm doing this over a 2 week span. I still take 1.25 mg in tablet form. It's the .125 mg I'm dissolving. I take mine at night. Sharlkey helped me with this. I'm hoping when I'm finished with this, then I'll do the next .125 mg and so on, until I get to around the .25 mg mark. I'm sure the lower I go the more I'll have to stretch it out.

 

Is there an amount I should switch completely to liquid? I was thinking I'd keep taking the tablets with the liquid titration and long as I have the tablets.

 

This is/was my plan. If I have to stretch the .125 mg to 3 weeks, I'd dissolve it with 1 ml of vodka and add 20 ml of water. If it takes 4 weeks, 1 ml of vodka and add 27 mg water. If longer, I'd adjust accordingly.

 

I started with removing 1 ml the first night. On day 13 I'll be removing 13 ml. If that makes sense. I'm not good with numbers so am trying to keep it as simple as possible.

 

I'm only on day 7, but have felt good. I assume in the next week or so I'll start having more withdrawal symptoms.

  The more dilute your solution is, the more precise your dose measurements will be.

 

It's pretty obvious that its easier to measure .1ml than it is to measure .01, or .001.

 

Thanks. Although it may be obvious for some, I'm still new to all of this and am still learning. I'm not a math whiz, nor a pharmacist, nor a doctor. I'm just a hick from the sticks, trying to figure all this micro-tapering business out. That's it.

[[Ra...]]

After reading some of these posts, I'm feeling rather dumb. I'm in the early stages of daily micro-tapering. Why do some use a large amount of water when diluting? I dissolve with 1 ml vodka and dilute with 13 ml water. I'm doing this over a 2 week span. I still take 1.25 mg in tablet form. It's the .125 mg I'm dissolving. I take mine at night. Sharlkey helped me with this. I'm hoping when I'm finished with this, then I'll do the next .125 mg and so on, until I get to around the .25 mg mark. I'm sure the lower I go the more I'll have to stretch it out.

 

Is there an amount I should switch completely to liquid? I was thinking I'd keep taking the tablets with the liquid titration and long as I have the tablets.

 

This is/was my plan. If I have to stretch the .125 mg to 3 weeks, I'd dissolve it with 1 ml of vodka and add 20 ml of water. If it takes 4 weeks, 1 ml of vodka and add 27 mg water. If longer, I'd adjust accordingly.

 

I started with removing 1 ml the first night. On day 13 I'll be removing 13 ml. If that makes sense. I'm not good with numbers so am trying to keep it as simple as possible.

 

I'm only on day 7, but have felt good. I assume in the next week or so I'll start having more withdrawal symptoms.

  The more dilute your solution is, the more precise your dose measurements will be.

 

It's pretty obvious that its easier to measure .1ml than it is to measure .01, or .001.

 

Thanks. Although it may be obvious for some, I'm still new to all of this and am still learning. I'm not a math whiz, nor a pharmacist, nor a doctor. I'm just a hick from the sticks, trying to figure all this micro-tapering business out. That's it.

 

I'm learning all this stuff too.  Some of this to those who have been doing it a while seems straight forward, but when you're in the thick of it, anxious and you aren't good at math, NOTHING is obvious, right? 

[[Ra...]]

So if I dissolved 1  .5mg pill in 2mls vodka, added 98mls of water, to reduce by .0015mg per day, that would be a reduction of .3ml per day.  Oh my word, that just took me about 30 minutes to figure out, OUCH!!!  Is that right?

 

Thank you again for being patient with me 

 

Sorry, I modified that post to include this calculation.  Is this right?

 

Thank you (((again)))) 

 

Exactly. 

 

Thank you SG, I just ordered my supplies from Amazon. I know plastic isn't ideal, but I got a plastic 100ml cylinder to travel with, I'm so afraid of a glass one breaking. I did get 2 glass ones for home use (an extra in case one breaks, I would have a heart attack if that happened)  I really appreciate your help 

 

Plastic is fine.  Many Rx-grade benzo liquids are packaged, shipped, and stored in plastic containers.

 

There is some data indicating that IV liquid diazepam administered in PVC IV bags and tubing can degrade.  I know of no other negative data involving other benzo form or other plastics.

 

Thank you Builder, I appreciate that 

[[en...]]

After reading some of these posts, I'm feeling rather dumb. I'm in the early stages of daily micro-tapering. Why do some use a large amount of water when diluting? I dissolve with 1 ml vodka and dilute with 13 ml water. I'm doing this over a 2 week span. I still take 1.25 mg in tablet form. It's the .125 mg I'm dissolving. I take mine at night. Sharlkey helped me with this. I'm hoping when I'm finished with this, then I'll do the next .125 mg and so on, until I get to around the .25 mg mark. I'm sure the lower I go the more I'll have to stretch it out.

 

Is there an amount I should switch completely to liquid? I was thinking I'd keep taking the tablets with the liquid titration and long as I have the tablets.

 

This is/was my plan. If I have to stretch the .125 mg to 3 weeks, I'd dissolve it with 1 ml of vodka and add 20 ml of water. If it takes 4 weeks, 1 ml of vodka and add 27 mg water. If longer, I'd adjust accordingly.

 

I started with removing 1 ml the first night. On day 13 I'll be removing 13 ml. If that makes sense. I'm not good with numbers so am trying to keep it as simple as possible.

 

I'm only on day 7, but have felt good. I assume in the next week or so I'll start having more withdrawal symptoms.

  The more dilute your solution is, the more precise your dose measurements will be.

 

It's pretty obvious that its easier to measure .1ml than it is to measure .01, or .001.

 

Thanks. Although it may be obvious for some, I'm still new to all of this and am still learning. I'm not a math whiz, nor a pharmacist, nor a doctor. I'm just a hick from the sticks, trying to figure all this micro-tapering business out. That's it.

 

I'm learning all this stuff too.  Some of this to those who have been doing it a while seems straight forward, but when you're in the thick of it, anxious and you aren't good at math, NOTHING is obvious, right? 

[[Sh...]]

Hey MT's!

 

It has been a bitter sweet Independence Day for me.  I am BENZO FREE Today!!!!  No mixing solutions or syringes.  No prescribed medication what so ever! 

 

I have been MIA because my grandfather passed away on Thursday.  He was 88 years old and lived a good life but was very sad for my family.  So I spent my Independence Day and my first day med free at the funeral home.  The bright side is I got to spend this day with so many family members that I would not have seen otherwise.  I'm keeping my head up and staying strong!  I'm not sure why Infinite Intelligence threw me this curve ball but I hope that is proves to you guys that we can quit this stuff under any circumstances.  I hope to write my benzo free celebration post in the next few days.

 

Happy 4th of July Everyone!

 

Stay strong!

sharkey

 

Sharkey, So sorry for your loss. You are an amazing person and I am sure I am not alone in saying you have  been an inspiration.  Take care and we will see back here soon for your benzo free celebration. Stay strong!  Shaani

[[Ra...]]

New question, sorry if this has been answered somewhere already:

 

When you dissolve your Xanax pill in the alcohol, does it dissolve completely and when added to water is then stable in the water or does it remain a suspension?  I dissolved a .5mg pill today in some Everclear (190 proof), I didn't mix it with water, but even in the alcohol it didn't seem evenly distributed.  When I stirred it, I could watch it settle, at least I thought I could.

 

Another question, if you were going to make up more than 1 day at a time, how many days could you reasonably make at a time?  I read somewhere not to store in the fridge, but should be protected from light.  Again this may seem elementary to those of you who are experienced at this, but if you were to make up say 2 days at a time, would you just use a large glass container or would you want to use an actual 200ml cylinder?

 

Goodness, the more I think about this, the more complicated it seems.

 

Is there a spreadsheet somewhere built to help us with any of this?

 

Thank you!

[[sh...]]

New question, sorry if this has been answered somewhere already:

 

When you dissolve your Xanax pill in the alcohol, does it dissolve completely and when added to water is then stable in the water or does it remain a suspension?  I dissolved a .5mg pill today in some Everclear (190 proof), I didn't mix it with water, but even in the alcohol it didn't seem evenly distributed.  When I stirred it, I could watch it settle, at least I thought I could.

 

Another question, if you were going to make up more than 1 day at a time, how many days could you reasonably make at a time?  I read somewhere not to store in the fridge, but should be protected from light.  Again this may seem elementary to those of you who are experienced at this, but if you were to make up say 2 days at a time, would you just use a large glass container or would you want to use an actual 200ml cylinder?

 

Goodness, the more I think about this, the more complicated it seems.

 

Is there a spreadsheet somewhere built to help us with any of this?

 

Thank you!

 

The alcohol dissolves the benzo and with ever clear you can be certain.  What you see is just fillers that they use to shape the pill.  You don't need to worry about the sediment.

 

I kept my solution at room temp for up to 5 days with no problems.

 

sharkey

 

[[Ra...]]

New question, sorry if this has been answered somewhere already:

 

When you dissolve your Xanax pill in the alcohol, does it dissolve completely and when added to water is then stable in the water or does it remain a suspension?  I dissolved a .5mg pill today in some Everclear (190 proof), I didn't mix it with water, but even in the alcohol it didn't seem evenly distributed.  When I stirred it, I could watch it settle, at least I thought I could.

 

Another question, if you were going to make up more than 1 day at a time, how many days could you reasonably make at a time?  I read somewhere not to store in the fridge, but should be protected from light.  Again this may seem elementary to those of you who are experienced at this, but if you were to make up say 2 days at a time, would you just use a large glass container or would you want to use an actual 200ml cylinder?

 

Goodness, the more I think about this, the more complicated it seems.

 

Is there a spreadsheet somewhere built to help us with any of this?

 

Thank you!

 

The alcohol dissolves the benzo and with ever clear you can be certain.  What you see is just fillers that they use to shape the pill.  You don't need to worry about the sediment.

 

I kept my solution at room temp for up to 5 days with no problems.

 

sharkey

 

Thank you Sharkey, there was a LOT of sediment, is that normal?  The pill is peach colored and there was a LOT of peach colored sediment, that why I wondered if it dissolved completely.

[[...]]

The alcohol dissolves the benzo and with ever clear you can be certain.  What you see is just fillers that they use to shape the pill.  You don't need to worry about the sediment.

 

I kept my solution at room temp for up to 5 days with no problems.

 

sharkey

 

Thank you Sharkey, there was a LOT of sediment, is that normal?  The pill is peach colored and there was a LOT of peach colored sediment, that why I wondered if it dissolved completely.

 

You didn't ask me, but I'll just jump in I don't think Sharkey would mind.

 

If the pill is breaking apart thoroughly that is normal and fine.  The benzo is only a very small portion of the total pill and as long as it gets exposed to the alcohol it will dissolve.

[[sh...]]

Hey Rabbit,

 

Yes the sediment is normal.  It got my nerves bad in the beginning too but don't sweat it.  Until you get use to it, stir the solution well to ease your mind.

 

Stay strong!

sharkey

[[do...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

Just wanted to let you know that I switched over from my ativan pills to liquid today.  So I will stay at my normal dose for 1 week so that my body goes through it's adjustment period.  Then I will start my taper next Sunday.

 

Thanks everyone for getting me started with all the info that I needed for this journey to benzo freedom.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

[[Mo...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

Just wanted to let you know that I switched over from my ativan pills to liquid today.  So I will stay at my normal dose for 1 week so that my body goes through it's adjustment period.  Then I will start my taper next Sunday.

 

Thanks everyone for getting me started with all the info that I needed for this journey to benzo freedom.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

 

Well done Doodle!

I'm hoping  it'll be a smoother ride  for you with this method, too.

[[...]]

I would like to learn more about microtapering.  I started liquid titration on Friday 7/3.  But I am using the same method I used when I was dry cutting and holding for two weeks.  I am on Temazepam.  I started at 15 mg. I slowly dry cut to 7.5mg.  On Friday I dropped to 6.25mg using liquid titration for the first time.  I was going to continue this way but now I am rethinking this.  If this will allow me to have some sort of life.  Can i get some help with this?  When should i start micro tapering?  Should I stay on my current dose for a week or two and then start microtapering?

[[an...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

Just wanted to let you know that I switched over from my ativan pills to liquid today.  So I will stay at my normal dose for 1 week so that my body goes through it's adjustment period.  Then I will start my taper next Sunday.

 

Thanks everyone for getting me started with all the info that I needed for this journey to benzo freedom.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

 

Doodle Dog,

 

Glad to hear you have started. Please keep us posted on how you are doing.

 

Anne

[[Mo...]]

I would like to learn more about microtapering.  I started liquid titration on Friday 7/3.  But I am using the same method I used when I was dry cutting and holding for two weeks.  I am on Temazepam.  I started at 15 mg. I slowly dry cut to 7.5mg.  On Friday I dropped to 6.25mg using liquid titration for the first time.  I was going to continue this way but now I am rethinking this.  If this will allow me to have some sort of life.  Can i get some help with this?  When should i start micro tapering?  Should I stay on my current dose for a week or two and then start microtapering?

 

Hi,

Yes, I think you'd stay on this dose for a bit and then start a micro taper which is the point of titration or you could just have cut and hold. Now that I'm saying that, I don't know in what size temazepam comes and if you started to titrate for easier cuts.. But I'm not sure about with which increments you'd taper temazepam.

If 0.25 is a large amount to drop or not. Do you happen to know the equivalent to other benzos?

 

[[Mo...]]

I would like to learn more about microtapering.  I started liquid titration on Friday 7/3.  But I am using the same method I used when I was dry cutting and holding for two weeks.  I am on Temazepam.  I started at 15 mg. I slowly dry cut to 7.5mg.  On Friday I dropped to 6.25mg using liquid titration for the first time.  I was going to continue this way but now I am rethinking this.  If this will allow me to have some sort of life.  Can i get some help with this?  When should i start micro tapering?  Should I stay on my current dose for a week or two and then start microtapering?

 

Hi,

Yes, I think you'd stay on this dose for a bit and then start a micro taper which is the point of titration or you could just have cut and hold. Now that I'm saying that, I don't know in what size temazepam comes and if you started to titrate for easier cuts.. But I'm not sure about with which increments you'd taper temazepam.

If 0.25 is a large amount to drop or not. Do you happen to know the equivalent to other benzos?

 

Alright, I looked it up in the Anatom manual just know and learned from a cross over schedule that 30 mgr temazepam equals 15 mgr of Valium.

With what increments have you dry cut to 7.5? Congrats on being half way!

 

I Waldo wanted to mention that for many , the liquid route with a daily taper has been a blessing. If you read back, Sharkey said somewhere that it's like comparing stairs with a ramp.

The result in the end is the same but the journey smoother for many. It was the best thing I could have done during my taper .

Welcome.

 

[[do...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

Just wanted to let you know that I switched over from my ativan pills to liquid today.  So I will stay at my normal dose for 1 week so that my body goes through it's adjustment period.  Then I will start my taper next Sunday.

 

Thanks everyone for getting me started with all the info that I needed for this journey to benzo freedom.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

 

Well done Doodle!

I'm hoping  it'll be a smoother ride  for you with this method, too.

 

Thanks so much Moodle & Anne.  I would not have made it this far without you.

 

I hope that you both are doing well with your tapers.

 

With gratitude

doodle dog

[[do...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

I have an after thought question:  Did any of you upon starting liquid have a strange sense of tiredness?  I am not feeling myself today.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

[[ga...]]

Ah, OK, thank you SG, I get it now.  Well for now I only dose twice per day.  I take 75mg of Seroquel IR at night and have been taking that since Dec 2013.  That was what seemed to stabilize me. 

 

Right now mornings are pretty tough although they have been the whole time.  My job is extremely stressful and it may be that just waking up and knowing I have to go to work brings on the bad feelings as when I wake up I feel OK, but shortly thereafter I start feeling anxious/depressed.  Then once I shower and start to drive to work it gets better.  I dose at 11:00am and 7:00pm. 

 

I've wondered if I have interdose w/d in the morning, but it does seem once I shower and get going I feel better.  I'm not inclined to complicate it further with more frequent dosing unless it becomes obvious that I have I/d w/d.  I would assume if that were the case, I would feel crappy right up until the time I take my 11:00am dose, right?

 

So if I dissolved 1  .5mg pill in 2mls vodka, added 98mls of water, to reduce by .0015mg per day, that would be a reduction of .3ml per day.  Oh my word, that just took me about 30 minutes to figure out, OUCH!!!  Is that right?

 

Thank you again for being patient with me 

 

Bun, This has always been how Seroquel made me feel. Just awful to get out of bed. Better as the morning went on.

[[Mo...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

I have an after thought question:  Did any of you upon starting liquid have a strange sense of tiredness?  I am not feeling myself today.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

 

When I switched to liquid I felt more sleepy at first. I think it has to do with the quicker absorption. It didn't last very long.

 

[[do...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

I have an after thought question:  Did any of you upon starting liquid have a strange sense of tiredness?  I am not feeling myself today.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

 

When I switched to liquid I felt more sleepy at first. I think it has to do with the quicker absorption. It didn't last very long.

 

Thanks Moo.  I kept replaying in my mind how I made the liquid solution with all kinds of wild imaginings.    Now I can chill. Gee, it has only been one dose.  I must practice patience and mindfulness.

 

With gratitude,

doodle dog

[[Ne...]]

New question, sorry if this has been answered somewhere already:

 

When you dissolve your Xanax pill in the alcohol, does it dissolve completely and when added to water is then stable in the water or does it remain a suspension?  I dissolved a .5mg pill today in some Everclear (190 proof), I didn't mix it with water, but even in the alcohol it didn't seem evenly distributed.  When I stirred it, I could watch it settle, at least I thought I could.

 

Another question, if you were going to make up more than 1 day at a time, how many days could you reasonably make at a time?  I read somewhere not to store in the fridge, but should be protected from light.  Again this may seem elementary to those of you who are experienced at this, but if you were to make up say 2 days at a time, would you just use a large glass container or would you want to use an actual 200ml cylinder?

 

Goodness, the more I think about this, the more complicated it seems.

 

I helped make someone's solutions through their valium taper as they couldn't manage it themselves.  I couldn't guarantee seeing them every day, so I would make up 4 or 5 days at a time and leave it with them.  It seemed to work well enough. 

 

You're right that it's more complicated than it first seems    because there were times when the math went wrong which meant it would affect 4 or 5 days worth of solutions and I would have to remake them when we spotted the mistake.