Example of a Valium/Diazepam Daily Reduction Method

[[Li...]]

Thanks, this is terrific!! It means a lot that you responded.

[[Bu...]]

Hi Diaz-Pam,

 

I am new to Benzo Buddies and unsure how to proceed on the final leg of my clonazepam titration.  I've been titrating off of .5mg pill since November 2014.  Cut pill into 1/2s, 1/4s, 1/8s then 1/16!  Probably been having tolerance withdrawals all along but, things got really bad a few weeks ago after holding at 1/16. Bouncing between 1/8 and 1/16 now, not sure whether to jump or try a liquid titration method.  I seem to be extremely sensitive to any little cut and am scared of going to 0.  Also thinking of a clinic that will titrate me off Clonazapam onto Valium then off Valium in 6 weeks or so...I wonder if that's too fast?  A local compounding pharmacy has liquid Valium but, no liquid Clonazapam and none of my doctors have any idea/experience titrating people off these horrible drugs.  I just recovered from severe adrenal fatigue (bedridden/weight loss/etc) and need a gentle as possible withdrawal off to not crash again. Allergic to dairy and can't do Vodka.  Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!!!!!  BurnedOut

[[bu...]]

Hi Diaz-Pam,

 

I am new to Benzo Buddies and unsure how to proceed on the final leg of my clonazepam titration.  I've been titrating off of .5mg pill since November 2014.  Cut pill into 1/2s, 1/4s, 1/8s then 1/16!  Probably been having tolerance withdrawals all along but, things got really bad a few weeks ago after holding at 1/16. Bouncing between 1/8 and 1/16 now, not sure whether to jump or try a liquid titration method.  I seem to be extremely sensitive to any little cut and am scared of going to 0.  Also thinking of a clinic that will titrate me off Clonazapam onto Valium then off Valium in 6 weeks or so...I wonder if that's too fast?  A local compounding pharmacy has liquid Valium but, no liquid Clonazapam and none of my doctors have any idea/experience titrating people off these horrible drugs.  I just recovered from severe adrenal fatigue (bedridden/weight loss/etc) and need a gentle as possible withdrawal off to not crash again. Allergic to dairy and can't do Vodka.  Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!!!!!  BurnedOut

 

Do you realize what a tiny amount of vodka you would be taking? 

 

If your at 1/16 of  .5mg tablet, your dose is .03125.  If you dissolve your .5mg tablet in 1ml vodka, and dilute that 99ml water, you would only be taking .0625ml of vodka , or .0256ml alcohol.  That's .005 (5/1000th) tsp of alcohol. 

 

You get far more alcohol in a glass of orange juice, or just using a mouthwash.

[[Di...]]

Ditto on what builder said. Vodka is definitely a viable option, even for someone who has issues with alcohol. The amount you are using is so tiny (less than half a teaspoon in most cases) it really shouldn't be a concern to you, and you really would get more alcohol in a glass of orange juice.

 

I don't have any experience tapering off clonazepam, but if you are finding it tough going perhaps switching to valium could help you. Regarding the 6 week schedule, that's really going to depend on what dose you are now at and how you react to tapering. Unless you are on a very low dose, I would honestly say a 6 week taper could be a bit ambitious.

 

Please don't fall into the trap of just wanting to get off benzo just for the sake of being off benzos. It's a drug that doesn't work that way. Usually the slower you do the taper, keeping in line with what you body will allow, the better off you will be.

[[...]]

Hi,

I would really appreciate some ideas on how I can begin my taper off of Valium 40 mg.  I have tablets and the oral diazpeam solution (5mg/5ml).  My doc recommended that I start out by cutting 1 mg at a time by using the diazepam oral solution and reducing by 0.1 ml every day or every other day.  I believe this works out to a 3 mg reduction in 30 days or 1.5 mg reduction over 30 days, respectively. 

 

Is there any benefit in diluting the oral diazepam solution with water to create a 1:1 solution and then removing  "x" ml's every day over my doc's suggestion of taking 0.1 ml less?  I am completely stumped at how to begin this taper based on my history. Thank you for any suggestions. 

 

[[Fr...]]

Sounds like you've got a good doc willing to work for you. It's late, my brains a little frazzled from doing homework all day. . . But I don't see why it'd make a difference 5mg/5ml is the same as 1mg/1ml, so I guess the only reason why you'd do that would be to make it easier to measure? In which case I don't see why it'd hurt. I don't know that it'd diffuse equally in water though, it could very well as it's already a prepared solution.

 

Also, if you don't mind me asking. . . what caused you to fail your Klonopin taper? seems like you were going slowly and you had made a lot of progress.

[[Di...]]

Hi,

I would really appreciate some ideas on how I can begin my taper off of Valium 40 mg.  I have tablets and the oral diazpeam solution (5mg/5ml).  My doc recommended that I start out by cutting 1 mg at a time by using the diazepam oral solution and reducing by 0.1 ml every day or every other day.  I believe this works out to a 3 mg reduction in 30 days or 1.5 mg reduction over 30 days, respectively. 

 

Is there any benefit in diluting the oral diazepam solution with water to create a 1:1 solution and then removing  "x" ml's every day over my doc's suggestion of taking 0.1 ml less?  I am completely stumped at how to begin this taper based on my history. Thank you for any suggestions. 

 

 

Yes if you reduce 0.1ml per day over 30 days that would be a reduction of 3ml (or 3mg) over 30 days (or 1.5mg if you do it on alternate days). The 3ml reduction would be roughly a 7% reduction over the month, so that's a pretty good middle of the road reduction amount.

 

Seeing as you are on a higher dose, and reducing a larger daily amount, it's probably not necessary to dilute the liquid because it should be fairly easy to measure 0.1ml with a 1ml syringe.

[[bu...]]

Hi,

I would really appreciate some ideas on how I can begin my taper off of Valium 40 mg.  I have tablets and the oral diazpeam solution (5mg/5ml).  My doc recommended that I start out by cutting 1 mg at a time by using the diazepam oral solution and reducing by 0.1 ml every day or every other day.  I believe this works out to a 3 mg reduction in 30 days or 1.5 mg reduction over 30 days, respectively. 

 

Is there any benefit in diluting the oral diazepam solution with water to create a 1:1 solution and then removing  "x" ml's every day over my doc's suggestion of taking 0.1 ml less?  I am completely stumped at how to begin this taper based on my history. Thank you for any suggestions.

  5mg=5ml is already the same as 1mg=1ml.

 

But there are major advangtages to diluting.  Dilution makes measuring small doses and increments much easier.  You will find that trying to consistently and accurately measuring .1ml isn't really very easy.  But if you dilute your liquid 9:1, you then have a solutiom where 1mg=10ml.  So now your .1mg is 1ml liquid.  Much easier to measure out 1ml than to measure .1ml. 

 

And the error factor is greatly reduced.  If your off by half a mark (easy to do) with full strength liquid (1mg=1ml), that's a 50% error.  But if your off half a mark with 1mg=1ml diluted liquid, that's only a 5% error.

[[...]]

Hi,

I would really appreciate some ideas on how I can begin my taper off of Valium 40 mg.  I have tablets and the oral diazpeam solution (5mg/5ml).  My doc recommended that I start out by cutting 1 mg at a time by using the diazepam oral solution and reducing by 0.1 ml every day or every other day.  I believe this works out to a 3 mg reduction in 30 days or 1.5 mg reduction over 30 days, respectively. 

 

Is there any benefit in diluting the oral diazepam solution with water to create a 1:1 solution and then removing  "x" ml's every day over my doc's suggestion of taking 0.1 ml less?  I am completely stumped at how to begin this taper based on my history. Thank you for any suggestions.

  5mg=5ml is already the same as 1mg=1ml.

 

But there are major advangtages to diluting.  Dilution makes measuring small doses and increments much easier.  You will find that trying to consistently and accurately measuring .1ml isn't really very easy.  But if you dilute your liquid 9:1, you then have a solutiom where 1mg=10ml.  So now your .1mg is 1ml liquid.  Much easier to measure out 1ml than to measure .1ml. 

 

And the error factor is greatly reduced.  If your off by half a mark (easy to do) with full strength liquid (1mg=1ml), that's a 50% error.  But if your off half a mark with 1mg=1ml diluted liquid, that's only a 5% error.

 

Hi Builder and Diaz-Pam.  Thank you so much for responding.  Diaz-Pam, thank you for the calculating the reduction over 30 days at 0.1 per day - 7%.  I agree this is a good middle of the road reduction for the beginning of my taper.

 

Builder, this was also my concern - inaccuracy of drawing up the undiluted solution.  When you say 9:1 - would an example be 10 ml's of the oral diazepam solution in 90 ml's of water, making a total of 100 ml's?  Each ml is therefore 0.1 mg?  Example:

Day #1:  0.9 ml's diluted solution

Day#2:  0.8 ml's  etc. until I have reduced a full mg?

 

Do you know how long the diluted solution is stable - if kept away from light?  Would it be better to make up the diluted solution in 50 mls so it does not sit around as long?

 

 

[[...]]

Sounds like you've got a good doc willing to work for you. It's late, my brains a little frazzled from doing homework all day. . . But I don't see why it'd make a difference 5mg/5ml is the same as 1mg/1ml, so I guess the only reason why you'd do that would be to make it easier to measure? In which case I don't see why it'd hurt. I don't know that it'd diffuse equally in water though, it could very well as it's already a prepared solution.

 

Also, if you don't mind me asking. . . what caused you to fail your Klonopin taper? seems like you were going slowly and you had made a lot of progress.

 

Hi Frotob,

Once I reinstated the Klonopin in 2012 after a ill-advised, quick taper, I rapidly developed tolerance.  The lower I got, the more interdose wd.  When I reached 0.5 mg, I got very ill and could not find a doctor to cross me to Valium.  Out of desperation and panic, I updosed and found a doctor who began my crossover.  It took me 5 long months to complete the crossover.  The first 6 weeks of the crossover were dreadful.  I believe this is because I had updosed, had not stabilized and had then begun the crossover - or it could have just been from adding the Valium.  At any rate, I learned something very important.  No matter how bad it gets, I can get through it.  I was incredibly sick the first 6 weeks of the crossover.  It got better and currently I am not dealing with interdose wd on the V. 

[[bu...]]

 

 

Hi Builder and Diaz-Pam.  Thank you so much for responding.  Diaz-Pam, thank you for the calculating the reduction over 30 days at 0.1 per day - 7%.  I agree this is a good middle of the road reduction for the beginning of my taper.

 

Builder, this was also my concern - inaccuracy of drawing up the undiluted solution.  When you say 9:1 - would an example be 10 ml's of the oral diazepam solution in 90 ml's of water, making a total of 100 ml's?  Each ml is therefore 0.1 mg?  Example:

Day #1:  0.9 ml's diluted solution

Day#2:  0.8 ml's  etc. until I have reduced a full mg?

 

Do you know how long the diluted solution is stable - if kept away from light?  Would it be better to make up the diluted solution in 50 mls so it does not sit around as long?

  Yes, 10ml liquid diluted with 90ml water will make 100ml of solution, with .1mg per ml.

 

I typically did a 9:1 ratio, and usually mixed enough to last 10-14 days.  Your dilute solution will remain stable.  Store it at room temp and  protect from light.  I stored mine on the kitchen counter under a Solo cup. 

 

Yes, your reduction procedure is correct.  Take the major part of the dose from  tablets, use the  liquid for the "cut" portion,, and lower the amount of liquid each day until you drop 1mg, then start over.

[[Cr...]]

I have mine in a brown bottle which is carried around in a brown plastic container with the syringe. It lasts 20 days without a problem. I have to travel a lot, so it needs to be portable.

[[...]]

 

 

Hi Builder and Diaz-Pam.  Thank you so much for responding.  Diaz-Pam, thank you for the calculating the reduction over 30 days at 0.1 per day - 7%.  I agree this is a good middle of the road reduction for the beginning of my taper.

 

Builder, this was also my concern - inaccuracy of drawing up the undiluted solution.  When you say 9:1 - would an example be 10 ml's of the oral diazepam solution in 90 ml's of water, making a total of 100 ml's?  Each ml is therefore 0.1 mg?  Example:

Day #1:  0.9 ml's diluted solution

Day#2:  0.8 ml's  etc. until I have reduced a full mg?

 

Do you know how long the diluted solution is stable - if kept away from light?  Would it be better to make up the diluted solution in 50 mls so it does not sit around as long?

  Yes, 10ml liquid diluted with 90ml water will make 100ml of solution, with .1mg per ml.

 

I typically did a 9:1 ratio, and usually mixed enough to last 10-14 days.  Your dilute solution will remain stable.  Store it at room temp and  protect from light.  I stored mine on the kitchen counter under a Solo cup. 

 

Yes, your reduction procedure is correct.  Take the major part of the dose from  tablets, use the  liquid for the "cut" portion,, and lower the amount of liquid each day until you drop 1mg, then start over.

 

Builder, I want to thank you so much for your help. I sincerely appreciate it. 

[[...]]

I have mine in a brown bottle which is carried around in a brown plastic container with the syringe. It lasts 20 days without a problem. I have to travel a lot, so it needs to be portable.

 

Great idea when traveling!  I have a ton of the 4oz amber bottles with the "Accu-Dose" stoppers that work perfectly with a syringe - no spilling if the bottle gets accidentally tipped over. 

[[bu...]]

 

 

Hi Builder and Diaz-Pam.  Thank you so much for responding.  Diaz-Pam, thank you for the calculating the reduction over 30 days at 0.1 per day - 7%.  I agree this is a good middle of the road reduction for the beginning of my taper.

 

Builder, this was also my concern - inaccuracy of drawing up the undiluted solution.  When you say 9:1 - would an example be 10 ml's of the oral diazepam solution in 90 ml's of water, making a total of 100 ml's?  Each ml is therefore 0.1 mg?  Example:

Day #1:  0.9 ml's diluted solution

Day#2:  0.8 ml's  etc. until I have reduced a full mg?

 

Do you know how long the diluted solution is stable - if kept away from light?  Would it be better to make up the diluted solution in 50 mls so it does not sit around as long?

  Yes, 10ml liquid diluted with 90ml water will make 100ml of solution, with .1mg per ml.

 

I typically did a 9:1 ratio, and usually mixed enough to last 10-14 days.  Your dilute solution will remain stable.  Store it at room temp and  protect from light.  I stored mine on the kitchen counter under a Solo cup. 

 

Yes, your reduction procedure is correct.  Take the major part of the dose from  tablets, use the  liquid for the "cut" portion,, and lower the amount of liquid each day until you drop 1mg, then start over.

 

Builder, I want to thank you so much for your help. I sincerely appreciate it. 

 

:)

[[me...]]

do you guys still get daily brain fog from this micro dosing? I am just doing .02 V

[[Cr...]]

Nope, I'm virtually 100%!

 

Just go slow.

[[me...]]

Did you start out with the brain fog and then it went away eventually?

[[Cr...]]

I had it until i stopped the cut and hold method. Once i went to the daily taper, i was fine. 

[[me...]]

Wonder why I am having problems. I switched over to milk taper and held for 10 days before reducing. Reducing at only .02ml daily

[[Cr...]]

I'm reducing .01 ml per day, which is about .001 mg. Try slowing it down a bit.

[[...]]

Thanks Diaz Pam, for the help.  im on 3mg now and planning to taper using liquid diazepam 2mg/5mg.  what i understand is i need to reduce everyday my dose.  As the example there is if i need to reduce 1mg in 15 days.

 

1mg am--------2mg evening = if this formula is wrong can you or anyone can correct me coz Im confused at the moment, havent tried this method yet.

 

1st day==2.5ml D mix with 97.5ml of water= 100ml solution===i need to take out 6.5ml and drink-----follow on the evening dose 2mg tablet.

2nd day==2.5ml D mix with 97.5 water=100ml solution--take out 13ml and drink---follow on evening dose 2mg

 

do I need to take out solution 6.5ml less and less everyday?  NEED HELP!!!!! THAT IS WHAT I UNDERSTAND.

 

 

Reduce 100ml by 6.5ml per day = 15 days to reduce 1mg

 

THANKS MCM

[[...]]

  3mg diazepam a day===1mg am-----2mg evening

 

I think I understand now. I will using 2mg/5ml Lquid diazepam.

 

1mg D=2.5ml LDiaz====2.5ml mix with 97.5ml water=100ml solution

 

My BIG PLAN NOW IS TO START BYreduction of 1mg every 25 days.

 

1st day--drink 100ml solution-----plus evening dose in tablet

2nd day--drink 96ml --plus

3rd day--drink  96ml--plus

4th day--drink  92ml---plus

5th day--drink  88ml  ---carry on the evening dose

carry on the reduction everyday till next cut.

 

PLEASE REACT OR CORRECT ME PLEASE!!

 

thanks MCM   

             

[[Di...]]

Yes you've got the hang of it. However, if you are on 3mg per day, I would suggest not going over a 1.5ml per day cut initially (which is 0.015mg). That will take 66 days to reduce 1mg. Maybe you could try 2ml per day, but I really don't think I'd like to be cutting more than that. When I was on 5mg I was only cutting between 2ml and 2.5ml per day.

 

You can always increase it as you go if you feel you can, but you really don't want to get too ambitious to start with because then you might only have to end up holding anyway.

[[...]]

Thanks a lot Diaz Pam,  i woud try that and keep you updated. for now i need to stabilise where I am and start the micro taper soon.

 

thanks.mcm