Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[ho...]]

hey guys,

 

i'm at 15mg a day. i've been here a little over a month, down from 17.5 (for about 2 weeks), which was down from 20mg for about 2 years. i've stabilized. i have about 80 10mg tablets right now and i don't think i will be able to get more this time. i have never had a prescription. i have an appointment with my primary doc next week, where i am planning to come clean and hope she will be willing to help me taper. i have a counselor who specializes in benzo withdrawal on my side.

 

i'm wondering if anyone has advice on what to say to my doctor? i plan to bring in parts of the ashton manual and definitely bring up my counselor, but beyond that, i'm really not sure. this will be my third time seeing this doctor, so we don't have a super strong relationship. she knows i quit drinking almost 2 years ago and she knows i tapered myself off lexapro over 3 months this spring.

 

so... yeah. what do i say, and what are my chances?

 

p.s. cutting to 12.5 immediately, preparing for the worst.

 

Hi.  Welcome to our group.

 

You are in the right place.  I hope your doctor is willing to work with you and Pamster has given you a great link.  If for some reason your doctor isn’t, there are options. 

 

Your cut you are planning to do is very large at over 28% and it is recommended to do 5 to 10% cuts every 2 weeks if tolerated in the community.  I just wanted to share that with you.  You don’t want to find yourself in trouble and discouraged from getting off of the benzo’s. 

 

Marie

[[ho...]]

Hi there tapering warriors,  I'm on Diazapam and I'm currently tapering to 6.0.  I plan to taper .5 every two weeks.  Some folks on the facebook forum say that this is way too fast.  But Heather Ashton recommends tapering 1 mg every 2-4 weeks.  I feel like I'm tapering at a slow rate.  I've been tapering for 15 months and I don't want to spend another year tapering 6 mg of Diaz.

 

Hi-

 

Well I think you might find yourself in trouble.  Just my two cents.  I know the temptation of just wanting to be done with this process. I so get it. I am at 5.30 and I feel like it is going to be forever….but I am already symptomatic and I can’t even do 10% a month.  You are having Anxiety, and pain now….I would imagine with those cuts, it will get pretty brutal once you get to the lower mg’s.

 

Example:4 to 3.5mg 12.5%, 3.5 to 3 14.29%, 3 to 2.5 16.67%….gets worse.

 

I know for me the first 10 Mg were hard and I was doing the cut and hold method every 2 weeks and that about did me in.  Now like I said, I can’t even seem to do 10% and I am micro tapering.  As bad as I want to get off, I couldn’t imagine bumping up my %.

 

I guess you can try and see how it works.  If you get into trouble, you can hold and stabilize and then continue 

 

Marie 

           

[[ho...]]

Hi Joeb and Tall Girl -  I went back and read your post.  I’m glad you were here for each other  

 

This board seems a bit slow and that is sad.  I am guilty too for not being on like I once was.  Sorry  .  Sometimes I just don’t feel like participating.  That is one of my struggles.  I also have the pain and severe muscle aches and bone pain.  I can take Motrin or Tylenol, but I try to not take it daily to spare my kidneys and liver.  I also get pain meds prescribed once in a while for a break, just to give me a few days of rest.  It does help. 

 

We stayed home for TG, I wasn’t feeling well, my son got sick too, so it all worked out.  My daughter came over and we all had Chinese Food. My oldest and his wife went to his father’s.  Crazy times.  I am use to the big TG’s, so it was really strange. 

 

Joeb- You mention you are retired, so that takes some pressure off.  I am retired too, but have one teenager left at home.  He is pretty self sufficient thankfully and very understanding.  It is good that you are trying to keep yourself busy.  I hope you can.  I “try”.  I haven’t been very successful the last few weeks.  I have been in a funk.

 

Tall Girl- I am so impressed that you painted and you are getting out and about!  I am really trying to work on getting out more again.  I had to slow down my wean….it was too much and I am trying to get in a better place with that. 

 

Where are the other BB’s?

 

Check back later

 

Marie.

[[ca...]]

hey guys,

 

i'm at 15mg a day. i've been here a little over a month, down from 17.5 (for about 2 weeks), which was down from 20mg for about 2 years. i've stabilized. i have about 80 10mg tablets right now and i don't think i will be able to get more this time. i have never had a prescription. i have an appointment with my primary doc next week, where i am planning to come clean and hope she will be willing to help me taper. i have a counselor who specializes in benzo withdrawal on my side.

 

i'm wondering if anyone has advice on what to say to my doctor? i plan to bring in parts of the ashton manual and definitely bring up my counselor, but beyond that, i'm really not sure. this will be my third time seeing this doctor, so we don't have a super strong relationship. she knows i quit drinking almost 2 years ago and she knows i tapered myself off lexapro over 3 months this spring.

 

so... yeah. what do i say, and what are my chances?

 

p.s. cutting to 12.5 immediately, preparing for the worst.

 

Hi.  Welcome to our group.

 

You are in the right place.  I hope your doctor is willing to work with you and Pamster has given you a great link.  If for some reason your doctor isn’t, there are options. 

 

Your cut you are planning to do is very large at over 28% and it is recommended to do 5 to 10% cuts every 2 weeks if tolerated in the community.  I just wanted to share that with you.  You don’t want to find yourself in trouble and discouraged from getting off of the benzo’s. 

 

Marie

 

hi marie,

 

i appreciate your reply and pamster's reply as well. i'm wondering where you got 28%? i'm at 15mg now, so going down to 12.5mg would be 17% cut, right? admittedly this is still higher than i'd like, but with uncertainty regarding supply, i can't afford to do a method that involves "tossing" any of the drug (shaving pills, DLMT), and in my mind it seems good to try to get lower while i can. today is my first day at 12.5. i'm expecting s/x in about a week, as this has been the case with my last two cuts. i'll update my signature as well to make it clearer.

 

you mention other options... what are my other options?

[[...]]

Hi Joeb and Tall Girl -  I went back and read your post.  I’m glad you were here for each other  

 

This board seems a bit slow and that is sad.  I am guilty too for not being on like I once was.  Sorry  .  Sometimes I just don’t feel like participating.  That is one of my struggles.  I also have the pain and severe muscle aches and bone pain.  I can take Motrin or Tylenol, but I try to not take it daily to spare my kidneys and liver.  I also get pain meds prescribed once in a while for a break, just to give me a few days of rest.  It does help. 

 

We stayed home for TG, I wasn’t feeling well, my son got sick too, so it all worked out.  My daughter came over and we all had Chinese Food. My oldest and his wife went to his father’s.  Crazy times.  I am use to the big TG’s, so it was really strange. 

 

Joeb- You mention you are retired, so that takes some pressure off.  I am retired too, but have one teenager left at home.  He is pretty self sufficient thankfully and very understanding.  It is good that you are trying to keep yourself busy.  I hope you can.  I “try”.  I haven’t been very successful the last few weeks.  I have been in a funk.

 

Tall Girl- I am so impressed that you painted and you are getting out and about!  I am really trying to work on getting out more again.  I had to slow down my wean….it was too much and I am trying to get in a better place with that. 

 

Where are the other BB’s?

 

Check back later

 

Marie.

Hi Marie, so glad you checked in on our posts. I’ve been in a funk too so I thought I try to get more comms going on this site and support each other to the end goal. There’s so much we can share to help each other. I was reading the old posts on this site and there is so much useful information and moral support. Tall Girl is a great motivator too.

I’m getting ready to make another .25 cut from my night dose to see how it goes and even out my doses before starting liquid. This cut went fairly well but I still have the sedated lack of motivation and slight depression. I’m nervous about cutting but know I have to do it. Hope to hear from you soon Marie, we can do this all of us together

Joeb

[[Ca...]]

Hey all!

 

Joeb invited me over, so I thought I’d join in to offer support!  I’m at the “end” of my taper, and I use the term “end” loosely because it literally feels like it’s going to take forever to get this last mg out. I make a .005 mg dose reduction and I feel it!  So taking things verrrrryyy slowly right now and avoiding another crash like I had last year. I’m honestly not keeping track of the percentage I’m clearing each month or the pace I’m on, I’m completely letting my body lead. I figure I’ll get to zero when in get there. In the meantime I’ve been stable enough to restart my career (albeit working from home but it’s a huge step for me). My nervous system is so easily dysregulated… I’ve had periods where I felt it had improved so much and lately the last couple weeks have been rough again. Anyways, I’m here and would love to be of support. Reading y’all’s experiences is helpful for me too. This experience can be isolating, and while I know I’m not the only one going through this, it helps to connect with others too. I do however feel like I’m the only one needing to go THIS slow 

[[Cb...]]

I have been doing a hybrid liquid and tablet valium taper and cut to 8.5mg a day 6 days ago and hit a wall today where I can not stop the anxiety. I have been cutting .5mg every two weeks from my 12.5mg a day dose I was on. Been feeling pretty good for the most part on the taper but today was intense and had to go home from work because I was so restless with anxiety. I got really bad headache if you can call it that felt like ice pick in my skull. I must have tapered to fast and it hit me out of the blue. I ended up updosing to 12.5mg for one day and had some relief and yesterday I stayed home from work and I took 10mg and finally got some sleep and feel more clear headed.  any thoughts on what I should do? should I updose some for awhile and stabilize and what dose should I go to? 9-10mg I didn't think I was tapering to fast because had mild symptoms and was following a lot of what I learned on BB but two days ago was unbearable. Kinda seems the good thing and bad with valium is the long half life because of the delayed reaction to cuts and by the time you realize you went to fast its to late to slow down.

 

I am thinking I need to slow down to .25mg every two weeks for awhile. I don't care how long it takes me as long as I make progress and have minimal symptoms so I can work because I own two businesses and so many people depend on me. Do more people have success with a daily micro taper or dropping every 2-4 weeks? I was told on BB by some posters with valium doing a daily taper is harder because its hard to tell when to slow down because of the stacking of the cuts takes awhile to hit you but doing a cut every two weeks literally hit be from nowhere. I went from one day fine to next day just feeling like I was going to die.

 

any feedback would be apppreciated.

[[ho...]]

I have been doing a hybrid liquid and tablet valium taper and cut to 8.5mg a day 6 days ago and hit a wall today where I can not stop the anxiety. I have been cutting .5mg every two weeks from my 12.5mg a day dose I was on. Been feeling pretty good for the most part on the taper but today was intense and had to go home from work because I was so restless with anxiety. I got really bad headache if you can call it that felt like ice pick in my skull. I must have tapered to fast and it hit me out of the blue. I ended up updosing to 12.5mg for one day and had some relief and yesterday I stayed home from work and I took 10mg and finally got some sleep and feel more clear headed.  any thoughts on what I should do? should I updose some for awhile and stabilize and what dose should I go to? 9-10mg I didn't think I was tapering to fast because had mild symptoms and was following a lot of what I learned on BB but two days ago was unbearable. Kinda seems the good thing and bad with valium is the long half life because of the delayed reaction to cuts and by the time you realize you went to fast its to late to slow down.

 

I am thinking I need to slow down to .25mg every two weeks for awhile. I don't care how long it takes me as long as I make progress and have minimal symptoms so I can work because I own two businesses and so many people depend on me. Do more people have success with a daily micro taper or dropping every 2-4 weeks? I was told on BB by some posters with valium doing a daily taper is harder because its hard to tell when to slow down because of the stacking of the cuts takes awhile to hit you but doing a cut every two weeks literally hit be from nowhere. I went from one day fine to next day just feeling like I was going to die.

 

any feedback would be apppreciated.

 

HI- I wanted to get to you first. ( hi everyone else… .  I personally would not updose.  You have made such great progress and I know it’s tough and feels awful right now.  I went too fast too and ended up crashing at 10 mg, and had to hold for a month.  So that is what I would suggest.  Just try and hold until you stabilize.  I felt so much better by the third week and by the fourth week, I felt really good (well as good as one can while weaning).  I remember standing in the shower and I had absolutely no symptoms, and the women I thought I had lost was in there….it was the most amazing feeling. 

 

Obviously this is a personal decision and one you must make.  Others hopefully will chime in and give their personal experience and wisdom too.  I hope you can find the best choice for yourself.  We are here for you

 

Marie

[[ho...]]

hey guys,

 

i'm at 15mg a day. i've been here a little over a month, down from 17.5 (for about 2 weeks), which was down from 20mg for about 2 years. i've stabilized. i have about 80 10mg tablets right now and i don't think i will be able to get more this time. i have never had a prescription. i have an appointment with my primary doc next week, where i am planning to come clean and hope she will be willing to help me taper. i have a counselor who specializes in benzo withdrawal on my side.

 

i'm wondering if anyone has advice on what to say to my doctor? i plan to bring in parts of the ashton manual and definitely bring up my counselor, but beyond that, i'm really not sure. this will be my third time seeing this doctor, so we don't have a super strong relationship. she knows i quit drinking almost 2 years ago and she knows i tapered myself off lexapro over 3 months this spring.

 

so... yeah. what do i say, and what are my chances?

 

p.s. cutting to 12.5 immediately, preparing for the worst.

 

Hi.  Welcome to our group.

 

You are in the right place.  I hope your doctor is willing to work with you and Pamster has given you a great link.  If for some reason your doctor isn’t, there are options. 

 

Your cut you are planning to do is very large at over 28% and it is recommended to do 5 to 10% cuts every 2 weeks if tolerated in the community.  I just wanted to share that with you.  You don’t want to find yourself in trouble and discouraged from getting off of the benzo’s. 

 

Marie

 

hi marie,

 

i appreciate your reply and pamster's reply as well. i'm wondering where you got 28%? i'm at 15mg now, so going down to 12.5mg would be 17% cut, right? admittedly this is still higher than i'd like, but with uncertainty regarding supply, i can't afford to do a method that involves "tossing" any of the drug (shaving pills, DLMT), and in my mind it seems good to try to get lower while i can. today is my first day at 12.5. i'm expecting s/x in about a week, as this has been the case with my last two cuts. i'll update my signature as well to make it clearer.

 

you mention other options... what are my other options?

 

Hi..OMG…Yes…You are right.  I put the wrong figure in.  Sorry :tickedoff:  My calculation came back at 16.67%  Still kind of a high cut, but if you can handle it, try it.  Just understand that the symptoms can start to come on later and kind of like a snowball effect after a while and then thats when the trouble can happen.  However, not everyone ends up in trouble.  So I don’t want to scare you.  Some people don’t seem to have as much trouble as other’s coming off of benzo’s. 

 

As far as “options”, there are other doctor’s, nurse practitioners, psychiatrist, pain management clinic’s, and some of the psychiatrist are even online in benzo weaning (not sure if your insurance will cover it, or even if they take Insurance) and you have enough pill’s and time to call around too.  It’s important to find someone who will work with you on a “symptom based” taper and not try and rush you off.  Hoping your doctor is super compassionate and will be open and work with you 

 

Marie

[[ho...]]

Hi Joeb-

I am so glad you are trying to keep this board active and going as we all need the support and this is such a great group.  Hopefully it will get active again.  There really is so much useful information on here and the moral support is wonderful.  It has saved me at times.  Just a place to be when there seems now where else to go, where now one else really understands.

 

You mentioned you have your liquid yet haven’t started it yet. Do you have a plan?  You also just mentioned another cut coming up….I know the dread of cutting.  Have you thought about micro tapering?  I do a micro taper with pills and liquid and it has been much better than the dry cutting was.  I still have sx, and still have the “funk” and my issues, but nothing like when I was dry cutting.  Just a suggestion.  And maybe you have already tried it.

 

Candice JN- Welcome over here…..Congratulations on your progress and you are almost to the finish line, how exciting!  As far as feeling “it”, I can relate.  I recently had my RX changed (well like 13 days ago, and about a few days in, something was off) and they changed my generic brand.  Anyway, my doctor (Benzo specialist) said the FDA only requires that medications are with in 10-15% of the product.  Well for us, that is MAJOR and can really cause a problem. So anyway, it is suppose to be fixed today.  My pharmacy is suppose to be able to get the brand I was on back in today, and it filled today, and it’s noted on my script to use that brand only.  Hopefully the pharmacy can continue to get it. 

 

How exciting that you are back at work and your life is moving forward.  That is so encouraging !  I think I need to slow down more…..I’m not functioning like I should be ( I did just recently slow it down, and was waiting for the results, but this medicine change put a wrench in it) and I know it’s about “symptom based”, not the calendar and just getting off.  Although if being honest, I still have those thoughts that creep in my head from time to time, that I just want this to be done   I was suppose to be off last Spring   Anyways, thank you for your positive “share” over here   I hope your anxiety will settle down, and you will find the nice calm window’s open wide 

 

Marie

[[ho...]]

Oh…it’s me again….I didn’t really share about me.  I’m at 5.35 right now.  Today is a little better, somewhat of a window.  Yesterday I was able to get up and about some more, so that was encouraging.  I am actually going to go and pick my daughter up and take her back to her house why her car is looked at in about and hour, so that will get me out of the hours too.    I am only sleeping about 5 hours a night and that is discouraging.  I was sleeping about 6 hours for a while……I am also getting the adrenal surges, and I wasn’t getting those either.  I think it’s because I am not eating right.  I don’t know.  When I get back, I am going to walk the dog’s around the block and then rest

 

Marie

[[...]]

Hey all!

 

Joeb invited me over, so I thought I’d join in to offer support!  I’m at the “end” of my taper, and I use the term “end” loosely because it literally feels like it’s going to take forever to get this last mg out. I make a .005 mg dose reduction and I feel it!  So taking things verrrrryyy slowly right now and avoiding another crash like I had last year. I’m honestly not keeping track of the percentage I’m clearing each month or the pace I’m on, I’m completely letting my body lead. I figure I’ll get to zero when in get there. In the meantime I’ve been stable enough to restart my career (albeit working from home but it’s a huge step for me). My nervous system is so easily dysregulated… I’ve had periods where I felt it had improved so much and lately the last couple weeks have been rough again. Anyways, I’m here and would love to be of support. Reading y’all’s experiences is helpful for me too. This experience can be isolating, and while I know I’m not the only one going through this, it helps to connect with others too. I do however feel like I’m the only one needing to go THIS slow 

Hi Candace I am so glad you decided to join us. I think I have the same nervous system based on my Ativan experience. I didn’t pay enough attention on bb so I was in constant acute wd and suffered a lot. You are being smart about it. My problem is stability doesn’t get me to where I feel good, I still am lethargic and unmotivated so I have to push myself. Still haven’t tried liquid but will have to soon since cutting Valium pills is hard and finding an accurate scale is hard too. I’m due for another .25 cut this week nervous but hopeful it will go well. Let’s keep this going, and maybe more will join

Joeb

[[...]]

Hi Joeb-

I am so glad you are trying to keep this board active and going as we all need the support and this is such a great group.  Hopefully it will get active again.  There really is so much useful information on here and the moral support is wonderful.  It has saved me at times.  Just a place to be when there seems now where else to go, where now one else really understands.

 

You mentioned you have your liquid yet haven’t started it yet. Do you have a plan?  You also just mentioned another cut coming up….I know the dread of cutting.  Have you thought about micro tapering?  I do a micro taper with pills and liquid and it has been much better than the dry cutting was.  I still have sx, and still have the “funk” and my issues, but nothing like when I was dry cutting.  Just a suggestion.  And maybe you have already tried it.

 

Marie

Hi Marie

Feeling a little better today, nervous about cutting tomorrow. I’ve had the liquid over a month now but for silly psychological reasons wanted to get to 3 mg before starting it because I know I’ll have to hold for a while to make sure I can adjust so wanted to try to make some progress first. I hope it doesn’t come to bite me. My first cut .25 2 weeks ago went well, I’m just concerned with the V half life delay. Wondering if 2 weeks is a long enough hold cause I’d hate to go unstable and have to suffer and wait.

There’s a bb that posted some interesting info lately, I’ll post a link to his post separate since I can’t remember but here’s the link to a free mindful meditation course that might be helpful https://palousemindfulness.com/. I haven’t done it yet but think I’m going to try it

Anyway, glad your here, let’s keep it going!!

[[...]]

Oh…it’s me again….I didn’t really share about me.  I’m at 5.35 right now.  Today is a little better, somewhat of a window.  Yesterday I was able to get up and about some more, so that was encouraging.  I am actually going to go and pick my daughter up and take her back to her house why her car is looked at in about and hour, so that will get me out of the hours too.    I am only sleeping about 5 hours a night and that is discouraging.  I was sleeping about 6 hours for a while……I am also getting the adrenal surges, and I wasn’t getting those either.  I think it’s because I am not eating right.  I don’t know.  When I get back, I am going to walk the dog’s around the block and then rest

 

Marie

Hi me again also, here’s the thread I was talkinh about in my other post http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=263070.msg3319612#msg3319612

Pretty interesting what he did, not sure I could do it. Any way on your sleep have you considered changing your doses? Shifting more to your night dose? I know any change cud cause issues but from what I read o healing sleep is very important. I know there’s other things like melatonin and hydroxzyne that work for some people

Anyway hope your day stays good

Joeb

[[ho...]]

Joeb- very interesting about his jump and his experience, it makes me want to try…..but I won’t.  Not yet.  I did a mindfulness class a few years back and it is amazing.  I do use it all the time, a true game changer for sure.  I recommend this for everyone.  In fact I should pull out my workbook and reread it and refresh myself.  Once you do the workshops, you just kind of incorporate mindfulness into your daily life, and it is so helpful.  For me, it is especially helpful while driving.  I live in the Bay Area (CA) and it saved me 

 

I can see why you are hesitant about the liquid.  I see that you just transitioned over to the V, and are just “cutting”, so lots of new stuff.  For me the liquid went smooth.  You can do a little of both, and that may help you.  See how you do.  I am at 5.30mg.  So I take a 5mg tab, and then I draw up .30ml.  I will do this for a few more nights and then I will go to 5.25, take a 5, draw up .25ml then .20ml for about 7 days and then down to 1 for another 7 days until I get to my 5mg tap only.  I will take the tab for about 7-9 days, and then switch to 2 2mg tabs and draw .95ml/.90ml for about 6/7 days and keep going down.  So the tabs and liquid can work really well together, obviously I am doing a micro taper, but you could do it with a dry cut too and slowly exchange out some of your dose.  I chose to get rid of all of my day time doses like the Ashton Manuel said to do early on, and followed it.  So I only take my meds at night.  I don’t want to split it up, because I think that would make my sleep even worse. 

 

I think I have to just start getting out more and exercising and physically wearing myself out.  Like I said, my motivation has been severely lacking but I haven’t been feeling well.  I had to slow my wean down.  Plus I found out my generic brand was changed and that has messed me up, so I think once I can get back on the right brand, and get stabilized that will help me get back to a better place with less sx.

 

Are you thinking about jumping like he did?  Just curious …….

 

Marie

[[...]]

Hi Marie, it is tempting to be done ah yi, but at this point I don't think so about jumping off like he did, but I was wondering if there was anything in his story that had some level of consistency with people that have "just quit" and didn't have PAWS. He mentioned that he got very stable on the medicine and then did his jump.

 

Was it the same mindfulness class that he used?

 

I am hearing alot about the generic issues, that concerns me since I cant tell from the bottle of liquid if its generic or not. Maybe its not since it doesnt say the word "generic". I've taken both of the tablets and not noticed a difference although i didn't pay any attention at that time so if it did i wouldnt know.

 

So it looks like you are doing a cut and hold using liquid? You reduce .05 then hold for 7 days, then reduce another .05 hold for 7 days etc? Do you ever hold longer?  I worry about the long Valium half life which catches up with some BBS.  There are numbers on half life that you can look at but everyone is different and this could vary from person to person. I think the key thing here is to journal your symptoms and modify/hold before things get really bad. Marie, maybe with your symptoms you may want to hold a while to stabilize before continuing your taper

 

I am dosing 3 times a day just because that's what i was doing when I crossed over from Ativan. I plan to keep these doses since I've heard from some BBs that as you get lower even on Valium, there could be interdose wd. Its an extra hassle but I'll see how it goes and change it if it becomes to difficult. Maybe take equal amounts of each dose to keep them all the same, again not sure yet. I am reading old posts on this site to get ideas, Momof7Babes, Candace, and several others have been successful with their approaches. Worth looking at for ideas. But ultimately we gotta figure out what works for each of us.

 

I push myself to go to the gym every day, its very hard but once I'm there it gets easier but not easy. and I feel better after but not fantastic.

Being retired doesn't help but i try to keep as busy as I can, but the sedative depressive effects from Valium make it tough. Sometimes I drink a little caffeine in the morning to help get going but never too much.

 

Glad your here Marie, hope that you are feeling better,

 

Joeb

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[[...]]

Hey all!

 

Joeb invited me over, so I thought I’d join in to offer support!  I’m at the “end” of my taper, and I use the term “end” loosely because it literally feels like it’s going to take forever to get this last mg out. I make a .005 mg dose reduction and I feel it!  So taking things verrrrryyy slowly right now and avoiding another crash like I had last year. I’m honestly not keeping track of the percentage I’m clearing each month or the pace I’m on, I’m completely letting my body lead. I figure I’ll get to zero when in get there. In the meantime I’ve been stable enough to restart my career (albeit working from home but it’s a huge step for me). My nervous system is so easily dysregulated… I’ve had periods where I felt it had improved so much and lately the last couple weeks have been rough again. Anyways, I’m here and would love to be of support. Reading y’all’s experiences is helpful for me too. This experience can be isolating, and while I know I’m not the only one going through this, it helps to connect with others too. I do however feel like I’m the only one needing to go THIS slow 

I Candace are you reducing .005 per day? How much per week?

[[we...]]

Hey all!

 

I need tips on crossing over to diazepam from ativan. I'll provide you with quick info, longer intro is here:

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=263056.0

 

Anyways, quick storytime: used 0.5 lorazepam for ~30 days (irregular use). Bumped to 1 mg for regular ~10-15 days (a liberal estimate). Decided to wean off as I don't want to use benzos anymore, and took 0.75 for a few days, then crossed to 0.5 lorazepam + 2 mg diazepam.

 

That is what I'm holding until the end of this week. Then I'd like to cross this 0.5 lorazepam fully to diazepam, so I'd take 6 mg in total (it's not an exact equivalent to what Ashton suggests, but it's in the ballpark).

 

From there I'd take 1 mg off every week, just like Ashton suggests. I really don't want to take this drug any longer, it makes me sick.

 

I feel if I go any slower, I'll be tapering off for longer than I took the drugs regularly in the first place.

 

What do you think? Any help is appreciated!

[[ho...]]

Hey all!

 

I need tips on crossing over to diazepam from ativan. I'll provide you with quick info, longer intro is here:

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=263056.0

 

Anyways, quick storytime: used 0.5 lorazepam for ~30 days (irregular use). Bumped to 1 mg for regular ~10-15 days (a liberal estimate). Decided to wean off as I don't want to use benzos anymore, and took 0.75 for a few days, then crossed to 0.5 lorazepam + 2 mg diazepam.

 

That is what I'm holding until the end of this week. Then I'd like to cross this 0.5 lorazepam fully to diazepam, so I'd take 6 mg in total (it's not an exact equivalent to what Ashton suggests, but it's in the ballpark).

 

From there I'd take 1 mg off every week, just like Ashton suggests. I really don't want to take this drug any longer, it makes me sick.

 

I feel if I go any slower, I'll be tapering off for longer than I took the drugs regularly in the first place.

 

What do you think? Any help is appreciated!

 

Hi - WeWillWin and Welcome

 

So glad you found us here.  Sounds like you are on a good plan.  I would suggest you follow the crossover to V per the protocol.  I did a crossover from K to V and went way too fast, and it was absolutely horrible.  So please stick to the protocol for your crossover before you start your cutting.

 

As far as cutting, I totally understand wanting to get off ASAP.  Hopefully the 1mg will work for you.  It is recommended again to stick with the protocol.  Even Ashton can be a bit fast for many and they find themselves getting too many side effects.  However there are people that do just fine, so go in with a positive attitude and no fear and you could have a very good outcome.  The general rule is 5-10% reductions every 2 weeks and to do a “symptom based” taper.  There are also different ways to taper.  A cut and hold or a daily micro taper.  Perhaps you have already looked into those.  If not, I suggest you do. 

 

Glad you are here and hope to see you participate in our group 

 

Marie

[[ho...]]

Hi Marie, it is tempting to be done ah yi, but at this point I don't think so about jumping off like he did, but I was wondering if there was anything in his story that had some level of consistency with people that have "just quit" and didn't have PAWS. He mentioned that he got very stable on the medicine and then did his jump.

 

Was it the same mindfulness class that he used?

 

I am hearing alot about the generic issues, that concerns me since I cant tell from the bottle of liquid if its generic or not. Maybe its not since it doesnt say the word "generic". I've taken both of the tablets and not noticed a difference although i didn't pay any attention at that time so if it did i wouldnt know.

 

So it looks like you are doing a cut and hold using liquid? You reduce .05 then hold for 7 days, then reduce another .05 hold for 7 days etc? Do you ever hold longer?  I worry about the long Valium half life which catches up with some BBS.  There are numbers on half life that you can look at but everyone is different and this could vary from person to person. I think the key thing here is to journal your symptoms and modify/hold before things get really bad. Marie, maybe with your symptoms you may want to hold a while to stabilize before continuing your taper

 

I am dosing 3 times a day just because that's what i was doing when I crossed over from Ativan. I plan to keep these doses since I've heard from some BBs that as you get lower even on Valium, there could be interdose wd. Its an extra hassle but I'll see how it goes and change it if it becomes to difficult. Maybe take equal amounts of each dose to keep them all the same, again not sure yet. I am reading old posts on this site to get ideas, Momof7Babes, Candace, and several others have been successful with their approaches. Worth looking at for ideas. But ultimately we gotta figure out what works for each of us.

 

I push myself to go to the gym every day, its very hard but once I'm there it gets easier but not easy. and I feel better after but not fantastic.

Being retired doesn't help but i try to keep as busy as I can, but the sedative depressive effects from Valium make it tough. Sometimes I drink a little caffeine in the morning to help get going but never too much.

 

Glad your here Marie, hope that you are feeling better,

 

Joeb

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

 

Joeb-

 

Hi-  No, not the same class, but same concepts.  It was super cool, and I really recommend taking a mindfulness class.  I would like to take it again.  There were people in my class that had taken it before.

 

Your tab’s are probably generic as most are, and don’t worry to much about it.  Not everyone has problems.  It doesn’t say “generic”, it will have a name, they all have names.  Most “insurance” doesn’t cover the brand name unless there is a certain reason.  Like if I needed the actual brand of Valium for me out of pocket a 30 day supply would cost me 295.00$, but generic is 1.95 with my co-pay( I like the brand -generic Mayne).  Now I could try and get my doctor to make a case I need the “brand” and we could petition the Ins., to cover it and they “probably” would, but I am able to get the Mayne now so I don’t need to go that route.  As far as the liquid, I believe there is only one brand that makes liquid and it is Rouche (not sure if I am spelling that right) and I think that might be the actual “Valium” brand.  I have to look that up again.  Or you can, or maybe a bb buddy will come on here and help out.  But I think that is the case.  If I am wrong, it will have a “name” and that will be the manufacture, just like on your pill bottle.  I have my liquid made at compound pharmacy, and it’s made from a really good powder of diazepam.  This particular compound doesn’t have to be refrigerated, and it’s a tincture, so I hold it under my tounge for 2 min before I swallow.  It has worked well.  I tried another one before it, and it didn’t work as well.  The other one had a 2 week shelf life and had to be refrigerated and I had to swallow it.  I think it was also losing it’s stability before the two weeks were up.  So my pharmacist came up with this other one, and it worke GREAT!

 

So as far as my system, I guess it’s kind of like a cut and hold, but it’s a micro cut.  My brain right now is mush….it’s 1:34Am and I can’t do the math…LOL.  I was trying to do 10% a month and that was too much.  I will do the math tomorrow.  But by micro dosing the way I do, it is much better than the larger cut at once, like before.  It is just kind of slowly going down.  There is no way around sx, unless I guess you go super super slow.  I think a few people have gone that route.  But I have done both, and this is for sure much better.  I was really really in bad shape before.  I have had to play around with this taper, and I am still trying to figure it out.  I do think I am one of those that for some reason is very sensitive and I just feel every single drop leaving my body.  I was never addicted, I never took more, I don’t crave this medicine…..I never have updosed, in fact I loathe it.  I can’t wait until I never have to take it again.  Yet, it seems every bit of it leaving my body, my body screams in protest.  It is really frustrating. 

 

I do kind of like the idea of getting lower, really getting into my mindfulness, maybe holding and feeling good and getting to the gym and maybe jumping like he did.  Just an idea.  I am going to think about it.  I wouldn’t do it until like 2mg, or 1 mg.  But it is an idea.  He obviously didn’t have any PAWS and I don’t think everyone does.  I was reading some information today about benzo and w/d and about the % of people it effects and the PAWS and it seems that the numbers can be favorable not to have PAWS.  I do believe some of it has to do with maybe if someone has previously used benzo’s, and how many times they have w/d, or gone cold turkey, and the whole kindling thing and that can lead to PAWS.  So that would make sense.  But then……who knows, because we are all so unique and we just don’t know if we could be that outlier that everything points to being “perfect” and then BAM  .  Not trying to be negative….just being real

 

I need to go to bed….sleep well 

 

Hi to everyone else……

 

Marie

[[we...]]

Hey all!

 

I need tips on crossing over to diazepam from ativan. I'll provide you with quick info, longer intro is here:

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=263056.0

 

Anyways, quick storytime: used 0.5 lorazepam for ~30 days (irregular use). Bumped to 1 mg for regular ~10-15 days (a liberal estimate). Decided to wean off as I don't want to use benzos anymore, and took 0.75 for a few days, then crossed to 0.5 lorazepam + 2 mg diazepam.

 

That is what I'm holding until the end of this week. Then I'd like to cross this 0.5 lorazepam fully to diazepam, so I'd take 6 mg in total (it's not an exact equivalent to what Ashton suggests, but it's in the ballpark).

 

From there I'd take 1 mg off every week, just like Ashton suggests. I really don't want to take this drug any longer, it makes me sick.

 

I feel if I go any slower, I'll be tapering off for longer than I took the drugs regularly in the first place.

 

What do you think? Any help is appreciated!

 

Hi - WeWillWin and Welcome

 

So glad you found us here.  Sounds like you are on a good plan.  I would suggest you follow the crossover to V per the protocol.  I did a crossover from K to V and went way too fast, and it was absolutely horrible.  So please stick to the protocol for your crossover before you start your cutting.

 

As far as cutting, I totally understand wanting to get off ASAP.  Hopefully the 1mg will work for you.  It is recommended again to stick with the protocol.  Even Ashton can be a bit fast for many and they find themselves getting too many side effects.  However there are people that do just fine, so go in with a positive attitude and no fear and you could have a very good outcome.  The general rule is 5-10% reductions every 2 weeks and to do a “symptom based” taper.  There are also different ways to taper.  A cut and hold or a daily micro taper.  Perhaps you have already looked into those.  If not, I suggest you do. 

 

Glad you are here and hope to see you participate in our group 

 

Marie

 

Thanks! I'll probably do a more slow crossover. I won't transfer 0.5 directly over to diazepam, but 0.25 every week for a more steady approach.

 

I'm thankful I'm not too deep into the game, this few weeks will pass by fast. Slow and steady wins the race!

[[Ca...]]

At this point it’s .005 mg every 4-5 days!  I told you I’m slow, lol!  And the past couple weeks I have been holding bc I’m fighting off some kid germ.

 

Hey all!

 

Joeb invited me over, so I thought I’d join in to offer support!  I’m at the “end” of my taper, and I use the term “end” loosely because it literally feels like it’s going to take forever to get this last mg out. I make a .005 mg dose reduction and I feel it!  So taking things verrrrryyy slowly right now and avoiding another crash like I had last year. I’m honestly not keeping track of the percentage I’m clearing each month or the pace I’m on, I’m completely letting my body lead. I figure I’ll get to zero when in get there. In the meantime I’ve been stable enough to restart my career (albeit working from home but it’s a huge step for me). My nervous system is so easily dysregulated… I’ve had periods where I felt it had improved so much and lately the last couple weeks have been rough again. Anyways, I’m here and would love to be of support. Reading y’all’s experiences is helpful for me too. This experience can be isolating, and while I know I’m not the only one going through this, it helps to connect with others too. I do however feel like I’m the only one needing to go THIS slow 

I Candace are you reducing .005 per day? How much per week?

[[ho...]]

Hi WEWILL- Good plan.  Slow and Steady does win the race. 

 

Candice- I hope you feel better soon 

 

I thankfully got my right medicine last night. YAY!  And I actually slept about 6 hours plus I fell asleep in the early eve for like and hour or more. It wasn’t a solid 6 hours.  It was a solid 4 hours, then I went back to sleep.  But I will take it.    Today I feel super fatigued and I just want to watch TV.  I am going to force myself to get up and do a few things and get out for a bit too.

 

I will try and check back later today.

 

Marie

[[...]]

Hi all, had a downer day today, went to the gym felt somewhat better but hard to shake the sedated depressed state of mind, better than acute but still sucks. Nervous about my cut tonight. Taking .25 from my night dose so will be down to 3mg with 3 equal doses. After a couple weeks going to try out the Pharmacy liquid.

You would think with all the modern technology out there someone would figure out how to help people like us and stop all the suffering. My rant for today,

Hope all of you are doing well, seems like alot of folks getting colds etc. that really makes the wd even worse. I got over a cold a few weeks ago, it was pretty bad.

Anyway best to all of you,

Joeb

[[ho...]]

Hi Joeb- 

 

I am just impressed that you are getting to the gym.  WTG.  I really mean that.  I wanted to go on a walk today, and I just didn’t do it.  I did some other stuff (better than just being on the couch) so that is good.  I saw my daughter again for a couple hours and that was so nice.  But back to going to the gym….that is obviously so good for your healing and state of mind in the long run. 

 

Cutting is always nerve racking but just try and be positive, and hopefully it won’t hit you to bad.  If it does, maybe you might want to look at micro tapering.  And yes, you would think there is a way they could help us.  I have joked with my doctor ( well kind of serious once) a few times about being put in a drug induced coma while they wean me off.   Have you figured out your plan on introducing your liquid?

 

Marie