Stomach healing place

[[br...]]

100th Post woo! 

 

I spoke to the manufacturer of the DGL supplements I bought, they said that the pills are treated and it is the black licorice that causes blood pressure issues. The DGL is filtered somehow and they take this out, humm?, I didn't quite believe it, the DGL may still come in useful, it is better than taking another PPI.

 

I have a positive piece of news at least, even though I am going through PPI wd, I am still experiencing windows, which are very strange. The feeling of the two opposing experiences meeting each other. The PPI wd and the healing energy both charging at the same time is weird enough.

 

I am feeling a strange but good feeling around the inside of my stomach, it feels as if I am shedding the old burning feeling experience and growing a new less painful and less burning skin or stomach experience, almost like the pain and burning is shrinking and going away, that is the only way I can explain it.

 

I now know for certain, getting off these PPI will be the final piece of the puzzle in my healing journey, once my stomach heals, everything else will quickly follow and I suspect it will be the same for everyone in this thread too.

 

Healing is a magical experience, you just feel an overwhelming charge of clarity and wellness, I feel lighter, as if I am recharged.

 

My stomach has been good today too, in comparison to yesterday. I know the worst is probably still yet to come with PPI wd, thankfully, I do feel as if I have got over the worst, I could be wrong.

[[Si...]]

Good luck Bring-it-on with coming off the PPI.

 

Doing it cold turkey is not something I would do again! 

 

DGL and zinc can both heal the gut, and I have found marshmallow to be very helpful in healing the stomach lining too if you need any help along the way.

 

 

Thanks SB, could you please tell me about your own experiences with PPI's

 

How much were you on and for how long? How long did it take to get over the worst of the cold turkey?

 

Thanks again

 

Hi Bring-it-on

 

To answer your question, I was on PPIs for 14 years straight!  I had a stomach infection that was never diagnosed and I was told that it was reflux even though my PH probe did not show reflux.  At the time I was naive about doctors and many health conditions, and so I just did what I was told, unfortunately.  I was told I had to be on it for life, so I believed that doctor.  Every time I tried to come off my PPI, I had awful rebound symptoms, but I did not know this and thought it was my bad gut.

 

It was only a couple of years ago, after getting ill with Lyme disease, that my doctor tested me for all sorts of things, and we found that I had had a uncommon stomach infection that fit the bill when my gut problems all started.

 

I finally came off my PPI about 18 months ago, cold turkey, and it was awful! The rebound lasted about 2 months, but then got much better. 

 

When I started tapering from my benzo, I went too fast, and went into withdrawal, and thats when my stomach went crazy - instant gastritis and reflux.  It was so severe I had to go back on a PPI, but this time, I just did the over the counter version and coming off that was much easier.

 

Now I am in tough place again with my gut and I am holding my dose for now, and just taking zantac, but its not helping much.

 

I don't want to have to go back on a PPI again since I developed polyps in my stomach from the PPI after being on it so long.  Apparently they are benign and go away once the PPI is stopped, but I want to avoid touching one again.

 

Unfortunately the gastritis from the withdrawal is so difficult to tolerate and it completely messes us with my digestion.

 

I take DGL powder which does help but not enough right now.  I also take high dose probiotics.

 

Silverbell

 

 

[[Si...]]

Charlotte made this comment:    ****Acid blocking medications almost always interact with benzo metabolism, therefore as you are trying to slowly wean and get clean from the benzos, the acid blockers are increasing the benzo concentration in your body, making it hang around longer.  That's why stopping them rapidly is disastrous, as it is like bumping up your benzo dose, then doing a big cut, you're going to get more stomach burning and withdrawal.****

 

I've just stopped 40 mg nexium 9 days ago c/t.  I was on nexium 3 months.    7 days ago I started the second half of my c/o to valium from Serax.    But I am having problems stabilising.    The first half went fine (with nexium on board) but am feeling bad since giving up my old benzo and being all on valium.    I wish Charlotte had cited where she read this information as I may be sabotaging my own success in c/o to valium but really felt I needed to get off nexium because of osteoporosis (at age 61) and having no history of GERD before I had difficulties with SSRI's.      I am finding that I get burning in my chest only when I take the valium. 

 

I really thought it best to get off PPI's because of my bone density.  I live in Australia and the only form of tablet we get is solid - can't open it and get rid of some of the contents.      Any comments as this is delaying my tapering - if Charlotte is correct then I've made an unscheduled cut in valium by stopping the nexium!!!

 

This is true.  Acid blockers and PPIs can interfere with benzodiazepines and withdrawal.  Both types of medications are metabolized by the P450 enzymes in the liver and can affect the metabolism of each other.

 

Lansoprasole, and omeprazole both inhibit the CYP2C19 enzyme which valium is metabolized by and can increase the valium, causing withdrawal if the PPI is reduced or stopped.

 

Many of the acid blockers and PPIs are substrates of the same enzyme and can interfere with each other's metabolism depending on genetics, age, overall health, and other medications that are taken with them.

 

There is lots of information on the CYP450 enzyme system online with charts to see which drugs are metabolized by which enzymes, but these charts are not all comprehensive, and there is still so much to be learned about this.

 

 

 

[[sp...]]

Hello All,

 

I once looked into PPI/benzodiazepine interactions and it's just not simple.

 

It's true that acid suppressants can interfere with the clearance of benzodiazepines through the CYP450 liver enzymes. As Silverbell says, the effect this has in a given individual would be dependent on other factors like genetics, age, lifestyle and other medication. Both nicotine and cabbage can have much greater effects

 

It's generally thought if an interaction does occur it would cause increased blood levels of most benzodiazepines except lorazepam(which isn't fat soluble and isn't metabolised by any of the eighteen CYP450 isoenzymes).

 

There are other factors in play. Benzodiazepine absorption depends upon an acid environment. In the presence of a PPI the peak concentration of diazepam can be up to 30% lower, probably because absorption is slowed...overall and by about 20-25 minutes. Stopping a PPI could therefore theoretically increase blood levels.

 

Both benzodiazepines and PPIs affect gastrointestinal motility, most increase transit time though lansoprazole often causes diarrhoea and so reduces it. Either increase or decrease, especially in relation to the timing of food intake, can impact unpredictably on absorption...increasing drug destruction if it hangs about not being absorbed in the wrong bit of gut or increasing absorption if it hangs around in the right bit of gut.

 

The bottom line is that the overall effect of PPI/benzo interactions in a given individual are unpredictable.

 

Take care,

 

spartacus 

[[ov...]]

My acid is so bad, it is always coming up into my mouth.  It is eroding my teeth.  I am taking acidophulus/bificus and coconut kefir water, trying to slam the bacteria.  Eating no acids, nothing is working.  I am very miserable.  I have tried DGL, but it won't stay down, it just comes up with the acid into my mouth, which I have to expel.  All this began with my K taper, and got worse as the taper progressed and got even worse in the jump off 11/22/13.  Now am tapering temazepam with V.  Does V affect the stomach acid too? I know it has a muscle relaxer, maybe it relaxes the LES muscle too much. if I sneeze, cough or bend over the acid just pours out.  This is scarey.

 

OC  :smitten:

[[sp...]]

Hello overcomer,

 

I tapered from the equivalent of 100mg diazepam and, after crossover from clonazepam, was still on 80mg diazepam and 7.5mg zopiclone.

 

Tapering affects the GI tract inevitably and horribly.

 

1.  Dries the mouth reducing the pints of saliva that normally begin digestion and continuously wash debris out of the oesophagus.

2.  Deranges oesophageal motility, particularly producing uncoordinated spasms of the crucial lower third.

3.  Relaxes the functional(rather than anatomical)cardiac sphincter that helps keep stomach contents where they do least harm.

4.  Decreases gastric motility and therefore delays stomach emptying.

5.  Increases acid production by the stomach if only through the adrenaline of the over-exercised HPA axis.

6.  Interferes with the production of the protective mucus that normally lines the mucosa of the stomach.

7.  Tightens up all skeletal muscles including the abdominal wall, raising abdominal pressure and increasing reflux.

8.  Badly but unpredictably upsets the vagus nerve that is nominally in charge...my heart was often in my mouth.

9.  When not producing diarrhoea can decrease lower GI tract motility and cause constipation and back-up.

10.Constipation can cause straining at stool which raises abdominal pressure and that increases reflux.

 

All the acid suppressants in the world do not affect reflux in the slightest, in fact PPIs in further delaying gastric emptying can easily make it worse. They decrease the awareness of its happening and can allow a time of healing for the cardiac sphincter and oesophagus by stopping the acid burn that brings it to your notice.

 

After that, in my experience, reflux has to be addressed empirically. Allow normal gastric functioning to go on as much as possible and try to keep the acid to a minimum, in the right place and its flow onward.

 

Anything known to increase free acid production should be avoided. Some triggers will be individual...cucumber and brown sauce for me...but there are constants...alcohol, caffeine, smoking, milk, drugs like benzodiazepines and some supplements, awful meal replacement products like Ensure, and sugar.

 

Once the acid is up anything relaxing the cardiac sphincter is bad...alcohol, caffeine, nicotine, benzodiazepines.

 

And so is anything that delays gastric emptying...fat, fibre, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, iced water, benzodiazepines, PPIs. Ginger can increase gastric emptying.

 

If a lot of acid is hanging around in the stomach adding to that anything capable of damaging the lining of the stomach leads directly to gastritis....aspirin, ibuprofen and other anti-inflammatories, calcium, alcohol, benzodiazepines and other drugs.

 

If the acid is well wrapped in food it will be carried forward quicker by the process of digestion than if it has been provoked by free fluid. Until you have had a pint of milk acidify and curdle your stomach for a couple of hours before that stomach chooses to empty by the direct route you haven't lived. The only thing worse is Ensure. Barfing back vitamins and iron sucks.

 

It may be common sense but it isn't true that liquids are "more easily digested". They can hang around sloshing idly in and out of your stomach forever. They are really harmful at bedtime. The best of stomachs will shut down as you sleep except to produce the odd litre of secretions itself. You don't need to add to that.

 

And I would say that you don't need to dilute out digestive enzymes by sluicing the system with litres of water daily. Many would disagree with this.

 

Ensuring onward progression of acid, and using gravity to facilitate that is perhaps most helpful. Not lying down after eating, not eating immediately before bed, lying on the left side to tuck the cardiac sphincter under the diaphragm(though some do swear by the right sometimes), no strenuous exercise immediately after eating because this shuts down digestion, gentle walks two hours after eating.

 

All this will be to no avail if you don't avoid anything that raises abdominal pressure...bending, coughing, deep breathing exercises, tight clothing, swimming, weight lifting, pregnancy.

 

I could go on but the aim is to break into the various vicious circles that can so easily be established and, depending as they do on lifestyle choices, the remedies will to some extent be individual.

 

It can be done. It's a whole lot easier once you stop benzodiazepines.

 

Take care,

 

spartacus

 

 

[[Br...]]

How long did the worst of PPI wd take to settle down and when was it at its worst, if you can remember?

 

Hiya BringItOn.  PPI WD causes an acid rebound for approximately 1 month.  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23311977  However I have seen other studies which suggest that acid levels do not fully go back to normal for 3 months.  However although the acid levels are higher than usual, you may not have any perception of it - for example, if you take a PPI to prevent ulcers then you may not detect much difference when you stop but if you tale PPI for acid reflux then you are likely to detect the difference.

 

The main issue is the lack of sleep due to burning and undigested food and the fact I can not eat much, those two combined has my emotions going hay wire. I was all set to leave my gf yesterday. I am a lot more snappy at the moment. Tough times.

 

If you tough it out until the acid levels go back to a tolerable level you may incur esophageal erosion.  This will make your esophagus feel sore until the erosion heals which may be some weeks after the stomach acid levels have gone back to normal. 

 

To help cope with acid reflux, a simple but effective trick is to raise the bed by 4 to 6 inches and also avoid foods which cause the lower esophageal sphincter to relax such as tomato, citrus fruits, fatty foods, peppermint.  This is all standard management for GERD and details can be found on the Net.

 

 

 

 

 

[[Br...]]

Charlotte made this comment:    ****Acid blocking medications almost always interact with benzo metabolism, therefore as you are trying to slowly wean and get clean from the benzos, the acid blockers are increasing the benzo concentration in your body, making it hang around longer.  That's why stopping them rapidly is disastrous, as it is like bumping up your benzo dose, then doing a big cut, you're going to get more stomach burning and withdrawal.****

 

I've just stopped 40 mg nexium 9 days ago c/t.  I was on nexium 3 months.    7 days ago I started the second half of my c/o to valium from Serax.    But I am having problems stabilising.    The first half went fine (with nexium on board) but am feeling bad since giving up my old benzo and being all on valium.    I wish Charlotte had cited where she read this information as I may be sabotaging my own success in c/o to valium but really felt I needed to get off nexium because of osteoporosis (at age 61) and having no history of GERD before I had difficulties with SSRI's.      I am finding that I get burning in my chest only when I take the valium. 

 

I really thought it best to get off PPI's because of my bone density.  I live in Australia and the only form of tablet we get is solid - can't open it and get rid of some of the contents.      Any comments as this is delaying my tapering - if Charlotte is correct then I've made an unscheduled cut in valium by stopping the nexium!!!

 

Hello again WiserNow!  Of the PPIs, Nexium (esomeprazole) probably has the strongest effect on poteniating diazepam.  One study (and later studies may find differently) suggest that Nexium can poteniate your diazepam level by 40%.  Losec/Prilosec (omeprazole) is reckoned to raise diazepam levels by about 20%.  Other PPIs have less effect.  However there is a lot of person to person variation in these figures so don't assume the percentages must apply to you personally.

 

Note that it is likely that other benzos will not necessarily be effected in the same way as diazepam.

 

 

 

 

 

[[br...]]

Excellent info here, thanks a lot guys.

 

Spartacus,

I will read it all through thoroughly when my blurred vision stops being so intrusive, I can type but can't seem to concentrate on the screen for any period of time aside from skim reading, sort of like a tunnel vision.

 

Overcomer,

I hope your'e feeling better. My stomach was a real mess during certain stages of my Diazepam taper and now I am well enough to cold turkey PPI's, this in itself I hope will give you hope, lol, there is a lot of hope here. I would just try to stay focused on the task in hand, treat this like a job, the job of repairing and healing.

 

Silverbell,

I would hold off the PPI's, there are better and safer alternatives and after all your'e doing reasonably well without them, once your free, you will see some major improvements with your stomach. We will work to help you as much as possible. Unless your'e in extreme pain then of course if there is no other option to ease the pain then maybe take the smallest possible dose of PPI and can I just say you did well getting off PPIs whilst in a taper, that must of been really tough, it is hard enough in acute wd and your'e doing the right thing, it's wise to have a rest (hold) every now and then, there's no harm in letting your body rest.

 

Braban,

I agree with the PPI potentiating the effects diazepam wd by up to 40%, this makes perfect sense and although I didn't know the exact figures, I always knew that PPI's were exasperating my wd in one way or another. I always knew these PPI pills were doing me more harm than good, I just couldn't think clearly enough to get off them, that and how under weight I was during most of my taper wd. In theory my benzo wd symptoms should improve by up to 40% once I'm completely over PPI withdrawal?

 

Day 7 of this cold turkey PPI withdrawal:

 

My current symptoms range from aching joints/bones, blurred vision, ear pain returning, only mild so far, sound sensitivities returning, again mild, these had almost vanished up until a week ago, ocd thoughts increased, medium to high burning in stomach, constipation, bladder issues again these had majorly improved up until the start of PPI wd. Zero digestion at night, if I stay awake all night around 4am-6am my food starts to digest. Insomnia, nightmares, so far every night for a week now.

 

I also have back/hip pain which is a burning sensation that seems to be angry and ready for a fight. I just hope that this is the PPI wd at its peak or more or less its peak at least, saying that, I could handle another level or two up from this, pain wise, not much more please, this will do thank you very much. I am still experiencing windows even through out this mess, so it is mixed emotions. I feel as if this is the worst of PPI withdrawal. I hope I'm right? 

 

I just need to be fully aware of the progress I made before the PPI cold turkey began, as I was seeing some real improvements in acute benzo wd and remember I will get better again, the line becomes blurred sometimes, basically, it is just a case of being aware of the fact I'm not myself at the moment and trying not to get to down about this whole taking one step forward in benzo wd healing and then taking two steps back by throwing myself into PPI wd situation, which without question needed to be done, this is the right time.

 

Thanks again for your help everyone. There is so much more to discover as to why our stomachs go through what they do during benzo withdrawal. Knowledge is everything here, it will help us and others that seek help in the future, to heal and far better, far safer than any PPI pill could have ever done. knowledge is the key to our recoveries, this and of course time, lots and lots of time. 

 

 

Wishing you all well. 

 

B

 

 

[[sp...]]

Hey bring-it-on,

 

Thank you for starting this great thread. I have a vested interest in keeping it going so I thought I'd mention ginger...it could help you now.

 

The thing to understand about ginger is that it's a collection of multiple active agents depending upon the formulation. For all intents and purposes it IS a drug, a largely untrialled and untested drug, in having effects it may have side-effects and can be overdosed. The trick is to find out what sort works for you best at what "dose".

 

And it can have many effects.

 

1. It's a proven prokinetic or gastric stimulant. It increases antral contractions and speeds up stomach emptying so can help nausea where gastric stasis is a problem.

2. At the same time it can be spasmolytic in the lower bowel. Good for colicky pain but at the expense of all spasmolytics...constipation.

3. It encourages the stomach to produce prostaglandins which are cytoprotective(in rats at least), helping protect and repair the stomach lining.

4. It has been used for centuries in Asia for dementia. Recent work suggests it has cholinesterase inhibitor activity...the West has just got round to making anticholinesterases to try to address early dementia.

5. Many cultures have used it for the inflammatory pain of arthritis. Recent research demonstrated anti-inflammatory and analgesic properties equivalent to diclofenac when used for arthritis of the knee, without its awful tendency to strip away the stomach lining. I'm thinking of your hip and back bring-it-on...and every single joint I possess.

6. It appears to kill Helicobacter which may be a good thing...and may suggest it could kill other bugs multiplying in stomach contents hanging around for too long and fermenting anything they can get their hands on.

7. It appears to help gas dispersion.

 

It's unusual, because of the way it works, for ginger to help motion sickness or seasickness. If you've tried it for these and had no success this doesn't mean it would be a waste of time to try it now.

 

I have tried most formulations.

 

I'm unable to tolerate any ginger tea even when this is sweetened, but this may just reflect my difficulties with fluids.

 

I cook with powdered ginger(and turmeric for similar reasons)but there's a limit to how much you can take this way and it's difficult to know how much you have taken. I aim for low level chronic protection and may get it.

 

Ginger oil capsules allow you to quantify your intake but have very different contents.

 

Acutely, I find crystallised ginger is best...chewed before eating or drinking, stem ginger less so.

 

The main effect I notice is that, on a good day, it does speed up gastric emptying and help reflux and nausea through doing that.

 

I have gastroparesis that predates my glorious psychiatric career and any psychotropics including benzos. I know that my last gastric emptying test demonstrated that, during the test period, not one radioactive cornflake or drop of milk made it out of my stomach.

 

In your terms bring-it-on...nothing "dispelled"

 

Ginger can change that. It's worth a try.

 

Take care,

 

spartacus

[[br...]]

Thanks Spartacus,

 

I will add ginger to the list of supplements I buy, only this time, I will use it instead of leaving it to collect dust in the cupboard. 

 

I am going to try Apple cider vinegar tomorrow, I will let you know if it helps. I had previously tried it, I did do it

whilst in the mist of my benzo taper and stupidly I drank the ACV neat, this time I will dilute and hope it works better.

 

Day 9 PPI wd,

 

I am seeing some improvements, only mild improvements but at least it is not getting worse. Now I just need to make

sure I stick to this benzo wd/PPI wd/Acid reflux friendly diet. I can't let the rains off for at least another 2 months, food wise.

 

How did you get those tests on your stomach? I could do with something like that, I plan on getting a full medical once I am healed.

 

Edit.

Dispelling is how I gauge the rate of my recovery, the more dispelling that happens at night and the earlier it occurs is how I measure how far my stomach has progressed. Until one day, as soon as we eat, we will hear and feel dispelling instantly and gone are the days of waiting till 4am plus before we hear that sweet engine in our stomachs starting up!

 

'Come on stomach', 'you can do it'! 

 

I swear if you close your eyes and really concentrate on your stomach, sort of visualize it dispelling, it actually helps it happen,

it requires a lot of concentration and usually makes me feel drained afterwards, but it works, give it try.

 

 

Wishing you well

 

B 

[[ma...]]

Bring,

 

Hope you keep seeing improvement.

 

Spartacus,

 

I have ginger capsules that are 550mg.  Someone posted that they took, if I'm not mistaken 6,000mg at one time for it to help.  How much do you take?  What is the difference in the crystallized and the regular capsules? 

 

My nausea is back with a vengeance.

 

Mama2

[[je...]]

I will add ginger to my list too, I juice every morning so I think I will just juice it. I tried the Apple Cider Vinegar and it was so gross to drink that I haven't tried it since. I did notice it calmed my stomach down. How often do we need to drink it to see any results?? Once a day, twice a day? Im going to try it again today--ugh it smells like stinky feet.

[[br...]]

I just watched this vid,

 

http://www.howcast.com/videos/504365-Apple-Cider-Vinegar-for-Acid-Reflux-Stomach-Problems

 

she said 2-3 teaspoons, so maybe one and half in the morning and one and half at night. This what I will do as a starting block, then just tweak as I go, adding or reducing the amount if I need to, it will not be getting drank neat again I know that, let us know how you get on Jenny.

 

Thanks Mama, I hope so too. Wishing your nausea away...

[[sp...]]

Hello bring-it-on,

Thanks for the link. Her explanation for ACV working seems to assume everyone will be on a PPI, so that they can replace strong HCL acid with weak acetic...this is quite imaginative. I don't take acid suppressants at all if I can help it but ACV still works somehow. I've never read a convincing explanation of how.

 

I never take more than a teaspoonful in as little water as possible with food, and I would never take it at night. I also make salad dressing and mint sauce with it and sometimes use it neat with seafood, fish etc.

 

The gastric motility test is based on scintigraphy, done in nuclear medicine and safer than it sounds. As you describe your symptoms you do seem to have some difficulty emptying your stomach but that could still be down to benzos and their withdrawal. They certainly made mine worse.

 

Hey mama,

 

I don't use ginger capsules much, one a day for background usually. There are many brands and they are all different, except in that they are all processed to death. Whole ginger has many active substances and I have reasons for wanting them all so I eat whole ginger, usually crystallised occasionally stem, a chunk or two before food...any real food shop will have it and most supermarkets.

 

I cook with powdered ginger and today I also ate ginger and spice preserve but that's because I like it.

 

I regularly give it and anything else I take a rest. ALL gastric motility agents have the same problem...used continuously they stop working.

 

Take care,

 

spartacus

 

 

 

[[wi...]]

I have not started my taper off 9mgs of valium yet.  Everyone here seems to be off benzo's.  I'm so jealous!!    But I need advice as valium seems to upset my stomach.    I have celiac disease which doesn't help - very sensitive to medications.

 

I was on 40 mg nexium for 3 months after quick stopping of an SSRI.      I stopped nexium c/t on teh 25th of march.  Apparently this amounted in a cut to my valium dose as PPI's increase serum levels of valium in the body or make it hang around in the body longer.    I have stopped having diarrhoea since stopping the nexium  but now I have acid burning after taking my valium dose.       

 

So now I'm off nexium I get burning in my chest from taking the valium dose.    Valium does not sit that well with me - I did the c/o from a short acting benzo that I could not taper off.  I had no choice but to move over to valium.      My GI doc has recommended I take some nexium during my taper.  She said even if I take 20mgs instead of 40mgs.    A gastroscopy done two weeks ago showed mild gastritis.  But since then I've stopped the nexium.    Am noticing much more burning in chest - but am convinced it's from the valium rather than rebound.

 

Would it be a bad idea to go back on 20mg of nexium while I taper off valium.  I think I will be in for a long slow taper so will be on nexium a long time.    Of course my GI lady said that people don't ahve to taper off PPI's.   

 

I am sure I would not need a PPI if it wasn't for having to take the valium.    I really really really prefer not to take nexium but don't know how much damage I would be doing to my stomach if I ignore the acid reflux for period of taper.   

 

Have many people simply had to take a PPI while tapering?

[[Be...]]

Hi wiser-

 

I tried that Nexium a few years prior to my taper. Like you I was not very keen on using PPI.It worked ok for me for awhile, then reflux came back while I was still on it.  After a month or so of the Nexium, I decicded to C/T it. For approx. 2 weeks after C/T my indigestion canme back worse than before I started PPI.  Go figure.

 

What worked very well for me was Dgl liqorice root chewables combined with ginger root tea brewed using fresh ginger root.

 

BTW, after about 4-5 months of being benzo free, all of my reflux issues have resolved themselves. I had these for many year. No more, all gone, so it was attributed to the benzo Valium.

 

Consider trying this. Good luck to you!

 

Bella

[[wi...]]

Hi Bella,  so I can't work out from what you are saying whether you did you stay on nexium for your 1.5 yr taper?  Also I notice you tapered regardless of symptoms....  how bad were your symptoms and what age are you?    You must have tapered nearly 1mg per month.... 

 

thanks for replying...

[[br...]]

Wiser now,

 

I would try and do everything in your power to not take another PPI. At the time I was in your position I did not know BB existed and was to ill to think clearly, this is why it took me so long to get off them, that and just laziness, more of that fact it was just easier to stay on them.

 

If you have to stay on them, then of course do what you need to and if you do, I would only use the smallest amount of PPI possible and only use sporadically. I know armed with the right knowledge I could of got off and stayed off PPI's during my taper. It is up to you, remembering, it is important to rule out any non benzo wd related issues before you stop using PPI's. Wishing you well and your'e doing excellent.

 

Bella,

 

Well done on getting your stomach issues to zero. I bet it feels amazing, thanks for letting us know how you healed.

 

Day 10 PPI c/t wd,

 

Yesterday was the first fairly good nights sleep I have had since this c/t began. I found an excellent way to combat the burning,

 

LEMON JUICE.

 

I was tinkering about with how I drink the Lemon juice and largely inspired by Spartacus's idea for the ACV when she advised about only putting a small amount of water in to dilute.

 

I did the same with Lemon juice, I squirted about a third of a half of fresh Lemon juice into a glass then added about a third of water.

 

It tasted sour and I am used to adding a lot more water, I felt an almost immediate pain and instantly thought the worst, then a couple of minutes passed by and I guess the Lemon started Alkalizing in my stomach and to my amazement the burning I had in my stomach completely went away for the first time in 10 days.

 

As a result, I slept extremely well, considering what is going on in my stomach. The trick was getting the ratio of water to lemon correct, in the past I had been adding to much water and using to much lemon juice. My stomach still remains fairly calm through out, fingers crossed this is the beginning of the end of PPI wd.

 

I'm keen for someone else to try this and please come back to let us know how you get on.

 

Thanks for the advice Spartacus, without it I would have probably just kept on drinking the Lemon juice in the same old way.

[[sp...]]

Hey bring-it-on,

 

You describe the essence of what we all have to do, and the reason why this thread is so helpful.

 

Listen to what others have tried and then find out if, and how, it might work for us.

 

I will be revisiting lemon juice in the light of your experience:)

 

Take care, spartacus

[[Br...]]

I have not started my taper off 9mgs of valium yet.  Everyone here seems to be off benzo's.  I'm so jealous!!    But I need advice as valium seems to upset my stomach.    I have celiac disease which doesn't help - very sensitive to medications.

 

I was on 40 mg nexium for 3 months after quick stopping of an SSRI.      I stopped nexium c/t on teh 25th of march.  Apparently this amounted in a cut to my valium dose as PPI's increase serum levels of valium in the body or make it hang around in the body longer.    I have stopped having diarrhoea since stopping the nexium  but now I have acid burning after taking my valium dose.       

 

So now I'm off nexium I get burning in my chest from taking the valium dose.    Valium does not sit that well with me - I did the c/o from a short acting benzo that I could not taper off.  I had no choice but to move over to valium.      My GI doc has recommended I take some nexium during my taper.  She said even if I take 20mgs instead of 40mgs.    A gastroscopy done two weeks ago showed mild gastritis.  But since then I've stopped the nexium.    Am noticing much more burning in chest - but am convinced it's from the valium rather than rebound.

 

Would it be a bad idea to go back on 20mg of nexium while I taper off valium.  I think I will be in for a long slow taper so will be on nexium a long time.    Of course my GI lady said that people don't ahve to taper off PPI's.   

 

I am sure I would not need a PPI if it wasn't for having to take the valium.    I really really really prefer not to take nexium but don't know how much damage I would be doing to my stomach if I ignore the acid reflux for period of taper.   

 

Have many people simply had to take a PPI while tapering?

 

 

Hiya WiserNow.  Did you see my post to you?  http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=94455.msg1349137#msg1349137

 

Nexium has an unusually strong effect on diazepam and potentiates it by an average of 40%.  That is a lot.  If you vary your Nexium during your taper then you are likely to feel the effect it has on your diazepam.

 

It may be wise to avoid esomeprazole and omeprazole. 

 

I seem to recall that lansoprazole has a smaller effect on levels of diazepamand pantoprazole has a very small effect.

 

The extent of these effects depend on the genetics of the individual so there will be some variation.

 

 

 

[[Be...]]

 

 

Posted by: wisernow

« on: April 09, 2014, 06:47:22 am »Insert Quote

 

 

Hi Bella,  so I can't work out from what you are saying whether you did you stay on nexium for your 1.5 yr taper?  Also I notice you tapered regardless of symptoms....  how bad were your symptoms and what age are you?    You must have tapered nearly 1mg per month.... 

 

thanks for replying...

 

Hi Wiser-

 

Sorry about the confusion. I used Nexium for only a couple of months before my taper began, while I was in "tolerence", not while I was tapering. 

I did taper regardless of symptoms. I found that holding brought me little if any relief. I was one of those who are sensitive & instinctively knew that I was going to have  symptoms regardless, so I reasoned why prolong the agony if going slower does not bring significant relief. I can honestly say that I am so glad I tapered at the speed I did. I feel way way better now than while taking the Valium & I am not fully healed yet. This is for sure!

 

Symptoms were extreme after cold turkey. Then they mellowed out when I re-instated & began my taper. My symptoms were mostly tolerable, but vast. Over 30 symptoms.

 

I am 54 years young now

 

I did taper 1mg per month consistently. That worked well for me. A reasonable rate. Not to fast, not to slow, consistency wins the race.

 

Bella

 

Bella,

 

Well done on getting your stomach issues to zero. I bet it feels amazing, thanks for letting us know how you healed.

 

Hello b-i-o

 

Thanks! My reflux issues have indeed been gone for over a year now 

However, I am still experiencing the benzo belly, bloating, & vibration sensations in my stomach So I still have a ways to go. 

 

Glad you found the lemon juice to help with the burning you are experiencing in your stomach. I had good luck with the DGL also. Hopefully these issues will resolve themselves as you progress & heal.

 

Bella

[[wi...]]

Braban,  I missed your reply.  So glad I posted again and have now gone back over and read those posts.    I had the worst tolerance w/d s/x on nexium - unbelievable paresthesia all over my body.  Made my glasses fog up (in summer).    I woke at night to full bladder and after moving (as is necessary to empty bladder) I would come back to bed and the fire in my flesh would consume me - never known anything like it.      Night after nite for weeks.      I now have really bad nerve pain in my buttock and I keep linking it to those weeks I put up with the intense burning during tolerance w/d.    Mostly likely worse because of nexium.   

 

I now have 'indigestion' if I eat too much - but am always working to eat so as to keep my weight up.  Never have any appetite!!  I eat bland food mostly.    But one treat I have of an evening is honey and sheeps milk yoghurt but since I stopped nexium that treat seems to burn my chest.  :-(

 

I drink soda water when husband drinks wine.  I can squeeze lemon into it.  I tried the ACV but it burned my chest too much.    I will try ginger.    I will keep following this thread and hope like mad i can survive the valium taper without it burning a hole in my stomach.     

 

many many thanks for your reply Braban & Bella!!! 

 

 

[[ov...]]

Spartacus:  Thanks for the info on ginger?  I have not heard of crystallized ginger, where do you get it?  Health food store, grocery store?  Have seen ginger capsules.

 

Wisernow:  Good luck honey with the ginger and hope your bum is feeling better.

 

xo OC  :smitten:

[[br...]]

 

I drink soda water when husband drinks wine.  I can squeeze lemon into it.  I tried the ACV but it burned my chest too much.    I will try ginger.    I will keep following this thread and hope like mad i can survive the valium taper without it burning a hole in my stomach.     

 

many many thanks for your reply Braban & Bella!!!

 

Wisernow,

 

I would try and cut out all Carbonated Drinks, Dairy, Simple Sugars, all processed foods. Switch to Wholemeal Bread, Sugars from Fruit only, anything whole is better and no more Milk I'm afraid.

 

I would say up to 50% of your stomach sx could be cut if you do change your diet, it is a strong guesstimate but I'm confident you will see improvements. I know it's hard and a lot of effort when your'e in wd, the end results are worth the upheaval.

 

Day 13 PPI C/T W/D:

 

All appears calm and I feel I am over the worst of PPI WD. I still have constant burning in my stomach but all the other sx have calmed down, the bone aches, the back pain, the nightmares, the cold sensitivities, the bad moods, all of these have lifted. My BM's are much better. I just feel a little better all round. This was tough, I won't lie, though not as tough as I thought. I just hope I'm over the worst, I'm 99% certain.

 

It is clear to me now that I should never of been on these PPI's in the first place, at the time with a combination of the fear of the unknown, i.e, what was actually causing the stomach pain during benzo wd and then the actual benzo wd sx themselves, were just to much to handle, both mentally and physically. Looking back, had I of known the real reasons why I had stomach pain, things most certainly, would of been very different. I would not of ended up taking PPI's for almost 3 years

 

I am not out of the woods yet. Work has began on resuming normal activity in my stomach and it will take months, about 6 at a guess, to really feel back to my normal self again. The recovery from PPI wd will tie in nicely with my benzo wd recovery times, I have been linear so far, it looks like the PPI wd and Benzo wd recoveries will meet up, if this makes sense. Theoretically, speeding up overall benzo wd recovery times.

 

I Hope everyone is ok. Wishing you all speedy recoveries.