The Easier Taper Support Group

[[Ca...]]

Thanks for the information Candice!

 

It definitely helps to know what to expect beyond what I experienced with a 25% reduction. You mention that you have trouble driving. That could be a deal breaker for me as I work out of town. Is it because of the medication or a symptom with withdrawl? I am glad there are others here that offer positive feedback to us newbies!

 

You’re most welcome!  For me, my driving is affected by disruptions to my vestibular system as well as pre-existing PTSD from a big car accident long before I even knew what benzos were. Also, not everyone develops problems driving, I know plenty of people the drove throughout their withdrawal and healing. You’ll only know as you go. 

[[be...]]

Hi 52.  It's updose.  You would only updose if your symptoms are very bad.  To hold, you symptoms should be getting worse and and you want to hold as quickly as possible to keep them from ramping to the point you need to updose.  Updosing and holding when the symptoms have become out of control or you are working and need to keep yourself as stable as possible.  So there are many reasons to do a hold, an updose, or both.  All are symptom intensity related and what is happening in your life at the time.  I hope that made sense.  Mary 💜

[[Zu...]]

Thanks Candice. A lot of my anxiety right now is coming from anticipation of what could happen. I know I need to learn to live in the here and now if I have any chance of tapering successfully. I've always been the type of person that wants to know as much as possible and be prepared. Benzo WD is just one of those things that doesn't give you a solid to do list lol. It's nice to know that a 25% cut may have just been too much and that a smaller reduction may help me be much less symptomatic. I plan on dry tapering up until I get down to the smaller doses. At that point I'll either have to get creative or switch to a DLMT (which still sounds hard to do). However if I'm lucky maybe i can get away with just a dry taper before jumping.

[[ga...]]

Thanks everyone!

 

I guess one thing that is constantly bothering me about all this is, I really have no idea what a 'comfortable' taper feels like. The week that I tapered put me in a very dark place that I do not want to return to. What does one expect as 'tolerable'?

 

My biggest fear is going back to the constant fear, panic, and depressive state. My physical WD symptoms didn't go much further than muscle/eye twitches, fast heart rate/palpitations and I think it's causing my BP to rise. Naturally not being able to sleep either. The doc put me on lisinopril (5mg) to compensate, and this is one of the reasons I want to get off. I currently smoke, but will be working toward quitting as I'm sure it will just make everything worse, but it's also a nervous habit of mine which makes it difficult.

 

My problem is I'm afraid my doctor will think I'm an addict and start tapering me right away with 10 other medications to go with it. I am hoping this is an unsound fear but I won't know until I try. If he decides to taper me too quickly I'll do my best to find a different doctor before time runs out.

 

At this point I just want my life back. For the 8 years or so I've been taking the 1MG it never gave me any problems, but after the taper I haven't felt 'right' since. It's just one of those situations where I don't want to take this medication if it does this to me, but I'm terrified to go through the taper if it is uncomfortable as I cannot take time off work, nor lose my job.

 

My bosses are aware of this, as I gave them full disclosure on what to expect from me, and they were the ones pushing me to go to a doctor and get it worked out as its been a constant distraction at work worrying about tapering.

 

Thank you for your kind words everyone!

 

Zurek, I would expect anyone who cut 25% off their Xanax to have horrible symptoms. That is a HUGE amount. 10% is the most I would tel anyone to cut at one time. And then wait 2-4 weeks before making another cut. That is called cut and hold. Some people prefer that because they tend to have a week or so of bad symptoms and then feel better for the next few weeks. Other people, like me, could never tolerate that large of a cut. I did a daily liquid micro-taper, making a tiny cut each day. It was much gentler.

 

I think no matter what system you choose, the secret is to go s-l-o-w-l-y, especially if you have been on your med for years. If your symptoms ramp up to where you cannot live your life, you probably need to pause and start up again more slowly.  That's what I would ask myself. Can I live my life with these symptoms? You may be not sleeping well or may be having a lot of anxiety, but if you can go to work and take care of yourself and those who rely on you, then I would say the taper is working.

 

I think there is a support group for people who are working full time during their tapers. Try scrolling through the support groups and give it a bump if it needs one. I think those people will have good advice on how to manage your symptoms while working.

 

As for your doctor, I would suggest approaching him carefully. Tell him you are considering it. See how he reacts. At the first sign of him jerking away your med, I would advise backing off and telling him you want to think about it. Be creative, if necessary. I exaggerated a family emergency to get my doctor to slow down.

 

I'm sorry to say that your bosses have too much faith in doctors. The doctors are trained by pharma. Parma does not tell them about withdrawal syndromes. My doctor learned about withdrawal and tapering from me. In the end he said it was an educational experience for him. I was very lucky he was so open-minded. And also that he was not afraid of benzos at all when I started tapering! He is now, though.

[[bl...]]

I am new here and really need this thread. Thank you for starting it.

 

Hello Buv and wellcome to this thread! I'm new too, I started this taper before two months.

 

I wish you health and the easier taper! 

 

[[ga...]]

The wonderful support you all provide says to reduce the amount we are taking based on symptoms.

 

For those of you tapering from K, when do symptoms show up?  I started a taper in November at 0.5mg and I am at now at 0.365. If you have symptoms that are difficult do you just hold at that dosage or do you update? When do people update? I am also working with a compounding pharmacy. Thanks for your help with this!

 

52, Mary gave good advice. If you have questions specific to Klonopin, I suggest you check out the Klonopin Klub.

[[Zu...]]

As for your doctor, I would suggest approaching him carefully. Tell him you are considering it. See how he reacts. At the first sign of him jerking away your med, I would advise backing off and telling him you want to think about it. Be creative, if necessary. I exaggerated a family emergency to get my doctor to slow down.

 

Yeah? That makes me worried about even going now. Do you think I'd be better off looking for a benzo wise doctor? Like I said this a new doc of mine and he currently isn't aware I've been on xanax for 8 years, I was just sent to him after a hospital visit. I did not have a script for them until I saw him (Stupid yes, I just took it because it was prescribed before and I had bad anxiety. I'm probably stupid to expect he will trust anything I say, but BWD is serious). He warned me about how addicting xanax is, but never said anything more than that. That's actually what led me to research BWD in the first place. I dunno, if this doesn't go well then who knows what will happen to me. Had I honestly known that you could become physically dependent on xanax I would have stayed off the first time I quit taking them.

 

He likely isn't stupid however. I called the nurse after tapering 7 days and told her that I was taking 1mg and tried to taper down to .75 mg and that I was having really bad rebound anxiety, which after that the doctor prescribed 1.5mg xanax as needed along with 50mg trazadone. So he either already knows and just let me stay on them (I really do have a GAD and knows I was on them before). So who knows how this will go.

[[Mo...]]

Thanks Candice. A lot of my anxiety right now is coming from anticipation of what could happen. I know I need to learn to live in the here and now if I have any chance of tapering successfully. I've always been the type of person that wants to know as much as possible and be prepared. Benzo WD is just one of those things that doesn't give you a solid to do list lol. It's nice to know that a 25% cut may have just been too much and that a smaller reduction may help me be much less symptomatic. I plan on dry tapering up until I get down to the smaller doses. At that point I'll either have to get creative or switch to a DLMT (which still sounds hard to do). However if I'm lucky maybe i can get away with just a dry taper before jumping.

 

I have that fear, I think everybody does. I'm going very slowly and I feel it. But so far it has not been as bad as I anticipated it. I did c/o to valium and that may be part of an easier taper, I don't know. When I passed the 2mg mark which was about 4 weeks ago, it hit me. Not as bad as I thought it was. But enough to keep me in bed for a week. I had a 10% cut and that was too much. Last week I tried to go a little every day but at day 4 I had to hold, but it was much easier, so I'll try that again. I'm dry cutting so I have to do it by weight of the pills and not the mg. I would suggest you weigh your pill. For a valium that I get. Each 2mg pill is about .156 grams. So going down .004 grams is around 2-4%. My math might be off. I'm using a spreadsheet so I don't actually do the math. Benzo brain

 

Try going so much slower and in smaller pieces. Also a lot of people, like myself, are having an easier time going off valium. I was on klonopin .5mg but convinced my doctors to c/o to 10mg valium (the equivalent dose). The pills come in smaller doses than xanax, so easier to cut.

 

It's nerve wracking to think about bad it might get. But I think the horror stories are in the minority and those who had and easier time rarely join groups like this.

[[ga...]]

As for your doctor, I would suggest approaching him carefully. Tell him you are considering it. See how he reacts. At the first sign of him jerking away your med, I would advise backing off and telling him you want to think about it. Be creative, if necessary. I exaggerated a family emergency to get my doctor to slow down.

 

Yeah? That makes me worried about even going now. Do you think I'd be better off looking for a benzo wise doctor? Like I said this a new doc of mine and he currently isn't aware I've been on xanax for 8 years, I was just sent to him after a hospital visit. I did not have a script for them until I saw him (Stupid yes, I just took it because it was prescribed before and I had bad anxiety. I'm probably stupid to expect he will trust anything I say, but BWD is serious). He warned me about how addicting xanax is, but never said anything more than that. That's actually what led me to research BWD in the first place. I dunno, if this doesn't go well then who knows what will happen to me. Had I honestly known that you could become physically dependent on xanax I would have stayed off the first time I quit taking them.

 

He likely isn't stupid however. I called the nurse after tapering 7 days and told her that I was taking 1mg and tried to taper down to .75 mg and that I was having really bad rebound anxiety, which after that the doctor prescribed 1.5mg xanax as needed along with 50mg trazadone. So he either already knows and just let me stay on them (I really do have a GAD and knows I was on them before). So who knows how this will go.

 

Wouldn't hurt to look, but I don't know if you'll find one. Some doctors sound one way and act another way. If you've had a good relationship with this doctor and he knows you, you might do better sticking with him. If you look, but make sure you look somewhere outside of your current group so your current doctor doesn't find out you're looking. I looked at one point and my doctor found out and it hurt our relationship.

 

I know people who never told their doctor at all. I kept ahead of mine the whole way and built up a stash so I could slow down if I needed to. I know many other people who built up stashes, too. My insurance lets me refill at 28 days, so I always would and then had 2 extra days. And then the next month I filled at 28 days again and then had 4 extra days. Like that. I also started up tapering after my hold before I told my doctor I had started up and got a whole month ahead of him. In my case, I was being paranoid. He never over-rushed me. He just would say something about going faster now and again, but never did. Think he was on the fence over whether I was an addict or dependent. At some point I think he did some research on his own about withdrawal syndromes because he stopped rushing me at all.

 

One important thing, I kept my own record of my taper in writing and gave it to a family member so somebody besides me knew what I was taking. That was in case I had some kind of medical emergency. So I had my own record of where I was at and a separate record of where my doctor thought I was at. It got danged complicated! It would have been simpler if I had just tapered without telling him.

 

I sure didn't like lying. I was uncomfortable every time I went in. That was an added stress. But having a stash reduced my stress, so it was a tradeoff.

 

My doctor also had no fear of long-term benzo use when I started my taper. It sounds like that's where your doctor is at. Now my doctor is trying to get his patients off, not very successfully. So ideas are changing.

 

Here's a thought, you could tell your doctor you want to be on the lowest dose you can be and still control your GAD, so would like to try to get lower, say half your current dose. If you have a good relationship with your doctor and sound eager to take less med, I think it unlikely he will think you are an addict. Then you'd have him helping you, your bosses would have more peace of mind, and you'd be tapering not in secret.

 

That's what I'm doing with my gabapentin. Nobody thought I should get off except me. I told my doctor I wanted to get lower and still control my nerve pain and RLS just so I was putting less drug in my body. Doctors usually like patients taking the "lowest effective dose." Just something to think about.

 

And please remember, we are all a bit paranoid while withdrawing. And some people get anxiety from just taking the benzo. So try not to let worrying thoughts loop around in your head. Try to "change the channel" when you notice them. Here's how I coped with looping thoughts.

 

• I noticed them and responded to myself with compassion. "I notice my thoughts are looping again. That's normal during withdrawal."
  
• Then I changed the channel, even said in my mind, "Changing the channel," and shifted gently to something else. Gently but firmly is an important mindset. You don't want to be harsh and scolding with yourself. That just leads to more anxiety.
  

Distraction is an important tool in this process. I kept funny youtube videos bookmarked. I took up a new hobby I could think about. If you have work, that is a good way to occupy your mind. Keeping your mind occupied and distracting are important. Your brain naturally wants to focus on problems. In benzo withdrawal, it will be hyper-focused. So it's work to learn to change the channel over and over and over. The more you do it, the more it will become automatic, the easier it will become.

 

I know you had a bad experience so are scared. But, I assure you, that was way too huge a cut you made. I did the same thing, started way to fast and freaked myself out. When I slowed down it went better. When you go slower, it will go better, too. You can do this!

[[ga...]]

 

It's nerve wracking to think about bad it might get. But I think the horror stories are in the minority and those who had and easier time rarely join groups like this.

 

:thumbsup:

 

The number of people with horror stories is low, but the number of posts is high because suffering people post more. It's natural. When we are scared our brains try to connect to other people and to focus on our problem in order to fix it. That's what brains do.

[[Zu...]]

Thanks Gardener.

 

That's not a bad idea, I think I may start there and if things go well I see no reason not to continue with the tapering. My next problem is basically working. I know it seems like people can manage to work but ever since I tried to taper I haven't felt good. I hate my job so of course that isn't helping anything, but for some reason I just feel lost and hopeless. I'm so jealous of those who were able to stay home and taper off / recover from benzos. I had another bad day at work and I'm pretty sure I'm ready to look for another job, unfortunately where I live the work sucks and good paying jobs discriminate against cannabis use. I use cannabis to help keep my mind the in the right place and to relax. I don't smoke a lot of it but enough to fail a drug test. Ironically it recently was legalized where I live but it will take time for jobs to become more lax in their hiring protocols.

[[Ca...]]

Thanks Candice. A lot of my anxiety right now is coming from anticipation of what could happen. I know I need to learn to live in the here and now if I have any chance of tapering successfully. I've always been the type of person that wants to know as much as possible and be prepared. Benzo WD is just one of those things that doesn't give you a solid to do list lol. It's nice to know that a 25% cut may have just been too much and that a smaller reduction may help me be much less symptomatic. I plan on dry tapering up until I get down to the smaller doses. At that point I'll either have to get creative or switch to a DLMT (which still sounds hard to do). However if I'm lucky maybe i can get away with just a dry taper before jumping.

 

You have an innate ability to heal and you will find your way through this    Like others have said, it's only natural to feel overwhelmed and fearful.  Definitely stay away from the horror stories- usually they are a result of a rapid taper, a CT, or because of other factors including taking multiple medications. 

 

I agree that a 25% dose reduction is way too big, even for a cut and hold.  If you could handle that large of a reduction of a short acting benzodiazepine for a week- I have faith that you're going to do just fine with a slow taper.  I also agree that a daily micro taper is the most gentle way of tapering. 

 

Give yourself grace, you're getting through this, one step at a time, and you're never alone.

[[ga...]]

Thanks Gardener.

 

That's not a bad idea, I think I may start there and if things go well I see no reason not to continue with the tapering. My next problem is basically working. I know it seems like people can manage to work but ever since I tried to taper I haven't felt good. I hate my job so of course that isn't helping anything, but for some reason I just feel lost and hopeless. I'm so jealous of those who were able to stay home and taper off / recover from benzos. I had another bad day at work and I'm pretty sure I'm ready to look for another job, unfortunately where I live the work sucks and good paying jobs discriminate against cannabis use. I use cannabis to help keep my mind the in the right place and to relax. I don't smoke a lot of it but enough to fail a drug test. Ironically it recently was legalized where I live but it will take time for jobs to become more lax in their hiring protocols.

 

I'm sorry things are hard for you at work. I would really suggest you check out these two support groups.

 

Cannabis and CBD

 

Full Time Workers

 

It's especially important to figure out if cannabis and Xanax interact in some way. I decided against using CBD because it interacts with my Seroquel.

 

Not sure if the full time worker group is active, but reading through old posts can be helpful. Also, if you give it a bump, people may show up.

 

I would add that it may take awhile for you to recover from the effects of your large cut. Give yourself some time.

 

I would also recommend the ebook Xanax Withdrawal by Shipko. He has some very helpful information in there.:thumbs:

 

Take your time with this. Those who rush are the ones who have the most problems. You can do this. One step at a time.

[[Zu...]]

Will do Gardener! I just purchased the book. Hoping I can find perspective and meaning in the struggle to a better life. I appreciate all Candices and your help. You two are a god send!

[[ga...]]

Will do Gardener! I just purchased the book. Hoping I can find perspective and meaning in the struggle to a better life. I appreciate all Candices and your help. You two are a god send!

 

We're paying it forward. Some day you will, too!

[[Zu...]]

I absolutely hope so!

 

After reading Dr. Shipkos book, I actually feel a lot more confident about it. It's nice to know most people can achieve a relatively easy taper if done properly. My doctor did prescribe 50mg Trazodone (SNRI) so I am hoping that doesn't come bite me in the butt.

 

The way Shipko talks about it makes xanax seem like the better option to taper, and who knows, if I was managing (although uncomfortable) a 25% reduction for a week. I'm beginning to have confidence that smaller reductions may actually not be so bad for me. I know I'm not getting out of this without any discomfort, but if it is no where near the level of discomfort I already felt, I think I can do this.

 

Now to just convince my doctor to let me do a patient controlled taper, well see how that goes.

[[ga...]]

I absolutely hope so!

 

After reading Dr. Shipkos book, I actually feel a lot more confident about it. It's nice to know most people can achieve a relatively easy taper if done properly. My doctor did prescribe 50mg Trazodone (SNRI) so I am hoping that doesn't come bite me in the butt.

 

The way Shipko talks about it makes xanax seem like the better option to taper, and who knows, if I was managing (although uncomfortable) a 25% reduction for a week. I'm beginning to have confidence that smaller reductions may actually not be so bad for me. I know I'm not getting out of this without any discomfort, but if it is no where near the level of discomfort I already felt, I think I can do this.

 

Now to just convince my doctor to let me do a patient controlled taper, well see how that goes.

 

You've got this!

[[Ca...]]

I absolutely hope so!

 

After reading Dr. Shipkos book, I actually feel a lot more confident about it. It's nice to know most people can achieve a relatively easy taper if done properly. My doctor did prescribe 50mg Trazodone (SNRI) so I am hoping that doesn't come bite me in the butt.

 

The way Shipko talks about it makes xanax seem like the better option to taper, and who knows, if I was managing (although uncomfortable) a 25% reduction for a week. I'm beginning to have confidence that smaller reductions may actually not be so bad for me. I know I'm not getting out of this without any discomfort, but if it is no where near the level of discomfort I already felt, I think I can do this.

 

Now to just convince my doctor to let me do a patient controlled taper, well see how that goes.

 

Yes!  That's exactly right!  You definitely have got this 

[[Mo...]]

I absolutely hope so!

 

After reading Dr. Shipkos book, I actually feel a lot more confident about it. It's nice to know most people can achieve a relatively easy taper if done properly. My doctor did prescribe 50mg Trazodone (SNRI) so I am hoping that doesn't come bite me in the butt.

 

The way Shipko talks about it makes xanax seem like the better option to taper, and who knows, if I was managing (although uncomfortable) a 25% reduction for a week. I'm beginning to have confidence that smaller reductions may actually not be so bad for me. I know I'm not getting out of this without any discomfort, but if it is no where near the level of discomfort I already felt, I think I can do this.

 

Now to just convince my doctor to let me do a patient controlled taper, well see how that goes.

 

I've been on trazadone for awhile. So I understand about biting you in the butt. But (pun intended) it is so easy to get to sleep. I'll deal with this drug next after I'm healed.

[[Mo...]]

When I get my brain back I'm going to learn long division (again). Perhaps even fractions. Whoo hoo! No more relying on the internet for basic math.

 

I have to have goals.

[[ga...]]

When I get my brain back I'm going to learn long division (again). Perhaps even fractions. Whoo hoo! No more relying on the internet for basic math.

 

I have to have goals.

 

Absolutely!

[[Ca...]]

When I get my brain back I'm going to learn long division (again). Perhaps even fractions. Whoo hoo! No more relying on the internet for basic math.

 

I have to have goals.

 

Absolutely!

 

I simply cannot say no to the German chocolate wafer cookies currently in my pantry because the children wanted them.  I've been able to cut out sugar since Christmas and my body loves this, but, the past two nights I have eaten a handful of these delightful, evil treats.  .

[[Mo...]]

When I get my brain back I'm going to learn long division (again). Perhaps even fractions. Whoo hoo! No more relying on the internet for basic math.

 

I have to have goals.

 

Absolutely!

 

I simply cannot say no to the German chocolate wafer cookies currently in my pantry because the children wanted them.  I've been able to cut out sugar since Christmas and my body loves this, but, the past two nights I have eaten a handful of these delightful, evil treats.  .

 

I know what you mean. I ate handfuls of Hershey's chocolate kisses last night and paid for it today. My wd were worse today. But they were sooooo goood. I'm looking at them today and I feel nauseous just thinking about them. But I'll forget how bad they made me feel and I'll do it again. It will probably take me a year to taper valium, and I have to give up sugar?

 

To be able to eat chocolate again is a good goal to have.

[[ga...]]

I didn't give up any foods. I was just careful to to over-indulge. But each person is different. The key to an easier taper is to figure out how your own body reacts to things. Jot down a few notes if you notice something makes you feel worse or if something makes you feel better. And then set the notes aside and get on with life. Put your mind on things besides your taper.

[[Ca...]]

I didn't give up any foods. I was just careful to to over-indulge. But each person is different. The key to an easier taper is to figure out how your own body reacts to things. Jot down a few notes if you notice something makes you feel worse or if something makes you feel better. And then set the notes aside and get on with life. Put your mind on things besides your taper.

 

Good advice for us all!  I’ve been at this for so long, I know my body really well and sugar along with dairy and wheat are big triggers to my nervous system. But, I can’t say no to those dang wafers    I made the kids eat the rest of the bag after dinner last night so they’ll be out of the house, lol.