The Easier Taper Support Group

[[bl...]]

Hi all 

 

Congratulations to all that made it through (and those that are in the process 😊)

 

May please I join the group?

 

This is my first post (after my introduction) and I am still working on my taper plan.

 

Before anything else, I wanted first to say to anyone that might come to this thread for some reassurance, that quitting benzos easy (or easily) is possible. My first-time off benzos, 9mg bromazepam after 13 years of use, was almost like a “walk in the park”. I only had very mild anxiety some days that was lasting only for a few hours. That was all! No acute after discontinuation, nothing.

 

So, why am I here at this forum looking for help? Because after one year, a fertility doctor prescribed me benzos for a few weeks, before an IVF. I got pregnant, so I stopped the benzos cold turkey but this time was not easy at all. It was beyond words. The worst part is that I miscarried, with no profound reason for this. I had a very good pregnancy, so I always think that it might have been the benzo withdrawal (plus the hormones) that caused my loss. After that, I reinstated/upped my dose.

 

In any case, I believe that the symptoms might vary not only from person to person, but also from period to period, namely, the specific situation a person is at the time of tapering.

 

So now I have to figure out how to taper my 12mg bromazepam (lexotanil) 3mg x 4 times a day, in six to (maximum) eight months (I have to be off before end of July 2020  ). I don’t know if this will be an easy taper or not, but I need to stay positive!

 

Right now, I am “fighting” with percentages and calculations.  Any advice on tapering rate and reaching my goal on time, will be more than welcome!

 

Best wishes to all!

 

Blue sea

 

[[Ma...]]

Hi all 

 

Congratulations to all that made it through (and those that are in the process 😊)

 

May please I join the group?

 

This is my first post (after my introduction) and I am still working on my taper plan.

 

Before anything else, I wanted first to say to anyone that might come to this thread for some reassurance, that quitting benzos easy (or easily) is possible. My first-time off benzos, 9mg bromazepam after 13 years of use, was almost like a “walk in the park”. I only had very mild anxiety some days that was lasting only for a few hours. That was all! No acute after discontinuation, nothing.

 

So, why am I here at this forum looking for help? Because after one year, a fertility doctor prescribed me benzos for a few weeks, before an IVF. I got pregnant, so I stopped the benzos cold turkey but this time was not easy at all. It was beyond words. The worst part is that I miscarried, with no profound reason for this. I had a very good pregnancy, so I always think that it might have been the benzo withdrawal (plus the hormones) that caused my loss. After that, I reinstated/upped my dose.

 

In any case, I believe that the symptoms might vary not only from person to person, but also from period to period, namely, the specific situation a person is at the time of tapering.

 

So now I have to figure out how to taper my 12mg bromazepam (lexotanil) 3mg x 4 times a day, in six to (maximum) eight months (I have to be off before end of July 2020  ). I don’t know if this will be an easy taper or not, but I need to stay positive!

 

Right now, I am “fighting” with percentages and calculations.  Any advice on tapering rate and reaching my goal on time, will be more than welcome!

 

Best wishes to all!

 

Blue sea

 

Hey Blue Sea, I am so sorry that has happened to you.  That must have been really hard to deal with.

I have no idea if it was benzo's.  What I would recommend now, after all that's happened, and this is just my opinion.  In the beginning of the taper, until you see how your symptoms are, I would go very slow and at a low dose.  No more than 5% a month, and going by a symptom taper.  That way you can see your reaction.  If things are pretty tolerable for you, you can always speed up.  To help find a taper plan for you, go to the Homepage and scroll down until you see the different taper plans.  Give them a good read and decide which one sounds best for you.  Then you can ask for help on that thread for creating a plan.  I wish you lots of luck.  Mary 🍀🍀

[[be...]]

[glow=red,2,300]Welcome, [/glow]Blue Sea I agree with what Mary posted, and I am sure others will come on and comment too. 💖 Peace and Healing. :smitten:

[[bl...]]

Hi Mary5588 and Begood thank you both so much! :smitten:

 

I am seen a psychiatrist for prescribing the pills and he is (kindly) insisting that I have to quit. He proposes cutting half a pill (1.5mg) per month, which seems a bit too much for me, as I still have tinnitus since my cold turkey (it is much less intense after all these years, but still it comes and goes).

 

Your recommendation sounds very reasonable (thanks!!!) and I will start with a 5% reduction from tomorrow.  Let’s see how it will go from there

 

Begood congratulations for your freedom!!!

Mary5588 from your signature I see you have accomplished so much!!!

You are both great examples for me to follow and stay positive 😊

 

Thanks again!

 

Peace and Healing to you too! 

 

[[ga...]]

Welcome, blue sea! Here's a link to the board for making taper plans. If you want to do a daily micro-taper, I would choose the Titration Board. They usually help with difficult math there.

 

Planning Your Taper

 

A 5% cut is a reasonable place to start. I would suggest waiting a month before you try your next cut. Pay attention to how you feel, if you can tolerate the symptoms, how long it takes for them to resolve. If the month goes well, you could either make a bigger cut the next time or make your 5% cuts closer together. I would lean toward the latter. I really hope your doctor is willing to go along with this. Usually, if the prescriber believes you are sincere in really wanting to get off, they are willing to be flexible.

 

I think we've all learned that it's easier to start slowly and then pick up the pace rather than start too fast, crash, and try to recover. You're on the right track to start with a small cut. Slow and steady wins the race!

 

Gardie

[[Ma...]]

blue sea, keep us posted, all three of us  will always be around if you need support or ask questions.  .  Lots of luck!!

[[bl...]]

 

Hi gardener99 and Mary5588 

 

thank you so much for all the help!

 

gardener99, you are so right!!! “Slow and steady wins the race!”.

I will remind this to myself every day! 

 

I understand why you propose smaller cuts closer together than bigger ones more apart. It seems so much safer, so I will do that! Thank you!

 

Mary5588 I am so grateful for your kindness and support!   :smitten:It is much needed! I will keep you updated 😊

 

Today I have started my 5% dry cut reduction. (Fingers and toes crossed that it will go ok). During this cut, I am planning to read everything about daily micro-taper at the Titration Board as gardener99 proposed, maybe it is easier than calculating dry cuts.

 

Concerning my doctor, he is nice. Even though he stated from the beginning that he believes that I have to quit the benzos, he never really pressed me. Until I told him that I want to get off the pills. Surprise: the same evening, he mailed me a reduction plan   Anyway, I believe he has the best intentions and this is what he perceives as a very “slow” taper. The problem is that he proposes stable 1.5mg reductions on the original dose, so after 4 cuts I will be 50% down the dose and every reduction will be bigger. I will have to talk to him again and your advices are a huge gift to me for this discussion too!

 

Thank you from the bottom of my heart, all three of you!

 

I wish you all the hapiness and healing and everything you wish for to come true 

 

Blue sea

 

[[ga...]]

blue, you are right that your doc's plan is too fast. I hope he will come around. Have you seen the The Ashton Manual? Perhaps he would be open to slowing down if he read it. Also, BIC has good info for patients and prescribers. 

[[Ol...]]

Hi Blue,

Glad you are getting some good advice. Your doctor's plan does sound way too fast for most, so I hope he is open to you controlling your own taper based on symptoms. Keep us updated on your progress! I hope you have an 'easier' taper.

[[bl...]]

 

Hi Gardener99 and OliveKitty,

 

 

Gardener99 great links! Thanks! (I have started reading your blog today. It’s really very helpful! 😊 )

 

 

OliveKitty thank you very much!

 

I can see from your signature that you have come a long way! Congrats!!!

Yes, controlling my own taper would be ideal.

 

I just booked an appointment with my doctor for next Thursday. I will give him the Ashton manual and the info from BIC and I hope he will understand. Meanwhile, I am doing all the reading I have to do and collecting info from the forum, while I am trying to avoid threads that, at the moment, make me feel a bit less positive.

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to be here for me!

 

Wishes for an 'easier' taper and healing for all!

 

Blue

 

[[bl...]]

Gardener I meant p-log, sorry, I don't know well what means what at the forum yet. 

[[ga...]]

Gardener I meant p-log, sorry, I don't know well what means what at the forum yet. 

 

It's OK. I knew what you meant because I don't have a blog. Did you know that you can edit your posts by clicking on modify at the upper right? The button is there for a day or so. Also, if you click preview at the lower right, you can see what the post looks like before you post it.

 

I'm glad I took the time to clean up my p-log about a week ago. It was rambling like crazy for awhile. Now it only rambles a little. The rambling is because I use it to save funny animal pictures that I don't want to lose. I need them for Fiona's blog. You should come over there and see what we're up to! Anyone who can figure out the story line is welcome to join in! Her blog is called Looking forward to a new life.

[[be...]]

Hi Gardie, I see you put the critters to sleep tonight, they are so busy that they do not care about any Partay's :D

 

Blue Sea, another thing you can do, is read from the beginning of this thread, lots of good information and thoughts. Stay Strong. 💖 Peace and Healing.

[[ga...]]

Hi Gardie, I see you put the critters to sleep tonight, they are so busy that they do not care about any Partay's :D

 

 

They wore themselves out visiting all the Santas!

[[bl...]]

Hi all,

 

How are you today?

 

Gardener I like very much the funny animal pictures on your p-log! I would love to join in Fiona's blog, thanks! I will try first to catch up with what’s going on with the critters

Thanks for the guidance on posting! it seems that my "preview" is not working, but since I can edit, it is not big deal!

 

Begood great idea!! I will do this!

By now, I started reading the Progress Logs to learn from your journeys and it seems really helpful.

 

I don’t have much news, I think I caught the flu, which is not a surprise as everybody around here has it. I will stay home and read 😊

 

Peace and Healing to all 

 

Blue

 

[[ga...]]

Hope you feel better soon! This reminds me to pester my kids to get their flu shots!

[[be...]]

Hi all,

 

How are you today?

 

Gardener I like very much the funny animal pictures on your p-log! I would love to join in Fiona's blog, thanks! I will try first to catch up with what’s going on with the critters

Thanks for the guidance on posting! it seems that my "preview" is not working, but since I can edit, it is not big deal!

 

Begood great idea!! I will do this!

By now, I started reading the Progress Logs to learn from your journeys and it seems really helpful.

 

I don’t have much news, I think I caught the flu, which is not a surprise as everybody around here has it. I will stay home and read 😊

 

Peace and Healing to all 

 

Blue

Yes rest and read, I like reading plogs too. Drink plenty of fluids and keep warm. May you feel better soon. 💖 Peace and Healing. 

[[ga...]]

Checking in to report that this easier taper method works for tapering gabapentin, too. I expect it would work for any psych med.

 

My method is a cautious, symptoms-based taper. I use a flexible schedule that allows me to listen to my body and slow down or speed up depending on my symptoms. Every time I speed up, I do it cautiously with only slight increases.

 

Here's how I decided on a rate for this taper. I first tried cut and hold. I have capsules so I liquefied. I made a large-ish cut and waited about 2 weeks. I felt OK after 2 weeks, so I did it again. That one didn't go so well, so I decided I really needed to wait 3 weeks between cuts. So I did that. Then I decided that I didn't like cut-and-hold very much and I would go back to figuring out daily micro-taper cuts. The larger cuts I had made gave me an idea of what a good taper rate for micro-tapering for me would be, about 20% per month. So now I'm micro-tapering again at about 20% per month.

 

There's a good post by builder about this which explains how to figure out your micro taper daily cuts. I'm going to fetch it and quote it here so everyone can see the formula. The math works. This is just a formula with an example. You plug in your own numbers.

 

 

It's a very simple procedure that any one can do. Example:

 

10mg daily dose

5% reduction every 14 days

 

Daily dose X percentage cut:

10mg X 5% = .5mg reduction

 

Divide reduction by days:

.5mg/14 days = .036mg/day reduction (and if you want, you can round up to .04mg/day, or round down to .03mg/day)

 

The formula works for any benzo, any dose level, and any desired taper rate.

 

One thing I would add is to consider recalculating at the beginning of every month. And to remember that you can adjust your taper rate at any time depending on how much your taper is affecting your life. People who have very stressful lives might need a slower rate. Some people can use a faster rate. Builder's example is just that, an example.

[[ga...]]

Hi all,

 

How are you today?

 

Gardener I like very much the funny animal pictures on your p-log! I would love to join in Fiona's blog, thanks! I will try first to catch up with what’s going on with the critters

Thanks for the guidance on posting! it seems that my "preview" is not working, but since I can edit, it is not big deal!

 

Begood great idea!! I will do this!

By now, I started reading the Progress Logs to learn from your journeys and it seems really helpful.

 

I don’t have much news, I think I caught the flu, which is not a surprise as everybody around here has it. I will stay home and read 😊

 

Peace and Healing to all 

 

Blue

 

Blue, trying scrolling up after you hit preview. It may be there but too high up to see it. Also are you better from the flu yet? I sure hope so!

[[bl...]]

 

Hi Gardener and Begood

 

How are you? Thanks so much for your wishes 

 

I am feeling a lot better from the flu this week. And I finally went to see my doctor concerning the cutting rate. To my surprise, he has already heard about the Ashton manual! The good part: he agreed to let me do slower cuts. The "grey" part: he believes that cutting 5% of my dose is too small of a cut and it will take me ages to quit.  Anyway, he agreed with me to "start the cuts and see" (apologies for my horrible english).

 

I feel a huge relief!

I only wish that I will have a clear mind to work during all this period! My doctor said that he doesn't expect me to experience something more than insomnia and anxiety as side effects, but when I asked him again if he is sure about this, he said that he can't be sure. Also, he is not sure what will happen with my tinitus.

 

I have a lot to write, but I don't want to make this post toooo long and selfish and to bother you more!

 

I'm so happy that I met you! You can't imagine how important it is to me!

 

Gardener I'm happy that micro tapering is working on cutting the gabapeptin!

And I will study the formula you shared

 

Best wishes to all 

 

Blue

[[be...]]

 

Hi Gardener and Begood

 

How are you? Thanks so much for your wishes 

 

I am feeling a lot better from the flu this week. And I finally went to see my doctor concerning the cutting rate. To my surprise, he has already heard about the Ashton manual! The good part: he agreed to let me do slower cuts. The "grey" part: he believes that cutting 5% of my dose is too small of a cut and it will take me ages to quit.  Anyway, he agreed with me to "start the cuts and see" (apologies for my horrible english).

 

I feel a huge relief!

I only wish that I will have a clear mind to work during all this period! My doctor said that he doesn't expect me to experience something more than insomnia and anxiety as side effects, but when I asked him again if he is sure about this, he said that he can't be sure. Also, he is not sure what will happen with my tinitus.

 

I have a lot to write, but I don't want to make this post toooo long and selfish and to bother you more!

 

I'm so happy that I met you! You can't imagine how important it is to me!

 

Gardener I'm happy that micro tapering is working on cutting the gabapeptin!

And I will study the formula you shared

 

Best wishes to all 

 

Blue

Glad you are feeling better post Flu. It is good he knows about the Ashton method, hopefully he will let you go slowly, things could work out very well for you, but if it starts going south, let him know it is too fast for you, if he tries to increase your taper. Some here have had extra pills stored away, and was able to tell white lies to their Doctor and able to taper at a reasonable speed. Things could go very well too, so take one day at a time. Stay Strong and keep posting. Your English is fine. 🎅 Peace and Healing.

[[ga...]]

 

Hi Gardener and Begood

 

How are you? Thanks so much for your wishes 

 

I am feeling a lot better from the flu this week. And I finally went to see my doctor concerning the cutting rate. To my surprise, he has already heard about the Ashton manual! The good part: he agreed to let me do slower cuts. The "grey" part: he believes that cutting 5% of my dose is too small of a cut and it will take me ages to quit.  Anyway, he agreed with me to "start the cuts and see" (apologies for my horrible english).

 

I feel a huge relief!

I only wish that I will have a clear mind to work during all this period! My doctor said that he doesn't expect me to experience something more than insomnia and anxiety as side effects, but when I asked him again if he is sure about this, he said that he can't be sure. Also, he is not sure what will happen with my tinitus.

 

I have a lot to write, but I don't want to make this post toooo long and selfish and to bother you more!

 

I'm so happy that I met you! You can't imagine how important it is to me!

 

Gardener I'm happy that micro tapering is working on cutting the gabapeptin!

And I will study the formula you shared

 

Best wishes to all 

 

Blue

 

I'm so happy that you are feeling better and that your doctor is willing to be cautious. It is better to start slowly and then speed up than to start too fast and crash. Crashing will slow down your taper! I found that as long as my doctor knew I was determined to keep going then he was willing to go slowly. I think doctors may worry we will give up.

 

Your doctor has heard of Ashton. She has a longer list of side effects than insomnia and anxiety. It could be, though, that your doctor doesn't want to scare you but bringing up more side effects. But, if you choose the right taper rate, your side effects should be tolerable. It's rushing that gets people into trouble.

 

I think your English is fine, too. I am always impressed by people who can communicate in more than one language.

 

We are always happy to hear how you are doing, so please write as much as you want.

 

Gardie

[[Ol...]]

Glad to hear it, Blue! It is wonderful when doctors actually listen. We are rooting for you!

[[bl...]]

Hi Begood, Gardie and OliveKitty,

 

(Sorry for not answering sooner, a lot of interruptions, work and visits yesterday).

 

OliveKitty thank you very much! 

 

Begood that’s a great advice.  I have already 1 and ½ extra packet of pills (leftovers from previous months) and I will try to keep some more extra pills, just in case.

 

Gardie I agree with you that my doctor might try not to scare me, but he knows that I had already experienced many symptoms during my cold turkey (from vertigo to tinnitus to blurry vision, just to name a few). As I have people that depend on me and also, I can’t afford to lose my job, he might think that this way I will not be scared (which I am already a little bit  ).

 

I am making my second 5% cut today, fingers crossed! The first either went well, or I was feeling too miserable from the flu to notice anything .

 

Wish you all to be healthy and happy!   

 

Blue

 

[[ga...]]

Thanks for the update, blue. It sounds like things are going well. I'm glad!