Tapering off Ativan Support Thread

[[be...]]

Incredible dedication and tenacity, Lisa! Congratulations on your walk off and happiest of birthdays! Thank you for the wisdom and grace you’ve brought to our group. Your kindness and resilience always encouraged me so much.

 

You did it!!

 

Beauty

[Guest [ba...]]

Congratulations Lisa!! 

 

I've typed that word a few times this week.  Such a good feeling. 

[[Gi...]]

Well done Lisa.  You persevered and won your freedom from benzodiazepines.  Do you know what your dose was when you jumped? G

[[te...]]

Thanks to everybody for all your support and kind words .

Ginger mint , I stopped at 2mls.

Lisa

[[kr...]]

Welcome to the other side Lisa..  well done

[[Ha...]]

Hi all,

 

I hope everyone is having a good day.  Mine has been good! I don't know if it's a window or just a better day, but I'll take it gladly. 

 

I got my new scale today, although I haven't set it up yet.  I do have a question about crushing the pill(s), though.  How do people crush them?  I remember seeing on one of the boards that someone was using a mortar and pestle.  Should I order one of those, or is there another way to do it using things I already have on hand? I'm not in a rush to move the taper forward at this moment, but I would like to get a more steady dose as I just can't seem to cut accurately when it comes to the smaller piece (I cut the .5 mg pill in half, then quarters, then cut the quarters in half -- it's the cutting the quarters in half part that is so hard to get right with the pill cutter I have been using.

 

Thanks for any help! I'm sure I'll have many more questions as I move forward with the crushing and weighing enterprise.

 

Haimona

[[Ma...]]

So happy to hear you are having a good day!

I am on a stretch of about 5 ‘normal’ days. I find it’s sometimes hard to enjoy these days, as I feel like it’s too good to be true. But I’ve decided to enjoy them and fear less about what’s ahead. So far so good!

 

I never crushed my pills, so I can’t help you with that. Once I got to where you were I had switched to the compounded liquid.

 

Maybe you could start a new thread, asking for another Buddie to weigh in?

Hoping your window stays wide open!

[[po...]]

TECH CONGRATS!! What an amazing feat! Finally, this journey is over. I only hope you are getting some sleep!

 

Haimona. Sorry I had a delay in getting back to you. If you have a scale, do not crush the pills. Jut cut into small pieces with a sharp blade, so you have some larger and smaller pieces. I see you are at .3125mg (?). Do you mean .312mg? So here is my formula. 

 

1. You need to weigh all the pills in your bottle. Now, without your pills, weigh the bottle. Subtract the weight of the bottle by the total weigh of all the pills. If there are 15 pills, then divide that total number by 15. THIS IS THE MEAN WEIGHT OF YOUR PILLS. YOU NEVER HAVE TO WEIGH ANY MORE PILLS ON THIS BOTTLE (until you have a new bottle - this is the placebo effect by not weighing the again). Then you do the same thing with a new bottle.

 

2. You have taken the sqaure paper I talked about and let's say it weighs .325mg. The next part is easy. Since you are already at a low dose you may want to micro taper all the way down.

 

3. If you want to taper by 0.005, then place the SQUARE (in my next post I will tell you what to do if the next paper it has a different weight (vey possible).

 

4. Add .325 to (square) and add the new dose you want to be at. (are you really at .3125 dry cutting?). I can see .312 but I do not have a scale that goes to the thousandth. I haven't heard of one. Please confirm. But if you wanted to take off .005 from .300 then your dose is .295. You then add your crumbs to the scale until you have .620mg which is very easy to do. Now you have precisely cut 0.005 from your dose to a new dose of .295mg.

 

5.Last point, again as a reminder. When you have the mean weight of the pills, treat them all as the same weight. The placebo effect will tell your brain they are all the same (and will believe this). Just do not weigh the rest of your pills. Just cut them up AND SAVE THE SHAVINGS!

 

6. Please confirm your current dose and what you want your next dose to be. I used this method to get all the way down to .01 mg and then I could not cut to .005mg, even though I tried! But I could not use scale, I would have to do a visual cut which I could no. Luey also confirmed that at such a low dose it surely meant nothing to me.

 

Good night. Powerball

 

 

[[Ha...]]

Hi Powerball,

 

Thank you! I have never weighed before -- I just got a scale today, and plan to set it up tomorrow.

 

What I have been doing is cutting and eyeballing, from a .5 mg pill.  First I cut it in half and then quarters.  That is how I ended up with .375 mg (approximately, since I am eyeballing).  Now I am cutting the quarters in half -- that is HARD to do, and I fear I never come close to getting this cut right.  But, theoretically, .25 mg (half a pill) plus an eighth of a pill is .25 mg + .0625 mg = .3125 mg.  I just pulled out my calculator to make sure I had this right, as math has never been my strong suit.  But that is theoretically the dose I am at now. 

 

I have to read all your instructions again ... it's a lot of new stuff for me.  I guess I also need to scroll back up and reread about the square of paper, since I only vaguely remember what you had said about that.  Please forgive my benzo brain! But I really want to get my dose more steady, so I am taking pretty much the same amount every day, and then taper slowly from there.

 

Thanks,

 

Haimona

[[Ba...]]

Hey TECH, that is GREAT! This drug is out of your life! It will take a while for us to fully heal but this has been well worth it to just be done with it. And now, on to the post-taper phase. Oh will the fun never end?

 

Since my last dose, I have been saying that for the most part, I don't feel better but I don't feel worse. But this past week I definitely feel better. Not amazingly better but enough to feel like a better "normal" isn't quite as hard to imagine. It's really something how feeling fewer symptoms or the same symptoms, but less severe, can make such a difference in the capacity for tolerating the suffering. That can provide some room to visualize days ahead that seem like they're more about us than about the benzo and its afflctions.

 

I don't like going onto the post-withdrawal board. It kind of messes me up, mentally. I'd much rather see how all of you are doing. Usually someone is stepping off and being congratulated, or people are problem-solving and encouraging others. What strength!

-- Liz

[[te...]]

ThAnks powerball ,

Liz I feel the same way .. still some symptoms but nothing like before .

Mostly sleep , but feeling a little more uptight not comfortable than usual , hope it passes soon only 3 days out so we will see.

Wishing you well Liz also.

Lisa

[[Ju...]]

Hello all

I just wanted to pop in and let you know that I am taking a vacation from the boards.  I am doing well and still reducing and moving forward with my taper. I am finding I need to stay off the boards and more focused at home and on self care for now.  I am not deleting my account but just taking a reprieve.  So if you don’t see me in here know I am moving forward and will make it through.

Please keep supporting each other and moving forward.  We will all make it through.

 

Congrats to all that have finished and so many so close.

 

Hugs and Peace

JuJuBi

 

[[su...]]

Congratulations, Lisa!  I am so happy for you as from what I understand, this has been a long road for you.  Well done, happy belated birthday, and thank you for the understanding words.  I wish you post-taper healing thoughts. 

 

 

Glad to hear some good days have been had by others.  I'm still holding. 

 

 

JuJuBi, thank you for inviting me to the group and being a source of encouragement and hope.  Take care during your break. 

 

 

Amanda

 

 

[[su...]]

TECH CONGRATS!! What an amazing feat! Finally, this journey is over. I only hope you are getting some sleep!

 

Haimona. Sorry I had a delay in getting back to you. If you have a scale, do not crush the pills. Jut cut into small pieces with a sharp blade, so you have some larger and smaller pieces. I see you are at .3125mg (?). Do you mean .312mg? So here is my formula. 

 

1. You need to weigh all the pills in your bottle. Now, without your pills, weigh the bottle. Subtract the weight of the bottle by the total weigh of all the pills. If there are 15 pills, then divide that total number by 15. THIS IS THE MEAN WEIGHT OF YOUR PILLS. YOU NEVER HAVE TO WEIGH ANY MORE PILLS ON THIS BOTTLE (until you have a new bottle - this is the placebo effect by not weighing the again). Then you do the same thing with a new bottle.

 

2. You have taken the sqaure paper I talked about and let's say it weighs .325mg. The next part is easy. Since you are already at a low dose you may want to micro taper all the way down.

 

3. If you want to taper by 0.005, then place the SQUARE (in my next post I will tell you what to do if the next paper it has a different weight (vey possible).

 

4. Add .325 to (square) and add the new dose you want to be at. (are you really at .3125 dry cutting?). I can see .312 but I do not have a scale that goes to the thousandth. I haven't heard of one. Please confirm. But if you wanted to take off .005 from .300 then your dose is .295. You then add your crumbs to the scale until you have .620mg which is very easy to do. Now you have precisely cut 0.005 from your dose to a new dose of .295mg.

 

5.Last point, again as a reminder. When you have the mean weight of the pills, treat them all as the same weight. The placebo effect will tell your brain they are all the same (and will believe this). Just do not weigh the rest of your pills. Just cut them up AND SAVE THE SHAVINGS!

 

6. Please confirm your current dose and what you want your next dose to be. I used this method to get all the way down to .01 mg and then I could not cut to .005mg, even though I tried! But I could not use scale, I would have to do a visual cut which I could no. Luey also confirmed that at such a low dose it surely meant nothing to me.

 

Good night. Powerball

 

Powerball,

 

Hope you don't mind if I jump in here with a request for insight/assistance. 

 

I made moves to switch to the liquid (thank you again to badsocref for the info ), but when I stabilized figured I was so low that it would be best to stay the course on dry cutting, plus not knowing how I would react to the switch spooked me--clearly my system was not meant for benzos given the difficult time I've had from Day 1 being RX'd this stuff.  Here I am, a mess of a taper later (Dr.'s too fast taper but by time I found BB's and knew any better, it was too late, then when I stabilized just a bit, went too fast again, fooled by improving sxs and a strong desire to get OFF), BUT the fact is I am near the end and trying to finish as gracefully (HA!) as possible given what I've been through.  I have the Gemini-20 scale and it has been a struggle, so could use some help as I finish out. 

 

I'm trying to figure out the use of the paper process that you suggested to Haimona.  I'm currently weighing my chips/shards to get .008 (which for me is .067 mg dosage).  I split it up as best I can into 3 for my doses.  Yesterday I tried to cut at least 4 days worth because it's such an anxiety-laden experience for me.  I end up constantly calibrating and reweighing things.  Its maddening. Once I have more better days than not, I will drop to .007 weight of chips/shards and then go from there.  I understand there cannot be absolute precision with a scale like this, and the margin of error is there, but could use some insight on how you got so low.  I don't foresee me getting all the way down to .01 in dosage before jumping, but I'd like to get as low as possible.  Hell, I may already be lower than I think, given how hard I crashed again last week and the imprecision of weighing such tiny pieces.  Regardless, I'm just trying to dust myself off, regain as much strength as possible, and forge on. 

 

 

Thank you,

 

Amanda

[[Bi...]]

Congratulations Lisa / Tech!

 

It gives me such encouragement to see others completing their taper! I’m hoping to be joining all of you in about two months.

 

Right now I continue to focus on training my mind to calm using worship music, mindfulness meditation, and Qi Gong. I continue to have hours most mornings with extreme clarity, joy and gratefulness. I hold onto this as the days progress and often symptoms present. My biggest challenge is still insomnia. Its crazy, even though nights can be difficult, I do not feel sleep deprived.

 

Again congrats to you Tech!

Bibs Jo

[[te...]]

Bibs jo

Hang in there nights are still very difficult for me as well . Sleep has been tough for me threw this entire process .

JuJuBi

Take care during your break

Lisa

[[2c...]]

Here’s a situation my husband and I have discussed recently since my symptoms have ramped up.  My most recent prescription for Ativan is 0.5 mg 2x day. For some time maybe a couple of years, I had tapered down to 0.5 at bedtime and 0.25 in the morning.  So after a month I had some pills left but I always refilled on time.  It worked out that I would eventually have 2 full prescriptions in the cabinet and one that I was using from.  I did not tell my doc that I had tapered because I felt like I needed a reserve in case I had to change docs and I never used more than I had tapered to.( in fact I did lose my doc because she quit practicing for personal reasons out of the blue)

 

Recently I have had terrible symptoms of either tolerance or withdrawal. Not sure how to use those terms and having additional high stress from unresolved pain.  So I have starting using on occasion from my “extras”when I am losing my mind. My husband tells me I absolutely cannot do that because I’m technically taking more than I’m prescribed.  He’s very afraid I’m going backwards and to be honest so do I but I’m not sure how to handle it.  I have the most intense symptoms I’ve ever had and trying to use all coping skills but not being very successful. 

 

Can anyone comment in this and give me some suggestions?  I am losing it

[Guest [ba...]]

<snip>

Can anyone comment in this and give me some suggestions?  I am losing it

 

I'm sorry that you're hurting.  What you're experiencing is pretty common.  You've become tolerant and/or dependent on your current dose and now need more drug for therapeutic action to be realized.  You may even be experiencing some interdose withdrawal.  That's what happened to a lot of us.

 

Adding the extra 0.25 isn't likely to hurt you except it raises the dosage bar - a bar that you'll need to back down through if you want to eventually eliminate klonopin from your life.  Your husband is correct that you should discuss recent changes in your symptoms and possible solutions with your doctor.  Perhaps you and your p-doc can explore alternative approaches to regaining your mind when you lose it.  Developing stronger 'coping tools' will make it a little easier to taper/withdraw.

 

You might benefit by adjusting the timing of your doses.  Perhaps increase two doses to three.  Depends on when you feel the worst.  Again, something that you can discuss with your doc.

[[2c...]]

thanks badsocref

I not have a doc at present that is supportive.  My primary care that was supportive suddenly quit practicing for personal reasons and the new one I got does not want to deal with it and sent me out for psychiatrist referral but no response yet.  I called about it and the nurse said no one would want to touch me because I was taking Ativan! What? She suggested I go to one if the walk in clinics. I couldn’t believe it! So now I’m just hanging.

 

Sorry for the rant .  I’m just feeling so bad it’s hard to get through the day let alone deal with trying to find a supportive doc. 

 

 

[Guest [ba...]]

A good therapist might be a better choice than a new p-doc.  They're better equipped to help you develop coping mechanisms.  P-docs are usually more prone to using drugs.

[[2c...]]

Badsocref thanks.

The good news is that I just made an appt with a psychiatric nurse practioner. I had good vibes from them when I called.  I explained why I wanted to make the appointment and did not get a brush off and staff was super nice. Hopefully it will work out . The other thing is that they are co-located with a psychologist/therapist so maybe it will be a good situation. 

 

[[Gi...]]

thanks badsocref

I not have a doc at present that is supportive.  My primary care that was supportive suddenly quit practicing for personal reasons and the new one I got does not want to deal with it and sent me out for psychiatrist referral but no response yet.  I called about it and the nurse said no one would want to touch me because I was taking Ativan! What? She suggested I go to one if the walk in clinics. I couldn’t believe it! So now I’m just hanging.

 

Sorry for the rant .  I’m just feeling so bad it’s hard to get through the day let alone deal with trying to find a supportive doc.

 

I can relate to everything you said.  My supportive doc quit her practice.  I had to wait 4 months for an appt with a new one.  She said I was off ativan as of that moment and she would give me two other meds instead.  When I refused she turned and left the room and did not return.

 

I had taken the advice of Begood and had been stockpiling my pills.  I had about 18 months worth left.  I have a new dr now but have only met him once in a virtual appt.  He seems more supportive although doesn't understand why I still get wd sx at my low dose.

 

I've been holding since May 1st and still have sx.  I have enough ativan left to last until June 15th but I plan to jump Jan 1st, endure whatever I have to and be done.  I just want this nightmare behind me.

 

I hope you get a supportive and understanding doctor, they are out there.  It is just difficult to find one when you are already feeling lousy.  I will be thinking good thoughts for you. Ginger

[[2c...]]

Thanks Ginger.  I just recently made an appointment with a psychiatric nurse practioner and I explained why I wanted to see her and it sounds like she is willing to work with me . Let’s hope this will work

[[Bi...]]

Hi Everyone,

 

I just got off a virtual visit with my addiction pysch who is managing my taper. He said that he thinks it is quite remarkable (not in a good way) that I have such severe discontinuation symptoms now as I am approaching the end of my taper. The worst of my symptoms right now are tinnitus that comes and goes, fractured sleep every night and some cognitive issues. He said that my symptoms are not common for someone at such a low dose (.1875mg /day).

 

He did say that he thinks I will be fine because I do stablilize and my symptoms get better after a few weeks on a hold.

 

I don't know if he is right about it being remarkable that I am having such severe symptoms at the end. It seems like so many of us have significant wd symptoms at the end, which is why I thought micro-tapering is so prevalent here in this forum.

 

Do you all think it's unusual to have significant symptoms at the end?

 

Thanks!

Bibs jo

 

[[Gi...]]

Thanks Ginger.  I just recently made an appointment with a psychiatric nurse practioner and I explained why I wanted to see her and it sounds like she is willing to work with me . Let’s hope this will work

 

That's good news.  I actually like nurse practitioners much better than doctors.  The ones I have seen really listen where many doctors do not.  I'm an RN myself and if I have the option to see an NP I always take it. G.