The Long Hold Support Group

[[Tr...]]

Thanks Mary, I also screen shot the equivalencies bc I always wonder where I am in respect to Valium. Since I'm the odd ball and the only one tapering Xanax.

 

So I'm not going to focus on the time it takes, I'm going to focus on getting off safely and as painlessly as possible. I have a few things in going to put into play. First I'm going to journal sx symtoms the next time I taper down so I can track it and look for a pattern. Also as soon as I'm better I'm going back to my therapist to help with coping, I had an appt as you know that had to be cancelled bc I got sick. I think having a plan in place gives some sense of control in this and I really need to get like in control of this wd and it not being in control of me if that makes sense.

 

Love you girl,

Trish

 

It makes great sense, I believe the more you know, the better chance you have of getting through this as easy as possible.  I didn't mean for you to follow anyone else's taper, I just wanted you to see the different ways people handle their taper and anything you might learn from that for yourself.  What you find that might be something you think sounds like a good idea for you.

 

Thanks Mary, I knew what you meant. The more I learn the better able I'll be able to help myself. Any knowledge I can gain would only be beneficial to me, that's why I'll ask you guys questions and occasionally I'll read on different boards to see what I can learn but I don't post. 

 

 

[[Tr...]]

Well I think I'll go wash my bed sheets, I'm feeling the need to disinfect my house. So since I feel better today I'll do a little house work.

 

I want to thank you Mary and Spy for your support, knowledge and wise advice. Love you both and appreciate all the help.

Hope you both have a good day/ night.

 

I'll be back..

 

Trish,

,💞💞

[[Ma...]]

Well I think I'll go wash my bed sheets, I'm feeling the need to disinfect my house. So since I feel better today I'll do a little house work.

 

I want to thank you Mary and Spy for your support, knowledge and wise advice. Love you both and appreciate all the help.

Hope you both have a good day/ night.

 

I'll be back..

 

Trish,

,💞💞

 

Love you too

[[Ca...]]

Hi Ladies...

 

Am home now, and just relaxing a bit.. 

 

Sounds like there is plenty of WD going on here for some... Trish it is all pretty common, as mentioned... These were/are my deeper type symptoms... Plus there is also some situational reality to it, more for some than others, but often we dont fit in so well because we ARE dealing with WD, and dont function with joy and spontaneity at the fore front.. But also there is just the plain WD aspects of struggling neuro chemistry... Thus it will get better, and it has for me at the better parts of my tapers..

Can be pretty daunting though, -looking to a future from a position of WD... It sure takes some faith, but understanding it for what it is can be a big help too...

-Not to mention that you must be feeling totally rotten right now to top it off.. So dont let the big picture bog you down atm...

Get well, -you got this...

 

Hello spy, thank you for the input,  I appreciate your words and value the support. All that you've said above has helped me put things back into perspective. I would like to hear more on the " better part of your tapers" though if you don't mind. I think I need some hope here. I think my eyes are truly being opened for the first time since the journey began to the actual damage this drug has caused me. All the years of misery it caused me, robbing me of real peace and joy, hiding in plain sight, is mind boggling. So I guess what I want to know is does it get better the lower you go in dosage or does it get tougher? I realize everyone is different but I wonder how hard or to better put it I don't want to be blindsided by this drug, I want to know what's in store the lower I go. What should I expect in other words as I continue on? Maybe it's not answerable but if you can tell me your experience going lower that might help.

 

I'm glad you're home and I hope you enjoyed your time away.

 

L word spy,

Trish ❤️

Probs the best way I can respond to that is that it could go either way, but if symptoms are increasing and one adjusts to suit as per those symptoms and their levels, then there is a high chance the results will reflect those changes... Thats why im anti end dates and set rates...

Its a bit more complex, because there will be some SX, -perhaps long, mid, and short term.. Short term being more volitile... The aim being to find what you can handle and maintain...

 

My good times were when my body caught up and started to get on top of things.. At low dose 0.25V it started to clear things, and my long or deep SX started to improve, but new things showed up, things that are well known to be horrific, but at that dose my body coped and I got a taste only... I assume faster taperers would get this as post accute..

I tried to keep my body out of a shocked or stressed state, and I feel it healed better for it...

Im not so sure this is as possible to the same degree at higher doses, with more meds in ones system, but it kinda works both ways, -on higher doses there is more med to buffer the shock and things like holds might work quicker...  Gosh, Im not putting this well at all..

 

I guess as I got lower, I gave the volitile SX more time, and the deeper SX started to improve too...

I could see that my body could heal, that it wasnt going to be a huge struggle to get basic human emotions back, and I shouldnt judge the battle ahead by todays standards... I lost it again with the lyrica taper and what not, but my body is responding and healing faster now too... So I know im not too far ahead of myself...

There are exceptions to this, as with everything, and some have issues to contend with that arent so well managed by taper speed and holding alone...  These people may have to push on to an extent..

But if you improve with holds, things are looking good..!! -Just dont push through exessive symptoms...

 

Rhetorical question.. Is there any reason to prevent anyone from holding long enough to see just how much better they can get..??

I guess I kinda overheld a little at the end in preperation for the next cut.. But it was all over before I got good at it...  And I added a med when I should have held instead... It is hard to go slow when we know these meds are crap...

 

Trish, try not to compare others tapers and speeds to your own, In this respect they dont mean much...

Trust your own Symptom Profile and history... -You will do fine..!! -and im not saying that lightly.. Yes its a battle, but you will get there...

 

Can't, I have a question, since my main sxs is muscle pain and I pretty much have it all the time, it's hard for me to monitor my sxs, do you understand my question?

I could be wrong, but I think I do understand...??

My GI cramping and spacticity dictated my taper speed.. It came way before most other SX, and I only realy just saw them after a cut, or more when I made a mistake.. But by then my GI was starting to dictate a dose correction or similar..  The big question I guess is do your muscles respond to taper speed, and if so, would that be an acceptable (reduced) speed...

I did have a hand full of other little things that helped, -insomnia, light sensitivity, fatigue, T, sound sensitivity, etc.. More they helped comfirm rather than guide... If I got to the RLS, sweats/chills, retention, etc.. Then I had cut way too big...

 

A micro taper might make it harder to determine where one is at, particularly with a dominant SX...

But thats the trade off for reduced symptoms and a smoother taper...

 

Hope that helps..??

 

 

 

[[Ma...]]

Can't, the only time I could really tell the difference in my muscles was when I had that window and I have tried to repeat what I did before the window, but so far no window.  I knew it wasn't likely but I had to try.  So I guess it's the trade off, thank you for responding.  M ❤️.  You are our hero, lucky you 

[[Ca...]]

Can't, the only time I could really tell the difference in my muscles was when I had that window and I have tried to repeat what I did before the window, but so far no window.  I knew it wasn't likely but I had to try.  So I guess it's the trade off, thank you for responding.  M ❤️.  You are our hero, lucky you 

lets hope it eases off as you get lower, as brain zaps did for me...

 

Must be my bed time too..

 

Night Guys...

 

[[Ma...]]

Well I think I'll go wash my bed sheets, I'm feeling the need to disinfect my house. So since I feel better today I'll do a little house work.

 

I want to thank you Mary and Spy for your support, knowledge and wise advice. Love you both and appreciate all the help.

Hope you both have a good day/ night.

 

I'll be back..

 

Trish,

,💞💞

 

Yes, you are accidentally going to feel good today, enjoy it 

[[Sc...]]

Just wanted to say a quick hello & thanks for all of the great feedback people are sharing with others on here. It’s helpful for many, I’m sure.

 

Wanted to say I may not be on for a bit. Family & personal stuff going on. It’s hard in my current state & don’t know how things will play out. I can only take it one day at a time & see right now, till I get to some sort of acceptable baseline, I suppose.

 

I’ll keep holding till things settle much more, I believe. Hopefully when I’m ready, someone can help me liquid taper & it works for me, as like I said. I can’t dry cut these pills. Don’t think I could do scales. I need to find a therapist.

 

Wishing hope, healing, & strength for you all. XX, love Scaredie

[[Ma...]]

Just wanted to say a quick hello & thanks for all of the great feedback people are sharing with others on here. It’s helpful for many, I’m sure.

 

Wanted to say I may not be on for a bit. Family & personal stuff going on. It’s hard in my current state & don’t know how things will play out. I can only take it one day at a time & see right now, till I get to some sort of acceptable baseline, I suppose.

 

I’ll keep holding till things settle much more, I believe. Hopefully when I’m ready, someone can help me liquid taper & it works for me, as like I said. I can’t dry cut these pills. Don’t think I could do scales. I need to find a therapist.

 

Wishing hope, healing, & strength for you all. XX, love Scaredie

 

Take care of yourself ET, hope things are okay.  We will be right here when you come back.  Love you, Mary 🌺☘️🌸☘️🌼🍀❣️

[[Sc...]]

Thank you, Mary, for the reassurance, you’ll still be there for me. Means so much.😊💕XX,SC

[[Ma...]]

Thank you, Mary, for the reassurance, you’ll still be there for me. Means so much.😊💕XX,SC

 

Right here girlfriend 😊

[[Ma...]]

Be back.......

[[es...]]

I wish I had something constructive to add to the discussion. I have few sxs, but the ones I have are persistent. I do not have windows. So, what works for you in establishing a pattern, hasn’t worked for me. Probably because I had been on relative withdrawal so long before starting to taper. Trishy, what I have noticed about lower doses is something that seems to be happening with you. You are looking at your years on the benzo and really seeing all the stuff it had been doing to you, maybe things you didn’t really notice, or thought were just something else. It is like a puzzle coming together. I don’t know if that is because we are on lower doses or we are now more knowledgeable and can really see what we once thought was therapeutic, was the exact opposite. It takes a while to see and believe anything can be so destructive without it becoming common knowledge. I am not an expert, but I have read that your short acting benzo can make tapering harder. I do think you should talk to someone tapering directly from Ativan. I am on klonopin and it is not easy either because it is high potency. The half life is longer than yours is, but not as long as V. I think you have done well on a challenging drug. Don’t lose hope now. I think you are going to get through this with manageable symptoms. You have, so far. That says a lot. Look how far you have come. It will someday be behind you. Love, Espy

[[Tr...]]

I wish I had something constructive to add to the discussion. I have few sxs, but the ones I have are persistent. I do not have windows. So, what works for you in establishing a pattern, hasn’t worked for me. Probably because I had been on relative withdrawal so long before starting to taper. Trishy, what I have noticed about lower doses is something that seems to be happening with you. You are looking at your years on the benzo and really seeing all the stuff it had been doing to you, maybe things you didn’t really notice, or thought were just something else. It is like a puzzle coming together. I don’t know if that is because we are on lower doses or we are now more knowledgeable and can really see what we once thought was therapeutic, was the exact opposite. It takes a while to see and believe anything can be so destructive without it becoming common knowledge. I am not an expert, but I have read that your short acting benzo can make tapering harder. I do think you should talk to someone tapering directly from Ativan. I am on klonopin and it is not easy either because it is high potency. The half life is longer than yours is, but not as long as V. I think you have done well on a challenging drug. Don’t lose hope now. I think you are going to get through this with manageable symptoms. You have, so far. That says a lot. Look how far you have come. It will someday be behind you. Love, Espy

 

Thank you E, so much of what you said makes so much sense. I do believe you're right on all points made. I am still going to do a direct taper bc I believe I can do it. I just have to accept that it'll take as long as it takes and not be so hard on myself when I can't go as fast as I'd like to go. The goal is and always should be to get off this drug as comfortably as I can. I think what I've noticed so far is that tapering a quarter of one pill at a time does work for me without too many horrible sxs. I may need to hold longer than two weeks in between cuts, possibly 3 to 4 weeks but it's all trial and error. I am getting impatient with the holding so I'll have to work on that. I want to set goals for myself and if I don't meet them then I want to be able to accept the fact that that's ok. I have to remind myself that I've already come a long way and while some sxs I could do without like dp/ dr I'll just have to find a way to accept that that is part of this. I'm still functional and working and living my life, while doing most of that with no real joy I'm still doing it, I guess what I'm trying to say is it could be so much worse for me and I know that. I see the suffering that goes on here, I read on other boards sometimes but I don't post but if I think I have something to add I will. When I see your strength and the strength of others it is the fuel that feeds me to go on. I will get through this with good and bad days, hoping for more good though

 

Thank you for being such a kind friend. You are so helpful to this group and you've come such a long way, with amazing courage. I admire that and you.

 

Love to you,

Trish ❤️

[[es...]]

Trishy, I would not want to cross to V either. Honey, I think I am a kind person, or I try to be, but I am neither strong nor courageous. Believe me, that is not who I am. I wish I was. Maybe it would make this easier. We all have our own set of assets and liabilities, and I think it is the assets that pull us through. You and I are short on courage, but we have something else. We have people in our lives that we love so much that we are willing to feel the fear that it takes to get us to the place where we can be there for them. Love is a powerful asset. It can make you do what you never thought possible. Espy

[[4G...]]

Scaredie, Look after yourself and I look forward to seeing you back here when the time is right for you.

Love, Gilly xxx

[[4G...]]

Trishy, I've pm'd you. Love, Gilly xxx

[[Tr...]]

Trishy, I've pm'd you. Love, Gilly xxx

Hey English, just wrote back ❤️

[[Ma...]]

Trishy, I've pm'd you. Love, Gilly xxx

Hey English, just wrote back ❤️

Hey, what am I chopped liver  :P

[[Tr...]]

Trishy, I would not want to cross to V either. Honey, I think I am a kind person, or I try to be, but I am neither strong nor courageous. Believe me, that is not who I am. I wish I was. Maybe it would make this easier. We all have our own set of assets and liabilities, and I think it is the assets that pull us through. You and I are short on courage, but we have something else. We have people in our lives that we love so much that we are willing to feel the fear that it takes to get us to the place where we can be there for them. Love is a powerful asset. It can make you do what you never thought possible. Espy

Well said E, my family is everything to me 😘🤗

[[Tr...]]

Trishy, I've pm'd you. Love, Gilly xxx

Hey English, just wrote back ❤️

Hey, what am I chopped liver  :P

No you're  the purple haired lady :laugh:

[[Tr...]]

Be back later ladies..

[[4G...]]

Chopped Liver, How are you today? Lol!  You know we Love you, Oh Great Purple-Haired One! xxx 💙

[[Ma...]]

Chopped Liver, How are you today? Lol!  You know we Love you, Oh Great Purple-Haired One! xxx 💙

 

English!!  You sound so much better girlfriend, how are you?  My back is easing off some after pulling on the mattresses, thank goodness.  Can't said I was dumb :laugh:

[[Tr...]]

Hey Mary, what year did you start your taper?