Updosing Support Group

[[ka...]]

i completely agree with Kitty, very good plan. most important to stabilize to the baseline you handle and move forward slowly with your tapering. In the long term, one tends to benefit best with slow and healing happens at a pace the brain can tolerate. you will stabilize and then can resume tapering when ready and healing is happening.

[[...]]

Thanks, ladies!  So glad for the support!

[[...]]

Yes, not everyone frowns upon updosing - and in withdrawal, some even call it dose correcting instead of updosing because it really is dose correcting....trying to find the amt of benzo you need to balance out the excess glutamate created by withdrawing the medicine too fast.  I've learned that if I updose enough, it works much faster than if I updose only a little.  Makes sense, I guess.  I'm always reluctant to updose "too much" but what's the point of updosing only a little and still feeling bad.  Seems like 10% kinda works for me so far....and I feel great in a week or so.

[[Ge...]]

"Dose correcting"  I like that!

[[...]]

AF1- what did you updose to and any improvement yet? It will take a little time.

 

George- yes, cuz that's really what it is- correcting to the dose your body needs now to function properly. In theory it all makes sense - dose correcting, taper at the right pace, etc- but it's all easier said than done.

 

I'm still holding and stabilizing....

[[...]]

Hi all, so I'm trying to figure out if I should try an updose .... I'm really scared to do it after many months of suffering. I did an 8 month hold only four months into my taper as I was bedridden .

In that time I cut 1/4 mg Valium and every tiny reduction brought on horrible symptoms .,

 

I did improve with the hold , but not to a place I'd call functional , and no windows .

 

I was able to go out and do a few simple things , drive to the grocery store etc.

short walks in the evening.

 

In June I microtapered 1/16 th mg with my doctor pressing me somewhat to move along in my taper .

 

I am back in hell, really bad .

 

What I'm questioning is should I go back to 8 mgs , which is where I was at the beginning of June ,where I had begun to make a little progress. Or maybe I need to updose even more than that , but it's been since last September that I was at 8-1/4 mgs V.

 

I am feeling hopeless and so want to make progress. I know not to cut , I'm clear on that at least.

 

I've read some posts here that make a lot of sense , I'm just not sure still if I should updose or do another very long hold. It may turn out to be better to updose ? If I could get past the idea that I'm wasting months of hellish WDs . And then the question comes in of ' what if it doesn't work' .....

 

You know the story .

Thanks for may help you can offer .

MiYu

By the way , I'm a rapid metabolizer of Valium and so dose 3 X day .

I'm also on 400 mgs gabapentin .

 

[[...]]

"Dose correcting"  I like that!

 

Hi George ... How are you doing from your dose correct? Have you felt any improvements yet?

Love , MiYu

[[Ca...]]

Hi all, so I'm trying to figure out if I should try an updose .... I'm really scared to do it after many months of suffering. I did an 8 month hold only four months into my taper as I was bedridden .

In that time I cut 1/4 mg Valium and every tiny reduction brought on horrible symptoms .,

 

I did improve with the hold , but not to a place I'd call functional , and no windows .

 

I was able to go out and do a few simple things , drive to the grocery store etc.

short walks in the evening.

 

In June I microtapered 1/16 th mg with my doctor pressing me somewhat to move along in my taper .

 

I am back in hell, really bad .

 

What I'm questioning is should I go back to 8 mgs , which is where I was at the beginning of June ,where I had begun to make a little progress. Or maybe I need to updose even more than that , but it's been since last September that I was at 8-1/4 mgs V.

 

I am feeling hopeless and so want to make progress. I know not to cut , I'm clear on that at least.

 

I've read some posts here that make a lot of sense , I'm just not sure still if I should updose or do another very long hold. It may turn out to be better to updose ? If I could get past the idea that I'm wasting months of hellish WDs . And then the question comes in of ' what if it doesn't work' .....

 

You know the story .

Thanks for may help you can offer .

MiYu

By the way , I'm a rapid metabolizer of Valium and so dose 3 X day .

I'm also on 400 mgs gabapentin .

Hey Miyu...

I was realy thinking that you were getting close to improving with your hold... Which would lead me to think of going back to the 8mg, -a dose your body knows well...

Things can go from bad to good, with very little notice, and for me (with a hold) I get worse (for a short time) right before I get much better...

 

You could go up as high as you like, but that is a whole lot of choices, decisions and risks (of unknown results)...

 

Best wishes...

 

[[...]]

Thanks Cant.... This is a b*tch.......

 

Yes , I could go back to 8 and see what happens .... So many different points of view and no one can really say what's best . I don't know if ' trusting your body ' even applies with this stuff.....it's so confused  anyway. And there's just no way to tell what will happen when you do something.

Total gamble all the way, Except for the  holding I feel, cutting when your bad is never a good idea.

 

So my choices are updosing or staying where I am .

I could try the eight again..... Maybe that would be enough....id have to be prepared to hold a long time I think.

 

It would be so nice to get a break for a bit ....

 

Glad you are getting through this , you deserve it!

 

MiYu 

[[no...]]

Thanks Cant.... This is a b*tch.......

 

Yes , I could go back to 8 and see what happens .... So many different points of view and no one can really say what's best . I don't know if ' trusting your body ' even applies with this stuff.....it's so confused  anyway. And there's just no way to tell what will happen when you do something.

Total gamble all the way, Except for the  holding I feel, cutting when your bad is never a good idea.

 

So my choices are updosing or staying where I am .

I could try the eight again..... Maybe that would be enough....id have to be prepared to hold a long time I think.

 

It would be so nice to get a break for a bit ....

 

Glad you are getting through this , you deserve it!

 

MiYu 

Hi M    I'm in fkn hell and had to updose again , my life is fkn hell read what I wrote to some one else below as its too much to try explain it all again in this hell state,,I was also scared to do it but have done so and only wish I had done a bigger updose to begin with

 

 

I have an upstairs neighbour from hell who moved in just over a year ago, and the noise problem have been terrible, but have gotten even worse the last few months although the housing officers have been in touch with him trying to solve the problem, each time it gets worse.

 

 

I'm barely getting any sleep as he's on drugs and stays awake non stop playing a PC game 24/7 loudly, and I need to move as there's no way I can taper in this situation but am too unwell to leave the house, and am now barely functional and losing weight as I'm either unable to eat or can't prepare any food at all so its not good.

 

 

I up-dosed 2 times so far once from 3.45mg to 5mg held there nearly 4 months with no real improvement, then again by 1/2 mg to 51/2mg  and am still going down hill after over 4 months holding especially over the last 6 weeks, and obviously all the stress is complicating matters.

 

 

I feel I really have no choice due to my overall situation other than to updose again, there's no way a long holds going to work in this environment, and now I'm going to have to go practically back to the starting line in order to find some balance so I can get stable enough to move from here.  Well not the ''absolute starting line'' that was 20mg of Diazepam and there's no way my Doctors will up the dose they just don't believe its to do with Benzos and I'm only prescribed 8mg a day now, and have a few spare packs tucked away.

 

My overall healths taking a kicking on top of my hell symptoms  and I  ended up being told I'd had two heart attacks Saturday and Sunday of last week end after 4 ECG's done in my home showed I was my blood pressures high, but it's not its the withdrawal plus the stress and barely any sleep. And  they wanted to admit me to hospital as an emergency both times but I told them there's no way I can tolerate being in a vehicle as I'm totally hypersensitive to vibration, sound, touch, hearing, and smell.

 

 

 

The last time I got on a Bus was two years ago when I began tapering again  after being stable for 9 months still unaware it was all to do with withdrawal, and had cut 2 or 3 mgs way to fast and it was hell physical and mental symptoms came for nowhere and I barely made it home. And this heart business happened before when I was  still unaware my symptoms were  withdrawal related, and having breathing problems and other symptoms rang my GP who rang an Ambulance as I was struggling too breathe on the phone.

 

 

 

And the Hospital insisted I was having a heart attack  and rushed my into theatre after ripping my clothes off covered my in iodine as as far as they were concerned I needed surgery and did an angiogram which showed my heart and arteries were fine even though the ECG readings were showing something else. So as you can see its quite a dilemma I have on my hands, I really can't see any point where holding any longer is going to benefit me not in my present situation, and cutting certainly isn't the answer at all, I'm getting stressed about up-dosing again as well as I'm so unwell and fragile now.

 

Sorry for bending your ear, but as you know there's not a lot of discussion form others that have tried lots of times before succeeding on here like you did, and  I've been trying to get off these hell drugs for years too.

 

But this is the worst I've ever been after being pointed the the Ashton manual on here and cutting too fast, even my younger sister bought up that its been 2 years I've been trapped in this hell. Where as before I may have been a bit rough now and again but at least it was nothing like this I was still able to function and go out and about most of the time, I can't even  sit outside to escape what going on in my home now

 

 

Anyway I've now up-dosed to 8mg so that's another 2.1/2 mg, am holding here for 4 weeks if still no improvement will then go to 10mg then stay there hold and hope to stabilise. As far as I'm concerned now after nearly two years of holding for months here and there the longest being 6 and cutting each time while still unstable hoping to improve as I got lower but  am under too much pressure with what's going on in my home, and still unable to find any stability.

 

Apart from the odd ok day which are rare, and the last few months being absolute hell , I came to the obvious conclusion that up-dosing by only a small amount after being this sick for over 2 year's,  is futile as there's too much glutamate damage still going on.

 

My brain is  unable to to regulate it as the holding dose is far too low, if the dose was going to work even in this atmosphere there should be more and better changes happening but I'm just getting sicker and sicker, and I'm never going to wait for months again if a 1/4mg cut  fks me up too badly after all we're going to get withdrawal symptoms in most cases.

 

 

But there's a huge difference in discomfort and disabled, and feeling rough or being completely fkd up. I'm going to immediately add  the last cut back as soon as I feel its not just discomfort and hold as long as needed re-stablise then try a smaller cut, hold for 1 to  3 months if I have too between cuts. That's what I did before the Ashton cut rates fkd me up, I was doing brilliantly before sure I had some symptoms but they were negligible or non exsitant and I was living a happy life while getting off this hell drug . I do not give a fk how long it takes me to get off as that's still the plan to get off this fkn shit, but I do give a fk about how I feel while getting off and spending year's like this and possibly getting worse  if I don't do whatever I have to to get stabilised first?

 

Then more years in this hell when ? no way!! I stabilise before by going back up and holding and cutting was no problem either, the problem was this time I believe. Was I left it too long before up-dosing, then too low a dose for it too make any difference after all this time, and even at this dose or if I have to go up to 10mg it still going to take some time holding before I stabilise  as much as I wish it would work quicker plus a fkr of a neighbour to deal with.

 

I'm now waiting for the Police to call here this morning as his electricity metre cupboard is on my bedroom wall out side, and he keep banging it against the wall and its like Thors hammer hitting my home so I'm getting woken up by that fkn lot as well. I told the police its attempted bloody murder as there were officers here when I had a  the 2 heart attacks ''diagnosed' I wrote about in the quoted post above.

 

And  they knocked his door and told him and asked him to keep the pc game down but he hasn't then he started doing that after they spoke to him? What the easy way to kill some one with a bad heart? exactly what he's doing right? I want him fucking charged this time and I had monitoring equipment in my home from the noise pollution people so its going to be on there as well.

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[be...]]

[glow=red,2,300]"Sista"[/glow] so sorry you have had to have ongoing problems with the Paramedics and the neighbor from hell. All I can say you do what you feel is best for you, you know your struggles and what you can handle. Reading of so many that have had problems when up dosing I have to agree that if you only go up a bit it is not going to help much, the degree of discomfort is still there and seems to get worse. I can say with clarity the first time I went back to 10mg I felt better within  a  few days and stayed there, but because I still trusted my ENT I finally decided to try again at a pretty fast clip, after all he is a Doctor...then had to reinstate again...but only went to 5mg, failed once more, and stayed at 5mg and did a lot of soul searching..and decided I would have to have my own plan from that day on. So a long hold and now to a functional slow slow taper and I do not care how long it takes, I am doing it my way...I do not worry about anything, but just try to live each moment the best I can. Always thinking of you Nova and you have a special place in My Heart.

[[no...]]

[glow=red,2,300]"Sista"[/glow] so sorry you have had to have ongoing problems with the Paramedics and the neighbor from hell. All I can say you do what you feel is best for you, you know your struggles and what you can handle. Reading of so many that have had problems when up dosing I have to agree that if you only go up a bit it is not going to help much, the degree of discomfort is still there and seems to get worse. I can say with clarity the first time I went back to 10mg I felt better within  a  few days and stayed there, but because I still trusted my ENT I finally decided to try again at a pretty fast clip, after all he is a Doctor...then had to reinstate again...but only went to 5mg, failed once more, and stayed at 5mg and did a lot of soul searching..and decided I would have to have my own plan from that day on. So a long hold and now to a functional slow slow taper and I do not care how long it takes, I am doing it my way...I do not worry about anything, but just try to live each moment the best I can. Always thinking of you Nova and you have a special place in My Heart.

Thanks  "Sista"  your very dear to me also your such a good hearted soul, and a wonderful friend  not just to me, but too many on here who also appreciate you  Well the Police are also full of shit, they never sent no one after I rang them, but I just spoken to my friend  whom I had forgotten is a  City Councillor, and she's outraged about the situation, and my health problems its causing so she's getting in touch with the big guns in the housing department as she said the housing officers should be doing more and transferring HIM not me away from here.

 

She's  evil that the noise pollution department have had my recordings back on their equipment since last week yet haven't listened to them yet. She pissed off with the Police as well sending community police who are would be ''Police' not paid up Police to attend my calls when it should be proper Officers that called here. She also agrees with me that what my neighbours is doing is attempted murder.

 

And they should have come here as soon as I rang them this morning when he was told by the Police community officers I had 2 heart attacks? It makes no difference that I know its the Benzo withdrawal as  according to Doctors its not Benzos??? FULL OF SHIT!! She's also horrified at my treatment by the medical system and can't believe I've been left all by myself in this mess and the Doctors attitude about the drugs and the withdrawal ?? 

 

There's a whole heap of things that have been going on while I've been trying to deal with this and now she's gone to do what she can she's contacting the housing executive and a load of other peole and will get back to me later God willing something will be resolved sometime today I just want peace to be able to get off this forged in hell  drug.

 

I also wish I never ever came across the Ashton manual as well, although I did read the she herself agreed  eventually it was way too fast for many people so why is is pushed so much on here? And before some other wise guy reads this and ask me to ''provide a link'' I can't remember where I read it and never thought to save it at the tim eas I was so ill  when I read it Also the support groups in UK agree that's its to fast although another one out of the many I spoke to kept reciting the bloody thing to me !! The persons' attitude or words were ''Well I did it suffered and got off the Benzos eventually???  Bully for her

 

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[Ca...]]

So hope things change for u Nova...

A quiet, non stimulating environ plays a huge role in healing, and Im sure is why I survive my wonkey taper...

Asides from C14, who is quite self sufficient, I can semi hybernate for weeks... And im sure I can feel the CNS reconfigure in this zombie like stato of bliss...

Just one loud noise can ruin things for hours, If not a day for me...

The only noise is the fish tanks, which is soothing water noise, and probably the reason I never notice my tinitus, unless I think of it...

 

So I hope im not too premiture in saying this will be you, with a new quiet neighbour...

And that the time that you have spent holding and dose correcting, will assist with a fast catch up..!!

 

All the Best...

 

[[no...]]

So hope things change for u Nova...

A quiet, non stimulating environ plays a huge role in healing, and Im sure is why I survive my wonkey taper...

Asides from C14, who is quite self sufficient, I can semi hybernate for weeks... And im sure I can feel the CNS reconfigure in this zombie like stato of bliss...

Just one loud noise can ruin things for hours, If not a day for me...

The only noise is the fish tanks, which is soothing water noise, and probably the reason I never notice my tinitus, unless I think of it...

 

So I hope im not too premiture in saying this will be you, with a new quiet neighbour...

And that the time that you have spent holding and dose correcting, will assist with a fast catch up..!!

 

All the Best...

Thanks hun  I've had lots of offers to exchange, but can't do F-A until I can stabilise, and I'm sure I would be a lot better than I am now  if I had equilibrium to be able to rest and relax when I need too, my life is being dictated by someone else's behaviour. I can't sleep or eat  when I want too and I can't distract when I'm being distracted by another person either.  Anyway after many years of good neighbours I NEVER EVER want to live in a ground floor flat ever again,  when I'm able to move I would like a house or a first floor flat where there's no one above me.

 

But I live on the out skirts of a  major Capital city where I've got country side around me, and there's a massive lack of social housing in this city there's 1000's on the housing waiting list and the best way to get out is by exchanging. My housing officer keeps going on about me going on the transfer list but it can take year's for a property to come up that way. Anyway my friend has got in touch with the housing executive saying that she wants something done urgently never mind the noise pollution people and the monitored recordings .

 

 

As I've been informed although they had them back a week ago its going to take possibly until the end of next week before they listen to them? I told her about the Benzos and she's well clue up on them and also concerned  about what its doing to me trying to deal with that and everything else. Anyway the housing executive just answered her first email and she sent a reply on exactly what she wants done and hopefully there will be a positive solution to all of this pretty soon, but I'm not holding my breath on that one. Each time I got hopeful  that my environmental problem is going to be resolved I've been shot down so its a case of wait and see what happens  sigh!

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[...]]

Dear Nova, I am so so sorry with what you ar having to go through , no one should have to suffer that much....

I know you are making the right decision to updose and stabilize .... You just can't go on the way you have been , with your circumstance and everything you've been through .

 

You will get better .... And you are right , you need to stabilize so you can change your situation .

 

Praying for you , that things get better faster than you could ever hope for .

Much love to you , MiYu  :smitten:

[[no...]]

As usual back to square one no one is doing nothing to help my situation and it even  worse now 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[Ca...]]

As usual back to square one no one is doing nothing to help my situation and it even  worse now 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

well that just sux..!!

-back to the spilt cooking oil on the top step...

Im sure there is no remedy you havnt thought of a dozen times...

I just hope something changes for you real soon...

 

Wishing for an act of god for you..!!

-if you know what i mean..!!

 

Stay strong...

 

[[be...]]

[glow=red,2,300]"Sista"[/glow] Darn it, I was sure your Friend would be able to help you. I had a guy from hell that lived above me and his life's work was to come in late, and turn on stereo and jump around and have wild parties, but the Manager finally kicked him out for not paying rent, but it was hell, pure hell. I am thinking that we need a covert plan soon. I know that there is something someone can do, but why they are denying you is beyond horrible. Hang in there my dear Friend and know we here that call you Friend are pulling for you. Hugs

[[He...]]

Hoping to find some support here.  I am updosing from 3 mg of Ativan to 3.5 mg after a month hold at 3 mg.  This is my second failed attempt at tapering .

I e been on this drug for 30 years and I've been tapering at 8% per month.  My brain is telling me it is too fast.  I'm not functioning.  A month ago I was .  Today was terrible.

 

I tried updosing before but only did so for a couple of days . Do you ever stabilize?  I panicked and immediately started tapering again .  Am I going to kindle?

 

Any suggestions and or support would be most grateful.  Holding at 3 mg for a month was not working . 

 

Thank you for any encouragement .  I had to do something.

[[Ca...]]

Hoping to find some support here.  I am updosing from 3 mg of Ativan to 3.5 mg after a month hold at 3 mg.  This is my second failed attempt at tapering .

I e been on this drug for 30 years and I've been tapering at 8% per month.  My brain is telling me it is too fast.  I'm not functioning.  A month ago I was .  Today was terrible.

 

I tried updosing before but only did so for a couple of days . Do you ever stabilize?  I panicked and immediately started tapering again .  Am I going to kindle?

 

Any suggestions and or support would be most grateful.  Holding at 3 mg for a month was not working . 

 

Thank you for any encouragement .  I had to do something.

Hi healing, Im just waking up, starting my first cuppa, so bear with me...

Great that you made a choice... It can be the start of new things... Im sure you will recognise many faces here, though it is a much slower thread than long hold...

 

Updoses arent a guarantee, but one month is a good time frame to hope for good results... time frames vary, but think of it like a reverse cut...

Dont stress about this, you are just correcting medication to healing ratios... A wise thing to do..

 

From the new stuff I have been reading on kindling, it is a process with many factors, and being in too deep of a withdrawal can be just as problematic, probably more so...

-ask if u want a ref...

 

Try to get good and stable, within reason, before starting on a slow SX based taper.. -dont get over ambitious, you may be able to increase from very slow if all goes well for a while...

 

There is plenty to read here that will help,

 

My best...

 

 

[[He...]]

Thank you for responding to me.....I don't think people quite know what to say to me......that's what Bertie told me....I'm so desperate.  I've gone from anxious and functioning to terrified and in the house......hoping to right the ship.

 

Thank you always for your kindnesses

[[Ca...]]

Thank you for responding to me.....I don't think people quite know what to say to me......that's what Bertie told me....I'm so desperate.  I've gone from anxious and functioning to terrified and in the house......hoping to right the ship.

 

Thank you always for your kindnesses

correct, People dont want to guess at what may or may not happen... but now you have made the choice people can support that, as you have seen on the other thread..

 

I usually respond well to an updose within a day or three...

But my last one (see sig) took 1-2 weeks as it was a longer time gap, and I was rather sick...

 

Settle in and try to distract, for now... you will get there...

 

[[...]]

Thank you for responding to me.....I don't think people quite know what to say to me......that's what Bertie told me....I'm so desperate.  I've gone from anxious and functioning to terrified and in the house......hoping to right the ship.

 

Thank you always for your kindnesses

correct, People dont want to guess at what may or may not happen... but now you have made the choice people can support that, as you have seen on the other thread..

 

I usually respond well to an updose within a day or three...

But my last one (see sig) took 1-2 weeks as it was a longer time gap, and I was rather sick...

 

Settle in and try to distract, for now... you will get there...

 

Hi Cantfly.....

Question....I was in such a state of panic this morning I took part of my lunch dose mid morning .....was in a crazy "I've got to updose" state .

Any thoughts on whether I should consider this a rescue dose , or just taking my med early? I don't think I'm going to updose if i help It... Not yet anyway.

 

I know , you can't tell me what's going to work -just in your experience or what you might have heard from others .... It's Valium but being a fast metabolizer it acts more like Ativan for me kind of , parent half life anyway .....

 

Hope you are hanging in there ?

MiYu

 

[[Ki...]]

If your total daily dose isnt different and you just took it early its really just an experiment!

[[...]]

If your total daily dose isnt different and you just took it early its really just an experiment!

 

Thanks kitty , that's a nice way of putting it! After a very rough start to the day and panicking , the afternoon eased a little , still fragile , but a little better , so I guess I'll call it an experiment and neither an updose nor a rescue dose , as I'm  Only taking my usual total for the day now .

MiYu