Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[US...]]

Builder? For those of you tapering using PG and draw out your dose each day...I’m coming up on the end of my first batch...Since I’ll have extra after each batch...what do you do with it?  Since you don’t “throw” out...do you just keep it separate and use it until it’s gone and then start drawing out of your new batch?  Thanks to all!! 

[[Va...]]

Builder? For those of you tapering using PG and draw out your dose each day...I’m coming up on the end of my first batch...Since I’ll have extra after each batch...what do you do with it?  Since you don’t “throw” out...do you just keep it separate and use it until it’s gone and then start drawing out of your new batch?  Thanks to all!!

I either use it to do a partial dose or just pour it into the new batch.  —V

[[bu...]]

Builder? For those of you tapering using PG and draw out your dose each day...I’m coming up on the end of my first batch...Since I’ll have extra after each batch...what do you do with it?  Since you don’t “throw” out...do you just keep it separate and use it until it’s gone and then start drawing out of your new batch?  Thanks to all!!

 

As long as you have enough for a full dose, use it.  If you have a little remaining that is not enough for a full dose, just discard it.

 

Thoroughly clean all your equipment and containers, and start a fresh batch.

[[ga...]]

I would also suggest discarding it. You don't want to introduce bacteria from the old batch into the new batch. Low levels of most bacteria aren't going to harm you. Our kitchens are loaded with bacteria. But if the bacteria sits in liquids at room temperature for long enough, it can multiply to unhealthy levels.

 

Gard

[[US...]]

Hey guys...sorry it’s me again.  I feel like the guest who won’t leave.  Thanks builder!  So after you said that about having enough...I looked at my remaining batch for the next 4 days.  It didn’t look like enough so I measured it.  I screwed up somehow.  I don’t have enough to take my last dose in that batch on the 10th day.  I should have 13ml left and my last dose is 27.80 ml. So not only do I not have any leftover, but I’m short!  I’ve been so careful...tracking and marking off my spreadsheet everyday.  I don’t know what to do...I feel like I failed.  How do I fix this? 

[[ga...]]

Hey guys...sorry it’s me again.  I feel like the guest who won’t leave.  Thanks builder!  So after you said that about having enough...I looked at my remaining batch for the next 4 days.  It didn’t look like enough so I measured it.  I screwed up somehow.  I don’t have enough to take my last dose in that batch on the 10th day.  I should have 13ml left and my last dose is 27.80 ml. So not only do I not have any leftover, but I’m short!  I’ve been so careful...tracking and marking off my spreadsheet everyday.  I don’t know what to do...I feel like I failed.  How do I fix this?

 

USMC, you will not be the first person to measure wrong. How are you feeling? If you're feeling OK, you haven't messed up even if your math is off. You're pretty early in the taper right? I would just look at where you are today and start over from there. If you want to be extra safe, you could hold a few days at today's dose and then start up again. As long as you're not going to run out of your script, there's not much to worry about.

 

Going forward, do you have someone in the house that can check your math and check your measurements? I sometimes ask my daughter to do that for me. Usually I'm on track but sometimes she finds me off because I'm looking at the wrong line or something silly like that. It goes something like this,

 

"Will you check my mark? The card says I'm at 6.2ml today." 

"Mom, that's the 6.4ml mark."

"Oh, sure enough, it is!"

 

If you're unsure about your math, I'm sure builder can help you. You'll get back on track and everything will be fine.

 

Gard

[[bu...]]

Hey guys...sorry it’s me again.  I feel like the guest who won’t leave.  Thanks builder!  So after you said that about having enough...I looked at my remaining batch for the next 4 days.  It didn’t look like enough so I measured it.  I screwed up somehow.  I don’t have enough to take my last dose in that batch on the 10th day.  I should have 13ml left and my last dose is 27.80 ml. So not only do I not have any leftover, but I’m short!  I’ve been so careful...tracking and marking off my spreadsheet everyday.  I don’t know what to do...I feel like I failed.  How do I fix this?

 

See my reply on your other thread.

 

Don't worry about, there is no problem.

 

Is your dose lower today than it was 10 days ago.  Then your doing fine.

 

 

[[US...]]

Thanks Gard...yes, it’s my first batch.  Thanks for being so kind.  I’m going to prepare my batches with my husband for awhile...

[[Ba...]]

Builder, hey found you again.  I get so confused by these boards.

I screwed up my taper.  Took to little and it hit me 5 days later-- yipes.  And this was tiny taper.  Then tried to figure it out correctly and overdid it I am sure.  Hope I am at the right dose now.

 

You are one of the few folks who can figure them, I believe. 

You must have aced chemistry...

 

Hope you are well.

[[Ul...]]

Hey guys...sorry it’s me again.  I feel like the guest who won’t leave.  Thanks builder!  So after you said that about having enough...I looked at my remaining batch for the next 4 days.  It didn’t look like enough so I measured it.  I screwed up somehow.  I don’t have enough to take my last dose in that batch on the 10th day.  I should have 13ml left and my last dose is 27.80 ml. So not only do I not have any leftover, but I’m short!  I’ve been so careful...tracking and marking off my spreadsheet everyday.  I don’t know what to do...I feel like I failed.  How do I fix this?

 

You didn't screw up...you just found a way that doesn't quite work! Remember, it's not "trial and error", it's "trial and correction"!! It'll all even out in the wash and your finish line will still be in the same place.

 

Next!!

[[Ba...]]

My pill weight next day or two will be 10 mg valium will weigh .173 average, no longer .162.

 

If my dose has been .071, will it now go to .076??

 

I would really appreciate some insight as I've just made lotta errors lately and now new bottle of pills.

 

 

Thank you.

[[Re...]]

My pill weight next day or two will be 10 mg valium will weigh .173 average, no longer .162.

 

If my dose has been .071, will it now go to .076??

 

I would really appreciate some insight as I've just made lotta errors lately and now new bottle of pills.

 

 

Thank you.

 

Hey there.  As no one has chimed in yet, I'll add that you are about right.

 

Your previous full tablet was 0.162.  Your dose was weighed as 0.071.  By determining the percentage of a full tablet that is represented in 0.071 (partial tablet), we can calculate the mg's of valium in your dose (because we know your complete tablets contain 10 milligrams of valium):  So, 0.071/0.162 gives us 0.438.  Stated another way, 0.438 is equivalent to 43.8%.  So, what is 43.8% of 10mg of of valium?  Let's go back to our decimal equivalent of 43.8%, which is 0.438, and then multiply that by 10mgs.  Sooooooo 0.438 x 10 = 4.38mgs of valium.  Now, if your new tablets weigh 0.173, and you want to know how much to weigh out to get 4.38mg of valium, it's very straightforward.  In a 10mg tablet, 4.38mg of valium has a decimal equivalent of 0.438.  All we need do is take that number and multiply it by the measured mass of your 10 mg tablet, which you stated is now 0.173.  Therefore, 0.173 x .438 = 0.075774.  You correctly rounded up to 0.076.

 

Now, is that helpful or more confusing than before???

 

-RST

[[Ba...]]

Yes I think I get that.  I will try to copy that down.

 

I follow it all and that at the end where you have a percent of a new amount is kinda where for an unknown reason, my mind fades out.  I do get the ratio of amount taken of pill x  mg of pill for the dose.

 

I just have to remember  that percent of any other pill, right?

 

Hey I will write down your name and hope I can find you again should the need arise, ok?  I keep losing people and topics on BB boards... maybe it is the same brain glitch that had to ask for caculation help!!

 

Thanks very much, RST.

[[Ma...]]

Has anyone taken doxipin? Im having a terrible time with insomnia and i cant take temeron.

[[ga...]]

Has anyone taken doxipin? Im having a terrible time with insomnia and i cant take temeron.

 

I haven't, but there is an insomnia thread on here somewhere. Someone on there may have. I take low-dose Seroquel.

 

Gard

[[le...]]

I'm doing a liquid-dry split taper. I started with 5 ml (.5 mg V) of solution and reduced from that while keeping the dry pills stable.

 

Now I've tapered all that liquid down so I cut my dry pills and took a new draw of 5 ml of solution.

 

It seems to have upticked my symptoms. It could be the cuts catching up to me. But does everyone do it like that, swinging from taking almost no solution to a fresh batch?

[[Ba...]]

I don't know about temeron.  Tried doxepin and it made me kind of dizzy and a lot of tinnitus.  You can try it... nothing too bad but I haven't returned to it.

[[jr...]]

I'm doing a liquid-dry split taper. I started with 5 ml (.5 mg V) of solution and reduced from that while keeping the dry pills stable.

 

Now I've tapered all that liquid down so I cut my dry pills and took a new draw of 5 ml of solution.

 

It seems to have upticked my symptoms. It could be the cuts catching up to me. But does everyone do it like that, swinging from taking almost no solution to a fresh batch?

 

Whatever it may be, I suggest holding for a bit to see if things level out. It is possible to reduce without crazy sxs but you must be willing to go as slow as necessary. Avoid glutamate damage is your first priority. I learned this from SG57 and it is good advise!

[[US...]]

What is glutamate damage or toxicity?  I had to pretty stop my daily Ativan...was taking about 1mg everyday for about a year.  My Dr. Dropped my Xanax XR from 4mg to 3mg on December 8th.  I got switch over to regular X and he said to only use Ativan in emergencies.  Since the 1st I’ve only taken about 2.75mg total.  My last dose was January 11th of .75mg.  I started tapering the Xanax on a January 22nd...I’m down to 2.76.  The past two days are crazy with rage.  I’ve been angry but this is a whole new level.  Insomnia of course, GI problems and our favorite...anxiety.  I’m literally seeing red...

[[Ul...]]

What is glutamate damage or toxicity?  I had to pretty stop my daily Ativan...was taking about 1mg everyday for about a year.  My Dr. Dropped my Xanax XR from 4mg to 3mg on December 8th.  I got switch over to regular X and he said to only use Ativan in emergencies.  Since the 1st I’ve only taken about 2.75mg total.  My last dose was January 11th of .75mg.  I started tapering the Xanax on a January 22nd...I’m down to 2.76.  The past two days are crazy with rage.  I’ve been angry but this is a whole new level.  Insomnia of course, GI problems and our favorite...anxiety.  I’m literally seeing red...

 

I'm no smart one, but mercy, you've got a lot going on! Dropping Xanax from 4 to 3 in one motion is a tough one for the body. Tapering 3mg down to 2.76 in ten days is brutal for most bodies running around out there, as well. I know it can be done, but with your history that may be too aggressive. I'd bet that the quick stoppage of Ativan is playing a role in what you're experiencing too. And, I'll let someone else explain the glutamate damage, but I know it happens when we're doing things to create killer sx. It's an excitatory neurotransmitter of some type in the brain, neurons get damaged, and we don't want to make it mad . Your brain and body is probably similar to mine....meaning, been through one heck of a lot over the years. I'd chill and not do a thing for a chunk of time until your body "catches up" to the rest of the program. You'll know when it's safe to continue, but rage, insomnia etc are huge signs of communication. Listen to your body, heal faster than you taper, and I bet that you'll even out. Hang in there! On to the next!

 

Jeff

[[ga...]]

I remember SG57 (miss him tons!) urging everyone to avoid glutamate damage. My understanding is GABA (calming) and glutamate (excitatory) work together with one changing to the other as needed for our brains to function. Of course, in benzo w/d, this is messed up. SG used to talk about damage from excess glutamate during w/d being dangerous and that strong w/d symptoms were a sign of high glutamate. So the idea is to withdraw very slowly so as not to let glutamate get too high. Disclaimer: I am pulling this all from my bad memory.

 

I think SG was on the right track. Unless you are having a direct toxic effect from the drug itself, it's better to w/d as slowly as necessary to keep symptoms as low as possible. Daily micro-tapers and slow tapers including holds seem to be the best way to w/d safely with minimum damage, whether it be from glutamate or something else.

 

There's a member, Perseverance, who is no longer active, but who has written posts explaining all the biochemistry of this. I've seen them pop up here and there. They are way over my head, but the gist is benzos are very powerful and mess up a whole lot so it takes a long time for the nervous system to repair itself. But it can repair itself. I am one who believes we do heal as we taper. I am tapering and am better in many ways than when I was taking the drug as originally prescribed.

 

Gard

[[Su...]]

I'm doing a liquid-dry split taper. I started with 5 ml (.5 mg V) of solution and reduced from that while keeping the dry pills stable.

 

Now I've tapered all that liquid down so I cut my dry pills and took a new draw of 5 ml of solution.

 

It seems to have upticked my symptoms. It could be the cuts catching up to me. But does everyone do it like that, swinging from taking almost no solution to a fresh batch?

 

Hi Lemon Juice,

That's how it works for me and we seem to be doing similar patterns.  I hold for a few days when I start a new round of cutting from liquid. (I cut .06mg of Xanax in liquid form and the rest in pill form.  That way I'm  stable when I being to taper again).

SS

[[Va...]]

I remember SG57 (miss him tons!) urging everyone to avoid glutamate damage. My understanding is GABA (calming) and glutamate (excitatory) work together with one changing to the other as needed for our brains to function. Of course, in benzo w/d, this is messed up. SG used to talk about damage from excess glutamate during w/d being dangerous and that strong w/d symptoms were a sign of high glutamate. So the idea is to withdraw very slowly so as not to let glutamate get too high. Disclaimer: I am pulling this all from my bad memory.

 

I think SG was on the right track. Unless you are having a direct toxic effect from the drug itself, it's better to w/d as slowly as necessary to keep symptoms as low as possible. Daily micro-tapers and slow tapers including holds seem to be the best way to w/d safely with minimum damage, whether it be from glutamate or something else.

 

There's a member, Perseverance, who is no longer active, but who has written posts explaining all the biochemistry of this. I've seen them pop up here and there. They are way over my head, but the gist is benzos are very powerful and mess up a whole lot so it takes a long time for the nervous system to repair itself. But it can repair itself. I am one who believes we do heal as we taper. I am tapering and am better in many ways than when I was taking the drug as originally prescribed.

 

Gard

Your memory is better than you think gard.  —v

[[ga...]]

I remember SG57 (miss him tons!) urging everyone to avoid glutamate damage. My understanding is GABA (calming) and glutamate (excitatory) work together with one changing to the other as needed for our brains to function. Of course, in benzo w/d, this is messed up. SG used to talk about damage from excess glutamate during w/d being dangerous and that strong w/d symptoms were a sign of high glutamate. So the idea is to withdraw very slowly so as not to let glutamate get too high. Disclaimer: I am pulling this all from my bad memory.

 

I think SG was on the right track. Unless you are having a direct toxic effect from the drug itself, it's better to w/d as slowly as necessary to keep symptoms as low as possible. Daily micro-tapers and slow tapers including holds seem to be the best way to w/d safely with minimum damage, whether it be from glutamate or something else.

 

There's a member, Perseverance, who is no longer active, but who has written posts explaining all the biochemistry of this. I've seen them pop up here and there. They are way over my head, but the gist is benzos are very powerful and mess up a whole lot so it takes a long time for the nervous system to repair itself. But it can repair itself. I am one who believes we do heal as we taper. I am tapering and am better in many ways than when I was taking the drug as originally prescribed.

 

Gard

Your memory is better than you think gard.  —v

Thanks, V. I hope you're right. I don't think I have remembered a thing I have practiced from Unit 1 in my Office Skills class. And the quiz is next Friday! I sure miss the days when I had time to hang out on Benzo Buddies and learn things I actually cared about instead of studying things like how to merge cells and how to set up a virtual machine. Not only don't I remember how to make a virtual machine, I lost the one I did make. I am doomed if I can't find it because my work is on it. :'(

[[...]]

Gard- what's your dose now? Since you're doing 5% a month, do you decrease your daily cut Amt each month to keep it at 5%?