withdrawing from klonopin, norco, AND Z Drugs...(sorry, I didn't know...)

[[Pa...]]

I totally understand, Pam...I know that no one wants to lead anyone else astray here and that it is best to stay on topic about the things you know best.

 

About the hormone thing...is this something I should discuss with Adelia in a personal message, so as not to take everyone down a rabbit trail?  Do lots of people have trouble with thyroid when they are withdrawing from klonopin?  It is amazing how complex our bodies are and how all these things affect each other!

 

~Leena

 

Bring it out here Leena, we've seen a lot of thryoid "issues".  In fact Theresa2 had problems and usually advises those with similar symptoms to get it checked.  adelia and I have both wondered about what role this all plays in how we react to benzo withdrawal.  Could it play a part in why some people can get off of benzo's without any problems?  I don't know but it sure makes you wonder why we got so lucky to be the ones to suffer.

 

Dr Ashton does mention it, so we know we could be on to something.

 

Individual symptoms, their causes and how to deal with them

    Insomnia, nightmares, sleep disturbance

    Intrusive memories

    Panic attacks

    Generalised anxiety, panics and phobias

    Psychological techniques

    Complementary medicine techniques

    Exercise and other techniques

    Sensory hypersensitivity

    Depersonalisation, derealisation

    Hallucinations, illusions, perceptual distortions

    Depression, aggression, obsessions

    Muscle symptoms

    Bodily sensations

    Heart and lungs

    Problems with balance

    Digestive problems

    Immune system

    Endocrine problems

    Fits, convulsions

[[ad...]]

Adelia and Softtail,

 

You all are really such wonderful resources...THANK YOU for sharing your knowledge with me.  I appreciate both of your opinions on the opiates, as I think I may have to rely upon them to get me through the pain phase of whatever this is.  Isn't it odd that I can have the assurance that my pain doctor will prescribe an opiate for me...but that I have to be afraid to tell her too much about tapering off the benzo because she doesn't think I should be getting off??  This is one of the reasons I am so grateful for this website and for you all.  Besides helping me with this taper, you also are (in a way) an "accountability" group for me.  When I realized after that first night (3 nights ago) that the norco absolutely DID help me to be able rest at night, I have taken it the past 2 nights as well.  I have not been tempted to take it during the day because just my activity level helps me deal with the pain.  I appreciate the insight that your buddie gave you, Softtail, about how if you only take it at night, it hasn't had time to build up in your system.  Still, I am not going to take it unless I absolutely cannot sleep.

 

Adelia, I will post tomorrow (or should I say later today) about my latest lab results to get your opinion, and tell you more about the cortisol test.  It WAS the fasting blood test, not a saliva test.  I am not sure where I would go to get the saliva test...

SO many thanks to both of you for sharing your insights with me!

 

~Leena

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Leena,

 

As Pam suggested, the opiate issue can be kind of a cloudy one.  Forgive me, if I seem too strong against them.  That's just my experience of how they work, and work against.  But then, the beauty of being on a forum like BB is the range of experiences one can glean from.  That being said, I still need some pain relief once in a while too, so....I definitely can relate to everything that has to be weighed in taking different meds. 

 

I think it's been good to talk about your pain meds in this thread thus far, because they are just part of the entire "mix" of the many meds you take.  No doubt, they all have an effect on your benzo tapering, we just don't know what. 

 

But it will also be good to have some more focused discussions (on the "Other Meds" board) on maybe the opiods by themselves, because there's a lot to talk about!  You might get some info on some of the other meds you're taking too, who knows. 

 

And no matter information I might put out there, I know it's best for you to decide with your dr. what amounts you take, of what.  But I'm also a strong advocate of listening to yourself, like you are, and doing what you need to do (like you are).   Great job!

 

adelia

[[so...]]

ok last word on the opiates.  Adelia, thanks for the detailed info.  Leena.  you and I will have to deal with them as needed for our other problems.  Lets hope we can ditch them also down the road. 

As for the benzo's , no doubt they are the worst addicting drug I have ever faced, and never want to again.  Lets get that drug out of your system, then you and I can worry about the other chemicals we are feeding our bodies;

St.

[[le...]]

  From Leena...an update.  After holding for about 2 weeks at taking .125 mg klonopin, twice a day (total of .25 per day) I decided it was time for a cut.  I have been waiting for my graduated cylinder to arrive and it still has not come.  So, I decided to just go ahead and cut my 1/4 pills in half (not very easy!) and take .0625 twice a day.  I did this yesterday for the first time.

 

Today I woke up feeling horrible.  Does feeling horrible happen this quickly?  I think I need to go back to the .125 twice a day, since this week I am supposed to have two painting jobs and I cannot do it if I feel like I do today.

My worst "symptoms" are extreme muscle burning and pain.  I felt like I was tied in knots when I woke up.

 

Yesterday, on my google alerts about fibromyalgia, an article came up about how research was just completed that something like 98% of people in a group with chronic fatigue/fibromyalgia tested positive for (I think it was something called retrovirus).  This was in comparison to a group who did NOT have CF/Fibro and who tested at 0%.  SO...here I am wondering again:  Well, you know what I am wondering.

 

Can anyone explain to me the "why" of the muscle symptoms when going through klonopin withdrawals?  Maybe if I understood "why" it happens, it would help me with acceptance.  ~Leena

[[Pa...]]

Hi Leena,

 

It's very common to feel the effects of your cut right away.  Some say they notice the cut from one to three days afterwards.  So what you're feeling is normal.  Tapering is the most successful when its done at a slow steady pace.  Going down in dose, then going back up isn't a good idea.  You're training your body as you taper, it's beginning to think and react on it's own and making changes sends a confusing message. 

 

I know it's hard to plan when to cut when life gets in the way, but it's quite possible that you may feel stable again in a couple of days.  Try not to react to each new sensation, try to calm yourself and accept this is what needs to happen for you to heal.

 

This is from the Ashton Manual, I hope it helps.

 

Muscle symptoms. Benzodiazepines are efficient muscle relaxants and are used clinically for spastic conditions ranging from spinal cord disease or injury to the excruciating muscle spasms of tetanus or rabies. It is therefore not surprising that their discontinuation after long-term use is associated with a rebound increase in muscle tension. This rebound accounts for many of the symptoms observed in benzodiazepine withdrawal. Muscle stiffness affecting the limbs, back, neck and jaw are commonly reported, and the constant muscle tension probably accounts for the muscle pains which have a similar distribution. Headaches are usually of the "tension headache" type, due to contraction of muscles at the back of the neck, scalp and forehead - often described as a "tight band around the head". Pain in the jaw and teeth is probably due to involuntary jaw clenching, which often occurs unconsciously during sleep.

 

At the same time, the nerves to the muscles are hyperexcitable, leading to tremor, tics, jerks, spasm and twitching, and jumping at the smallest stimulus. All this constant activity contributes to a feeling of fatigue and weakness ("jelly-legs"). In addition, the muscles, especially the small muscles of the eye, are not well co-ordinated, which may lead to blurred or double vision or even eyelid spasms (blepharospasm).

 

None of these symptoms is harmful, and they need not be a cause of worry once they are understood. The muscle pain and stiffness is actually little different from what is regarded as normal after an unaccustomed bout of exercise, and would be positively expected, even by a well-trained athlete, after running a marathon.

 

There are many measures that will alleviate these symptoms, such as muscle stretching exercises as taught in most gyms, moderate exercise, hot baths, massage and general relaxation exercises. Such measures may give only temporary relief at first, but if practised regularly can speed the recovery of normal muscle tone - which will eventually occur spontaneously.

 

I understand you're worried about your fibromyalgia, but you need to eliminate the benzo from this equation.  How will you ever know which is what unless you do?

 

 

[[le...]]

Thanks Pam...I needed to hear that (again)

[[Pa...]]

Thanks Pam...I needed to hear that (again)

 

Keep coming back, we know what you're feeling, we know the fear this produces.  This process takes rational thinking adults and turns us into fear filled paranoid agoraphobics.  I hated it, I didn't recognize myself.  But I came back when I healed.

[[le...]]

Pam, Adelia, Theresa2...back to the thyroid question.  Did any of ya'll have a swollen thyroid gland?  I am going to go to the doctor (I think), but I think I have something swollen in the center/left side of the bottom part of my neck.  I am trying to figure out if I am just paranoid or not.  I keep looking online to see exactly where the gland is located.  My "lump" seems about even with my collarbone...but like I said in the center/left of my throat (or where my neck joins on with my body).  I let a friend look and feel of it today, and she said there is something there.  I had been to the doctor for this cough.  I remember he felt of my upper neck...but did not feel where I have noticed the lump.  I KNOW YA'LL AREN'T DOCTORS!  And would not try to diagnose me.  I am just wondering if ya'll had anything similar happen.

 

Thank you!

Leena

[[Th...]]

Pam, Adelia, Theresa2...back to the thyroid question.  Did any of ya'll have a swollen thyroid gland?  I am going to go to the doctor (I think), but I think I have something swollen in the center/left side of the bottom part of my neck.  I am trying to figure out if I am just paranoid or not.  I keep looking online to see exactly where the gland is located.  My "lump" seems about even with my collarbone...but like I said in the center/left of my throat (or where my neck joins on with my body).  I let a friend look and feel of it today, and she said there is something there.  I had been to the doctor for this cough.  I remember he felt of my upper neck...but did not feel where I have noticed the lump.  I KNOW YA'LL AREN'T DOCTORS!  And would not try to diagnose me.  I am just wondering if ya'll had anything similar happen.

 

Thank you!

Leena

 

I don't feel anything like that? When I was 22, I had a goiter where it was puffed out down there but maybe it could have started out as a lump??

[[Pa...]]

Hi Leena,

 

I had my thyroid removed last year, I never even knew where that little thing was until then!  But my scar is level with my collar bone, in the little indentation.  I think it's a good idea to get it checked out, and you're right unless you point these things out, your first Dr wouldn't notice it.

 

I had what they call a thyroglossul duct cyst near, it was a lump in my neck under my chin on my right side.  When they removed it and tested the lymph gland next to it they found cancer cells, thyroid cancer cells.  So, they then took my thyroid out.  I don't mean to alarm you, I just wanted to let you know what I found when I discovered a lump.

 

Look on the internet for thyroglossul duct cyst, see if it fits.  Or, it could be nodules on your thyroid gland and I hear they're fairly common.

 

Let us know!!

[[le...]]

Pam and Theresa,

 

Thank you for getting back to me so quickly.  You probably know I am already kind of "up to here" with worries.  I appreciate your thoughtful replies and sharing your experiences with me.  Pam..I think everyone (when confronted with a "lump" anywhere) immediately wonders if it is cancer.  So, don't worry that you may have frightened me.  I had already had that thought.  I will keep you posted!

 

:smitten:Leena

[[ad...]]

 From Leena...an update.  After holding for about 2 weeks at taking .125 mg klonopin, twice a day (total of .25 per day) I decided it was time for a cut.  I have been waiting for my graduated cylinder to arrive and it still has not come.  So, I decided to just go ahead and cut my 1/4 pills in half (not very easy!) and take .0625 twice a day.  I did this yesterday for the first time.

 

Today I woke up feeling horrible.  Does feeling horrible happen this quickly?  I think I need to go back to the .125 twice a day, since this week I am supposed to have two painting jobs and I cannot do it if I feel like I do today.

My worst "symptoms" are extreme muscle burning and pain.  I felt like I was tied in knots when I woke up.

 

Yesterday, on my google alerts about fibromyalgia, an article came up about how research was just completed that something like 98% of people in a group with chronic fatigue/fibromyalgia tested positive for (I think it was something called retrovirus).  This was in comparison to a group who did NOT have CF/Fibro and who tested at 0%.  SO...here I am wondering again:  Well, you know what I am wondering.

 

Can anyone explain to me the "why" of the muscle symptoms when going through klonopin withdrawals?  Maybe if I understood "why" it happens, it would help me with acceptance.   ~Leena

 

Hi Leena,

 

How are you feeling the past few days?  When I read about your cut, I thought YIKES!!!  That's a 50% cut!!!  

 

Are you back to "slow and steady" now?  To the recommended 10% cuts?  

 

Not that you have to do it that way.  We all get to do it however we want.  But it does seem, from what you've said so far, that your body is exquisitely dependent on the Klon.  And after taking it so long, that doesn't surprise me.   I tapered off too fast, but I didn't know any better then.  I didn't find BB until after I was off 2 weeks.  And after the extreme misery and suffering I'd been through already to that point, no way was I going back on ANY amount.  

 

My main symptoms were, and still have been, extreme muscle distress.  Burning, aching, pain, you name it.  All over my body -- from chest, neck, shoulders, back to the worst in my legs, for whatever reasons.  

 

I know you're worried about having fibromyalgia, and all of that.  I'm not sure you realize yet Leena, just how important this taper off Klon could be for your overall health.   That it might be possible some of your pain symptoms could have been, and still be, from the benzo (excluding the bone breaks, etc.).  It took a long time for this to sink into my head, that's why I suggest this.  

 

These are just my thoughts and experiences, but I can see you running all over the map, still looking for solutions for the "mysterious" illness.  And maybe there is one.  I did that same thing myself, convinced I would find it.  Instead, I found out what benzos could do.   You might want to consider just hunkering down and focusing on getting off the Klon.  And then see.  That doesn't mean jumping off the Klon, it means tapering off VERY SLOWLY so that your receptors and body have a chance to heal while you go through the process.  This way, you won't catapult your body into extreme stress and crisis.  Things don't have to be in crisis all the time.  There is another way.  Know what I mean?    

 

It's very possible you'll need to be off the Klon for awhile before you can begin to make any real sense of what's going on.  The benzo can be quite pervasive.   

 

How are things going with your thyroid?  

 

adelia

[[le...]]

Hi Adelia,

Thank you so much for your posting to me.  I DO agree with you...and know it can only be a good thing to get off of the klonopin.  I sent a post to Colin in the tapering part of the forum, asking him for make me a plan.  He told me I would need to talk to all of you (Pam, Theresa, Softtail, Adelia...) to help me decide on what kind of taper would be best for me.  I am totalling willing for you all to tell me what you think, since you have been interacting with me on this part of the forum.  I am back at .125 mg.  two times a day...and would love to do this as painlessly as I can, esp. since I am back at work now.

Would ya'll look at Colin's post to me and see what you think of his idea of a slow taper?  I think I would like to start on Friday.

 

About the thyroid, my internist wants me to come see him on Thursday so that he can look at the "lump" in my neck.  That will be 11:40 central time.  I am glad that I am busy painting so I can't focus on it too much!

 

OK...very tired!  :sleepy:Maybe I will sleep tonight!  Adelia, how is your tooth?

~Leena

[[so...]]

leena need to know exactly what amount you are trying to taper from and what drug .

looks like you are on clono and neurontin and want to get off both.

don't know about neurontin,  but if you are on clono, and it looks like that may be .25 mg. total per day If you have a grad . cylinder, you could crush the clono  and put it into .5 ml of water or milk... then split in half (25 ml each since you take twice a day.)

First day take all the  25 ml  which equals all of the.25 mg of clono.

second day throw away 1 ml from the day or night dose,  take the rest.

Continue doing that each day, and you will be off the clono in 50 days.  this is a slow taper, and you should be ok with it.  Maybe even too slow, but only you can tell that. 

If you are doing ok and want to go faster, try 1ml one day and 2ml the next.

If you need more information, we will be glad to help

St.

[[Pa...]]

Hi Leena,

 

I'm bringing your question to Colin, plus his reply over so we can all be on the same page.  I get the feeling that he was hoping that since we know you and might know your needs, we could help you decide what would be slow enough for you to tolerate.  I don't have titration experience, good thing ST is here.  My feelings though would be to try to go at a normal rate that many follow and if it's too fast for you, then you could slow it down then.  I just don't want you to anticipate trouble when you may not have it.  You do need to know however that most any reduction in your dose of Klonopin will come with symptoms, it's the nature of this particular beast.

 

Pam

 

Hello all.  I am currently stabilizing my dose of klonopin at .25 mg day (I take .125 twice a day, at about 10 am and 10 pm.

 

I have the yellow pills (.5 mg) and want to start doing a 10 % taper.  I have my pill crusher and graduated cylinder and was wondering if Colin could draw me up a schedule for a slow taper.  I do not know how long to stay at each dose. I do have the 100ml cylinder with each ml marked on the cylinder.

 

I am sorry to ask for help, as I am sure I could figure it out.  But right now it seems overwhelming to figure it out and I don't want to mess up. I would also be able to waste as few pills as possible.

 

Thank you so much for being so willing to help.  I am so appreciative of this forum!

 

~Leena 

Hi Leena,

 

You should have a discussion with other members to help you determin a good taper rate for you. These things are are always a best guess, but the taper rate can be adjusted later if need be (I can draw up a new schedule with a new taper rate to start where you leave off from the first schedule).

 

I would consider a slow taper rate to be something in the order of 0.5% per day, but if you are particularly sensitive, you might like to go even slower (at least initially). I don't know enough of your circumstances to give a solid suggestion of a suitable taper rate for you, so please seek the feedback of those that better understand your situation and history. I will also require a start date.   

 

 

[[le...]]

Hi Softtail,

 

Did you mean that I should put the crushed pill into 50ml of liquid?  I think you said to put it into .5 ml.

 

Yes, I am trying to get off of klonopin. You are correct about my current dose.  I have already gotten rid of the neurontin.  The only Rx's I am currently taking are klonopin and Cymbalta.

 

Your method looks easy (if I understand it correctly)...and I need it to be slow.  I am going to start on Friday, Lord willing.

 

Thank you, Softtail!

 

~Leena

[[Th...]]

Hi Softtail,

 

Did you mean that I should put the crushed pill into 50ml of liquid?  I think you said to put it into .5 ml.

 

Yes, I am trying to get off of klonopin. You are correct about my current dose.  I have already gotten rid of the neurontin.  The only Rx's I am currently taking are klonopin and Cymbalta.

 

Your method looks easy (if I understand it correctly)...and I need it to be slow.  I am going to start on Friday, Lord willing.

 

Thank you, Softtail!

 

~Leena

 

I am sure he meant 50ml of liquid. 

[[ad...]]

Hi Leena,

 

I'm bringing your question to Colin, plus his reply over so we can all be on the same page.  I get the feeling that he was hoping that since we know you and might know your needs, we could help you decide what would be slow enough for you to tolerate.  I don't have titration experience, good thing ST is here.  My feelings though would be to try to go at a normal rate that many follow and if it's too fast for you, then you could slow it down then.  I just don't want you to anticipate trouble when you may not have it.  You do need to know however that most any reduction in your dose of Klonopin will come with symptoms, it's the nature of this particular beast.

 

Pam

 

Hello all.  I am currently stabilizing my dose of klonopin at .25 mg day (I take .125 twice a day, at about 10 am and 10 pm.

 

I have the yellow pills (.5 mg) and want to start doing a 10 % taper.  I have my pill crusher and graduated cylinder and was wondering if Colin could draw me up a schedule for a slow taper.  I do not know how long to stay at each dose. I do have the 100ml cylinder with each ml marked on the cylinder.

 

I am sorry to ask for help, as I am sure I could figure it out.  But right now it seems overwhelming to figure it out and I don't want to mess up. I would also be able to waste as few pills as possible.

 

Thank you so much for being so willing to help.  I am so appreciative of this forum!

 

~Leena   

Hi Leena,

 

You should have a discussion with other members to help you determin a good taper rate for you. These things are are always a best guess, but the taper rate can be adjusted later if need be (I can draw up a new schedule with a new taper rate to start where you leave off from the first schedule).

 

I would consider a slow taper rate to be something in the order of 0.5% per day, but if you are particularly sensitive, you might like to go even slower (at least initially). I don't know enough of your circumstances to give a solid suggestion of a suitable taper rate for you, so please seek the feedback of those that better understand your situation and history. I will also require a start date.   

 

 

 

Hi Leena,

 

Good for you.....starting Friday!!  That's pretty exciting...I'm excited for you, anyway. 

 

Knowing what I know about you, I would go for the very slowest taper, at this point.  Start slow, then pick it up later (infitessimally) if you're feeling okay. 

 

 

The reason I suggest this for you is....from all your posts since you've been here, it seems your body reacts very quickly (and aggressively) to a change in dose.  And...that's pretty much it, I think.  IMO, a 50-day taper would probably be way too fast. 

 

adelia

p.s.  thanks Pam, for that info.  It was so helpful!  I was about ready to start my computer's slow trek over to find all those posts....

 

[[le...]]

Hello buddies,

I wanted to give an update on where I am in my tapering progress.  I began tapering this past Friday night (the 16th).  I started mixing my 1/4 of a .5mg tablet (crushed) in 50ml of milk, and drawing off 1ml.  Tonight I decided I am going to go ahead and take off 5ml at a time, because I think it is so hard to take off 1ml.  So, I think what I will be doing is tapering by 10% and staying at that dose until I feel "stable".  (The problem is, because I think I have been in tolerance withdrawal for so long, I don't think I am going to know what stable is.)  The point is that I have started and I am determined to finish.

 

I have made a 2nd decision that I know is kind of controversial, but there is a "method to my madness".  I began tapering off my antidepressant (cymbalta) a few days before I started tapering off the klonopin.  The reason is that the cymbalta has always had the effect of making my muscles more tense (even though it has helped with the pain in my feet) and I knew as I went down on the klonopin the effects of the cymbalta on my muscles would become more pronounced.  I just couldn't let that happen.

 

And the lump in my neck?  Turns out it is an extra large joint bone...and not my thyroid gland.  SO thankful for that.  And thankful for you all!  ~Leena

[[...]]

Dear Leena:

 

Congratulations on starting your taper.  I too went off AD's and mood stablizers at the same time I tapered Klon.  Like you I found the muscle pain too uncomfortable to tolerate.  It was not fun and I am certain that it exacerbated my emotional misery.  It can be done, however.  I can testify.

 

ntw

[[Pa...]]

Hi Leena,

 

I'm glad to hear your thyroid is okay, lets see how many scary stories did we tell you?

 

Congratulations on getting started on your taper!  Are you sure you want to taper the A/D??  How do you know the muscle aches are from the Cymbalta and not from the Klonopin?  We tell folks all the time that when you add or subtract something from your routine, do them one at a time so you'll know what's what.  BENZO depression is the worst Leena, its unreal.  Please reconsider!

 

Pam

[[...]]

Hi Leena: 

 

I have to come back to agree with Pam about benzo depression.  It is worse than regular depression.  Lots of people say they just want their regular depression back.  Frankly, the only reason I didn't become suicidal during the first months after withdrawal was because I was too confused.

 

ntw

[[ad...]]

Hi there Leena, 

 

Great to hear of your tapering plan.  I'm all for it!  I know it's hard to figure out just what to do, so congratulations on how well you're doing with that. 

 

So how are you feeling after reducing some of your Cymbalta?  I'm all for tapering off that too, does that surprise you?  I know, I know....it's best to do one at a time, just like wise Pam says.  But sometimes, there's too much crap going on, and you have to launch half the ship.   

 

Seriously though, I took Cymbalta a few years ago.  For one day.  It immediately helped the nerve pain, yes it did.  Within an hour and a half.  And then 6 hours later, I got intense REBOUND pain...meaning the resulting pain was much worse than what I started with.  Then my mood proceeded to get very bad...almost murderous!  (Lucky I live alone...)  And then I had severe insomnia all night.  I had to lay awake in front of the TV.  It was SO very destructive to me in that one day, that I vowed (to myself) that if I ever took one more dose of that, I would disown myself!!! 

 

Anyway, that's just my experience....and I trust your judgment on your own experience with what's happening with all of it.  Good for you! 

 

---

 

hey NTW....a belated congratulations on becoming a moderator.  I'll just take the opportunity to say that here (thanks Leena for letting me butt into your thread...).  I'm looking forward to getting to know you better, and what all you've gone through. 

 

I agree with your opinions on benzo depression.  I had to think back...was I depressed the first months off?  No, I wasn't, not really.  My brain was too hyper and needed too much minute-by-minute distraction from all the miseries to even get very low.  And if I ever felt any low-down depression coming on, I took tyrosine (amino acid) 500 mg cap, and B6, 50 mg together on an empty stomach.  Up to three times a day if I needed it.  Tyrosine also boosts the thyroid.  My brain feels more energized and more "glued together" sort of, for about 4-5 hours.  It really helps me a lot.  I just took some today because my brain cells felt like this... and it feels like my brain suddenly stands up and salutes...comes to order...or all the cells start holding hands and cross the street together. 

 

adelia 

[[Pa...]]

Well there you have it Leena, you got the benefit of all of our opinions!  I'm now trying to remember if you even asked for them?  Whatever you do, we just want you to feel the best you can during this difficult time.

 

Okay adelia and ntw, who shall we pop in on next?    I wish you could all see me sitting here at my desk grinning like an idiot. 

[[le...]]

  I just love all you guys!  First time I have smiled all day, I think!  Now...I have to confess to a REALLY stupid thing I just discovered about my taper.  I CANNOT believe I have done this!  I think I told you before that I have these syringes around because of a son that is diabetic...and the outside of the syringe is marked in cc's.  I have been thinking that because it has 1,2,3,4...on up to 10 that it was a 10cc syringe.  THEN...tonight when I was washing dishes, I knocked over my graduated cylinder and it shattered on the floor!  When I picked up the bottom part (the first 30 ml are still intact...yea!) and looked at it, I realized that it was impossible that the syringe was a 10cc syringe.  I don't know why it is marked the way it is, but it has to be a 1cc syringe.  I filled it up and squirted it into the cylinder...and yep, that is what it is.  So...these past few days when I have thought I was drawing out a ml from my cup, I was only drawing out what?  A tenth of a ml?  And then when I thought I was drawing out 5ml last night and this morning, I was only drawing out 1/2 ml!  I AM SO DISCOURAGED!  I was bellyaching all day (inwardly, of course about how BAD I felt since I started drawing out 5 ml, and it was only 1/2!  Can it be possible that I really felt that different (bad) with taking out such a tiny amount?  Now, I don't know what to do!  Do you think this was Providence keeping me from making too large of a cut???  At this rate, though, it will take me forever to get off!   HELP ME!!!!!!!

 

About the muscle problems from the cymbalta...yes, I know that the AD does this.  It happened with Zoloft and Celexa before I even tried the Cymbalta. And what did I do when this would happen?  Why, I would increase the klonopin temporarily and it would take that awful tension away. I did not realize what a mistake I was making. I always would tell my doctor about how bad the antidepressant made my muscles feel but they would not believe me!  But I know it to be a fact.  (continued on next post)