Z-Drug Support Group (Lunesta, Imovane, Zimovane, Ambien, Sonata, Zopiclone)

[[le...]]

No trick or treating here. Waiting for Boris to speak about to get another 4 week lockdown happy days!

[[Sh...]]

Great plan jerry x glad u had a good day.we had full moon and bats flying around everywhere. Very spooky x

[[De...]]

Happy Halloween fellow Z-sters!  I haven't posted for awhile.  Been in and out of waves but today marks 3 full months off Ambien and all other drugs.  The last few weeks I have felt that time is moving more quickly, which I'll take as some improvement.  Still many many symptoms, never without something or other for more than about 20 minutes.  I feel the stress building though - stress of the US election, stress of the worsening pandemic, Stress of the upcoming holidays and the peer pressure to gather with loved ones despite the pandemic, and good old fashioned typical family drama :-(

 

Stress is not good!  Breathe!  Breathe!

[[Sh...]]

Hey Deanna x so glad to hear from u x glad ur having a bit of an easier time xx sounds like the healing is beginning x we just had our election and our idiot premier (governor) just got voted back in. Pretty disappointed but what can u do. Will be watching us election to see what happens for sure x

[[Ka...]]

Jerry, do you live by the coast? I could google it! It feels good to go down a tiny bit, I'm with you!!! I enjoy hearing about all the richness in your life.

 

LadyDen and Shayna, happy blue moon! It's cool we can see it from everywhere ... I can't fathom astronomy myself, but it looks pretty out there! We lit 2 pumpkins that my husband carved, one is a kitty face!

 

Deanna!!!! CONGRATULATIONS, sorry I've not seen your story, do you have a link to more info? ... how long did you take it and how long to taper and did symptoms get worse as you tapered or better or neither? Stress is NOT good, yes, I am now online later than I want to be. BUT clocks get set back tonight where I am, so actually I'm on time.

 

My biggest symptom so far is I feel exhausted but also compelled to do a lot ... a confusing combination. But I walk daily and now in the cold I find it very draining and walking more than 20 minutes is hard on me due to fibromyalgia. SO, why was I out in the cold walking for an hour today? Full circle back to doing too much, but I need things to do and feel good about ... even if I pay a price. BREATHE. I do like to go through the alphabet and make a gratitude list, or think of people I love and care for and pray for them; so bedtime routine.

 

November begins. Wishing everyone warmth and rest and joy deep within.

[[De...]]

Hi Kachina,  I did a fairly quick taper (5 weeks - see sig) because I had hit tolerance withdrawal and was suffering terribly every day.  As soon as I dropped from 10mg to 5mgs I almost instant felt better, and that prompted me to reduce often, like every 10 days.  The half-life of Ambien is just a couple hours so I just wanted to be off it.  The first month of acute withdrawal was bad, couch bound most days.  I am fairly functional but VERY uncomfortable most of the time - nerve pain being the most bothersome symptom.  I keep forgetting to practice acceptance - so important. 

 

This past week I tried a gluten/dairy-free diet to see if it would help.  I don't think it did anything, I actually felt rotten this week but probably just a wave.  I totally understand the exhaustion/want to get up and do things conundrum!  I have so much desire to get things done - I'm a doer by nature - I actually lay down and plan my steps to minimize the energy needed to get my chores done lol.

 

Did you have fibromyalgia before the withdrawal? I do feel like that's exactly what I am suffering from but only because of this bad drug.

 

Happy November!

[[Ka...]]

Thanks for the update Deanna, wow, fast, congratulations!! How is your sleep? Did you build a sleep routine in the evening? Do you go to sleep easily???

 

You are reminding me maybe the fibromyalgia stuff is mainly due to taking Ambien... I keep forgetting that (this site is the first place I heard that idea) just because I've had the symptoms around as long as I've been on Ambien, 20 years, and never made a connection.  Which came first, I'm not sure really as that was SO long ago.

 

So you feel a lot better still or you did at first and now worse/as bad in total withdrawal? I see your signature now, but they all disappears when I hit reply ... so thought it wasn't there.

 

I have mega hip/thigh pain too. I'd like to taper faster, just afraid to. Going to go slow and easy as I've been on it too long.

 

I've been encouraged to do gluten-free by docs for the fibromyalgia but I rebel, food is a hard one for me. Wheat and dairy, I know, have read it so much. But love them ... I've been told it takes months for the "gut to heal" so 1 week isn't enough to know. Then I've read that the pesticides in our wheat are what is really bad, so European wheat products and organic ones better. What made you try going off wheat and dairy?

 

 

 

[[Li...]]

Ha ladies, today is not really super for me. I can’t really say what it is. Maybe it is taper related, I am not sure. I just played some etudes on my tenor saxophone. Quite a loud and warm instrument. It also needs more air than an alto. I have a special tenor. Its a Conn Ladyface from 1948. I bought it from a friend who got it from the US via Ebay. I got it in 2001. It is a kind of granddady for me. It has scratches and it has spots on the laquer. You can really see it is very old and has had many users before me, perhaps famous ones, I know the famous Dexter Gordon played on a Ladyface tenor. Jerry 

[[De...]]

Thanks for the update Deanna, wow, fast, congratulations!! How is your sleep? Did you build a sleep routine in the evening? Do you go to sleep easily???

 

You are reminding me maybe the fibromyalgia stuff is mainly due to taking Ambien... I keep forgetting that (this site is the first place I heard that idea) just because I've had the symptoms around as long as I've been on Ambien, 20 years, and never made a connection.  Which came first, I'm not sure really as that was SO long ago.

 

So you feel a lot better still or you did at first and now worse/as bad in total withdrawal? I see your signature now, but they all disappears when I hit reply ... so thought it wasn't there.

 

I have mega hip/thigh pain too. I'd like to taper faster, just afraid to. Going to go slow and easy as I've been on it too long.

 

I've been encouraged to do gluten-free by docs for the fibromyalgia but I rebel, food is a hard one for me. Wheat and dairy, I know, have read it so much. But love them ... I've been told it takes months for the "gut to heal" so 1 week isn't enough to know. Then I've read that the pesticides in our wheat are what is really bad, so European wheat products and organic ones better. What made you try going off wheat and dairy?

 

Hi Kachina!  I was inspired to try the gluten-free and dairy free thing by SSR1975 (hopefully I remember the handle correctly) who healed very well in 6 to 12 months.  You can read her posts.  She postulated that we have the imbalance with too much glutamate and wheat and dairy have high amounts, so probs not really a gluten issue per se.  In fact I have nearly no gut issues whatsoever.  Just lately a tiny bit of heartburn and dry mouth but those are minor issues I think are just popping in and out.  I feel like my biggest issue now is the "fibromylagia" sensations.  I have tons of hip and thigh pain as well.  Mostly all on my left side.  I was misdiagnosed back in Nov 2018 when after a minor mishap (walking into a doorknob) resulted in 12 weeks of major back pain that was excruciating and unrelenting.  I now realize I was given Baclofen and Flexeril, and then Gabapentin on top of my Ambien use.  My biggest mistake was increasing my dose of Ambien during that time which probably kindled me further.

 

My "fibro" symptoms started in Feb 2019 when I decided to wean off the gabapentin.  Thats when all these constellation of symptoms really kicked into gear and I knew there was something else really going on.  I bless my Primary Care Doc who finally asked me to get off the Ambien.  I believe now that the Ambien was the issue all along, probably exacerbating my minor bump into the doorknob into a full blown "back injury".  Of course I had steroid shots and all the rest of that protocol before I figured things out.

 

So I would say that the acute withdrawal in August was the worst, lasting about 4-5 weeks.  The restlessness and akathesia were terrible. Now I have the waves and windows, less restlessness, and the biggest improvement I see is that I am more functional around the house.  I force myself to plan my day, do at least a few things on my list.

Sorry for the long post.  Happy to share all of my experience. 

 

I also believe that a positive attitude is crucial.  When I give into the bad moods, my physical symptoms invariably get worse. 

 

Before I found this site I found the Curable.com website which is CBT for chronic pain.  Learned alot of neuroscience there and I also believe there is some neuroplasticity going on with us, such that our experiences are forming new connections, some not for the better.  So trying to not give in to the symptoms and trying to plan and live my life the way I want it to be - despite the symptoms. 

 

 

[[De...]]

Sorry Kachina - forgot to answer your question about my sleep....I have found that for the most part I am sleeping better than when I was on the Ambien, but it took me awhile to find a good nightime routine.  I drink Chamo tea in the evening, relax as much as I can until about 10pm then go to a cool dark bedroom with a sleep meditation.  Most times fall asleep within half hour, but do awaken many times during the night, and sometimes up for 2-3 hours.  But I make sure not to get frustrated about it.  I just enjoy the rest.  At my age (60) I think that's par for the course. 

 

The sad part is all the suffering for a drug that did little to help me in the first place.  I was so mentally dependent on it though.

 

 

[[Sh...]]

Ha ladies, today is not really super for me. I can’t really say what it is. Maybe it is taper related, I am not sure. I just played some etudes on my tenor saxophone. Quite a loud and warm instrument. It also needs more air than an alto. I have a special tenor. Its a Conn Ladyface from 1948. I bought it from a friend who got it from the US via Ebay. I got it in 2001. It is a kind of granddady for me. It has scratches and it has spots on the laquer. You can really see it is very old and has had many users before me, perhaps famous ones, I know the famous Dexter Gordon played on a Ladyface tenor. Jerry 

 

That’s ok jerry u will feel windows and waves after reducing x glad u are keeping busy x sounds pretty cool the old sax x what’s ur dose now?

[[Sh...]]

Sorry Kachina - forgot to answer your question about my sleep....I have found that for the most part I am sleeping better than when I was on the Ambien, but it took me awhile to find a good nightime routine.  I drink Chamo tea in the evening, relax as much as I can until about 10pm then go to a cool dark bedroom with a sleep meditation.  Most times fall asleep within half hour, but do awaken many times during the night, and sometimes up for 2-3 hours.  But I make sure not to get frustrated about it.  I just enjoy the rest.  At my age (60) I think that's par for the course. 

 

The sad part is all the suffering for a drug that did little to help me in the first place.  I was so mentally dependent on it though.

 

Hey Deanna

 

Greatful for the update x my sleep still hasn’t come back, heart palpitations get bad because of lack of sleep, but last 2 nights even tho I’ve have really light scrappy sleep, I’ve been feeling ok, yesterday I had a good day, went swimming with my son after school. Today I’m feeling a bit off, but I’m going to keep busy again. I had 1/4 unisom last night and it did nothing, so I’m going to try not to have it too much so that when I get desperate it will work. That 5-6 hrs a couple of nights ago really helped so I have to keep that up my sleeve when things get grim.

 

So first 4-6 weeks were the worst, did sleep improve a bit after that? I’m in week 5 now x

[[De...]]

Hey Shayna, yes sleep got better for me several weeks after I jumped, although again sometimes up for 2-3 hours in the middle of the night.  I do notice that I sleep better when I've had a more active day and try not to go to sleep until 10.  Hard because my body is so achy I just want to go to bed sometimes.

 

So glad to hear you're feeling better and got a good stretch of sleep finally! It will get better for you I'm absolutely sure...and it seems you are out and about more too.  That is so important to keep your mind on normal everyday things rather than ruminating on our situation.

 

Wish I could exercise.  When I walk I have more physical pain afterwards, but I'm really itching to get back to physical exercise.  I know that would help me mentally.  Oh well, in time.

[[Sh...]]

When I excercise too much I don’t sleep usually so I try to only do 30 min walk a day. Then I just keep busy with housework and picking kids up taking them to sport/work ect. I go into this half sleep around 8 and that’s when I should go to bed but it’s hard with kids. It’s like twilight sleep very strange. U will get there dee x sorry about ur pain do u think gfree helped at all?

[[De...]]

I know what you mean Shayna I have my tea and lull off into a nice relaxation around 9...my eyes just want to close.  but if I go to bed too early I'm sure to be up for hours in the middle of the night.

 

I don't think gluten free helped me.  It was only a week but I actually felt worse, and felt better when I had my regular whole wheat bread again.  Probably just coincidence, but I don't think any change I've made has helped.  It's like any deviation at all is met with resistance from my nervous system.

 

You are so lucky to have younger kids to keep you busy.  It's just me and hubby and my 30 year old daughter is married and 2 hours away.  No grandkids yet.  I miss her so much in this pandemic only saw them 2x this whole year  :'(

[[Sh...]]

I tried clean eating for a long time don’t think it helped much. Shame u can’t see grandkids that must be very hard x I haven’t seen nieces and nephews since July coz of boarder closure but things are better here than us. I hope it changes for u soon so u can visit xx

[[La...]]

Hugs everyone! Hope all had a happy Halloween. Did you enjoy the rare full blue moon? I'm feeling bad for those of you struggling to sleep especially Shayna. She seems to be having the toughest time. I'm hoping the unison is your new best friend Shay. You don't deserve this. We parents need our sleep.

Deanna sounds like you have a good sleep routine that's working most of the time. That's awesome. Mine is similar to yours....meditation, going to bed the same time, relaxation breathing, cooler room, dark etc

Jerry keep on with the sax, we are going to want to hear you play. I know your dad is proud. Sorry your having roller coaster symptoms but you're a strong guy so you'll be feeling better soon. Tapering does this unfortunately but it doesn't kill us. Thank God!

Kachina, you're doing well so far. I think all of us can benefit from changing our diets to nourish our bodies while we taper and heal. I eat wheat crackers. They don't bother me. And I agree about pesticides. If we knew what our food has in it or sprayed with, we probably wouldn't eat anything unless we grew it ourselves. And IMO, growing our own gardens isn't a bad idea. I also do my best to eat gluten free, dairy free.

And my Saints won last night! 3 ins in a row!!!! ( sorry but I had to give a shout out) 

[[De...]]

Hi LadyDen - Do you think the gluten/dairy-free is helping you?  Do you notice a difference when you don't?

It is so hard to follow strictly.

[[Ka...]]

Thank you for all you shared Deanna, I so relate to so much.  Really appreciate it. Also 60 with one adult son who luckily is close by and miss having him in the house and around for visits ... but see him outside with a mask.

 

I feel less alone knowing you have similar symptoms, hate the physical pain so much. Very interesting what you said about being worse off your normal bread and changes to routines/what your used to.

 

Thanks for the other suggestions, gives me stuff to look in to.

 

Shayna, hugs!

[[De...]]

Wow Kachina we really do have similar stories!  I feel your pain - literally!

 

I've been deliberating about the diet these last few days.  Had a very healthy broccoli soup last night for dinner and had lots of symptoms this morning.  I'm wondering now about the dairy as the soup was cream based.  I don't want to follow such a restricted diet because the brain might get too used to it then I'll have problems reintroducing foods later. 

 

So I'm thinking not to go totally gluten/wheat, dairy, and histamine-free - but perhaps just minimize those foods and see it that tips the scale so that I feel better but not totally restrict foods.  IDK, we'll see.

 

Are you in pain every day?  Are there patterns to your pain? 

 

Deeana

[[Ka...]]

Everyone, my gosh SO messed up that getting OFF the meds isn't the last straw ... there are all these symptoms to deal with!!!!

 

Shayna, what did you do for clean eating and for how long?

 

I think it's easier for some people to make big dietary changes. I like the idea Deanna expressed--that brain chemistry will change and get used to not having wheat and dairy and it could be a problem reintroducing... they always say moderation is best and I've read about extreme dietary changes a lot but for me it comes down to a bad effect from restricting where I binge-eat...so try to make very reasonable choices that include lots of healthy and some treats. That said I see over and over recommendations for health that we don't eat certain foods.

 

LadyDen, 3 nights in a row!?!?! Yay Saints! Thank you for your kind words and encouragement!

 

Deanna, yes, it helped me to think of you last night, it's like my thighs and hips are being attacked, that's the worst, but other parts of my body have pain too. You're mainly one side--the side you ran into the door nob on? I wish I knew what makes it worse, but it's been worse since the weather got colder so must be a part of it. But wondering if it's my taper too, the ambien in general... often wonder how much could be diet? I've had a lot of pain for a long time ... so it's kind of a blurr to pin down patterns. I"m going to check out the curable site you mentioned and the histamine topic. So much. I'll be curious to know what you try with food, could the cream soup have made you feel worse?

 

[[Sh...]]

Hi kachina

 

I ate clean with protein at every meal no sugar no wheat no caffeine or alcohol. But I was taking sleepers and ads at the time so who knows of it worked. I stuck with it a long time but when sleep didn’t improve I gave up.

 

I also tried antihistamine diet and again it didn’t help. And that was really restrictive

[[De...]]

Yes Kachina it was my left side that I walked into the doorknob!  How insightful of you!

I feel like there is a pattern of pain that is deeply ingrained in my nervous system and when I am stressed or other triggers it kicks in.  That pain is different from the fibromyalgia-like pain I feel all over my arms and legs sometimes.  I think you are right - cold weather def makes it worse.

 

May we all experience some healing and improvement soon.  We deserve it for sure.

 

D

[[Li...]]

Yesterday, we got the news that the Lockdown is going to be stricter here. My swimming pool will be closed for 2 weeks at least. Swimming is very important for me, so this is sad news.  Jerry

[[De...]]

Sorry to hear that Lightspacer...I know how important it is to maintain our schedules and do what we know helps.  So much uncertainty in the world.  It is so not helpful.  I'm running out of helpful activities too.  Feeling quite unwell today myself.  Guess it's time for more Chamomille tea.