Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group

[[An...]]

This mantra has helped me.  I hope it helps you too:

 

Every day i wake up and the sun pokes at my eyes through the gaps in the vertical blinds above my bed.  Every day i wake up, and like the sun, i rise.  Some days, i don’t want to.  Some days the nausea and the vertigo and the emotional incontinence make the thought of being curled up in my enormous blue fleece wolf blanket the most tempting thought occupying  my weary mind.  But the sun’s ever insistant jabbing prods at me to get my ass out of my bed and into my life.

 

I rise because, regardless of how i am feeling in that moment, i will acknowledge that i am one day closer to my goal of being free.  I rise because it is a celebration of my strength and courage to do so, and to invest entirely in my life, even when circumstance challenges me to the contrary.  I rise because i know there are others that are suffering and need a place to look to know that , yes, they too can rise.  I rise because it is necessary.  This is about more than surviving – it is about reclaiming life.

 

There are moments i forget.  I wont even attempt to feign that my ‘eyes on the prize’ attitude never wanes.  My process isn’t perfect, but my acceptance that there is a perfection in progress – a perfect imperfection, is unwavering.  There are times i am engulfed in self-pity.  There are times when the last thing on earth i want to do is take one more damn supplement or remedy. There are days that i go from zero to bitchy to whiny to wounded to peachy keen within the same hour. There are times i am convinced it is never going to end.  But it will.

 

The only important thing at the end of the day is that i know, without fail, in the morning the sun will rise…and so will i.

 

[[Mu...]]

I need help and support. Having a terrible time. I am a mum of three very young children aged five and under. After the birth of my son in June last year I began experiencing hot sweats palpitations severe fatigue and then I developed pulsatile tinnitus and hyperacusis.

It is a painful and debilitating condition and severely impacts my ability to look after my children. As a result I developed depression and anxiety (although arguably the anxiety could have been a

Contributing factor in the first place). I have been through a barrage of medical tests and this has only added to the worry.

I started citalopram in late November but it gave me bad insomnia so I switched to 15mg mirtazapine in late December. I began feeling really detached a out of it and dizzy so I spoke to my psychiatrist and agreed to change to sertraline. But I wanted to have a month off in between to clean my body of drugs before I started. I dropped from 15mg to 7.5mg in mid February and took this for two weeks. I then stopped taking mirtazapine on 28 February completely. The same day I experienced extreme very of every time I lay down. This resolves within two days with Brandt Daroff exercises but I have been dizzy and light headed and spaced out ever since. I also developed muscles twitches all over my body, I am getting horrible burning sensations in my skin and brain, my limbs feel numb, I have the worst fatigue ever, I am sensitive to light and colours and my vision is as though I am looking at everything through a sauna (I had an eye exam last week and everything is fine with my eyes which leads me to think it is withdrawal). I also have this horrible feeling like I am not really here. The insomnia is terrible. Only three to four hours sleep a night and I wake with terrible adrenaline surges and covered in sweat with my heart racing.

I have felt nauseous in the mornings but my appetite is starting to return. I am less bothered about this and more concerned about the terrible brain fog and neurological type issues. I am only 2.5weeks off mirtazapine and effectively came

Off cold turkey.

I wasn't on a high dose or for long only 2.5 months but I am super sensitive to drugs. Please please can someone offer me reassurance that these are all withdrawal symptoms and they will pass. I want to feel normal in the head again and I  so worried I will be like this forever. It's

Enough to deal with having to suffer the hyperacusis but this is killing me and I  so scared and worried. Has anyone had a similar experience and come

Through it?

 

[[Mu...]]

Sorry that meant to say vertigo every time

I lay down

[[no...]]

MummyD, hello. i am really sorry you are experiencing the discomfort you describe. it must be extraordinarily frustrating to have to deal with these symptoms while being the caregiver to three little ones. i have a lot of admiration for the challenge you are standing up to. you did essentially cold turkey off the mirtazapine. and many of us are truly sensitive to medication, so the fact that you were only on it short-term is really irrelevant. obviously no one on here can conclusively diagnose, but i can assure you that not one single symptom you mention experiencing falls outside of the parameters of withdrawal. every single one of them can be associated w/ withdrawal. AND importantly, you ARE following up w/ the necessary diagnostic tests to rule any other cause out. many times, mirtazapine withdrawal symptoms are not felt until 1 to 2 weeks after the last dose or decreased dose. so you fall right in prime-time for feeling what you are feeling at this moment in time.

so what i would like to emphasize to you is that nothing you are feeling would be odd in withdrawal AND you are doing the right things to address what you are feeling. i would like to encourage you to try and remain as calm as possible. any extra worry will only exacerbate underlying symptoms. i know you know this. being a mom is an insanely difficult task. and when hindered in any way, be it physical or emotional, it becomes epically difficult. i never cease to be amazed at the tenacity of the underlying love and dedication that mothers, not only here on the boards, but all over display in the face of adversity for the sake of their young. hold tight and be as strong as you can. my feeling is that these symptoms will subside. check back in here as you need. i hope this is helpful. everything you listed truly are on the many lists that exist for withdrawal-associated symptoms.

dave

 

p.s. note to other buddies too. i cut again last night, so i have my seatbelt buckled. love and blessings be bountifully yours....

[[Mu...]]

Dave

Thank you so much for your prompt and very caring reply. It has given me great hope and reassurance.

I seem to have seen very doctor going - ent, neurotologist, cardiologist, and next week I am seeing a neurologist. I guess all this back and forth with medical tests hasn't helped my underlying anxiety. I have essentially suffered a complete physical and mental breakdown (hence the Mirt but this just seems to have added even more anxiety with nasty side effects and withdrawal). I have had an MRI MRA scan ECG echocardiogram and all the blood tests possible and all have come back clear. So I have to put these things down to anxiety/depression or the drugs. I am

Ever hopeful that one day I will wake up and things not be quite so bleak. It is hard enough having to deal with painful noise sensitivity with three very little

Children but all these other symptoms on top are scaring me beyond belief.

I have followed your thread with interest and note you have been tapering now for a year. I do hope I can stay off this evil drug and not have to reinstate. I was not myself on it at all. What do other people seem to experience coming off at 7.5mg c/t? Is it a matter of months before I will feel

Normal again? I have no idea when to start the sertraline. My

Doctors are useless.

I now have incredibly cold/numb feet to add into the mix!

I hope you manage your cut ok- what are you down to now?

Thanks again for your support.

 

[[no...]]

MummyD, hey. i'm really glad you feel some reassurance. you should. absolutely. like you, i did all the blood screenings. i had the brain mri. the whole nine yards. what it came down to was withdrawal. i am intensely sensitive to medications. i always have been. it sounds like you are too.

it is a mystery how some people can cold turkey off the stuff with no problem and others, like myself, have a challenge. i'm glad for those that can but for those of us with more sensitive nervous systems, it's a longer march to the sea. but you'll get there. trust that. and it may not be so long for you.

so you've had the tests and they've turned out negative for other maladies. CONGRATULATIONS! bask in THAT (i know it is hard when you're hurting). i was hurting so bad during my benzo withdrawal days that i almost wished they had found something in the medical tests that would have explained it away. but no, it was withdrawal. and in hindsight, i am obviously glad it wasn't anything else.

did you have any of these symptoms pre-withdrawal? if not, please know that it will go with withdrawal. you need to repeat that to yourself a few times. "if it came with withdrawal it will go with withdrawal." i'm guessing you weren't feeling all of these things, say a year or two ago. you are not permanently damaged. i thought i was. i have improved a lot. a lot. i felt so many of the symptoms you described. dizziness, lightheaded, twitchy, sweats. i had them all. i will occasionally get these physical symptoms when i cut. they don't stick around too long. the depression and anxiety are horrible. cry for no reason-type depression. jump out of my skin anxiety. but these are fleeting now too.

the sertraline introduction is tricky. the difficult part is that if you are having symptoms from the cessation of mirtazapine, you will not be able to differentiate what is the sertraline and what is the mirtazapine w/d. i had a really good psychiatrist who was patient enough with me to constantly keep me from making drastic changes. patience was a hard won ally for me. i'm still a student of patience.

so no medical advice here and you should run everything by your doc, but say i was in your position. i would probably try not to introduce something new at this point with the w/d symptoms i was experiencing. because i just wouldn't know what was what. i would try, if i were not a danger to myself or anyone else, to hold without the drug - since i'd already made the jump 2 and 1/2 weeks ago. if i couldn't deal with it, especially with 3 littles to look after and that is a BIG consideration, i would consider reinstatement. BUT i would not go back to 7.5mg. i would try 3.75mg in liquid form and see how that went. stabilize and slow taper from there. that would be my approach.

you have a lot to take into consideration and you have a lot on your plate. i'm glad you found us here. does what i said make sense? i hope so. 15mg of mirtazapine for 2.5 months could certainly cause the withdrawal you are feeling. 15mg is the high-end of the dose scale used to treat anxiety. above 15mg (up to 30mg and sometimes higher) hits the depression. so you were actually not taking a low dose, but a middle dose. you followed the withdrawal pattern most docs prescribe. halving the dose every 2 weeks. for some of us, it just does not work. count me in on that one.

stay in touch and hang in there MummyD. any other questions, pass them along. you're going to be ok.

dave

[[Mu...]]

Bless you Dave. You are a source of inspiration! I didn't have vertigo or dizziness or vision issues etc before I started the withdrawal but when I first started up the Mirt I got

Visual snow and within two weeks bad brain fog/detached derealization feeling and that hasn't gone.

The palpitations and sweats I had before any drugs but am

Pretty sure they are anxiety plus sleep deprivation and fatigue (three babies in four years and I am no spring chicken at 40).

In fact my doc is going to get me to see the chronic fatigue people as I have so many of the symptoms - just in case they have an idea how to get me out of this hole I am in. I am so weak and tired with heavy legs - but again I think that can go hand in hand with depression and withdrawal. It seems to be on big ****storm of symptoms all wrapped up in each other and hard to extricate what has caused each of them.

I have sunk into horrible nothingness and that empty feeling,

Plus my anxiety is sky high particularly in the morning. If I could just shake this brain fog and dizziness and vision issues I would have the strength to deal with everything else.

I spoke to my gp and he said hang fire on the sertraline just until the neurologist gives me the final all clear and to give it another couple of weeks to get over the Mirt withdrawal. It's an evil little

Drug - regret so much taking it in the first place but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

I am so relieved to hear that you have experienced a lot of what I am going through. How much longer do you think you will need to stay on it?

Good luck with your latest cut. It's all about getting through each day

X

 

[[no...]]

MummyD, oh my goodness. you are truly describing "the normal" for this garbage. your morning anxiety is most likely because of the cortisol cycle. we all have it. mirt supresses it. going off mirt unleashes hellfire on that cycle. i rev like an engine-out-of-control in the morning. it hits me around 4am and burns off as the morning winds onward.

yes, i truly have experienced so much of what you listed - if not all. the side-effects i have on the mirt are dizziness, like i am walking on a boat, heaviness in the legs, a heavy-headed feeling, a muted/fuzzy/foggy feeling, stuff like that. i know it is time to cut again when i start feeling side-effects instead of symptoms. and i've become unfortunately good at discerning this as i have been cutting for a while!

i'm right about where you are age-wise and i have a toddler and a near-pre-schooler, so i totally get the all-out barrage that the noise, intensity, etc of those little beings bring. i'm in the workforce which presents its own set of challenges, but being a mom is front-lines material - especially when dealing w/ the kind of stuff withdrawal and anxiety present! but you're doing it, right? every day.

i am anxious by nature anyway, depression was never huge for me, but i am familiar with it now. withdrawal has brought me up-close-and-personal.

again, remember how full your plate is! 3 littles in 4 years @ 40! i just saw a dozen hairs gray on the side of my head and a new wrinkle develop across my forehead as i wrote that to you! wow! intense responsibility!

take some deep breaths. do what you can to engage yourself w/ the littles. let their intensity drown out the intensity of what you are dealing with. it's wicked hard, but i'm betting you can do it.

based on what you describe, and what your medical tests have already proven, i'd put my money on the meds being the issue if i were a betting man.

try not to make hasty decisions w/ your docs. listen very carefully to what they tell you, consider EVERYTHING before you do ANYTHING. be an information-gatherer BEFORE you become a consumer. so often we are quick to jump right to what they recommend. and why not when we are suffering as we are? but, if we can allow a little space before we "go for it," there are some shards of clarity there.

no matter how hard any of this hits you, it's not taking away from your inherent goodness or abilities. it simply making things HARDER. be you never thought you'd have to prove your resiliency THIS way.

as for me, i'll be on this stuff until i taper off plain and simple. i'd like to think by the end of 2014. but i'm cool w/ the process now. it'll happen, it's happening. hurts like hell sometimes, but then life is kind of like that some times. when i stabilize, i realize how good i will feel when it is gone from my system completely. i am not defined by this process, but it is changing me. and with every cut, i eventually stabilize. my anxiety was never so bad as it has been on psychotropics.

hang in there, and please keep writing if you have questions, need to vent, etc. that's what this thing is here for. i think you'll do ok. you're doing an admirable job as it is.

dave

[[Mu...]]

I am just so glad I found your support forum - and that you are such a kind supportive person to reply in such depth and so soon. This is hell on earth - it is testing me to my limits of sanity. Why do the docs never warn you what you might have to face once you start taking these things. I am

Just sad that in trying to make my desperate situation better I have only served to make it worse

You must have some real grit Dave - to have been through such a protracted withdrawal not once but twice. I admire you for that.

So some specific questions to a Mirt withdrawal vet can you remember how long you had the blurred foggy vision symptoms and the dizzy brain fog feeling after your first cut? These two things bother me the most - I just feel like I am not really here iykwim? Also did you have light sensitivity? This sucks on top of hyperacusis! I can't go everywhere wearing shades and earplugs! Counting each day as a step closer to normality and being back in the mainstream of life again. I can't go anywhere at the moment - terrified of fainting or having a panic attack.

Supermarkets especially - all that florescent lighting I guess. Did you find that you suffered with agoraphobia and panic attacks with any of your cuts? This drug has sucked out my bubbly personality and self confidence and left a miserable pathetic little shell

I am on mat leave still , I'm a lawyer by trade but needless to say with the breakdown and physical ailments I won't be returning in June when my leave is up. I need to focus on fixing me and being a mummy again. My poor kids have not had their real mummy for months now but I am determined to beat both my hyperacusis depression and to kick these horrendous withdrawals into touch.

Thanks for letting me vent anyway - it's nice to share with someone who knows just how crappy these drugs make you feel.

Hoping you have an ok tonight and wishing you wellness for the coming few weeks of hell!

Natalie

[[no...]]

natalie, hey. it IS almost hell on earth, the whole withdrawal process - for certain. i think doctors, for the most part, have good intentions. i think they take their very standardized knowledge from medical school and couple that with what they are told by the pharmaceutical industry and that's what they dish out. it's what they know. sometimes it is wrong. this website is testament to that. we are the walking done-wrong-by-medicine crew!

i have to tell you, i got a good laugh last night. i was shaving and i was listening to the rolling stones' record "tattoo you." probably the last truly solid start-to-finish stones record. the second song on that thing is "hang fire." and i had never heard that phrase before in conversation until you said yesterday your gp told you to "hang fire" on starting the new med. damn near cut myself laughing when those dots connected. "HANG FIRE!"

you can't blame yourself for anything you've done w/ this process. don't do it. you're just trying to feel better. you've got kids to look out for. you have a career you want to get back to. even if you DID make the situation worse, everyday is a chance to make it better, letting your nervous system heal.

so, the blurred foggy vision. that symptom didn't just cut-out for me. it was a slow improvement. i should have taken better notes on how long and at what point certain things dissipated or ended, but i didn't. it was a gradual coming into focus though. like a camera trying to find its "zone." things are clear now.

also, i did have light sensitivity. this was a part of both my benzo and mirt withdrawal. not only would brightness kill my eyes, it would take forever for my eyes to adjust from going indoors to out, and back. not good!

noise sensitivity too. i remember standing in line to procure some food one day and this happy gal behind me in line was having a good old time w/ some kind of chewing gum product. cute. and she was snapping her gum, blowing bubbles, tra-la-la-la-la, SNAP!... ahhhh. i was about two seconds from turning around and saying "sister, if you do not immediately cease the noisy jawing of that watermelon flavored chew chunk you have in your mouth, you may see a man, weep, drop, spontaneously combust, turn into ash, and blow away right here on the spot!" oh, i could just hear the announcement over the store's public address system, can't you? - "cleanup on checkout aisle 3." and then the pimply faced food bag boy comes and sweeps up my dusty remains! ah! for real. the snapping of gum might as well have been canon fire. i am way past that symptom now. thankfully! i still deal with some coming and going tinnitus now, but that too has improved greatly.

i had gradually become agoraphobic as i developed benzo tolerance, so i was "used to it" by the time i hit withdrawal. i'd feel so lightheaded in public places, especially stores, that i thought i was going to drop. losing consciousness was a big fear. and if i had my kids with me, it made me even more nervous because what the hell would happen to them if i passed out!?!? let me tell you this. i had that symptom for over 2 years. and i never ONCE passed out. never once. have you actually ever passed out? i never did. but i feared it like crazy. it'd bring on a panic attack like nothing else. that agoraphobia is gone. i'll go wherever now. drive wherever. it's fine. that symptom will go!

i'm glad you were able to vent, that this is helpful. you're going to be fine if you make solid decisions going forward to take care of yourself. i think you are already doing that. remember - be a WISE consumer with the medical stuff. diagnostics have proven you are a physically healthy natalie. your nervous system is tweaked. and nervous systems heal. we have amazing capacity for healing. awe-inspiring really. you'll get there.

i did alright last night. i awoke this morning, the usual 4am "wham wham wham wham" of my heart. cortisol rush. the bright moon was there to put a light on the whole fiasco. so i did my usual "simmer routine." i take a magnesium glycinate. i sit in the dark in the living room and listen to "david bowie" or "thin lizzy" or whatever on the iPod and take some deep breaths and the cortisol slowly burns...away. i even find that coffee helps when the depression side of things kicks in. it doesn't over rev me any more. a good cup of black coffee and a thin lizzy ballad will have me going, "yeah, things get dark sometimes... here's to the darkness! ha!" truly, with the depression. if it is not harm-yourself or harm-others depression, it's normal human stuff. feels like hell. but if anyone ever tells you that they never get depressed, they are either lying or boring!

hang in there natalie. keep checking in here if this helps. when we bounce this stuff off others, it "normalizes" it all. once foot in front of the other - here's to it!

dave

[[Mu...]]

I think I may just have smiled reading your post for the first time in months thank you!

Alas I would love to listen to thin Lizzy but my poor old ears are shot to pieces with this hyperacusis. This is a nasty condition and it sucks big style. Again I am sure it all has to do with my overworked and highly sensitive nervous system in overdrive. I am wearing white noise generators in my ears to desensitise them but this can take up to two years and no guarantee they will ever be how they were. I have withdrawn from mainstream life even before I got the agrophobia because noisy places are a big no no for now. But it's all about little steps. I managed a panini in our local garden centre cafe today - a huge achievement for me.

Yes hang fire - sorry, am full of my British colloquialisms

am guessing you are across the Atlantic stateside?

It makes me feel sad every time I see a plane thinking how lucky those folks are and wondering if I will ever be well enough to travel again. I worked in the us NYC for a couple of months in 2000 - south tower wtc - loved it, and I really hope to return one day. Have been all over Chicago

San Francisco, Wyoming, Denver, Orange County to name a few.

When I beat this horrible anxiety and finally rid myself of this hyperacusis I will return!

In fact the first panic attack I ever had come to think about it was on a plane when I was pregnant with my third child in 2012. Some woman in the seat behind decided to have a heart attack so we were diverted to mainland Spain back en route from the Canary Islands. We were sat on the very hot runway for two hours and couldn't get off the plane - I had awful morning sickness and after seeing that lady get cpr in the aisle next to me I just panicked and then thought I was dying too! Most scary experience of my life!

Weird thing is growing up I was always super confident and outgoing - now the thought of popping into my local supermarket to pick up some frozen peas literally leaves me on hot and cold sweats gripping the trolley for dear life. Many a time I have quit by the time I got past the fresh produce and abandoned ship/trolley ...

I never thought I would be longing for normality so much that I would happily spend an entire day wandering up and down the food aisles. Sad - my

Life is very sad right now!

Still I have to stay positive for my kids - like you I can't take them anywhere or do

Anything with them right now for fear of fainting.

It has never actually happened - came very close in the bike shop in January. I could deal with my painful ear condition if I can just ride out the dizzy light head feeling. And this light sensitivity is a big pile of dog do too .... Doesn't even have to be sunny and it gives me a headache. Road signs at night - they are the worst.

Something about the reflective paint? I dunno. These drugs have done a number on me! It's as though I am looking at life through a steamy sauna - and I just feel

Like I am not really here most of the time. I am having trouble too with depth perception and loud patterns. I never had any issues at all with my eyes until I took this bleep bleep stupid drug. Now it's giving me no end of funky **** both while I was taking it and coming off it. My doctor doesn't help - "it will be out of your system by now, this is just anxiety". Great reassurance for someone with

GAD post natal depression and panic disorder!

I just keep reading and re reading posts in this thread and reminding myself that all this is the drugs and will pass.

I slept 10.30 til 2.45 am then bang wise awake so hot heart pounding out of my chest - and no more sleep for the rest of the night. So many times I nearly got back off to sleep only to jolt with this feeling like I am falling and dizzy (wtf - how does that happen when I'm lying down??) gave up at 6am as baby boy woke up wanting to play. I used to sleep seven to eight hours a night no problem. Those were the days. I do hope the insomnia subsides soon. But am guessing not if you have been tapering a year and still struggle now

You must have some strength of character Dave - truly I take my hat off to you!

I will beat this crappy depression and anxiety and be able to be a mummy again and I will try to do it without drugs. Whilst I have been in some

Dark dark places the past few months I have three very special little people who need me so I'm not going anywhere in a hurry!

Thanks for being there. I've finally found someone who understands it's not all in my head!

Natalie

[[no...]]

natalie, very happy to hear about that smile. i thought the sun from the east had intensified for a moment, but alas, it must have been the grin! and nice work on getting out for that panini, a VICTORY! and likely a tasty one. any day you push that envelope, you are developing fortitude that will serve you well tomorrow, and the days after.

please keep those British colloquialisms coming - they're great and i will absorb them. yes indeed, northern atlantic stateside - read that as been-freezing-my-backside-for-six-months side.

you'll fly again. you can look up at those planes and smile with that certainty. you have to start flying inside first though. that's what you're working on. honing in on the emotional disruptions - taking them apart, analyzing them. discerning what is truly harmful from what is your nervous system at full-command. this is the process. calming the storm. time takes care of a lot of that.

i find it very interesting that your first panic attack happened while you were carrying your third child. without question, a time when all those mama-hormones were ramping up. the air travel disruption triggers your fight-or-flight response, protect-unborn-child mama-hormones kick in, whammo! and right there, perhaps the seed for anxiety is planted. you've just had an experience of pure, and warranted, panic (or at least anxiety). the problem is, it sensitized you. now it gets triggered all the time. i don't know, that's my impression. i'm no doctor (thank goodness!), but it's the way these patterns develop. and then aversion patterns start to come into play, because you don't want to feel those feelings anymore. and you avoid activities and places that trigger the response and cause the discomfort. and suddenly, your world gets very tight. very tight. throw in some meds that mash your chemistry a bit and ugh... it's so hard. and here lies the compassion. because i've been there and i'd bank on it a boatload of people on this site have.

ah yes, the abandoned supermarket cart. stranded alone, motionless. the lettuce and carrots left behind almost calling to you, "don't forget us, we know you feel dizzy, people drink large quantities of high-test alcohol to feel that rubbish!" i jest, but i've left a few abandoned carts myself.

long for that normality you speak of natalie. that simplicity. i'm one of those try-to-find-the-shiny-piece-in-the-mud types (not always great at this endeavor). this experience is humbling, scary, and life-altering. as you've noted, it has reduced you from the basics. let me tell you this. from experience. you will heal. and when you do, starting from that very low and basic point, everything will be amazing again. life that our four decades have jaded us to will again be fresh - your perspective will be more on par with that of your thriving children. everything illuminated. that is my experience. when i am not in the throes of symptoms, i am in awe of everything - EVERYTHING around me.

no, the sleep WILL improve. mine was dodgy last night because, don't forget, i made a cut just two nights ago. so i will be in a state of semi-pain and unrest for another 2 to 3 weeks until i stabilize again. but in general, i bank six solid hours a night and that is good for my operating system.

i used to be so dizzy, walking from my work desk to the bathroom was an endeavor - and fear-weighted because i thought i would pass out on the way. even w/ the symptoms from this most recent cut, i went to the company gym this morning and cranked out 3 miles at a good running pace on the treadmill, hit the iron for a bit, showered, and grabbed another cup of coffee (thin lizzy in the earbuds of course). i NEVER thought i would be able to do that again a year ago. it all becomes relative. the healing is palpable. do i still suffer? hell yeah. will i forever? hell no (except for the general suffering all humans face). am i better than i was last year, last month, last week, yesterday? yes. incremental.

there is this old cliche, you've probably heard it - "when life hands you a lemon, make lemonade." that's a little to quaint for me. and it has no balls. next time life hands us the lemon, after what we've been through, we can respond, "oh i can hack lemons life, what else do you got?!"

hang in there.

dave

[[Mu...]]

Great post yet again - whatever your line of work is I think you are wasted ... You need to be some sort of inspirational life coach guru! In fact I felt compelled to get out and do a four mile walk this afternoon after I read your message yes seriously!

Actually I didn't know it was going to be four miles, my

Step mum hoodwinked me but I didn't mind too much as the sun was shining (for once in our crappy British weather). I felt GREAT afterwards -

All that cortisol burned off and the lactic acid bubbling around ...

But then I crashed and burned when I realised the smoky foggy vision thingumy was still there once I took my shades off. Oh and my dad's stripey shirt at dinner was so loud it have me a headache - freaky that whole vision issue. I have decamped to my parents to be looked after just with my youngest until the weekend when I have to come back down to mummy land with a bump again and go back home to my husband and two girls. It has been nice to wallow in my own self pity for a few days anyway without having three children to deal with

Ah yes now here comes one of those delightful head rush brain sweat things .... Easy does it here comes some room spin too. Damn, thought they were getting better earlier. Am debating taking either a zopiclone or temazepam tonight to sleep. I very rarely take either but desperate for sleep after three weeks of between three and four hours a night. I look like a heroin addict, in fact worse. The walking dead! Well it's 9.30 here so I'm off to do battle with the mirtazapine night demons - but tonight I am going to win (or at least put up a better fight than last night when I was shaking like a baby and gripping the bed for dear life during the wave upon wave of sheet terror and adrenalin)! Bring IT ON!!

And to end on a positive some of my favourite inspirational quotes and bedtime mantras....

"I may not be there yet but in closer than I was yesterday"

"You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have "

"One day someone is going to hug you so tight that all of your broken pieces will stick back together"

"When everything feels like an uphill struggle just think of the view from the top"

"The minute you think of giving up think of the reason why you held on so long"

Night Dave

Ps aargh my lovely son just decided to wake up screaming and burst my

Ever so positive feel good bubble....thought I had dispatched him for the night but alas it appears he has other plans than sleep

Babies eh, who'd have em!

[[Mu...]]

Ha that was meant to be sheer terror but actually sheet terror is just as appropriate

[[no...]]

natalie, hey. wow, WOW - WOW! you had a really positive day yesterday - REALLY positive. i can't believe you topped off with a four mile walk. that's impressive. i'm glad you could utilize a little of my energy to rise to it and hit it hard! and way-to-go stepmum for earning an advanced degree in hoodwinksim. dad should probably chill with the stripey shirts - ha.

it sounds like you have a good support network there. and that is a gift - truly. decamping sounds like it is giving you a chance to unwind a little, to sort, to heal. hopefully the bump back home will be minimal and your reunion with your husband and girls will be calm and good.

i'm glad you are careful with the temazepam and zopiclone. avoid as best you can. try to be really gentle with those receptor sites in your head. your body wants to correct its chemistry in the worst way - it will do it. gentle.

on that note, i hope sleep came to you, and came to you well. "sheet terror" and all! you're right, sheet terror could kind of apply. "Brint IT ON." yeah, see that's the spirit. we are stronger than we think.

thanks for those inspirational quotations - i appreciate them!

other plans than sleep for your son, eh? my oldest has decided naps are no longer necessary which means he is just shy of psychotic by about 4pm every afternoon. so, i throw some records on the turntable and we jump on the bed until my adrenaline burns off and he is exhausted. it works!

"inspirational life coach guru." that made me laugh. i'll take "friend and good humanoid." that works for me just fine. i really like to see good people thrive. thrive!

continue to rise, touch base when you can, updates are good.

day three of my cut has me feeling nausea, inner vibrations, and higher levels of anxiety and sadness. i felt none of these three days ago before the cut. i've got some dread. a dash of crashing and burning hope. a little fear. but... fear not. or at least i won't. this is the progression. i know this terrain. i've been here. it's a lonely, brutal desert of withdrawing. brain questioning why it is receiving less poison. imploring me to change my position, to cave, to give it back. i won't. it will pass. it will return. and that will pass too. there will be oases in the desert. i will stop and try to heal at each one. drink as deeply as i can. cry on hands and knees, i am not above this. and eventually it will be over and done for good. and i will just be a man. not withdrawing. just being.

i know your ears are sensitive, so listening to music isn't a great option. but one of the great songs phil lynott wrote for the thin lizzy is "fighting my way back." in a sense, anthemic for us all:

 

Fighting!

Well I'm tough, I'm rough I'm ready and I'm able

To pick myself up from under this table

Don't you stick no sign on me, I got no label

I'm a little unsure, unsound and unstable

 

But I'm fighting!

Fighting!

 

Well I'm busting out and I'm going in

And I'm kicking up about the state I'm in

Looking to my future, not my past...

 

hang in there.

dave

[[Mu...]]

Well the good news is I managed almost six hours albeit broken sleep - took half a temazepam. Have decided I might allow myself this little luxury only once a week until the insomnia clears. The sheet terror was decidedly less as a result

Horrible adrenaline rushes this morning though. My poor old heart. I used to be so fit and healthy. Now I get breathless just walking upstairs! I do have some beta blockers in an absolute emergency but I do try to get by without as they can worsen depression. It's a rock and hard place though as they do seem to help lower the pulsatile tinnitus (on the basis they lower blood pressure etc) although mine is low ish to start with at 110/70.

Today the light sensitivity is bothering me the most - I actually forced myself into a supermarket for a whole fifteen minutes, no abandoned trolleys or anything and I even browsed the deli counter! I had to wear my sunglasses though - and I tried a little experiment. The moment I took them off I could feel the panic and my heart starting to race. I swear the lighting has something to do with it!

But I didn't die and I didn't faint and I made it through the noisy checkout with groceries in tow for once!

I do hope this light sensitivity goes soon. It is pouring down with rain and I have glasses on and still feel like everything is way too bright this has to rival benzo withdrawal. Just escapes me how doctors happily prescribe these dangerous drugs willy nilly without a second thought to the lives they destroy (albeit the destruction is temporary I keep telling myself)!

3 weeks tomorrow since I jumped off c/t effectively at 7.5mg and I am still here but right in the thick of the withdrawals I think now. I read somewhere back along the posts that some people feel it worst at 3-4 weeks. Has this been your experience? And how long do the effects last? I need something to look forward to - keep feeling myself I will turn a corner soon and every day it's the same old same old.

Sorry to hear you are going through the mill. I am absolutely sure you will be free from this drug by the end of this year. Is the sadness and anxiety a rebound effect or are these underlying symptoms breaking through? You know - it takes a real man to cry! There is nothing more appealing to us women than a man with a sensitive side. So bring on the tears get out the man sized Kleenex and have a good old sob. It's good for the soul. I don't think I have any tears left. Today for the first time I thought I might have felt a tiny bit less sad than yesterday. It's those chinks of beautiful blue through the ugly grey that keep me plodding on. I guess I am going to have to pull myself out of this - I tried CBT meditation yoga drugs but nothing so far seems to have done the trick. My problem is I have a physical ailment and until this improves I can't pick myself up and dust myself off no matter how hard I try because the pain just drags me back under. But I will carry on putting on a brave face for my kids because that is what we mummies do. I loved the thin Lizzy lyrics, thank you. I miss loud music, but one day I am sure I can listen to it again.

Now a technical question - do you know why anti depressant withdrawal causes dizziness?  Is it anything to do with inner ears and balance? I just wondered if this was a weakness of mine due to the bad tinnitus and hyperacusis. You mentioned you have tinnitus- did this come on while you withdrew from benzos or from taking Mirt? It's enough to drive anyone insane - no wonder Van Gogh cut off his own ear! Not that I recommend such a drastic course of action

Well Dave onwards and upwards. Tomorrow is another day closer to 100%natural

Drug free depression free anxiety free you and me

[[no...]]

natalie, hello. let me throw a quick answer to the technical question. first of all, it's important to remember that neither the pharmaceutical industry nor prescribing doctors know precisely why antidepressants work. they get the basics, the increase in serotonin, etc., but precise method of action isn't truly known. that being said, research (surveys) suggest that dizziness is the most commonly reported symptom of antidepressant discontinuation. for me, it was both a side-effect of use and a symptom of cutting. antidepressants with short half lives (mirtazapine is in this bracket) are most notorious. the going theory is that the vestibular nucleus complex, a section of the brain with loads of serotonin receptors, is the culprit. when the drug is doing its thang, it's doing its thang like a son-of-a-gun - bathing, drenching, baptising those receptors in excess serotonin. but when you take the chemical away, after the brain has adjusted or even semi-adjusted to higher serotonin activity there, the electrophysiological activity of neurons decreases, and causes dizziness. it's a going theory. there's a published paper on it. works for me. so in the america, the short answer we might give is, well, "just because."

hang in there,

dave

[[Mu...]]

Works for me too! Very comprehensive. Thanks for that.enjoy your day

N

 

[[no...]]

parker, PARKER!!! so AMAZINGLY happy you posted here! you were a key-force for me early on when i was trying to figure out what the heck happened to my brain.

like you, i had MASSIVE benzo damage, so often times my remeron cuts were/are still uncovering benzo issues.

i've been doing the “Remeron 1mg per 1ml liquid suspension” for months now. SOOOO superior to dry-cutting. it was totally the right way to go. for whatever reason, i REALLY feel the cuts - some more than others. but - i'm doing it and getting there. i'm really knuckling down now. it's going to be all right. prior to this last cut, i knew it was time to cut because i was feeling pretty darn good.

thanks for checking in, for taking the time. and reiterated thanks for those early days when you and maranatha literally were the only beacons of light for me through the haze-maze of benzo destruction. it meant/means a lot! and i hope you are still working on that book. so needed.

dave

[[Mu...]]

Parker

A truly inspirational post. Great to hear your story.

I myself am struggling 21 days off remeron (jumped off at 7.5mg after 2.5 months on 15mg). Current symptoms are light sensitivity, foggy vision, difficulty focussing/depth perception off, dizzy spells, insomnia (of course), hot and cold sweats, palpitations, worsened tinnitus, worsened hyperacusis (I had this before the remeron) burning sensation in my brain, head rushes, feeling really odd like in not really here (derealization??). The only improvements have been to the nausea/gi issues and the severe muscle twitches all over my body. They were driving me insane but these are much improved. The anxiety is crazy bad especially at night but much better during the day. Depression is difficult to stay on top of. I am going to give it another three weeks (ie six weeks post c/t) and then either go back to 3.75mg and do the slow liquid taper or jump to sertraline.

These success stories are an inspiration to us all.

Natalie

[[Ji...]]

Hello,

 

lovely to see you posting here Parker and so good to hear you're writing a book!

 

Im currently holding at 15mgs of Remeron a night. However I am feeling gradually more and more unwell and I just can not be sure if it is related to the remeron so I am going to ask you all for for some advice.

 

Did anyone else: whilst withdrawing get,

 

O) Neck, head muscle aches?

O) Joint swelling (like you get with a temperature?)

O) watery eyes, running nose, sinus pain

O)Temperature/fever worse in the evenings

O)Headaches/eyeaches

O) lights are brighter, as in daylight is painful to look at

O) irritability!

O)symptoms that seem to mimic  really bad PMT

[[Mu...]]

Hi jiggly Jo - yes absolutely to head and eye aches, light sensitivity, irritability and feverish ness and yes I feel like I have permanent PMT!

X

 

[[Ji...]]

Thanks mummyD,

 

How far are you out? What dose are you taking?

[[Mu...]]

Day 22 off completely. Took 15mg for 2 months 7.5 for two weeks then stopped c/t. Have been suffering since the first day I stopped. Symptoms have been vertigo (gone now) dizziness/feeling like I am on a boat, extreme fatigue and aching muscles, light sensitivity, cloudy vision, more floaters, twitches throughout my body, nausea, insomnia, headaches, terrible anxiety, night sweats, hot cold flushes, burning skin sensation, feeling very detached like I am not really here, can't relax, terrible sense of dread and doom and I'm ratty as hell.

I have read that weeks three and four can be when symptoms peak for lots of folk but I think everyone is different and it amazes me to read stories of people taking 45mg for years then stopping c/t without any issue - while I took a relatively low dose for a short time and have never felt so ill in my life. One night my husband nearly called an ambulance -

The palpitations and severe head rush were scary intense - thought I was having some sort of seizure!

How about you?

[[go...]]

I'm having a similar experience as you MummyD, on it about the same amount of time, about 22 days off now and experiencing the same symptoms you listed since day 1.  Good God Almighty.  I hope this eases for us soon, it is a hell of a thing.  Another thing is I feel like I'm gonna stop breathing when I go to sleep (when I actually sleep).  Although, I don't obviously and I'm told I'm breathing fine while sleeping.  Maybe just anxiety.  I can't believe this is happening while on it for such short time at such a low dose.  I shake every morning for a few hours, then I'm just damn weak all day, can't relax, out of it, etc.  The nausea was bad the first week, but has mostly passed, but that's about it.  Good luck to all of you.