Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group

[[Si...]]

hi buddies, is it okay to stop mirtazapine after less than a week of usage?

 

i tried 3.75mg first time and it made me sleep well and my mood lifted the next day but the good mood only lasted till noon.

the 2nd day i tried another 3.75mg around 2pm no effect.

then 3rd day i was so depressed i upped the dose taking 3.75mg each time and reached 22.5mg and my mood lifted around afternoon.

the 4th day i only took 7.5mg but i felt somewhat agitated.

so on the 5th day i took nothing. i wanted to stop taking mirt but i will still observe. mood was bad in the morning but lifted in the afternoon.

then last night i slept at around 830pm and this morning i woke up at 1am. i wanted to go back to sleep but i couldnt. i tried some benadryl no help.

so i decided maybe ill try one 3.75mg. i still couldnt sleep till morning.

 

im scared because im having these weird, random, animation-like scenes when i close my eyes lying in bed wether im sleeping or trying to go to sleep or sleepy.

i also got mild akathisia/restlessness this morning and took 20mg propranolol to relieve it.

i also had more self-harm thoughts so im scared and i want to stop taking it now. my doc said it would help me get off valium.

 

so my question is, is it okay to stop it right away given the short course of taking it and on low doses only?

i took 3.75, 3.75, 22.5, 7.50, 0, 3.75.

thanks all. any inputs will be greatly appreciated..

[Guest [Ti...]]

Yikes I am so glad I only took Remeron for 2 days. I saw so many good things about it on this board that I decided to give it a shot in hopes that it would be easier to taper off benzos.... WRONG. It made me so depressed/hungover/dizzy/ill the next day after I took it. Sure I slept like a rock but I sleep like a rock on Klonopin already. I don't think I had any withdrawals from only taking it for 2 days, not sure how other people can handle taking it but everyone's body is different and handles meds different.

[[Si...]]

TimeForAChange how much did you take? was it 2 consecutive days? and how long before the bad effects wear off? thanks..

[[An...]]

Dave:  Thanks for the update - keep on keeping on.  You will get there.  I am doing fine - just a really bad flu right now but okay w/d wise - a few niggly things but nothing to write home about

 

Thankyouforyourhelp:  You seem to be doing it sensibly and again, keep on with what you are doing and you will get there in time  Patience and time is the way to go

 

SigmundFreud:  Sorry you are suffering but it was a risk you were prepared to take.  It's a bit like Russian Roulette. I wish I had read a similar thread before I started on Remeron.  I would never even have taken the chance!  You have only been on the drug for a few days but have chopped and changed your doses which you really cannot do on Remeron.  That is what got me into trouble upping and downing - I am sorry to say I got suicidal ideations from this and also when I suddenly came off which was why I had to get professional help.  I don't want to worry you, you have only been on it for a few days, I was on for a few weeks.  Goodness if it were me I would stop now - increasing and decreasing won 't help as you can see - and face the consequences.  Let's hope you get off lightly.

 

This thread was not intended to be instructional I don't think - just a platform to swap experiences.  Whether you take heed or what is written or not, it is up to you.  I am surprised anyone would choose to even try the drug after reading this thread but then again, there are others who did not have any problems.  Russian Roulette  yeah!

[Guest [Ti...]]

TimeForAChange how much did you take? was it 2 consecutive days? and how long before the bad effects wear off? thanks..

 

Yeah it was for 2 consecutive days after that I was fine.

[[Si...]]

thanks TimeForAChange. what dose were you on on those 2 days?

[Guest [Ti...]]

thanks TimeForAChange. what dose were you on on those 2 days?

 

7.5mg, was scared to try the full 15mg and I'm glad I didn't because even that low dose was horrid.

[[th...]]

This is an update and some messages.

First I want to send lots of healing and loving thoughts to Dave. I read your story and found several parallels with mine. I understand what you live and want to see you settled and happy in your life. I understand your anxiety about each cut as I have been there. Please know that for me some cuts were handled more easily than others so I will wish you that. You will be successful. I sense your determination and strength.

I also want to say hello to Ruby and to let her know that there are people thinking about her and sending her strength. Let us know how it goes for you.

Poptart, hoping that things are going well for you, too.

I've been sick with a sinus infection in addition to the insomnia which is requiring Ambien, anxiety (thank goodness inositol is helping with this), and depression (crying and feeling like things are pointless). The sinus infection added more stress and worry-- of course because I am a hypochondriac--so have been down in the dumps thinking negatively and wondering if I can indeed stay off the Remeron that I want to stay off!! Sometimes I , too , wonder, if I really need Remeron to keep me  from being a "crazy depressed" person, but omg, I just cannot think of ever going through this withdrawal again. I go day by day and tell myself to stay strong.

Any encouragement is most welcome and will be much appreciated.

[[no...]]

thankyouforhelp, hello. i really appreciate your kind words and the healing and loving thoughts. they are most certainly needed right now, so i received them with great thanks and am returning them with interest accrued. i'm sorry to hear you're dealing w/ the sinus infection on top of everything else. sickness compounds any underlying symptoms you are experiencing. i don't know if i ever mentioned it on this thread, but i am one of the most failed one-day-at-a-time/live-in-the-moment practitioners ever. and i KNOW it is the right thing to do. but i think when one is going through any amount of suffering, be it physical or psychological or the grand-mix we get w/ withdrawal, such an immense backlog of past what-ifs and a tidal wave of future what-ifs swing into play. and play they do. and they are HARD to overcome. but we have to try. i try. ha! not so good, but it's the effort, right? i can sympathize with any and all hypochondria ideas. most certainly everything i acquire, from a common cold to a razor burn i don't remember giving myself while shaving, is setting out to kill me.  but nothing has!

nothing about what you are going through is pointless, thankyouforhelp. i would never wish what i went through on even my worst nemesis. but every day i see ANY improvement on ANY level, i feel a dew-drop of strength in it. a dew drop isn't much, i know. but enough of those little reflective drops strung together will give a refreshing drink and in much greater amounts, a powerful life-sustaining river. every day you "go day by day and tell myself to stay strong," you're making it count - you're collecting those drops of strength. i believe you will make it to the other side despite the obstacles you see ahead of you. i say this not strictly to make you feel a shot of wellness (though i hope you do), but because i know that deep inside all of us is the seed of strength and survival. it's true. now is the time to nurture those seeds.

hang in there.

best to all the buddies out there...

dave

 

ps. this is so random. but i once had a psychologist tell me that when you are feeling anxious or depressed, listen to something the seems counter-intuitive. i always reached for classical or jazz when i was feeling poorly - and in acute benzo withdrawal, i listened to NOTHING. may i suggest the ramones, david bowie, and thin lizzy?  i don't know, it seems to work sometimes. take one and call me in the morning... heh heh heh...

[[th...]]

Hi Dave

You are a kind soul to take the time to send your encouragement and insight. Thank you so very much. My thoughts of strength and peace for you are coming your way as you read this.

I read your comments and descriptions and it struck me that I should ask right away if you have read Claire Weekes' book Hope and Help for Your Nerves. If not please get it (can be ordered from Amazon) and read it. Of the many things that I have read (I am constitutionally anxious) this is the only one that nailed it and gave me hope and tells us how to deal with the hard stuff--past what-ifs, how to take that one"glimpse" of success-- like your dew drop of hope-- and how to hold onto it and make it grow. I think that is what we seek, to have those times of what we remember as normalcy and strength become more of a reality. Even in w/d we can benefit from this info because the anxiety that is underlying is great. This book has been on my nightstand or close by since I got it about a year ago. I have heard others say the same. If I could share one thing that has helped me the most over the past year, it would be this book.

You describe your efforts and your perceived "failures" and what you must know is that any effort is by definition not a failure. It is precisely the act of trying that makes it count. She (Dr. Weekes) is very clear about that. So if you have had many efforts, regardless of your perception of the outcome, you must know that these have pushed you forward. One day you will perceive the success that is already there, planted as the seed that you describe.

Keep these thoughts of your fine efforts and bravery with you.

You know that we see you that way and look up to you.

 

 

 

 

[[no...]]

thankyouforhelp, hey. sincere gratitude again for your kind words, for taking the time. i need it and needed it. the last week or so has found me suffering some of the worst morning cortisol rushes that i've had in some time. it's just about all i can do to hold on for the ride until it burns off. movement helps. it comes on around 3 or 4 a.m. - rushes in. i rev like a plane engine and feel like i'm going to lose it. i get up. i move. this morning i listened to nico's "sixty forty" off the "drama of exile" record. fine record to listen to in the winter months anyway. i started to recover. music is a huge part of engaging my mind. it has been since i was a mere slip of a youth in the late 70s. from a real young age, music was a comfort.

thank you for the reminder on the claire weeke's book. i have that thing somewhere, but haven't read it in a good 15 years. i will dig it back out. i promise. i have a feeling it will resonate much more with me now after having gotten through the worst of the benzo withdrawal and w/ the remeron taper now in full-swing. i too am constitutionally anxious. but i was never as anxious as i was ON the benzos; they made it a bazillion times worse, but i've always had the anxiety. a fear as old as the world i surmise, but perhaps amplified a little louder through the medium of my unique nervous system. my parents used to say i was just too sensitive and not living up to potential because of it. i was started on meds pretty early. medicate that sensitivity into submission!  i can sort of laugh about it now. sort of.

you have started my day right. i can't tell you how much i appreciate that. i'll do a lot more looking up today.

dave

[[th...]]

Go forth, you are strong. Everyone is rooting for you. It is wonderful that we can help each other. We will continue to do so. Have a peaceful and restful evening.

[[Ru...]]

Hey Dave I jUst wanted to let you know that during early rem wd my adrenals were a total mess but now 3 months off they are back to normal. I just had them checked by my nd yesterday and they are bang on normal and functioning well and this is in a person whO has Lyme and at this time last year was in severe adrenal fatigue. I did treat my adrenals with supps for many months but now off the supps and rem after 3 mOnths they are doing well. So try to hang on they do get better.

[[no...]]

Ruby12, hello. thank you very, very much for this feedback and your priceless words of encouragement and perspective. so needed! i am hanging on - holding my grip - gently as i can. and may i say that i am nothing short of thrilled to hear of your progress. i mean truly, we're all in the big leagues when it comes to suffering through this stuff. and a win by anyone is a win for the team. and w/ Lyme on top of it - wow... i am immensely impressed by your fortitude and state of healing. may it continue to evolve for you.

thanks for writing, for taking the time, for the positivity.

dave

 

p.s. to ALL BUDDIES IN THE BOAT has anyone experienced a sort of vibrating feeling in their head? when i am symptomatic, i get this something fierce. like two rubber erasers being rubbed together, over one another. it is disconcerting. i don't freak out about it, but it feels really uncomfortable. i plan on being a bit more vocal on here about the symptoms i am experiencing. i realize that i hold back a lot because i don't want others to feel poorly based on what i am going through. i do this with people immediately surrounding me too. it's sort of a protective thing. maybe that is weird. i think we probably learn more from sharing. but anyway, i plan to talk about stuff a little more. all right. i need to put the nose to the grindstone. hang in there everyone.

[[th...]]

Hi Dave

I sent a message yesterday but I'm not seeing it in my sent file. I will try to reconstruct it.

Sending thoughts of strength , calm and peace.

Everyone out there, this goes to all of you. Every victorious small step is a win for all of us as Dave has mentioned.

Let us know how it goes so that we may send support.

[[Ab...]]

Hallo

 

I have only been taking Remeron 15mg at night prescribed for sleep when I was recently hospitalized.  I found out to my horror how addictive it is.  I am not depressed and do not need it.  How can I stop it after only 2weeks taking it at night?

 

Thank you

[[no...]]

thankyouforhelp, hello. thank you! did you try to reconstruct the message? i didn't receive one. i am doing ok. i'm having those annoying symptoms that seem fairly constant, but i am vertical and doing my thing. the morning cortisol rushes are just beastly and that vibrating feeling in the head - egad. of all the places on the body to be vibrating, the brain is not the place! again, thank you so much for your support. it means a ton. i've appreciated the past messages you've sent me. we have a lot of similarities as we've discussed. you are very compassionate.

i felt like i was going to spontaneously burst into tears about 5 times today. mostly in the morning. i worked late into the day and that seemed to help. i've had some task changes at work and adjusting to these is proving a GREAT distraction, though a little stressful.

abriton, hey. it's hard to say what you should do. everyone is different. some people swear they have a hard time getting off the stuff after minimal use. some people claim that they can c/t after 12 years of use and feel no ill effects. at 15mg, it would be the anti-anxiety affects that would be useful for you. the antidepressant mechanisms do not come into play until the higher doses (above 15mg). you could always half your dose for a week and see how that goes. hard to answer your question. but we wish you the best.

hang in there all. love peace blessings

dave

 

[[th...]]

Hi Dave

I will reconstruct and send. I am wondering where the message went and why I did not get a copy. No matter, it will be on its way in a few minutes.

Ruby, Coralashley, Angel, how are you all doing? Let us know what is happening.

I got sleep without Ambien last night. This is good and one step in the right direction. I am grateful for all small steps.

 

[[de...]]

I just want to add my experience to this very helpful thread as I am struggling with Remeron withdrawals.

I had a pretty successful taper from Valium, about 15 mgs. in 15 months.  After about 2 and a half months off the benzo I decided I really wanted to be off all psychotropics (I wanted my brain back!) and went from 7.5 mgs. of Remeron to zero in about a month.  How bad could withdrawals from an antidepressant be? I had already been through benzo hell.

Well it wasn't as bad as benzo hell but it was different.  I felt like I had an engine constantly purring in my brain.  At about a month off terrible tinnitus kicked in.  Yes it wasn't benzo hell but it was about all I could take.

Six months off of the Rem. now (and 9 months off of Val.)and I feel worse than ever.  I have some of that benzo anxiety back where you feel like the world is slipping away.  The DP/DR feeling has been there all along and I would say is the most prominent disturbing feature.

Am I crazy to think about reinstating the Rem.? and then tapering.  It's so depressing to think that this isn't the end of the battle.

If anyone is reading this thinking they can do a quick withdrawal from an anti-depressant think again and... as they always say on this website, it's always better to taper.

Anyway, Ruby I know you're going through alot of what I went through.  The one positive is I do have some windows where I feel 90% and sleep is not a major issue.

I would like some opinions on reinstating and if anyone has experienced a major wave after 6 months off an a/d.

Thanks,

D

[[th...]]

Hello deluls

I am in the same boat and right now having a difficult time. I, too  am hoping to hear more from the vets who have made it through. If you read the thread, you'll see the vets who have successfully made it through and have re-gained their lives . Tiger-Lily is one and Angel is another. Even though I feel like going back to Rem., I tell myself not to do it. To hold on and to look to a day when I will be successful , too, and feeling better.

You have already had success with the sleep and with the windows of feeling 90%!! Keep those  successes in the forefront and refer back to them often to remind yourself of the good that is there and that can be expanded upon.

This is a mirt. thread but I wanted to copy something from a post I saw from a woman who had come off another AD Paxil). Her message is also about Hope and Success so here it is:

 

  Anhedonia, depression and derealization/depersonalization were my very worst symptoms. They kicked in about 4 months past my last dose and lasted for approximately 5-6 months. I woke up one morning like a light switch had gone off and they were gone and the hellride was over. I was still in withdrawal but it was not debilitating nor crazy feeling.

 

What helped me the most was realizing it was paxil withdrawal and that it wasn't "me." I tried to stay detached as much as possible from the feelings I was having and just observing them without being them. Does that make sense? I also relied a tremendous amount on the wonderful people on this board.

 

Yes, it does get better. I promise you that. I am now almost 6 years Paxil-free after almost 9 years' of use. I know when you're in the thick of withdrawal it feels like it will never, ever end, but it does. I am living proof of it and so are thousands of other people who have been where you are and are now leading healthy, fulfilling lives. It just takes patience to get to the end.

__________________

 

a/k/a Lisa

PAXIL FREE AS OF 3/18/06! Fully recovered!

 

Would love to hear from other buddies-- needing help today.

Dave, sending comfort and feelings of calm an solidity to you!

 

[[de...]]

Thank You, Thank you!

 

Thanks for your understanding and the success story from the person who successfully withdrew from the Paxil.  It really helped me through my day.  I find comfort in the fact that her story is similar to mine in that her worse symptoms kicked in about 4 months along.  This is all so frustrating.  I just don't get the whole brain science of this.  I thought I turned a corner in December and here I am in (almost) March and feeling worse than ever.  Its all so insidious.  I decided not to reinstate as I read that after a few months off an a/d it's probably not a good idea.

I'll stick with this thread and look forward to posts that include continued healing.  Here's to patience and strength to you and everyone surviving these days.  Thank you again for your thoughtful reply.

d

 

[[th...]]

Hey Buddies--Dave, Angel, Ruby, poptart, deluls and anyone else who is reading this and needs help and comfort,

How are you doing? Deluls posted last almost 2 weeks ago! That is a long time not to hear from anyone.

I have been having ups and downs but overall I am improving. My sleep is getting better (fewer nights on Ambien). The anxiety is still pretty hard to deal with but I have added lemon balm (15 drops in water, boiling off the alcohol) and have gotten good relief from that. It is available at the health food stores as an alcohol extract in a dropper bottle. It calms in about 30 minutes after ingestion.

Life is still hard though, handing us stuff to deal with in addition to the withdrawal. So how have you all been? I hope that things are going well. Feel good about every small step forward--no matter how small or insignificant it may seem. Hold onto those insights. I was waffling a lot--- thinking-- do I need to go back on Rem? I thought about it every day. Now I think about it less!

Sending all of you thoughts of comfort and caring. You are cared about and held by your buddies here.

Write and stay in touch. Even a few words keeps us connected and strong.

Hugs to you.

[[An...]]

Hello Thankyou. I told you before and I will say it again. You really sound so nice!  I'm glad you are making some improvement albeit small ones. Every improvement leads you to the end of the tunnel.

 

Thanks also for the tip on the lemon balm.

 

I am over the mirtazapine withdrawals I think. It's hard to tell because I am still undergoing Effexor withdrawals. I am seven weeks off that drug but I'm not out of the woods yet yeuch but I'm getting there slowly.

 

I also hope everyone else is doing fine. No news is good news. Dave I'm particularly interested to hear how you are getting along so please keep in touch. I drop by now and then to check on progress.

 

Thanks for keeping the thread going Thankyou.  It's been a very useful tool for me during this process. You take care of yourself.

 

Angel

[[no...]]

thankyouforhelp, Angel958, everyone else, hello.

sorry i have been MIA for awhile. things got a little tough, but have evened out to some degree now. it is still the long march to the sea, but progress is palpable. i am stable for all intents and purposes on 3.8mg. the most promising thing to report is that i no longer seem to be getting hit quite so hard by remeron side effects once i stabilize. so i feel more comfortable with waiting to cut again.  withdrawal symptoms are still atrocious following the cuts, but with my last cut, they were noticeably shorter-lived, though still intense. i've discontinued taking fish oil for now. i am getting protein and omegas from a pure hemp protein powder. i re-introduced vitamin d with good results. i continue magnesium. and that is the extent of my supplementation. so remeron @ 3.8mg and supplementation.

thankyouforhelp - you sound good, STRONG. progressing. being bamboo. flexible, yet strong. keep up the amazing work. your positive prospective is a blessing. and i thank you.

angel, you sound like you are doing awesome too - even if not out of the woods - you have been a testament of fortitude here.

thank you for reaching out, for posting, for thinking of me, for taking the time. i am so grateful. i wish you and all the buddies continued healing, love, blessings - and please stay in touch.

dave

 

[[Co...]]

Hi everyone, Dave & Angel.. is Ruby still around?  Hi new buddies as well!

Just checking in to see how everyone has been! 

 

Dave I just read your last post, I'm sorry things have been so difficult!  But you are sooo Strong and have endured sooo much! Did you ever have a saliva cortisol test done to check why you get adrenal surges, etc? 

I now remeron jacked my stuff all up.. I have high cortisol from 3pm - 7am... so I am working on bringing those down.

I have learned that benzo's are the only pharma. drugs that lower cortisol, that's propbaly why I started on xanax at night to help me sleep.  And then the dependency grew, lol.  Alcohol increases cortisol, that's why I never get good sleep when i drink even one glass of wine (which I don't drink by the way but that gives me my reason)

 

Here is what I've found I now have:

High cortisol 3pm-7Am

High mercury levels/heavy metals, which can screw everything up... working on lowering this

Hypothyroidsim: but I can't take much thyroid because of the heavy metal issues, high cortisol and low zinc issue.The reason I'm so sensitive is because I'm pooling everything I take.. so when you take something it shuold go up and into your cells, well mine is pooliing and not going where they should.

Thyroid: I  have a Reverse T3 issues.. so my T4 isn't converting to T3, it's covnerting to RT3 which can cause anxiety, etc. Because you need free t3 it is very powerful and it helps keep us calm, etc.. This problem in conversion can be caused by stressors, copper/zinc ratio issues, low iron and lots of other things as well.. and Since most of us have come off a benxo and AD that is very stressful for the body!  So I am working on correcting that! 

Low progesterone: Cortisol actually inhibits progesterone production.. so I'm thinking once my cortisol is normal my progesteron will be normal again.  Dave you know men prduce progesterone too, so you may want to get your levels checked.

Low zinc: If youhave lines in your finger nails, which I do, that means you have low zinc.. zinc is needed for lowering cortisol and lots of other great things too.

I have high Iron, but low Ferritin... so My body is once again pooling iron but it's not getting into my cells.

 

Now I can't say all this is from Remeron.... but I don't believe I had any of this before I got off the Benzo and remeron..

But My body will heal.. I am eating a Paleo diet and I'm workign with some great people to correct everything..

 

I hope that this post helps someone out there!

If you are interested in getting the blood work I did here is what I had my doctor test for:

• All hormones: DHEA, progesterone, estrogen, estrodial, testosterone, free testosterone, etc

• All vitamins, including D, B12, vitamin c, and so on

• Full thyroid, including TSH, T4, free t4, T3, free t3, & Reverse T3

Full Thyroid antibodies check :

• Thyroid Peroxidase (TPO) and Anti-Thyroglobulin (TgAb):

• Full Iron panel (Ferritin, TIBC, serum Iron): Should not be deficient. I prefer iron to be between the lower quarter and midrange of the reference range.

Serum copper, serum zinc: both should be around 100 ug/dL and zinc should be slightly higher than copper.

RBC Magnesium (serum magnesium is meaningless): this should be in the upper quarter of the reference range, and any number below that needs to be repleted. Make sure to maintain balance of calcium and potassium as well.

Selenium (contained in 5’-deiodinase, an enzyme that converts T4 to T3):

• Cortisol am and pm Plus I did a urine cortisol test that separately tests 5 different times of the day.. Saliva tests are great too!

• CBC

• Full food and allergen panel

• Cholesterol

• MTHFR gene defect test

Test code(s) 36165, 10078 (NY), 17911X, 17912X (NY)

 

• Methylenetetrahydrofolate Reductase (MTHFR), DNA Mutation Analysis

MTHFR DNA mutation analysis tests for the presence or absence of two mutations in the MTHFR gene: 677C>T and 1298A>C. Testing for these mutations helps assess whether an individual is at increased risk for hyperhomocysteinemia and thus increased risk for vascular diseases, venous thrombosis, and neural tube defects.

 

 

it's very important to make sure your doctor tests for all this.. some will say oh well I never test for Reverse T3... well don't let them get away with that.. it's covered under insurance if you have it!

Then once you get those results.. you need to find the ratio of Free t3 and Reverse t3.

You have to take your FT3/RT3 (so you divide the free t3 by the RT3) and if the number you get isn't over .20 or higher then you have a RT3 issue like me! Which is why the Wilson Temperature Syndrome protocal worked so well for me to help reverse some of that.

For example my FT3 was 2.3 and my rt3 was 19.. so 2.3/19 is .12... So I'm not converting T4 to t3 and it's pooling as Rt3.  Make sense?

 

Also I am having a 23andme gene test done and then once I have those results I'm going to have it interpreted by https://livewello.com/23andMe

So I can know if I have any gene defects that can cause anxiety or anything else.

 

I hope all is helps and hugs!