What is happening in your brain?

[[pa...]]

Parker, this is just fantastic and I know it is going to help me so much as I attempt (slower) withdrawal again.  One question:  any theories about what it is that would cause chronic headaches and face/neck pain both on Valium and - wildly exacerbated - in withdrawal?  This is the most intolerable thing for me and I know if I can understand its place in the healing too it will help me even more. 

 

Thanks again for all the time and brainpower you put into this.

 

Hi Thisbe,

 

Not that I can really "know" what is causing headaches, but I can venture a few guesses.   BTW, lots of people have them in withdrawal - so it's very common. 

 

Headaches seem to have many causes.  In recovery, a lot of time, we have tight scalp, head, and face muscles. I'm not entirely sure why THIS occurs, but it's a common symptom.  That can lead to a "tight band around the head" feeling along with all kinds of weird head sensations.  That alone can cause a tension headache in the head or neck that can radiate.  I know I have gotten these, and if I lay down on floor face up and rub the back of my neck with my hands, I can literally feel the pain leave while I'm pushing on the neck muscles and supporting the head.  That muscle can get so tight.

 

Also - we have a lot of pupillary reactions and eye strain in recovery - where we are more sensitive to light - causing the pupils to constrict and the eye muscles to tighten. That can cause eye strain and headaches related to eye muscles.

 

The sinuses can feel stretched or expanded - and that can cause headaches.

Even the eustachian tubes are involved for some people or at some times.  You get a feeling like you're too deep underwater and your ears are shutting. Again - just muscles tightening - but it's weird - and when all that is happening at one time, a headache would seem to be almost obligatory.

 

There are also 12 cranial nerves in our head that innervate everything from our face muscles, to our tongue, eyes, etc.  And any of these could cause jaw soreness, eye soreness--- etc. etc. ---which can lead to headaches.

 

Again - no way for me to know for sure, but even in "normal life", stress can cause muscle tension leading to headaches - and especially in recovery where we aren't always getting great sleep, and have a million things going on, a headache is par for the course.

 

I try to keep my blood sugar even and drink plenty of fluids so that I don't have sugar-based headaches or get dehydrated - since that can cause a headache, too. But sometimes they are unavoidable in recovery.  When I get these really badly, I take a very hot Epsom salt bath (to relax my CNS and muscles), drink water, take tylenol or advil, and just lay down to sleep or rest. Sometimes, I will put Vicks VapoRub on my face or head in the place that it hurts. I'm not sure why, but the menthol seems to help confuse the nerves and it works so well to bring temporary relief while I"m just laying there.  They make "Head On' as a rub you can put on - and that works for me, too.  It doens't get rid of the headache, but it turns it down from a 10 to a 2 - and often enough so that I can get to sleep. The only thing that really cures me is sleep so that the muscles causing the pain can relax.  But everyone is different.

 

 

Hope this helps.

:)Parker

[[Ho...]]

Parker, I will ditto everyone and say what an amazing post.  Just last night I was coming off a really bad day (so dizzy I could not drive) and was so despondant -- hubby said he had no idea ho w to snap me our of it .  So the comment about not having control and treating us as if we were recovering from an accident really hit home.  I'm making hubbyrread your post.....and I've never made him read anything on benzobuddies!!!

[[Be...]]

b

[[tu...]]

Parker:

 

I don't know if it is something vestibular or something vision related.  But, I find that while I am driving (waiting at busy intersections) I get this sensation (if I don't focus on something stationary like a street sign) that I am being twirled.  Also, if I don't concentrate on something visually (again street signs are my favorite) my eyes "zone out" or go blurry and out of focus really easily and if I don't concentrate on something and visually bring them back into focus quickly again I get a panicky sensation.

 

Is this part of w/d?

 

Does anyone else have this?

 

I have learned how to control it.  If I am having a wave I don't drive or avoid intersections.  This has been with me to varying degrees since the beginning.  Just wondering how it relates.

 

Thanks,

TG

[[Be...]]

b

[[Be...]]

PArker,  I loved your post. Made copies and sent it to my doctors and family.  Really hits home.  Thanks so much for your work in posting it.  Another question, though-  Recently I've had two episodes of bruising superficially under the skin.  One on my arm and another today on my chin.  No cause for it.  I've been taking a lot of acetominophen and fish oil capsules, although I've taken those for a long time now. 

 

Have you or others experienced sort of spontaneous bleeds or bruising like this because of klono withdrawal?  I recently went to a gradual liquid titration of 5%/2weeks  after being no longer able to tolerate making cuts on a single day. 

 

These bleeds/ bruises under the skin are pretty unsettling.  Appreciate your thoughts.  Thanks.

 

 

 

 

[[pr...]]

hi benzotired,

the bleeds and bruises could very well be from something like an acetominophen. Tylenol can affect your blood system and can sometimes cause anemia. which can lead to unexplained bleeding and bruising.

but maybe Parker would know better what they are from. are you able to maybe not take the acetominophen for a week or so and see if it's gets any better?

pretty

 

 

 

[[pa...]]

PArker,  I loved your post. Made copies and sent it to my doctors and family.  Really hits home.  Thanks so much for your work in posting it.  Another question, though-  Recently I've had two episodes of bruising superficially under the skin.  One on my arm and another today on my chin.  No cause for it.  I've been taking a lot of acetominophen and fish oil capsules, although I've taken those for a long time now. 

 

Have you or others experienced sort of spontaneous bleeds or bruising like this because of klono withdrawal?  I recently went to a gradual liquid titration of 5%/2weeks  after being no longer able to tolerate making cuts on a single day. 

 

These bleeds/ bruises under the skin are pretty unsettling.  Appreciate your thoughts.  Thanks.

 

I'm not sure how much fish oil you're taking (in terms of mg of actual EPA, DHA, (omegas 3 and 6, etc.) but if you're taking a lot of it - you can have anticoagulating effects easily.  If the fish oil contains Vitamin E as well - then yes - that adds to it.  I'm not sure if this would "necessarily" create bruising - but if you're bumping yourself a lot - maybe you're taking too much fish oil.

 

Vitamin K deficiency is also very correlated to bruising. Have you talked to your doctor about this? I'm not sure if there is a way to supplement with Vit K or to test for a deficiency, but that is worth a conversation.

 

A few things to try...stop the fish oil for a week and put "Arnica" cream or gel on your bruises - and see if they go away and if you do not form any more.  Arnica is a natural homeopathic gel that will reduce and remove your bruises quickly. YOu can get it at any health food store. It won't rev you. (I use it on my kids for bruising, muscle soreness, etc - I've even used it prior to a surgery and the doctor was amazed that I had hardly any bruising at all and a fast recovery with minimal swelling). They also sell "arnica tablets" that dissolve under your tongue. They taste like little sugar pills and are very tiny but can have a huge benefit on bruising.

 

If you stop the fish oil and the bruises go away - that may help you to know better if this is the cause.

 

I don't know how much acetominophin you're taking - but talk to your doctor about a daily limit.  Acetominophin puts stress on your liver and with everyday use, it's good to be careful and potetentially get your blood tested every few months to be sure you aren't getting liver damage. I'm not a doctor - so I can't say what is normal - but this informaiton exists everywhere about acetominophin.  Be careful taking too much. 

 

:)Parker

[[Be...]]

Thanks PArker and Pretty,

Only taking 650-1000mgs of tylenol/day.  The max dose is supposed to be 3000mg, but I take it every day for muscle aches/pains, etc from the WD.  Have been taking it for months now.

 

Taking 2 X 1200 fish oil caps each day and can easily stop those .  Not major bleeds, but it's happened stice in the past two months and looks like am under the skin bleed.  The first one ended up looking like a 2 inch long black and blue mark from a bleed.  This recent one looks like I scraped under the skin and had a minor bleed.

 

I can't take aspirin or NSAID's, so tylenol is my only other choice for pain control.

[[Ho...]]

Parker, I forgot to add to the thread that I loved your suggestion about the weighted blanket.  Never heard of that one before, but it makes total sense.  And it helps REALLY explain to me why I noticed that the compression hosiery I wear (to keep up my bp), some days were not all that beneficial for my bp, but seem to calm down my "jitters."  I guess it's the same principle -- the pressure helps calm the nerves down.

 

Anyway, just wanted to add that to the thread.  Maybe someone might get the benefit out of compression hose like I have! 

[[pa...]]

Parker, I forgot to add to the thread that I loved your suggestion about the weighted blanket.  Never heard of that one before, but it makes total sense.  And it helps REALLY explain to me why I noticed that the compression hosiery I wear (to keep up my bp), some days were not all that beneficial for my bp, but seem to calm down my "jitters."  I guess it's the same principle -- the pressure helps calm the nerves down.

 

Anyway, just wanted to add that to the thread.  Maybe someone might get the benefit out of compression hose like I have! 

 

Cool! I have seen people with autism and related disabilities report that wearing tight clothes helps them like the compression hose helps you.  (LOL - I like that Lycra underwear they make now better than cotton because it "holds me in" like that.)  I like to wear tight spandex during workouts for the same reason.  Anyhow - that's cool you found something that works so well. 

 

:)Parker

[[No...]]

Weightened blankets are used often used in treating severe anxiety. I believe to have read that the blanket mimics the womb in some way.

[[ca...]]

Thank you so much for posting this great explanation of what is happening inside our brains/minds. Also, thanks for making it clear to loved ones that this is improving, but will take time. We are just like someone that has been in MVA and now has some low level brain damage and nerve damage. We will get better, but this is not about willpower, it is a waiting game.

I plan on coming back to read this at 2am when I snap awake and I cannot think straight.

So many symptoms associated with withdrawal of benzo's. If I had known this when I got my first prescription, I would never have gotten it filled.

Thank you for supporting your community and sharing your knowledge.

 

Causingpain

 

[[re...]]

Parker-

 

Thanks for sharing, you rock! I hope everyone gets a chanve to read this!

 

[[Ho...]]

Yeah, Parker.... I LOVE compression garments.  I found some cheapo ones at Old Navy, and they are really comfy and just seem to calm my nerves down.  The only "down" side is that now that I'm running around in spandex all the time my hubby is chasing after me.      Or would that be the "up" side.....??!!!    LOL!!!

 

But seriously, there are some folks on my "low bp" forum that go the extra mile...not just compression hose but some of them have bought suits that Air Force Pilots wear (can't remember the name) that compress you all over.  Man, that must feel great!!!

 

Thanks again for the post....especially the notes about akathesia and dizziness b/c that's what I am so suffering with.  And my docs look at me like "I have no idea?!" so I've passed your note on to them.

 

Maybe we all need to start lecturing to med students??!!!!

[[pr...]]

i missed the part where Parker talked about the weighted blankets and i couldn't find it in the thread.

what was that suggestion about?

thanks,

pretty

[[Th...]]

 

 

Hi Parker

 

Can't believe I managed to miss this!  Thanks very much for the detailed reply - will read it a few times (as with everything) until it does make sense.  My headaches started over 9 years ago and I began the Valium around 13 years ago.  They've just become more constant and severe with time and become my most incapacitating symptom, along with the neck and face pain.  During withdrawal they were in a different league to anything I had known before. 

 

I'm kind of going on faith that they may be caused by some sort of 'tolerance withdrawal' with pretty much everything else having been ruled out.  Whether or not they're connected I guess only time will tell.  One thing's for sure though, having seen what this drug does when I try to stop it I want it out of my system. 

 

(The worst times I have been saying various mantras to myself based around your explanation of how the brain is healing - it truly has given me a whole new perspective and new sense of respect and admiration for my body.)

 

Thisbe

[[Go...]]

Parker

 

Your post has really helped me to reframe this experience.  It helps me be be more hopeful and not so scared.

 

Thank you so much for this post.  It gives me the courage to continue this march forward.

 

My best wishes to you and all of us on this path to health.

 

Golden

[[Go...]]

Parker

 

Do you know what part of the brain is involved when you have cramps in your legs and stomach pain?  Are these symptoms a result of something going on in the brain or elsewhere?

 

I am trying to put these symptoms in perspective.

 

Thanks

 

Golden

[[pa...]]

Parker

 

Do you know what part of the brain is involved when you have cramps in your legs and stomach pain?  Are these symptoms a result of something going on in the brain or elsewhere?

 

I am trying to put these symptoms in perspective.

 

Thanks

 

Golden

 

Hey Golden,

 

That's a tough one for anyone to pinpoint, but I want to mention that the ENTIRE nervous system is affected in our recovery - both the Central Nervous Sysem (brain) and the Peripheral Nervous System (nerves stemming out from the spinal cord to the other organs, muscles, etc.) 

People in recovery have anythign and everything from both motor movements (shaking, twitching, vibrating, cramping) to sensory experiences (feelings of hold, cold, wet, pain, electric shocks, internal vibrations).  Not everyone has everything, but anywhere we have nerves (which is everywhere)  is fair game.

The entire body runs on nerves and GABA is involved in inhibition throughout.  So almost anything can occur in recovery.

The good news is that I believe that we only percieve so much of it - some of it is healing that we DON"T percieve.  What we DO notice can be unnerving (pardon the pun) But it can't truly hurt us.

 

I like Bliss Johns classic book - she talks about attempting to "observe" the symptoms from the outside - realizing they are what they are - simply symptoms - and then allowing them to "be and allowing them to pass.

 

I'm sorry about your pain. Pain is tough no matter when you have it. 

As far as the leg cramps - have you tried Magnesium Glycinate?  Anytime I read "cramps" in skeletal muscles, I always think of magnesium. It can do wonders for physical cramping in any muscle or organ.  I've posted a lot about this in the forum, but suffice it to say, I use a brand called "Doctor's Best 100% High Absorption Magnesium" - and it is the bomb!  Others have since posted their support of this product as well.  You may already use magnesium (I did) but THIS brand and this TYPE of magnesium makes all the difference.  It is greater than 90% absorbed which far surpasses other forms of magnesium. When I take this, I can feel it in 40 minutes.  Right away. It's an amazing mineral.  The "glycinate" is what the magnesium is bound to. Glycinate is an inhibitory amino acid much like GABA. It's so small that it absorbs right into the blood, pulling the magnesium with it - which is how it all gets in to your system so quickly. But the glycine itself is also calming for muscles - so the entire supplement is wonderful for several of us on here. It may be worth a try.

I'm including a link in case you're interested.  It may not be a cure all, but I take it twice a day (2 pills in the morning and 2 pills at night  makes for 100% of the daily dose) and it's wonderful for me. 

 

[nobbc]http://www.drbvitamins.com/products/products.html?id=126[/nobbc]

 

I hope you feel better. 

:)Parker

 

Edit: commercial link deactivated

[[be...]]

Thank you so much for this Parker!! 

 

xo S.

[[Th...]]

Parker, that's interesting about the brand mattering with the Magnesium.  I'm taking Mag Glycinate and have taken Magnesium in various forms for most of the time I've been sick with ME/CFS and fibro because they are 'supposed' to help.  But have never made any obvious difference to me.  Just ordered two huge bottles of another brand but I'm going to try this one on your recommendation after that!

[[Th...]]

PS - I like your reminder about mindfulness.  Gosh it's challenging when dealing with so much though. 

[[Da...]]

Hi Parker

 

Thank you for your erudite explanation of symptoms, I am just a short way into my taper, however, now armed with the information you have provided, I am sure it will make things a  little more bearable if symps. arise. I have not  read through all posts linked to your thread but will do so later.

 

Best. David

 

[[pr...]]

Parker,

i was going to start a new topic about this and i still may. maybe tomorrow.

firstly, it's so fantastic what Bliss says to do and to just Observe the symptoms and allow them to pass through.

most of the time i am able to do that, but sometimes it's very difficult.

i feel like this whole withdrawal is a very energetic process and when i am able to just Observe the Symptoms, they do pass through and i feel a healing and a kinda more in touch with my body and a grounding too.

 

but this morning was so bad!! my brain felt like it was filling up with a fluid of sorts. and this pressure just kept getting stronger and stronger and there was so much excruciating pain when my brain would fill up and land in a certain place, then my right shoulder and both heel of my feet would squeeze tighter and tighter and felt like they were crushing!

that's when i had a difficult time doing that Observing. and got into alot of fear!

 

anyway, i have to ask again--do you think that is all part of this withdrawal? or do now have to be checked for a fluid inside my brain even though i had a full on MRI last June/2012?

 

also, we just became aware that a family member as TB and that we all have to take antibiotics. and i dead set against antibiotics and i fear what they might do to me during a benzo w/d. of course i will take them if i must, but i was wondering if anyone knew about alternative and holistic measures to take for Tuberulosis?

and if i start a new topic about that, where would i start that topic? i would title it benzo withdrawal and TB. but not sure where?

anyway, thank you!

pretty