Discussion: Four Phases of Withdrawal-Where Are You?

[[qw...]]

Yesterday I would have said two, today maybe three. I feel almost normal right now but have had lessening symptoms today.

 

Do I even dare start to believe that progress is real? that maybe I am really coming out of this?

 

That would be so glorious and I hope I have learned what I needed to to be more successful in life without benzoa this time.

 

This is round three of withdrawal for me. Once in 1993-1996 then again in 2006-2008. I had no idea about the connection to benzos the first time around, I just hit what I now know as tolerance , suffered for many months then basically started taking benzos agaion to feel better.

 

Hoping I have really turned a corner this time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

[[pi...]]

does anyone have the link to the original post and the descriptions? i cant find it.

[Guest [pa...]]

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=156111.msg2089263#msg2089263

[[pi...]]

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=156111.msg2089263#msg2089263

 

your amazing. thankyou! 

[[Lo...]]

Phase 4, Alot to be thankful for considering how bad I was. Still dealing with body pain which is the only thing stopping me from having a normal life but everything else is gone 

 

 

[[La...]]

Phase 2. I definitely have patterns of Windows and Waves. I'm 14 weeks post jump

[[Ju...]]

When I first read this , I thought it was really stupid and I wanted to fight everybody on benzo buddies. I just wanted to start arguments and prove everybody wrong. That was in my first phase. That was right after my 7th or 8th cold turkey off of Klonopin and Valium.

 

The first 8 months consisted of 24/7 extreme suffering, complete paranoia and delusions and extreme anger and fear. And then I started to get a little bit of sleep so I thought things were improving but I was wrong.

 

And then months 10 + 11 + 12 ended me up in the hospital again. And then all kinds of things went wrong but months 13 and 14 have been a little bit less intense. And in half a month I will be at 15 months, and I'm thinking I might get into phase 3 by then.

 

My mornings have been super intense and if I do something as simple as walk outside to go for a walk I start sweating and my heart rate goes through the roof and I get these blood pressure throbbing feelings in my brain. But by night time I seem to be a little bit better. I've been getting decent sleep.

 

So I have a lot of symptoms of phase 2 and phase three right now. It's like I'm stuck in between the two. Whenever I wake up from a good sleep, I have a huge tornado of brain activity and Noise and extreme burning in my body. I'm guessing that I will get a really big one and it will disappear sometime soon.

 

I'm thinking I will wake up into phase 3 or 4 and then continue on with my sensitivity phase. I don't know if anybody else has had the brain tornado and body burning out of a sleep, it almost feels like it has to get going extreme enough so that it will burn itself out.

 

All I know is our bodies tell us everything if we listen closely enough.

[[...]]

PHASE TWO

This phase is a little easier than Phase One, but is marked by symptoms "morphing" in nature, becoming intermittent, decreasing in intensity and frequency, and even disappearing altogether.  New symptoms may even pop in and out periodically.  Some people start detecting the Windows and Waves pattern beginning.  Others may start seeing relief in the late afternoon and evening.  In this phase, you can pretty easily identify your "core" bugger symptoms versus the auxiliary ones, kind of like a circle within a circle of your close "friends" versus your "acquaintances."  Even if you experience windows, the waves crash down on you for no apparent reason too.  It's still a very hellish phase, to say the least, but it IS progress.

 

I think I more or less started coming into phase 2 around 2.5 years, finally getting my first partial window at 3 years post-meds (heavily polydrugged with 2 benzos and 2 ADs for 13 years). I saw my sleep pattern morph at 2.5 years and verrrrrrryyyyyy slowly felt my CNS calming down from dreadful inner agitation. At 3 years, I started to read again, and a couple of months later, started to watch some Netflix. I started to feel some very subtle improvement on the positive physical sensations: everything used to be physically uncomfortable, everything. Now, I can focus on some more positive sensations whien I'm lying in bed for example. What's new, and has kind of crept up gradually since 2.5/3 years, is insomnia with lots of fatigue/exhaustion/sleepiness/body heaviness, which is still ongoing now at 3 years 4 months. The symptom which will not bulge yet is the deep lack of emotion, drive, mental energy, enthusiasm, or pretty much any kind of enjoyment or pleasure...

And I still feel like my brain is broken. My thoughts are just... wrong? My thinking doesn't work. I make weird automatic associations which serve no purpose. I think it is simply struggling to make sense of the world and the current situation with the cues it is receiving from a CNS (and the brain itself...) going through deep deep deep healing... and a lot hasn't been restored back online just yet... I know it will, but for some, it can take a lot (a really big) lot of time.

 

I seem to remember Sofa telling me she started watching TV again around 3.5 years out, which gives me hope! Sofa, if you read this thread (or even if you don't, lol), I am sending you big healing hugs! I hope you are doing great 

 

Best wishes to everyone, hang in there!!

Julz 

[[br...]]

 

Julz  . It's late here and I'm about to pop off to bed for another night of C.N.S challenged sleep, but I wanted to send along nighty night hugs and a big well done you . It's such a hard journey ,but you hang in there with grace and courage and your posts are truly impressive . You could try to p.m. sofa . She got me through some very rough times bless her .

 

[[Ga...]]

I feel that I am in phase two, leaning slightly into phase three.  If I could get rid of the almost daily headaches, I would plant myself firmly in phase three

[[pi...]]

PHASE TWO

This phase is a little easier than Phase One, but is marked by symptoms "morphing" in nature, becoming intermittent, decreasing in intensity and frequency, and even disappearing altogether.  New symptoms may even pop in and out periodically.  Some people start detecting the Windows and Waves pattern beginning.  Others may start seeing relief in the late afternoon and evening.  In this phase, you can pretty easily identify your "core" bugger symptoms versus the auxiliary ones, kind of like a circle within a circle of your close "friends" versus your "acquaintances."  Even if you experience windows, the waves crash down on you for no apparent reason too.  It's still a very hellish phase, to say the least, but it IS progress.

 

I think I more or less started coming into phase 2 around 2.5 years, finally getting my first partial window at 3 years post-meds (heavily polydrugged with 2 benzos and 2 ADs for 13 years). I saw my sleep pattern morph at 2.5 years and verrrrrrryyyyyy slowly felt my CNS calming down from dreadful inner agitation. At 3 years, I started to read again, and a couple of months later, started to watch some Netflix. I started to feel some very subtle improvement on the positive physical sensations: everything used to be physically uncomfortable, everything. Now, I can focus on some more positive sensations whien I'm lying in bed for example. What's new, and has kind of crept up gradually since 2.5/3 years, is insomnia with lots of fatigue/exhaustion/sleepiness/body heaviness, which is still ongoing now at 3 years 4 months. The symptom which will not bulge yet is the deep lack of emotion, drive, mental energy, enthusiasm, or pretty much any kind of enjoyment or pleasure...

And I still feel like my brain is broken. My thoughts are just... wrong? My thinking doesn't work. I make weird automatic associations which serve no purpose. I think it is simply struggling to make sense of the world and the current situation with the cues it is receiving from a CNS (and the brain itself...) going through deep deep deep healing... and a lot hasn't been restored back online just yet... I know it will, but for some, it can take a lot (a really big) lot of time.

 

I seem to remember Sofa telling me she started watching TV again around 3.5 years out, which gives me hope! Sofa, if you read this thread (or even if you don't, lol), I am sending you big healing hugs! I hope you are doing great 

 

Best wishes to everyone, hang in there!!

Julz

 

reading your posts always lifts me julz, positivity seems to be contagious! you have done so well to come this far, and if i can offer some hope regarding the mental issues you talked about. I remember when i was where you are, the mental symptoms seemed to be the next thing on the list of healing. So fingers crossed its very close. Like i dont really have any mental symptoms anymore, the occasional weird thought feels like benzo's. But none of the weird stuff like you say. Healing happens! this fact is great to focus on, and remember it every day. Sadly its all the negatives that absorb our focus which is very understandable.

 

healing wishes to you all

[[Ju...]]

The better that I get, and the more time that goes by, the more I see how true this is. I did not really understand the phase one until now. I was stuck in Phase 1 for about 12 months. I did a cold turkey on 20 years worth of Klonopin and Valium at extremely high doses combined with other things, many central nervous system depressants. So it was a very hellish phase to say the least. There was nothing other than thinking I was going to die and getting hospitalized and being paranoid and suffering with pain and that was about it the entire time.

 

At one point I had even thought that I got better at 8 months, but I was completely wrong. I got hospitalized and all things went to hell again and it wasn't until about 12 months that I started to enter phase 2. Now I'm at 15 months on the 14th and I think I'm a combination of two and three right now. If there was a phase 2 and 1/2 that's where I would be at.

 

My day pretty much consists of wake up feeling decent for a couple seconds, and then entering a huge wave that lasts until afternoon at the earliest. Sometimes I don't start to feel any better until three or four in the afternoon. If I go for a walk or go outside, I'm still paranoid and I start sweating. I have to stretch and be really careful otherwise I will pull a muscle because of my muscles being so contracted and atrophied. It's still a hellish phase.

 

But the reason I think it is between 2 and 3 is I notice situational things. Like when I go to the dentist, it throws me back a few days every time. But at least I'm going to the dentist now. It's really hard to do, I'm paranoid the whole time but I do it anyways. Maybe that's why it throws me back because it's so stressful.

 

I also moved a few weeks back, and I was in hell for a couple weeks but the weird thing about this phase of withdrawal is sometimes you don't know it until later. And then once your system calms down, then you see. And there's things like vinegar, when I clean with vinegar it sets me back. Or if I eat certain breads like bagels or eat chocolate cereal or something, it can set me back.

 

Or maybe they are just waves, maybe these foods and cleaning items and stressful events cause waves and not setbacks. Either way, I'm having symptoms of both Phase 2 and phase 3. I have not reached recovery phase or phase 4 yet.

 

But just a couple weeks ago I got a taste of what the fourth one was going to be like. I was going for a walk and all of my symptoms completely disappeared and my body got really light. It wasn't all heavy and painful anymore, it was really light and felt good. I was able to relax.

 

So it will be great when I'm in my fourth instead of my first or second, that way I can come back and Report what it's like. Don't ever cold turkey massive amounts of Klonopin and Valium. Because your acute or phase one is going to be hell on Earth.

[[Gi...]]

PHASE TWO

This phase is a little easier than Phase One, but is marked by symptoms "morphing" in nature, becoming intermittent, decreasing in intensity and frequency, and even disappearing altogether.  New symptoms may even pop in and out periodically.  Some people start detecting the Windows and Waves pattern beginning.  Others may start seeing relief in the late afternoon and evening.  In this phase, you can pretty easily identify your "core" bugger symptoms versus the auxiliary ones, kind of like a circle within a circle of your close "friends" versus your "acquaintances."  Even if you experience windows, the waves crash down on you for no apparent reason too.  It's still a very hellish phase, to say the least, but it IS progress.

 

I think I more or less started coming into phase 2 around 2.5 years, finally getting my first partial window at 3 years post-meds (heavily polydrugged with 2 benzos and 2 ADs for 13 years). I saw my sleep pattern morph at 2.5 years and verrrrrrryyyyyy slowly felt my CNS calming down from dreadful inner agitation. At 3 years, I started to read again, and a couple of months later, started to watch some Netflix. I started to feel some very subtle improvement on the positive physical sensations: everything used to be physically uncomfortable, everything. Now, I can focus on some more positive sensations whien I'm lying in bed for example. What's new, and has kind of crept up gradually since 2.5/3 years, is insomnia with lots of fatigue/exhaustion/sleepiness/body heaviness, which is still ongoing now at 3 years 4 months. The symptom which will not bulge yet is the deep lack of emotion, drive, mental energy, enthusiasm, or pretty much any kind of enjoyment or pleasure...

And I still feel like my brain is broken. My thoughts are just... wrong? My thinking doesn't work. I make weird automatic associations which serve no purpose. I think it is simply struggling to make sense of the world and the current situation with the cues it is receiving from a CNS (and the brain itself...) going through deep deep deep healing... and a lot hasn't been restored back online just yet... I know it will, but for some, it can take a lot (a really big) lot of time.

 

I seem to remember Sofa telling me she started watching TV again around 3.5 years out, which gives me hope! Sofa, if you read this thread (or even if you don't, lol), I am sending you big healing hugs! I hope you are doing great 

 

Best wishes to everyone, hang in there!!

Julz

 

Sofa is doing great Julz, that’s why she’s not around so much these days

 

[[...]]

So where between three and four.

[[...]]

Thank you so much, Brave Rabbit, Pinky and Give me hope  thank you so so very much  :smitten:

[Guest [4y...]]

I'm at phase two hopefully will be crossing over to phase three soon

[[Gi...]]

I'm at phase two hopefully will be crossing over to phase three soon

 

Hi 4,

 

Can I just nudge you on the phrase ‘crossing over’? Lots of people stress about going forwards on the stages only to then slip backwards again. Using your language you would ‘cross over’ to stage 3 but then ‘slip back’ to stage 2. In my experience, it’s best to imagine a train moving slowly into the station: it arrives one carriage at a time. So you may start to exhibit some stage 3 characteristics but still have many stage 2 symptoms. In time the 2s lessen and the 3s increase. Also, don’t forget that waves can nudge the train backwards a bit. Hope that makes sense to you.

 

Best,

 

G

 

 

[Guest [4y...]]

@give me hope yes you can nudge me I'm open to some knowledge. Definitely can't wait to for the 2s to lessen like you said and have more 3s increase. That makes alot of sense to me especially the way you explain how the train moves slowly into the station. Thanks so much for breaking that down to me.

[[Gi...]]

@give me hope yes you can nudge me I'm open to some knowledge. Definitely can't wait to for the 2s to lessen like you said and have more 3s increase. That makes alot of sense to me especially the way you explain how the train moves slowly into the station. Thanks so much for breaking that down to me.

Hi 4,

 

You are such a short-term user I am sure that you will be symptom-free soon! Keep accepting and distracting. Try benzofree.org and D.E Foster book and podcasts. Some great info there.

 

Best,

 

G

[Guest [4y...]]

Okay cool, thanks for the positivity and providing me with that information.

[[pi...]]

I'm at phase two hopefully will be crossing over to phase three soon

 

phase 3 is really great comparitvely. You start to have some breathing room to take it in. Look forward to seeing you cross the threshold. Hold tight, nearly there!

[Guest [4y...]]

@pinkyandbrain Same to you. I'm trying to hold on. Thanks so much

[[La...]]

I spent 2.5 years in phase 1.

Couple of months in phase 2.

 

just recently crossed into 3!!!

Maybe I will be in phase 4 soon. Maybe I spent enough time in phase 1 to heal quickly now.....?

 

Only specific things trigger the symptoms now....finally....

Meganz I'm so happy for you! Great job hanging in there.

I'm still in phase 2. Boatiness has lessened but replaced with pulling of a magnet especially when standing. Very rough!

[[Me...]]

I spent 2.5 years in phase 1.

Couple of months in phase 2.

 

just recently crossed into 3!!!

Maybe I will be in phase 4 soon. Maybe I spent enough time in phase 1 to heal quickly now.....?

 

Only specific things trigger the symptoms now....finally....

Meganz I'm so happy for you! Great job hanging in there.

I'm still in phase 2. Boatiness has lessened but replaced with pulling of a magnet especially when standing. Very rough!

 

Thanks Lady. I may have spoken too soon. I’m in a wave today for no reason. After some nice windows. So I’d say I’m still in phase 2 because nothing triggered this. I’m so frustrated but I’ve been reading past buddie posts where they felt hopeless and seeing a ton of them have since healed.

[[Ju...]]

I wouldn't spend too much time trying to figure out which phase you're in, I don't seem to fit any of the four. At first I thought I was in two and then three and then two again, only to realize they're not legit. I guess for some people they go hand-in-hand with symptoms and reasoning for the symptoms, but not for me.

 

Maybe there should be half phases or five or six phases instead of four. All I know is I'm not two or three and definitely not four.