Discussion: Four Phases of Withdrawal-Where Are You?

[[so...]]

Macca,

 

I'm happy to see how much you've healed.  Your setback is temporary and you'll get back on track soon.  At your phase, these setbacks don't take long to resolve.  Walk gently into recovery, Buddie.  Gently.

 

Love, Sofa

[[Fl...]]

I pray for these people every day and I hope they figure out what may be keeping them in this for such a long time.

 

Why would you think that there has to be something keeping protracted folks in this? Some people have no symptoms at all when they quit. Some people heal in a few weeks, some a few months, some a few years and some it takes a little longer.

 

It is what it is. I have been around it for a long time and aside from some possible loose correlations with the type of benzo we were on and withdrawal duration there doesn't seem to be any common denominator.

[[il...]]

I pray for these people every day and I hope they figure out what may be keeping them in this for such a long time.

 

Why would you think that there has to be something keeping protracted folks in this? Some people have no symptoms at all when they quit. Some people heal in a few weeks, some a few months, some a few years and some it takes a little longer.

 

It is what it is. I have been around it for a long time and aside from some possible loose correlations with the type of benzo we were on and withdrawal duration there doesn't seem to be any common denominator.

 

FloridaGuy -

 

I too am very sorry you've had to suffer for so long. It really is a shame. I will pray for you.

 

Are you sure to stay away from caffeine and alcohol like they say? Any other irratators?

 

Prayers, my friend

[[so...]]

FD,

 

Many people see correlations to these phases in their journeys.  You do not.  Okay.  We hear you.

 

Let's acknowledge that these four phases, for most people (me) are true and real.  If people can see their progression, they can see the light at the end of the tunnel.  Hope and reassurance is sometimes all we need to keep moving forward.  My journey mirrors these phases.  I can see that my suffering is coming to an end very soon.  So can many others.  This recovery process, for most of us, is a systematic progression, not utter chaos.  I take comfort in that.  So do many others.  Let's just leave it at that. 

 

Sofa

[[so...]]

Buddies,

 

I've received several PMs from people who have posted links to this thread, or copied and pasted the original post other places and are concerned if it's okay.

 

ABSOLUTELY.  This information, and the collected years of observation that went into compiling it, belongs to all of us.  To be honest, I reread the post daily.  It gives me hope, spurs me on to keep going, reassures me I'm healing every single day.  I hope it does the same for all of you.

 

Sofa

[[Fl...]]

Sofakingdone- you didn't answer my question.

 

Are you sure to stay away from caffeine and alcohol like they say? Any other irratators?

 

Prayers, my friend

 

See, that's just it. I don't believe for one second that caffeine is going to prevent anyone from healing. Alcohol acts in a similar manner to benzos so it is a lot more likely to cause issues but even that I have my doubts about.

 

Who is "they"? There are no experts here and there is a TON of speculation and no real consensus that I have seen. If you are looking for a scapegoat for waves its pretty easy to find one. Caffeine? Alcohol? Gluten? Sugar? Candida? Glutamates? Histamines? Vitamins and supplements? There is all kinds of stuff that is reported to cause waves but I know quite a few protracted folks who avoid pretty much anything that might be considered "bad" and they are in the same position as everyone else.

 

 

[[pi...]]

Sofakingdone- you didn't answer my question.

 

Are you sure to stay away from caffeine and alcohol like they say? Any other irratators?

 

Prayers, my friend

 

See, that's just it. I don't believe for one second that caffeine is going to prevent anyone from healing. Alcohol acts in a similar manner to benzos so it is a lot more likely to cause issues but even that I have my doubts about.

 

Who is "they"? There are no experts here and there is a TON of speculation and no real consensus that I have seen. If you are looking for a scapegoat for waves its pretty easy to find one. Caffeine? Alcohol? Gluten? Sugar? Candida? Glutamates? Histamines? Vitamins and supplements? There is all kinds of stuff that is reported to cause waves but I know quite a few protracted folks who avoid pretty much anything that might be considered "bad" and they are in the same position as everyone else.

 

 

 

Agree with that, i know a guy in france who is a vegetable man, he only eat fruits and vegetables, no meat no sugar no gluten no dairy no cofee no alcohol no chemical product etc etc he only took benzo to treate a muscle pain and still suffer benzo wd years later after a slow taper and even with his good life eating habits

[[Cl...]]

Hey maca;) have you recovered after your setback? I really hope so . How have you been otherwise ?? How long did it take you to get to phase 3? I also c/t ativan...20days of use...but used quite a bit.i am 2months and 9days out...any advice or encouragement would be so appreciated !!!

[[Ma...]]

hi, Clare. im pretty much to back where i was , after the football my ears went deaf, the tinnitus roared. but the main symptom that became a issue has been depression. its come in waves, with terrible mood swings its come and gone for the last 6 to 8 weeks.as we speak its gone but who knows. other than that ive been feeling good really since about 4 months after finishing the taper. the first 4 months after jumping were terrible. thought i was defo like that forever. then i got a window which didnt really shut. i was always a window /wave person. it was really strange it went from 4 months of the pits and just stopped. what im dealing with now is a childs play compared to early doors. so id say 4 months from stopping. i was really lucky. get through the acute stage, which youd be in now. routine helped me get through. groundhog day, grind the days out, getting to the end of each day is so important cos its one stepping stone to feeling better. you wont believe me. but you ll be fine. just stay the course and dont take a benzo again, EVER. in a few months you ll be saying the same to some other person whose behind you. keep the faith , owen 

[[dr...]]

Sofakingdone- you didn't answer my question.

 

Are you sure to stay away from caffeine and alcohol like they say? Any other irratators?

 

Prayers, my friend

 

See, that's just it. I don't believe for one second that caffeine is going to prevent anyone from healing. Alcohol acts in a similar manner to benzos so it is a lot more likely to cause issues but even that I have my doubts about.

 

Who is "they"? There are no experts here and there is a TON of speculation and no real consensus that I have seen. If you are looking for a scapegoat for waves its pretty easy to find one. Caffeine? Alcohol? Gluten? Sugar? Candida? Glutamates? Histamines? Vitamins and supplements? There is all kinds of stuff that is reported to cause waves but I know quite a few protracted folks who avoid pretty much anything that might be considered "bad" and they are in the same position as everyone else.

 

I wouldn't say these items always cause waves.  I believe they will come and go but they definitely can effect the intensity of the wave    Right now I am in a wave.  If I drink coffee it will be way more intense.  for me that's a fact I've learned through trial and error.

[[il...]]

They've brought on waves for me.

 

These instigators are something that cause waves for many. Unfortunately, for *some*, they just worsen the wave.

 

It's like "what came first? The chicken or the egg?" Although most can agree these items bring on waves, there's really no point in trying to figure it out. My point is, stay away from all and then you'll have fewer issues.

 

😃

[[Fl...]]

I wouldn't say these items always cause waves.  I believe they will come and go but they definitely can effect the intensity of the wave    Right now I am in a wave.  If I drink coffee it will be way more intense.  for me that's a fact I've learned through trial and error.

 

I don't doubt that is possible. But there is a difference between flaring symptoms and preventing healing and the original implication was that protracted folks are doing something to themselves prevent healing.

[[Ho...]]

I really need someone's input. Help!!!! 0.125mg of Klonopin is making me drowsy. I'm thinking about cutting in half...is that a bad idea??

[[dr...]]

I wouldn't say these items always cause waves.  I believe they will come and go but they definitely can effect the intensity of the wave    Right now I am in a wave.  If I drink coffee it will be way more intense.  for me that's a fact I've learned through trial and error.

 

I don't doubt that is possible. But there is a difference between flaring symptoms and preventing healing and the original implication was that protracted folks are doing something to themselves prevent healing.

 

Got it!  I agree we can't prevent healing unless we take more benzos or the like.

[[il...]]

ATTENION: THOSE WHO ARE NEW TO BENZO BUDDIES AND ARE IN EARLY RECOVERY

 

it has been agreed upon by the majority that alcohol can and will interrupt healing, worsen benzodiazepine withdrawal syndrome and amplify symptoms. Please, disregard anything that may be confusing and just stay away from alcohol! It works on GABA receptors almost in identical ways. I made the mistake once, and boy, did I pay for it. I also don't think my post acute w/d would've been as bad if I hadn't. So, regardless of their reasoning, just do yourself a favor and STAY AWAY FROM ALCOHOL.

[[Cl...]]

I really need someone's input. Help!!!! 0.125mg of Klonopin is making me drowsy. I'm thinking about cutting in half...is that a bad idea??

 

Hi Hope, I do not think it is a good idea to reduce by 50% right now, better to do a smaller cut. I would do a consistent taper from now on in your case, what about 0.02 mgs K every 10 days?

All the best.

[[so...]]

Buddies,

 

With the exception of alcohol, I believe certain sensitivities cause more intense flare ups, not prevent healing.  I hope this clarifies my position, for whatever it is worth. 

 

FD, after reading some of your posts throughout the forum, you drank alcohol during your recovery process, which downregulates GABA B receptors and we need to UPregulate GABA A and B receptors. You stopped drinking.  I would expect your healing will accelerate now and become more linear.  It's my hope for you and everyone else in recovery that we all get to the point of more linear healing.

 

I have heard that Baylissa Fredericks has spoken to Heather Ashton many times about alcohol and Dr. Ashton has admitted that her manual needs to be updated to state that alcohol should be avoided completely during the recovery process.  Drew has spoken to Baylissa, as well, and can attest to her opinion on this subject.

 

We can all take away many positives from ongoing discussions that take place on these threads.  Perhaps opening up a thread on the effects of alcohol during withdrawal would be a more appropriate and useful tool than getting off the subject of this thread.

 

Sofa

[[so...]]

Hope,

 

Before you cut your dosage in half, I would seriously post your question on the tapering Klonipin thread and get some advice.

 

Sofa

[[so...]]

Drew,

 

As always seems the case, I am in agreement with you.  Thank you for the way you simply and directly express things.

 

Sofa

[Guest [mu...]]

This is a great general guideline and I thank you for making it. Like FloridaGuy, I don't think that everyone will find themselves firmly in one phase or another, but it's still useful to have a general map in which to view one's progress (even if that map happens to be mislabeled here and there, with streets and coordinates that are constantly shifting). Unfortunately for many people, recovery is often <i>very</i> non-linear, and there is a lot of back and forth and overlap between these stages (at least as they've been presented here). Also, one may progress in one realm (physically, emotionally, or cognitively), but plateau or even go backwards for a time in another realm. This is tricky business, and a very individual process. Some might have four phases of withdrawal, but some might only have one or two phases, while others might have a dozen or more.

 

But again, any map is better than no map (especially when you're lost in the thick fog of benzo withdrawal), and I think that this list will provide much more help and comfort than harm and confusion.

 

And for what it's worth, phase 2 seems to fit me best right now.

 

 

 

http://themighty.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/12027517_10205835686906412_6886242177370630353_n.jpg

 

 

[[sh...]]

Hi

 

I would say with my setback ive past the phase one stage..im in between two and three and can relate to both of them on different days.

 

a very good description BTW and the above diagram is also good....

 

which is why its so frustrating-one never knows if one is healing..im not sure how I know when or if  am

[[so...]]

Mutuuraia,

 

Excellent points and terrific graphic.  Your calm acceptance of whatever this is is comforting.  Thank you.

 

Sofa

[[Fl...]]

FD, after reading some of your posts throughout the forum, you drank alcohol during your recovery process, which downregulates GABA B receptors and we need to UPregulate GABA A and B receptors. You stopped drinking.  I would expect your healing will accelerate now and become more linear.  It's my hope for you and everyone else in recovery that we all get to the point of more linear healing.

 

I quit alcohol for 3 years and it did not speed up my healing. It was more of the same long, slow improvements. No change for the better or worse. Matter of fact, I saw the vast majority of my progress while I was still drinking.

 

I didn't bring up the alcohol thing. It was brought up as a possible reason why protracted folks are protracted, and I was challenging the idea that there has to be a "cause" for protracted wd.

 

[[il...]]

I have one foot in Phase 3 and another stuck in 2 still ... But how amazing? These descriptions are fitting me to a T. This is progress!!!! I'm so glad Colin approved this thread to be a sticky for post withdrawal support! 👍🏼💪🏼🙏🏼

[[so...]]

Illneverdothisagain,

 

I am so glad you see your progression through these phases.  You seem to be moving quickly to healing.  I'm more of a turtle.  Oh well, turtle or hare, we both get there in the end.  If the stadium is dark when I enter the end of this marathon, could you leave the bathroom light on for me?  I'll need to use the facilities when this is over!

 

Sofa