Cross-Over to Valium Support Thread

[[Ma...]]

Back to report that the past few days have been SO much better!  I was beginning to doubt C/O but this is really working.  Those K WDs are BRUTAL at times, even underneath Valium. 

 

Found my sweet spot to be 5 days between stages but this last stage, I'm gonna wait longer.

 

I'm getting a break and feeling so much better, right now.  WAY better than I ever did after reinstating and even updosing Klonopin!!  Didn't even know this was possible during Benzo WD after a horrific CT experience. I'd much rather feel stable and "functional" and walk off than rush through and suffer the whole time.  Seems Valium is going to be the path for this to be possible. Slow and steady.

 

Patience, Hope and Healing...  What is patience again??  Oh, that's right...  It's what I'm finally learning to accept!

 

I am so glad you are feeling better Uni, we were all worried and missing you.  You sound good ❤️ ❤️

:smitten:  Mary

[[Du...]]

Back to report that the past few days have been SO much better!  I was beginning to doubt C/O but this is really working.  Those K WDs are BRUTAL at times, even underneath Valium. 

 

Found my sweet spot to be 5 days between stages but this last stage, I'm gonna wait longer.

 

I'm getting a break and feeling so much better, right now.  WAY better than I ever did after reinstating and even updosing Klonopin!!  Didn't even know this was possible during Benzo WD after a horrific CT experience. I'd much rather feel stable and "functional" and walk off than rush through and suffer the whole time.  Seems Valium is going to be the path for this to be possible. Slow and steady.

 

Patience, Hope and Healing...  What is patience again??  Oh, that's right...  It's what I'm finally learning to accept!

 

Hey uni! Glad your getting some relief from Valium I had no idea you were having a tough time on k. I thought after teva being discontinued you switched over to brand K and were having success. I too am thinking about switching over to Valium. So far your doing better then on k it sounds like, glad to hear uni, hope you continue feeling better with each day

 

Hey Dub!

 

I had high hopes after switching to Brand, and some days were ok.  I tend to minimize my suffering on here, because I'm always looking for the positives and trying to remain hopeful.  I was suffering pretty badly when a lot of acute sxs (hallucinations, inability to take walks or stand in the shower, SI, constant fear state, and more) started coming back and/or got stronger... and even during a 3 week hold they got progressively worse.  Freaked me out way too much!  Also, I just couldn't handle the interdose WD's anymore.  Nor did I see how I would ever be able to get further down on K.  So, decided to do the good ol switch to Valium.  I'm still having K WDs now, under the Valium, but it's much more even keeled and I'm not in constant fear and overstimulated now.  The depression and lethargy from V is hard, so different than any feeling of depression I've ever felt, but most say it lifts.  I've had some really good days during C/O so far and have been able to participate in life more, here and there.  I'm so glad I decided to do this.  I support whatever decision you make!  If you're suffering too much on K and not getting anywhere, just know this is an option.  Jlavogt is in C/O too.  Some of us just can't do it on K. 

 

I hope you're doing okay, better than okay..  I've not been on much so I'm behind on how everyone is doing.  One of my buddies always reminds me, there is more than one way off of benzos and there are always options.  Helps a lot to remember this!  Love to you, Dub

 

Omg Uni sorry you went through so much, you are so strong! You really inspire me and give me hope so I want to thank you! I have been holding for a few months now and seems like I’m slowly just getting worse and the hold isn’t doing much at this point. I’m not sure if it’s interdose wd or tolerance wd. Do you know if switching to V would also help with tolerance wd.

[[Un...]]

Thank you, Dub!  You're strong too!!  For me, crossing to V has obliterated interdose and that tolerance feeling.  But since the first two stages of adding V and dropping K are at night I still experienced some interdose during the day until I got to stage 3.  Nowhere near as bad, though.  At this point, tinnitus has gone completely away, too.  I feel Valium covering through the day.  It's got its bumps but it is so much better than the constant fight/flight/freeze fear state I was in.  Fingers crossed the rest of C/O goes well and there is a chance to truly stabilize.  Hope this helps!

 

Much Love,

 

Uni

[[Un...]]

So glad to read that the crossover is working and that things are looking up despite the  Valium induced depression!!!

Yay to relief!

❤️❤️❤️

 

Hi SS!! 

 

Thank you, my friend!  Things are looking up and I just gotta hope the V depression/lethargy lifts a bit.  Or just learn new ways of coping!  It's so different.  Really hopeful!!  Have missed you and hope you are still doing well on your hold

 

❤️Big Love❤️

[[Un...]]

Back to report that the past few days have been SO much better!  I was beginning to doubt C/O but this is really working.  Those K WDs are BRUTAL at times, even underneath Valium. 

 

Found my sweet spot to be 5 days between stages but this last stage, I'm gonna wait longer.

 

I'm getting a break and feeling so much better, right now.  WAY better than I ever did after reinstating and even updosing Klonopin!!  Didn't even know this was possible during Benzo WD after a horrific CT experience. I'd much rather feel stable and "functional" and walk off than rush through and suffer the whole time.  Seems Valium is going to be the path for this to be possible. Slow and steady.

 

Patience, Hope and Healing...  What is patience again??  Oh, that's right...  It's what I'm finally learning to accept!

 

I am so glad you are feeling better Uni, we were all worried and missing you.  You sound good ❤️ ❤️

:smitten:  Mary

 

Thank you, Mary!!  I'm sorry you were worried    I tried popping in a little and posted on my blog that I was oddly sensitive coming on, starting in the first stage of C/O.  Overwhelmed easily... I think?  It has been weird in that way.  But, I really have missed you!  I tried holding but it was doing me no good.  I need to catch up on everything, I've missed like a month so I'm way behind.  I hope your hold has helped you, my sweet friend.  Still holding your hand 🤚 Not letting go.

 

❤️Love and Hugs❤️

[[no...]]

hi Uni,

 

Glad to hear that switching to Valium might be the way to go for you... I'm still plugging away at the Klonopin.. My drop

this morning is to .495mg for the day so that's a milestone... of course, I have to stabilize on it now. :-) I talked to a doctor about doing the switch to valium... I'm concerned about the lethargy/depression I've heard about. Hope that lifts soon for you.

 

Looks like the Klonopin2 group has been very quiet... I just popped in to check.

 

Wishing you well, and you too DubCity as see you've been here.

 

[[Du...]]

Hello there! Was wondering what everyone in here’s opinion is on switching to Valium from K, have more ppl had success in here? My Dr. prescribed me some Valium and told me I can try and do a cross over to Valium from K. But I feel so crumby already not sure if I can handle feeling any worse, I’d really need it to work.... Tnx everyone, hope to hear some feedback

[[Fr...]]

Hi Dub

I know crossing was the best choice for me but it definitely has not been easy. I was getting no where trying to taper K just going in circles. I do believe it is easiest to direct taper on what you are already taking but if problems arise with a direct taper I think it’s smart to look at other options.Maybe try one Valium pill and just see how it makes you feel to start.

 

There is a reason why Ashton has everyone switch to a longer half life medication. She also states that K is a high potency drug and is hard to taper off which has been my experience. Almost everyone I talked to said they felt better on V. Crossing can be difficult and you definitely feel withdrawal symptoms but then you can feel the valium working to cover it up so it takes the edge off a bit.

 

I believe you are on a small dose correct? Also how many times a day are you dosing? What worked me was dosing three times a day and do half of my K dose with half of Librium for all three doses. I will do this for about two weeks until stable and then cross the rest of the way. When I was crossing to v I did it the way Ashton suggests and I just think it’s better to have a steady stream of the new med coming in all day. It feels much better doing it half and half this way for the whole day with L as opposed to the way i was crossing with Valium and Ashton Manuel. You have symptoms in the crossover and it is not enjoyable but you can feel the new med working which is good. K felt more like a sugar pill to me I was so tolerant. So many that cross say it takes time but after the cross and holding you feel so much better. Tapering is hard no matter which way around it. Sometimes I wondering if I should have just continued to suffer and kept taper K but some of the k symptoms are already gone and I do believe it will be better in the other side. I really am loving the way Librium feels and think K is the nastiest drug.

 

Hopefully some others will chime in that have crossed fully and have moved in to tapering. Also maybe ask in the Valium support board.

[[Du...]]

Hey Jen, thanks so much for responding! I take .25 of K, doses twice. So I take .125 at noon and .125 at midnight. Did you feel better or worse on Valium compared to K, I didn’t think you had a pleasant experience. I was fine on K before the whole dumb teva change, I had to updose 50% because of the change and it made me feel much better for 2 weeks then I started to feel even worse than when I updosed..... which is very strange to me. I did my updose 4 weeks ago so I felt good for 2 weeks then like pure crap for 2 weeks, I wonder if I should give the updose a little more time before I switch over to V. not sure if I’m in a horrible long wave, tolerance wd, or interdose withdrawal...... very hard to tell them apart.

[[Fr...]]

Yes I could not do V. It made me cray-cray. I am fast metabolizer of V and it was just coming in and out to fast. I am crossing to Librium now. Librium is so much better for me. I was never well on K but was manageable until Teva discontinued. I held almost three months and did updosed and just like you the longer it went on the worst I felt. I was in tolerance on K for over a year and a half. I started feeling better only after slowly tapering down to .4mg. Holding and updosing in the past has never helped. Sometimes  the only thing to do is start slowly tapering off. There is no way around it. I thought I would try one last time to cross and updose a little if needed and stabilize then every so slowly come down. This is what Aston suggests so I am keeping faith that i will stabilize and be in my way. If not Inguess Ibsm no worse off then when I started.

[[Du...]]

Jen are you crossing over from Valium to Librium or from klonopin to Librium right now? Sounds like your reacting well to the Librium so far, hope it continues getting better 

[[Fr...]]

Kind of all three. I was doing K to V when I realized V was no good then switched to Librium. So my scheduke looks like this right now:

Am 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Noon 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Pm 5mg L + 1.66 V

 

Crazy I know. One day some I will be on one benzo.

[[Du...]]

Hey there was seeing if anyone that only doses klonopin twice a day has crossed over to Valium. The Ashton manual only shows how to do it if you dose 3 times.... would love some help Tnx!

[[Su...]]

Kind of all three. I was doing K to V when I realized V was no good then switched to Librium. So my scheduke looks like this right now:

Am 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Noon 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Pm 5mg L + 1.66 V

 

Crazy I know. One day some I will be on one benzo.

so Jen,

Interested in how it's going for you with the crossover.  My body sure doesn't like valium and I find it to be very short duration of action.  Keep reading about Librium these days and am wondering.... Could I cross over and have an easier time?

Don't expect you to have answers for me  just wondering how its all going...

SS

[[Du...]]

Anyone?

[[Fr...]]

Kind of all three. I was doing K to V when I realized V was no good then switched to Librium. So my scheduke looks like this right now:

Am 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Noon 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Pm 5mg L + 1.66 V

 

Crazy I know. One day some I will be on one benzo.

so Jen,

Interested in how it's going for you with the crossover.  My body sure doesn't like valium and I find it to be very short duration of action.  Keep reading about Librium these days and am wondering.... Could I cross over and have an easier time?

Don't expect you to have answers for me  just wondering how its all going...

SS

 

Hi SS

It is challenging and I am holding out hope I will stabilize and get on with the taper. I would think that going from Valium to Librium wouldn’t be as difficult. The thing with cross over is the K withdrawal comes on faster than Librium builds up. Also not sure if you experienced this with switching to Valium but every L dose I add in it is very sedating and feels like cement where you can’t move and feels painful at the same time but then it goes away after a day or two and by the third day the K withdrawal kick in. I have read that this is all normal and once the cross is complete and the k withdrawal are done and so hold for a month to stabilize it will be so much better than the position I was in.

 

It may be easier since valium and Librium are so similar. I didn’t have a problem with switching the night time dose from V to L except for the extra sedation which is kind of anxiety inducing but again it doesn’t last but a day or two with each cross and since you are already in V you may not feel it.

[[Fr...]]

Anyone?

Dub if you want to switch just try and cross over your two doses. If it gets difficult you can always add in a third dose. With valiums duraction if action shorter than K  to me it just made sense to dose three times a day but everyone is different.

[[Du...]]

Anyone?

Dub if you want to switch just try and cross over your two doses. If it gets difficult you can always add in a third dose. With valiums duraction if action shorter than K  to me it just made sense to dose three times a day but everyone is different.

 

I don’t always go to bed or wake up at the same time, my sleep pattern is very random and unpredictable, so it would be very hard to dose 3 times at the same time everyday if I spread my dose apart every 8 hours. Can I ask you how you dose 3 times? Do you spread it out every 8 hours what times do you take it? Thanks Jen, you are always helpful 

[[Fr...]]

7:30

2:30p

9:30p

 

I take it when I wake up which isn’t always the same time.  Then in the afternoon between 2-3 depending on when I have eaten and nighttime is between 9-10. I don’t dose exactly every 8 hours. Sleep is more important. Just take the time Your normally awake and split in three.

 

Two doses may very well work for you. It just didn’t for me. I felt way better dosing more often.

[[Su...]]

Kind of all three. I was doing K to V when I realized V was no good then switched to Librium. So my scheduke looks like this right now:

Am 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Noon 5mg L + .083mg K

 

Pm 5mg L + 1.66 V

 

Crazy I know. One day some I will be on one benzo.

so Jen,

Interested in how it's going for you with the crossover.  My body sure doesn't like valium and I find it to be very short duration of action.  Keep reading about Librium these days and am wondering.... Could I cross over and have an easier time?

Don't expect you to have answers for me  just wondering how its all going...

SS

 

Hi SS

It is challenging and I am holding out hope I will stabilize and get on with the taper. I would think that going from Valium to Librium wouldn’t be as difficult. The thing with cross over is the K withdrawal comes on faster than Librium builds up. Also not sure if you experienced this with switching to Valium but every L dose I add in it is very sedating and feels like cement where you can’t move and feels painful at the same time but then it goes away after a day or two and by the third day the K withdrawal kick in. I have read that this is all normal and once the cross is complete and the k withdrawal are done and so hold for a month to stabilize it will be so much better than the position I was in.

 

It may be easier since valium and Librium are so similar. I didn’t have a problem with switching the night time dose from V to L except for the extra sedation which is kind of anxiety inducing but again it doesn’t last but a day or two with each cross and since you are already in V you may not feel it.

Yes everything is challenging in this benzo dance.  Interesting that Librium is so sedating.

I hope that things ease in the next while and you get the stability that the Librium promises soon.

thanks for the detailed answer....

 

I'm not sure I'm ready to make any changes at this time, but am tucking everything away to see if it can be of any help.

,Many thanks Jen!

SS

[[Un...]]

Hi Everyone,

 

I'm on Day 9 in Stage 5 of C/O.  Things are kind of staying the same at this point.  I'm glad I decided to cross.  There are pros and cons, of course.  But this seems to have mellowed out the constant fight or flight.  Still not as stable as can be (yet) and may take some more time...  And finishing the darn C/O.  Which will happen after next doc appt.  He didn't write the rx correctly and so I was shorted by 30 V pills.  Enough to stay at this stage but not enough to move forward.  Frustrating. 

 

My concern is the flattening effect Valium has on me.  Others who have forged ahead with this process say the 'depression' lifts.  It's not even like a regular depression.  It's a chemical depression.  Apathy.  Lethargy.  Already had a pretty hefty amount of anhedonia, but it's worse now.  So, we'll see if it lessens.  A lot of the overwhelming fear stuff has pretty much abated.  The fear, terror and fight or flight is what I cannot handle.  Only get surges upon waking occasionally (usually after a cross stage).  I'm still experiencing K wds, so will update when fully crossed and further along. 

 

Anyone who has done this before us want to chime in?  I know some of us need words of encouragement. 

 

Love to ALL of you,

 

Uni

 

 

[[Du...]]

Has anyone in here crossed over to Valium that was only dosing klonopin twice a day? Tnx

[[Du...]]

Was also wondering how difficult the crossover to V was. Will I still be able to go to work is what I’m worried about, I can’t lose my job.... thanks guys anything would be helpful

[[Bu...]]

Hello All,

I'm a newbie to this crossover and very afraid.  My doc wanted me off of clonazapan.  He doesn't like it after being given  it by a regular doctor when my brother died years ago.  I have to say that carrying my brothers ashes an sticking him in my trunk driving for 60 miles to bury him next to my mother. The clonazapam kept me from passing out.  All the while the clonazapam was working against me and I didn't even realize it.  I gained really bad agoraphobia.  I would take it in the morning to be able to walk myself to work.  About noon, it would wear off and I felt like I was being strangled and shakey.  So there went another .5 mg.  Alot makes sense now. I was going through tolerance withdrawal.  Although, I don't feel like I am ready and would rather wait until I gain some vacation time at my job, I don't think I have a choice.  I do know that this has to happen at some point. I did read about the Ashton method and demanded that.  What came back from my doctor was straight..go to diazapam.  Well I was just given a bottle of clonazapam prior to his decision, so I am still doing the Ashton way. 

I'm finding that diazapam is giving me bad headaches.  I woke up one morning @ 3am with one so bad I could of thrown up.  I do already have withdrawals. Shakey, like I can't move right.  I'm trying so hard. 

Sometimes I just go the weekend without much so I can build tolerence and lower my dose so when I go to work on Monday a lower dose of clonazapam will work better. 

Does anyone else get real bad headaches from diazapam?

 

I sure could use some support. 

 

Will be much appreciated 

[[Va...]]

I switched from Ativan to Valium many years ago. The only times I've gotten bad headaches from Valium is when I cut too much, so do you think you may have done it too quickly?

 

Whatever the cause, try to do some deep breathing, drink (sips) of water throughout the day. And if you can get a 'Headache Bandage' try that. I've used that method before, wrapping it tight around my head, eyes, and laid down... It worked.