Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[Ju...]]

Solaceandpeace, as a totally trivial side note I think your signature with the thumbs up smiley faces as you make progress is so creative and also encouraging. Cool idea!

 

And for the record, what you were saying about "if a doc isnt willing to prescribe valium then you're screwed" and you'd go find another doc who is taper-friendly, that's exactly what happened to me! One said "no i wont give you valium to get off ativan because valium is addictive" (hilarious but frustrating irony right?) and second doctor agreed to give me valium as long as it was an industrial sized bottle so he only had to see me every three months and he refused to specify a taper plan and just wrote "take as needed" so thats when I found the benzo clinic luckily, and they had a much more balanced view even though they only do dry cuts and I'm secretly doing micro tapering.

 

On that note, well done Tex for your awesome breakthrough with feeling better! And well done Mountain Yogi and all the others on low doses for getting closer to your freedom!

 

And... sorry this is kind if jumbled, my brain is like a marshmallow...one other person, now I can't remember who said it, oh it may have been panicnomore, said that they threw out their leftover pills so that they wouldn't be tempted to take them when things were really really yuck... I may have to do that too because even though I've somehow stayed away from updosing so far I know I've been really tempted during the really dark horrible times and that I'm at risk of reaching for those pills just because they are there. That scares me. Everything scares me right now, even TV or having visitors or switching off my light at night.

 

Do any other women benzo buddies find that side effects get worse at a certain time of the month or is that just me?

 

 

Aww, thank you! I didn't even think anyone was paying attention or noticing that in my signature!

 

I'm still doing well, just a little tension in my shoulders, a touch of temple pain maybe a couple of times per day... and I think that's it. The valium really has covered almost all WD symptoms so far, so I guess my doc wasn't totally crazy. Uninformed and impatient though, absolutely.

 

Time for another cut today and I'm down to just the 1/4 of a pill once a day at this point. Scary stuff! I hope all hell doesn't break loose. Especially because I lost a major client and am starting with a new one next week, in a completely different area of work that I've never done before. Well, I'm up for the challenge. As long as vertigo isn't one of my WD symptoms, I feel like I can be strong and get through it.

 

Next cut is the final jump, and then I have to consider a valium taper plan. And possibly a new doc. Yikes.

 

Solace, I can relate. It's tricky to taper while changes are happening at work. I've been back at work for two weeks after being off work for more than four months and have all my fingers and toes crossed that side effects don't hit at work, especially hard core ones. Yesterday my boss got held up returning back and I ended up doing a ten hour shift and I think the tiredness and nerves started to get to me, I got dizzy and anxious and felt my chest tighten but tried my best to do the "Claire" stuff and float through it and just focus on my breath. I know you can breathe your way through your week too, and that you're going to go really well with your taper. Because you already have so much more awareness than me and many others had when starting our tapers. You're really strong and will hopefully find it much easier than you thought.

[[Ju...]]

I also find this is all very psychological.  When I can keep my spirits up and ignore the beast that these chemicals conjure up in my psyche, I can push through the anxiety.  It feels a bit like walking through 4 feet of water all the time.  As for the time between cuts, I stuck to the Ashton recommended minimum of 7 days, however, that is difficult to maintain if you are working.  I would try to get to one dose a day at bedtime.

--trying to be positive yet realistic about what lies ahead.

I feel as if this process has evolved my soul in a purposeful way.  For what reason and how it plays it is unclear.  I know I am a stronger woman.  This chemical has created an adversity within my being that can allow me to go to the darkest depths.  My evolution and growth lies in the choices and ways that I navigate those dark and murky waters.  I shall prevail and I hope you and all of our buddies will too.

I hope this helps.

 

Thanks Mountain Yogi, this was very encouraging to read  I'm scared of those "darkest depths" but am trying to see the big picture like you

[[Ju...]]

landsakes yes!!! hormones can wreak havoc for many while on and tapering benzo's.  However, for those on HRT they can also help stabilize and enable some to feel better.  I feel your pain, bless you 

 

Oh good, not just me then

[[so...]]

I feel as if this process has evolved my soul in a purposeful way.  For what reason and how it plays it is unclear.  I know I am a stronger woman.  This chemical has created an adversity within my being that can allow me to go to the darkest depths.  My evolution and growth lies in the choices and ways that I navigate those dark and murky waters.  I shall prevail and I hope you and all of our buddies will too.

 

That is astoundingly beautiful and inspiring! I feel the same way. I know I'm going to hit some rough patches on the way down, but I have already been there with the straight Ativan taper, and I feel like all of this has made me so much stronger to both understand and deal with anxiety in general. Wow, though, your words... I hope you don't mind if I keep those in my notes for a rainy day!

 

Solace, I can relate. It's tricky to taper while changes are happening at work. I've been back at work for two weeks after being off work for more than four months and have all my fingers and toes crossed that side effects don't hit at work, especially hard core ones. Yesterday my boss got held up returning back and I ended up doing a ten hour shift and I think the tiredness and nerves started to get to me, I got dizzy and anxious and felt my chest tighten but tried my best to do the "Claire" stuff and float through it and just focus on my breath. I know you can breathe your way through your week too, and that you're going to go really well with your taper. Because you already have so much more awareness than me and many others had when starting our tapers. You're really strong and will hopefully find it much easier than you thought.

 

"Breathe your way through your week..." I will keep those words in mind too! I just completed two tests for my potential new job, and I'm excited but nervous! Tonight will be the first day that I'm only taking a quarter of an Ativan in the morning (still on 10 mg of Valium spread out into four doses over the day). I thought only taking a quarter of a pill twice a day was crazy! Now once? And then none? I'm hoping it's harder psychologically than physically, because indeed I have been through a lot of tough things in my life (I know we all have!) and I feel more equipped to handle that than the physical symptoms. But I have no choice but to get through this.

 

Thank you SO much for your kind words. I don't feel as strong as how you perceive me to be, but reading those words makes me feel like maybe I can be. I'm also in the midst of trying to help two other family members with their anxiety, and seeing them in the throes of it definitely makes me realize how much we punish ourselves unnecessarily. "Second fear," as Claire Weekes would say.

 

We just have to remember that there is a bright, beautiful light at the end of this tunnel. Even if the journey takes a long while, we will eventually get there.

[[Ju...]]

Yeah Solace I hear you, I wish it didn't take so long either. Wish we could all be free right now. I think, regarding strength, that people who are the strongest are often the ones who don't feel strong. It's something other people see in them. Our courage is invisible to us most of the time, even when we really need it so much. I used to think courage meant feeling calm and strong, but I'm realising it maybe sometimes means feeling scared out of your mind and just pacing your way through it slowly.

 

I am soooooo glad I found this site because I was so scared of tapering when I was doing large dry cuts with my doctor, and I totally respect all of you who still find dry cuts work okay for you, I think whatever works for each individual is what's right for them as long as we get there eventually.

 

But for me, (and hopefully this doesn't sound too much like an Oscar Awards speech) I'm so VERY grateful to people like DiazPam, Mountain Yogi, Builder, Tex, BeGood and all the others who guided me through learning how to micro taper with daily liquid titrations. You have saved my sanity, I am now less than a week away from being down to 5.5mg valium daily!

 

Wouldn't have made that much progress with dry cuts because of my personal struggle with such large sudden reductions, and I wouldn't have been able to return to work this month either. I have had three "holds", one over Christmas for a week, and two 1-day holds when I had rough days and needed to stay on the previous days dose for psychological reasons.

 

I'm just listening to my body and seeing how it goes each day. Will no doubt need to slow down the lower my dose gets, but my "basic plan" is 10% reductions (currently approx 1mg over 4 weeks, and eventually that will be over many more weeks to stay within 10%, and will depend on how my side effects are going)

 

Anyway, thank you BB's!! I know I still have soooo far to go but I feel slightly, slightly more in control of this chaos than I used to and it all counts.

[Guest [mo...]]

Yeah Solace I hear you, I wish it didn't take so long either. Wish we could all be free right now. I think, regarding strength, that people who are the strongest are often the ones who don't feel strong. It's something other people see in them. Our courage is invisible to us most of the time, even when we really need it so much. I used to think courage meant feeling calm and strong, but I'm realising it maybe sometimes means feeling scared out of your mind and just pacing your way through it slowly.

 

I am soooooo glad I found this site because I was so scared of tapering when I was doing large dry cuts with my doctor, and I totally respect all of you who still find dry cuts work okay for you, I think whatever works for each individual is what's right for them as long as we get there eventually.

 

 

 

But for me, (and hopefully this doesn't sound too much like an Oscar Awards speech) I'm so VERY grateful to people like DiazPam, Mountain Yogi, Builder, Tex, BeGood and all the others who guided me through learning how to micro taper with daily liquid titrations. You have saved my sanity, I am now less than a week away from being down to 5.5mg valium daily!

 

Wouldn't have made that much progress with dry cuts because of my personal struggle with such large sudden reductions, and I wouldn't have been able to return to work this month either. I have had three "holds", one over Christmas for a week, and two 1-day holds when I had rough days and needed to stay on the previous days dose for psychological reasons.

 

I'm just listening to my body and seeing how it goes each day. Will no doubt need to slow down the lower my dose gets, but my "basic plan" is 10% reductions (currently approx 1mg over 4 weeks, and eventually that will be over many more weeks to stay within 10%, and will depend on how my side effects are going)

 

Anyway, thank you BB's!! I know I still have soooo far to go but I feel slightly, slightly more in control of this chaos than I used to and it all counts.

 

JustDo, excellent work on getting to 5.5 buddy :thumbsup:

I went back and read your intro page and you have come a long way!  My intro page is a lot like yours was: frightened and uncertain.

 

As you get lower, you will find your pace.  You seem to have evened out a bit with your symptoms.  If you need help with dilutions, I can send you my xcel spreadsheets.  I am approaching 1 mg and feeling fear and excitement if that makes any sense? 

You are on your way

[[Ju...]]

Yeah Solace I hear you, I wish it didn't take so long either. Wish we could all be free right now. I think, regarding strength, that people who are the strongest are often the ones who don't feel strong. It's something other people see in them. Our courage is invisible to us most of the time, even when we really need it so much. I used to think courage meant feeling calm and strong, but I'm realising it maybe sometimes means feeling scared out of your mind and just pacing your way through it slowly.

 

I am soooooo glad I found this site because I was so scared of tapering when I was doing large dry cuts with my doctor, and I totally respect all of you who still find dry cuts work okay for you, I think whatever works for each individual is what's right for them as long as we get there eventually.

 

 

 

But for me, (and hopefully this doesn't sound too much like an Oscar Awards speech) I'm so VERY grateful to people like DiazPam, Mountain Yogi, Builder, Tex, BeGood and all the others who guided me through learning how to micro taper with daily liquid titrations. You have saved my sanity, I am now less than a week away from being down to 5.5mg valium daily!

 

Wouldn't have made that much progress with dry cuts because of my personal struggle with such large sudden reductions, and I wouldn't have been able to return to work this month either. I have had three "holds", one over Christmas for a week, and two 1-day holds when I had rough days and needed to stay on the previous days dose for psychological reasons.

 

I'm just listening to my body and seeing how it goes each day. Will no doubt need to slow down the lower my dose gets, but my "basic plan" is 10% reductions (currently approx 1mg over 4 weeks, and eventually that will be over many more weeks to stay within 10%, and will depend on how my side effects are going)

 

Anyway, thank you BB's!! I know I still have soooo far to go but I feel slightly, slightly more in control of this chaos than I used to and it all counts.

 

JustDo, excellent work on getting to 5.5 buddy :thumbsup:

I went back and read your intro page and you have come a long way!  My intro page is a lot like yours was: frightened and uncertain.

 

As you get lower, you will find your pace.  You seem to have evened out a bit with your symptoms.  If you need help with dilutions, I can send you my xcel spreadsheets.  I am approaching 1 mg and feeling fear and excitement if that makes any sense? 

You are on your way

 

Thanks Mountain Yogi, you've been my big sister on this website since day one and your encouragement means a lot

 

If I want to upload a link to my Word document showing my basic plan (we all know plans with tapering change but hey... a plan gives a rough idea) then how would I upload it on here so other people can open it and give feedback or suggestions? Should I just cut and paste it somewhere...?

 

Lots of people seem to have web links in their signature section. I usually have a tech savvy eight year old who helps me figure out computer stuff haha! He sighs dramatically and rolls his eyes but secretly feels very clever helping someone so clueless 

 

But getting a child's help uploading a drug taper plan doesn't seem very appropriate 

[[Ju...]]

Dear "M",

 

Thank you for the message you sent, you were curious to know about how micro tapering (MT) has helped with my side effects. You will already know some of this, but in case other people are in the same boat, I'll answer in more detail.

 

Firstly, Micro tapering isn't for everyone, and that's okay.

 

Also, I'm fairly new to this whole thing so other benzo buddies may have more experience to guide you.

 

But, before MT: I did dry cuts every 4-6 weeks, sometimes longer because I was scared of how much it affected me each time, and each drop I was often only reducing half a mg (1/4 of a 2mg tablet of Valium). I'm one of the sensitive ones, and a reduction like that would wipe me out for at least a week with major panic attacks, depression, anxiety, sleep loss, nausea and diarrhoea

 

I would get a day or so of feeling normal-ish, and then start getting a headache, which would get worse and worse, and I'd have cold wet face cloths on my forehead and need to have the lights off because they were too bright. Nurofen and aspirin barely made a difference.

 

Then I would start feeling dizzy and nauseous, and wouldn't sleep well at all... I actually developed a phobia of bed time because the nausea would lead to throwing up and then I would start having a panic attack, a racing heart and tight chest, feeling what some people call depersonalisation, thinking thoughts of doom and not wanting to live, and feeling that everything was terrifying or overstimulating. Even when the main side effects started to level out I would be on edge, thinking they were going to come back. I would dread each taper and get anxious when I got closer to the next one.

 

During MT: Now I feel like I've gone from being a really nervous surfer who is trying to learn in a storm and has lost their board, to being a beginner paddle-boarder who is learning on slightly calmer waters (I won't pretend they're totally calm, that's not realistic), and I feel like I have a little bit more control, and much more manageable waves... some of them knock me off my board, but not for weeks at a time. Sometimes a day, sometimes less than an hour. Depends what else is going on around me. I still get general feelings of anxiety but I manage it with relaxation and distraction techniques.

 

Hopefully this isn't too gross: but I have only thrown up on average once a month during micro tapering, usually after an anxious social situation - but previously it was up to several times daily after a dry cut. That made it really hard to go to work and I didn't work for more than four months. I went back to work this month finally!

 

I have still had some trouble sleeping and usually wake up between 3-6am but now 90% of the time I don't start throwing up or having a panic attack each time, and I take supplements like valerian root, magnesium, ziziphus, ginger, vit B which also help with sleep and nausea

 

I hit a bit of depression when it's "that" time of the month as a female and also get really anxious in some social situations but I believe that is more to do with external factors rather than any change in tapering. If I have a really rough day I can hold the taper as long as I need to.

 

The reductions are so much smaller, and are daily, so I find it much less scary. Way less sudden, more gradual, not a big drop like a roller coaster. Not completely perfect, but definitely smoother. Which means that I feel able to reduce more consistently instead of delaying my reductions for months out of fear about how they will affect me. And that's helped me make more progress, which is the whole point after all.

 

Sorry this is so long, but I hope it helps you and anyone else who is curious about micro tapering. Many other benzo buddies have found it has helped them too, but it comes down to personal preference and trying it for yourself, and just going as slow as you need to

[Guest [mo...]]

 

If I want to upload a link to my Word document showing my basic plan (we all know plans with tapering change but hey... a plan gives a rough idea) then how would I upload it on here so other people can open it and give feedback or suggestions? Should I just cut and paste it somewhere...?

 

 

 

I believe you can upload it to photobucket and then just copy the link and paste it, but I am no expert when it comes to tech.  Maybe one of the others can help.

Have a nice weekend little sis

[[ka...]]

Hey JDT33,  I am confident many gained much from your post on MT. well said!  Thx for taking the time to share it, wh/ brings encouragement, confidence & courage, as well as helping to reduce anxiety over this issue for many. There is great truth in knowing that everyone is different and we all need to discover what our taper, reduction level our bodies/brain can handle.  However, you have given a wonderful starting place for so many. Keep up the great progress!!!

[[so...]]

JustDoToday, I have been seriously considering micro tapering my valium when the time comes, and your post gave me a lot of hope that method might just be the right one. Are you doing water titration? I feel overwhelmed by the idea of learning how to do that properly... the emery board method sounds promising to me... I don't know. Thoughts on methods? What is yours? (I apoligize if I overlooked it in that post... I read it top to bottom but it's late and I'm falling asleep! Lol)

[Guest [mo...]]

For those of you that cut and hold your Valium, what day do you begin to notice symptoms, what day do they peak, and when do they begin to improve? On average how long do you hold your cuts? Also for those that do twice a day dosing, what time of day do you take them, do you do them exactly 12 hrs apart?

 

Hey Hope

When I was cutting and holding, by the third day there was a distinct change in my sleep, personality, racing  thoughts, etc.  I would have to plan it so that if I had something important to do, it would not overlap.  I could be in bed for 2 days feeling terrible then it would lift. At that time I did not know about the benedryl or unisom for sleep so that may make a difference.  I still wonder what would be better for me: to cut and hold and have 3 awful days and nights, or feeling blah and sometimes okay, most of the time, which is what I feel these days?  If I push myself with too much activity, I just have to stop and reassess. This is a natural space to hold with the MT and allow the brain and body to catch up.  I also find this is all very psychological.  When I can keep my spirits up and ignore the beast that these chemicals conjure up in my psyche, I can push through the anxiety.  It feels a bit like walking through 4 feet of water all the time.  As for the time between cuts, I stuck to the Ashton recommended minimum of 7 days, however, that is difficult to maintain if you are working.  I would try to get to one dose a day at bedtime.

--trying to be positive yet realistic about what lies ahead.

I feel as if this process has evolved my soul in a purposeful way.  For what reason and how it plays it is unclear.  I know I am a stronger woman.  This chemical has created an adversity within my being that can allow me to go to the darkest depths.  My evolution and growth lies in the choices and ways that I navigate those dark and murky waters.  I shall prevail and I hope you and all of our buddies will too.

I hope this helps.

 

Mountain yogi,

 

How did you make the transition from 3 times a day to once a day?  Did you move some doses over gradually or did you do it all at once?  And did you hold for a little bit to see how it would effect you?  I'm doing three times daily currently and I think psychologically twice daily is the best I could do right now.  Even at three times a day I feel my heart pounding and anxiety level/chest tightness rising about 2 hrs prior to my next V dose (and this is not all psychological).  Maybe when I'm lower like less than 3 mg I'll go to once a day, but for now I'm pondering how to even get to twice a day.

Sorry I meant to get back to this entry and question Hope

 

I used schedule 8 in the Ashton manual: http://www.benzo.org.uk/manual/bzsched.htm#s8

I started at 25 mg and you can see in my signature the time it took to do it.  Believe me, I was freaked out and full of anxiety all the time, so the idea of crossing over and then dropping dosing eventually down to just one a day was frightening.  I would have to go to work and massage people all day while feeling this way, it was quite a difficult task, but I did it! I told my good clients what I was going through and they stood by me and understood.  I like the idea of the night dose as this was the reason initially I took the Ativan, so it is a sign that this is bedtime.  I also take some other sleep aids so if there is some sort of psychological placebo effect so be it and Calmes Forte can be my lifetime sleep aid~~happily

 

I believe the heart pounding anxiety will mellow out for you soon.  I do not know how old you are, but is seems to me that at 52 yrs old, I was taxing my poor heart with these drugs and it felt as if my heart was responding to valium use as a function of my age, but I realized once again it was the benzo beast and my poor heart calmed down.  When I was on Ativan and crossing over, it felt like an elephant was standing on my chest.  It sent me to emergency room with my thinking I was having a heart attack(this was before I joined BB and understood the symptoms of benzos). I must say that from time to time one may still have those palpitations during the valium tapering time but nothing like my crossover and first month on valium.  My problem is that I was rushing it because I could not reconcile in my mind, even after reading many stories here, that 8 months on ativan warrants a 2 year tapering!!!!! I remember telling Smiff last spring that I would be done by last summer ~~~she kindly responding 'well maybe not' and she was right.  I believe that there is nothing psychological about those symptoms--they are real and frightening so I have learned to sit back in my head and become an observer of them.  When I have bizarre thoughts and images in my mind, I again sit back and watch it like a film and then dismiss it by saying "this is not me, this is a chemical reaction in my brain that has nothing to do with me"

~~detach.  If you read Parker's link, you can understand that this is your brain healing.  Even now, I still have unwarranted fears creep in and I cannot leave the house. Fine. I breathe through it and it usually passes and I am up and running the next day. 

 

You will know when it's time to go to dosing twice a day then once a day, trust yourself and believe in you.  This chemical has an intelligence of its own like a fungus(ie Candida), and if you start going against it and what it reigns over(your neurotransmitters), it will put up a fight.  You must see that you are the winner.  It may knock you down, but never out~~NEVER.

I Hope this helps Hope

 

[[be...]]

Hi everyone, hope everything is going well for you. I need some help, well sort of, I am on the fence about starting my liq taper again on Monday, as

 

it has only been about 4 wks, I usually hold for two months and then start back on taper, I am in no rush to reach the finish line, but I am torn about

 

what to do, I have had a much easier taper this time, my first two were Horror shows, I can not do that again, of course I have had some mini problems

 

but minor, compared to so many here, and for that I am thankful, I am now at 1.75mg, I just do not know for sure what to do, start again, or hold for

 

3-4wks, that has been par for the course for me. I usually cut 0.25mg, and I love the liq taper as it is easy and is so much better than using a razor

 

to cut my pills, I do have to report, that although I had some sx's close to my ending of the cut, it was nothing compared to face planting and feeling

 

terrible. I have no set day in mind to quit, I like others just want to reach Recovery someday. So hope this helps to tell my story and any pearls of wisdom will help

 

I do want to give a shoutout to Diaz-Pam, and Mountainyogi, because without them I would be still cutting dry pills, I must admit, that my sx's are no

 

where near the ones that I had when I dry cut. So if you have the time I would like to hear your wisdom. All stay well and have the best day you can,

 

it is nice to know that I am in such good company all dear souls you are. 

[[Al...]]

Hi everyone, hope everything is going well for you. I need some help, well sort of, I am on the fence about starting my liq taper again on Monday, as

 

it has only been about 4 wks, I usually hold for two months and then start back on taper, I am in no rush to reach the finish line, but I am torn about

 

what to do, I have had a much easier taper this time, my first two were Horror shows, I can not do that again, of course I have had some mini problems

 

but minor, compared to so many here, and for that I am thankful, I am now at 1.75mg, I just do not know for sure what to do, start again, or hold for

 

3-4wks, that has been par for the course for me. I usually cut 0.25mg, and I love the liq taper as it is easy and is so much better than using a razor

 

to cut my pills, I do have to report, that although I had some sx's close to my ending of the cut, it was nothing compared to face planting and feeling

 

terrible. I have no set day in mind to quit, I like others just want to reach Recovery someday. So hope this helps to tell my story and any pearls of wisdom will help

 

I do want to give a shoutout to Diaz-Pam, and Mountainyogi, because without them I would be still cutting dry pills, I must admit, that my sx's are no

 

where near the ones that I had when I dry cut. So if you have the time I would like to hear your wisdom. All stay well and have the best day you can,

 

it is nice to know that I am in such good company all dear souls you are. 

 

begood,

 

This is interesting. I too am on my second time down using Valium. You cut .25 mg. each time with long holds. I couldn't handle that big of a cut and this time I am going much slower.

The longest I have ever held was something like 58 days or so. I personally have no issue with long holds. I might suggest that as you continue your decent from here you may want to reduce the size of your cut. .25 mg off of 1.75 mg. is huge maybe go to 1.65 mg. hold for a bit shorter period then 1.55.

You seem to be handling the cuts though very well so maybe your just one of those people who can do this quicker.

 

We are all so different. What ever you do just stay as confident as you are now!

 

Peace & Healing 

 

 

ATU

[Guest [mo...]]

Hi everyone, hope everything is going well for you. I need some help, well sort of, I am on the fence about starting my liq taper again on Monday, as

 

it has only been about 4 wks, I usually hold for two months and then start back on taper, I am in no rush to reach the finish line, but I am torn about

 

what to do, I have had a much easier taper this time, my first two were Horror shows, I can not do that again, of course I have had some mini problems

 

but minor, compared to so many here, and for that I am thankful, I am now at 1.75mg, I just do not know for sure what to do, start again, or hold for

 

3-4wks, that has been par for the course for me. I usually cut 0.25mg, and I love the liq taper as it is easy and is so much better than using a razor

 

to cut my pills, I do have to report, that although I had some sx's close to my ending of the cut, it was nothing compared to face planting and feeling

 

terrible. I have no set day in mind to quit, I like others just want to reach Recovery someday. So hope this helps to tell my story and any pearls of wisdom will help

 

I do want to give a shoutout to Diaz-Pam, and Mountainyogi, because without them I would be still cutting dry pills, I must admit, that my sx's are no

 

where near the ones that I had when I dry cut. So if you have the time I would like to hear your wisdom. All stay well and have the best day you can,

 

it is nice to know that I am in such good company all dear souls you are. 

 

Begood, I am confused as to why you are cutting more that .05 at a minimum of every 7 days and probably better for you at 14 days? .25 is waaaaaay to high a percentage of a cut dear friend. Please reassess and if you need a spread sheet for dilutions you can use mine.  I dilute 7 mg of diazepam in 2ml of vodka and fill with water to the 100 ml line on my mason jar(after the pills have dissolved).  The solution lasts for 4 days and I slowly creep down with my syringes.  You need a 10ml syringe and a 1 ml syringe.  I know there are other ways of creating the liquid solution but this is what works for me. You can do the .05 drop at once and hold, or you can microtitrate as I have been playing with the last month.  I know you have wavered between actually completing this taper or remaining a lifer on V at 2mg.  I admire your courage for going forward with the taper but PLEEEEZE go slowly if time is not of the essence and make smaller cuts.

ok cutie pie

I know you will be successful this time.

My husband just walked by me as I was writing this complimenting me on how far I have come.  I use to be a raging lunatic so he has seen and lived(poor man ) the whole crazy spectrum of what havoc this drug has wreaked upon our lives.  My son once again asked yesterday, as I was mixing up my batch, when this would be over so he could destroy and smash the bottles and syringes as Moodle's son did.  We can do it my friend

[[Ca...]]

I understand the need for a slow taper. Some of us are just too sensitive. But, if we are to believe in the Ashton Manual and a guide. She says the healing to the CNS, doesn't start until the 'poison' is out of the body. I'm trying to keep this in my mind as I continue my taper. Granted, I'm on a 'higher' dose of Valium at this point. And, have been on benzos for 16 years. I'm not sure how I am going to be feeling as I drop further. None of are. I'm planning at this point, anyway, to continue at a pace of 10% every two weeks, as recommended, and adjust accordingly. Keeping in mind, that symptoms are what they are and if unbearable to try to push through them. I, also, want the healing to begin. I'm not looking to race, but 16 years of this shit in my body, is time for it to go.

[[be...]]

Hi, I think I may be confusing everyone, yes I did 0.25mg dry cuts, but kept slicing away on the tablet till I reached the cut, I held for a while with each

 

cut when dry cutting until I reached 0.25mg. Now that I am doing the liq taper, I was doing 0.01mg everyday and I did that for 25 days hence my 0.25mg cut, long duration, and

 

with my dry cuts I was doing 2month holds in between, is that too fast of a cut, it is keeping me mobile and I am only having anthills once in awhile, in

 

fact better than when I was doing the dry cuts, I am sorry if I confused anyone, trust me I was in the pits of Hell my first two tapers and will not go

 

fast like I did before. I just wanted to know if I should restart or hold for another month as I have been doing before. so far it has been working for

 

me. Thanks you all  When I started my liq taper I had 100 days to get to 1mg of V, so I decided and my body decided to stop at the 0.25mg

 

point and it has seemed to be ok, then when I restart I will go for another 25 days with 0.01mg day cuts, stop and hold etc. which will bring me to 1.50mg

 

and down until the very end. 

[[Di...]]

Hi kgirl:

 

I did taper successfully off K by doing C/H until I got to .625 mg, from 6.5 mg. Then I began a MT. I have been advised by many that a MT at my dose is ill advised and to do C/H until I get to about 15 mg. Then do vodka titration. I don't want to be tapering for the next 10 years. Even my pdoc agrees with this, and my life is in his very capable hands. But I must admit, when I first saw him, titration and MT were news to him.

 

Bets

 

There isn't any right or wrong. It just depends on what you prefer to do. There is absolutely no reason why you can't do a daily taper at your dose. It's just that it may not be completely necessary at your dose. If I was you I would be trying a dry cut of say 0.5mg initially just to see what happens. If it turns out that's too much for you to handle, then a daily taper would be the way to go.

 

However, you might find you can cut that amount quite often, so you've really got the best of both worlds - a relatively smooth gradual taper, but without having to play around with the liquid. A 0.5mg cut from 70mg is less than a 1% cut (0.7% in fact), so chances are you will handle it quite well.

 

Thanks so much DP, builder, kgirl and Phoebe.

 

Q: DP: If I cut .5 mg initially how long should I wait before the next cut?

Bets

 

Hi Bets

 

Sorry I didn't reply sooner to this one, although maybe someone else has replied in the meantime. The internet on my laptop has been out all week (long story - actually an anti-virus problem grrrrrrr!!), so I'm only just catching up now on some posts. Sorry if I've missed anyone's posts too.

 

Maybe for the first cut wait for a good two weeks, just in case something sneaks up on you. That should give you a good idea of how you will react to future small cuts. I hope you don't feel anything at all though.

[[be...]]

Hi, just thought I would let those who responded to my post, that I decided not to hold for another month, I restarted my taper this morning, and will

 

do the 25 days @ 0.01mg per day and will be at 1.50mg and then hold for a month or so, I went back and forth about staying off for another month,

 

but remembered that Diaz-Pam said we could stop and stay at a dose if we felt bad, so I decided that I one month holding was enough. I have been on

 

Valium for over thirty years, so I still intend to do a slow snail taper, but I do have to say I really like this liquid taper, it is so easy and actually when

 

I had sx's was so mini, that I was able to tolerate. So far it is a win win for me. For those of you on the fence about doing a liquid taper, know that

 

it is a godsend for me, no more cutting away pills, so much better. All have the best day you can. 

[[ph...]]

Begood,

 

Happy you are doing well!

[[ed...]]

Good Morning,

 

First off, I'm so glad I found this thread.  Second, I hope some of you will be able to shed a bit of light upon my current situation.

 

1) First off, I believe that diazepam has a pretty long half life. However, when I tried to ingest my entire daily dosage in one session, I incurred nasty side effects. Do some people need to space out their dosage over the course of a day?

 

2)  When I down dosed from 9 mg of diazepam to 8 mg of diazepam, everything was fine...at first...then wham!...3 days later acute anxiety which lasted 36 hours kicked in. Is this normal for a lag time to occur?

 

3) After the aforementioned 36 hours of intense anxiety, I began to experience what you folks call a window.  However, I work nights on the weekend and my dosage times (regular to this point at 11am and 8pm) were thrown off to 2 pm and 10 pm for a couple of days. Coincidentally, today (Monday) I experienced a blast of anxiety and depersonalization. Could this be because of my scheduled dosages being thrown off or is it normal to have a temporary relapse into w/d after stabilizing for a few days at a set level during a taper?

 

Many thanks in advance,

Edzo

[[so...]]

Edzo,

 

I'm on 2.5 mg of V 4x per day, and I'm the same as you. I've never tried to take the full dose at once, or even the 5 mg pills 2x per day, because I can tell they'll be too strong for me that way. Everybody is different and every body (or every brain) is different. Do whatever feels best. That's what I'm doing!

 

I can't give any comment on V withdrawal as I have only done the addition of V and near-removal of A at this point, but I can tell you that when I would cut .25 mg of Ativan on my first (failed) attempt, the worst days were always the second and third, and then I'd get back to normal. You'd think it would be more like a week for Valium, but maybe you're a fast metabolizer (I am too).

 

Hang in there! And listen to your body. It knows the right pace.

[[Ho...]]

Good Morning,

 

First off, I'm so glad I found this thread.  Second, I hope some of you will be able to shed a bit of light upon my current situation.

 

1) First off, I believe that diazepam has a pretty long half life. However, when I tried to ingest my entire daily dosage in one session, I incurred nasty side effects. Do some people need to space out their dosage over the course of a day?

 

2)  When I down dosed from 9 mg of diazepam to 8 mg of diazepam, everything was fine...at first...then wham!...3 days later acute anxiety which lasted 36 hours kicked in. Is this normal for a lag time to occur?

 

3) After the aforementioned 36 hours of intense anxiety, I began to experience what you folks call a window.  However, I work nights on the weekend and my dosage times (regular to this point at 11am and 8pm) were thrown off to 2 pm and 10 pm for a couple of days. Coincidentally, today (Monday) I experienced a blast of anxiety and depersonalization. Could this be because of my scheduled dosages being thrown off or is it normal to have a temporary relapse into w/d after stabilizing for a few days at a set level during a taper?

 

Many thanks in advance,

Edzo

 

I am doing cut and hold and dosing three times a day. Not brave enough yet to cut it down to two doses a day, and definitely not one!  There is definitely a lag time with symptoms. I have been noticing cuts worse on day 4-5 then another spike on day 9. I've only made 2 cuts so far so will see if this pattern holds for me. I have another cut due tomorrow. Also you might consider decreasing your cut amount to 0.5 mg to stay within the recommended 5-10% cuts now that you are below 10 mg, especially if your symptoms become intolerable. Hope this helps!

[[Mo...]]

Good Morning,

 

First off, I'm so glad I found this thread.  Second, I hope some of you will be able to shed a bit of light upon my current situation.

 

1) First off, I believe that diazepam has a pretty long half life. However, when I tried to ingest my entire daily dosage in one session, I incurred nasty side effects. Do some people need to space out their dosage over the course of a day?

 

2)  When I down dosed from 9 mg of diazepam to 8 mg of diazepam, everything was fine...at first...then wham!...3 days later acute anxiety which lasted 36 hours kicked in. Is this normal for a lag time to occur?

 

3) After the aforementioned 36 hours of intense anxiety, I began to experience what you folks call a window.  However, I work nights on the weekend and my dosage times (regular to this point at 11am and 8pm) were thrown off to 2 pm and 10 pm for a couple of days. Coincidentally, today (Monday) I experienced a blast of anxiety and depersonalization. Could this be because of my scheduled dosages being thrown off or is it normal to have a temporary relapse into w/d after stabilizing for a few days at a set level during a taper?

 

Many thanks in advance,

Edzo

 

Hi Edzo,

1) it does have a long half life. And yes, some ( if not most people? ) take their dose spread out in two, sometimes three doses.

 

2) Most people will feel their cut somewhere between 3 to 7 days after cutting. Because of the long half life you will not feel it right away as you do on a shorter acting benzo, such as Ativan.

My two cents would be to cut way smaller but more frequent to keep the symptoms at bay. In my opinion, a 1 mgr cut at a 9 mgr dose is too large.

How often do you cut?

 

3) it is very common to have window and waves, sometimes we can't tell what brings it on and it's just plain old withdrawal. I think the few hours difference should not be a big deal, due to the long acting properties of Valium. I've forgotten a dose here an there during my taper and never felt it after just a few hours but I've seen it all and some folks just need to take their Valium on pretty regular times. IMO it would be " just" a wave. It comes and goes. Sometimes without warning.

I think you're just still feeling the cut.

When I was doing cut and hold, it would take me about ten days to recover a bit ( I switched to liquid tapering ).

 

The recommended cut is somewhere between 5-10% every two weeks or so. Again, I think you will be doing better if you didn't cut a whole mgr at once.

 

Hope this helps.

[[ed...]]

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! I never expected such quick responses.  I'm curious though about the 5%-10% cut limits though. I'm looking at Ashton's table and it shows a 1mg cut every 1-2 weeks all the way down to 0mg. Am I missing something?

 

Best,

Edzo