Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[dr...]]

Hi. I'm just popping in on this thread as I feel I need a support system with others tapering Valium . I was an active member on another site doing daily micro tapering but was recently locked out and unable to log back in for some unknown reason. I recently updosed as I was not stable anymore. Not sure what happened. I was using liquid v then switch to milk solution. Now I am having a compounding pharmacy make the solution. I'm not sure if I will try the daily micro taper again or try small reductions every 10 days or so, as this is what my new benzo wise doctor would like me to do. Anybody having good results cutting 2-3 percent every 10 days? I'm working at the moment and hope to continue working throughout my taper. I've been doing this a long time. I had hormonal issues that really messed me up. They are not completely resolved but better. Birth control pills made me worse and bio identical progesterone threw me into panic attacks. I dose 3 times a day evenly. Currently holding at 7.5mg and waiting to start taper when feeling stable throughout the day.

Mm

 

Hi MM,

 

I'm doing small cuts every now and then(depending on symptoms)days now instead of a daily taper.  It is averaging out to be about 4% every 8-10 days.    I was cutting .02 per day and the daily cuts caught up with me. I'm now lowering by .05 every 4 days so.  My lag time is about 8 days so if I get hit I will just hold. I hope I don't get hit as hard.

[[...]]

Thanks for the reply Drew. Are you working? Do you use Roxane liquid v to make the small cuts ?

Mm

[[dr...]]

Yes I do work. I do also use the Roxanne to make a liquid dose that I divide into three. 

[[Sm...]]

Hi MM

 

Looks like you've had a bad run from your sig. I can relate. I took something recently that has thrown my taper waaayy off. Don't know where I'll land.

You've come a long way fro 16mg though. And you'll get there soon.

You've come to the right place for support. This is a good supportive thread. Many people here have to work and function and taper accordingly.

 

Take Care

Smiff

[[...]]

Smiff-

Thanks for the encouragement. I'm a bit down because my support system of friends was taken away from me. May I ask what you tried that threw your taper way off? I've had many set backs to from bad choices I made in the past. This has got to turn around soon for the both of us .

Mm

[[...]]

eliz yes I hear ya about the weight. You're ahead of me . . . I lost just over 30 lbs. My weight loss though was mainly due to being nauseated and not feeling like eating. But some of it was from eating healthy lol. Shows you what I was eating before!!! Anyhow, I am trying to gain some weight back as all my clothes are hanging on me. The things that benzos do!

 

I am tentatively thinking about going with my partner to a restaurant she likes for Sunday brunch. It's pretty quiet and I can select from the buffet. I might try my wings with that. It's a personal goal of mine. Got to push myself a little, I think.

 

Okatz

 

O don't get me wrong, I do still go out to eat on occasion but usually have to stick to the "safe" menu items.  Can't be a hermit until this is over because we still need to try and enjoy life as much as possible!

[[...]]

Has anyone else noticed that sometimes w/ds pop thru during the taper even tho there was no cut or holding doesn't stop it?

My mom's symptoms seems cyclical and so do the improvements.

She was doing well on daily taper, but then got a couple bad symptoms and I held, but the hold didn't stop it.

I decided to keep cutting and she is getting better.

Could this just be underlying lorazepam w'd's coming thru no matter what we do?

 

M - I think from my personal experience that you have hit the nail on the head.  I think the K is still effing with me from time to time - in fact I think it has been trying to derail my taper for the last couple of weeks.  The meaner benzos may just have caused damage that takes a while to heal and we all know that the healing is not linear.  How else can we explain these random out of nowhere symptoms?

[[mr...]]

Has anyone else noticed that sometimes w/ds pop thru during the taper even tho there was no cut or holding doesn't stop it?

My mom's symptoms seems cyclical and so do the improvements.

She was doing well on daily taper, but then got a couple bad symptoms and I held, but the hold didn't stop it.

I decided to keep cutting and she is getting better.

Could this just be underlying lorazepam w'd's coming thru no matter what we do?

 

M - I think from my personal experience that you have hit the nail on the head.  I think the K is still effing with me from time to time - in fact I think it has been trying to derail my taper for the last couple of weeks.  The meaner benzos may just have caused damage that takes a while to heal and we all know that the healing is not linear.  How else can we explain these random out of nowhere symptoms?

Hi Eliz,

I am so happy to hear u say that because I was thinking it was only with my mom's case.

Valium smooths out the sx's making them more tolerable.

However, the valium is also, allowing our cns to re-adapt gradually, so that healing is more complete instead of protracted.

Finding our re-adapting rate is key.

I think I found my mom's to be .0035mg per day at where she is at now, .8mg v.

 

[[...]]

Hi. I'm just popping in on this thread as I feel I need a support system with others tapering Valium . I was an active member on another site doing daily micro tapering but was recently locked out and unable to log back in for some unknown reason. I recently updosed as I was not stable anymore. Not sure what happened. I was using liquid v then switch to milk solution. Now I am having a compounding pharmacy make the solution. I'm not sure if I will try the daily micro taper again or try small reductions every 10 days or so, as this is what my new benzo wise doctor would like me to do. Anybody having good results cutting 2-3 percent every 10 days? I'm working at the moment and hope to continue working throughout my taper. I've been doing this a long time. I had hormonal issues that really messed me up. They are not completely resolved but better. Birth control pills made me worse and bio identical progesterone threw me into panic attacks. I dose 3 times a day evenly. Currently holding at 7.5mg and waiting to start taper when feeling stable throughout the day.

Mm

 

Hi MM

Welcome to the thread.  It sounds like you made a good decision to hold until you feel better.  I am using hrt as are a few other ladies on this thread and I can tell you from my own personal experience that I do not think I would be able to taper unless I was on it.  Diaz-Pam posted some links to very good information on HRT a few pages back if you want to page back and access them.  If your hormones are properly balanced I think your taper will go much more smoothly.

[[...]]

Thanks for the reply Drew. Are you working? Do you use Roxane liquid v to make the small cuts ?

Mm

 

MM if you are working, please come and join us on the Working thread in the supports group board at this link.  http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=66302.0;topicseen

 

Lots of working BB members there to offer help and support.  Of course this valium thread is a godsend too!

[[...]]

Has anyone else noticed that sometimes w/ds pop thru during the taper even tho there was no cut or holding doesn't stop it?

My mom's symptoms seems cyclical and so do the improvements.

She was doing well on daily taper, but then got a couple bad symptoms and I held, but the hold didn't stop it.

I decided to keep cutting and she is getting better.

Could this just be underlying lorazepam w'd's coming thru no matter what we do?

 

M - I think from my personal experience that you have hit the nail on the head.  I think the K is still effing with me from time to time - in fact I think it has been trying to derail my taper for the last couple of weeks.  The meaner benzos may just have caused damage that takes a while to heal and we all know that the healing is not linear.  How else can we explain these random out of nowhere symptoms?

Hi Eliz,

I am so happy to hear u say that because I was thinking it was only with my mom's case.

Valium smooths out the sx's making them more tolerable.

However, the valium is also, allowing our cns to re-adapt gradually, so that healing is more complete instead of protracted.

Finding our re-adapting rate is key.

I think I found my mom's to be .0035mg per day at where she is at now, .8mg v.

 

I agree with you 100%.  Glad you slowed your mom down.  That sounds like a very conservative rate of reduction and she should do very well.  Just stick to the three day rule of symptom up-tick and you should do just fine.

 

P.S.  Which spice girl did she want to be.  Diaz-Pam said she wants to be Posh, I think I am probably best suited as Scary - Do you think she should be Ginger? 

[[or...]]

eliz what is the 3 day rule?

 

Okatz

[[...]]

Eliz-

I really wanted the progesterone to work. I tried 3 different topical and also an oral. I started at low doses. I recently talked to another pharmacist who uses sublingual and thinks I actually just needed more. I'm gonna hold off on trying again because it really was a disaster everytime I tried it. Thank you for the info. I think I did talk to Diaz a Pam in the past about her experience.

Mm

[[...]]

eliz what is the 3 day rule?

 

Okatz

 

Hi O

I think Etown uses this method too; If my symptoms kick up one day I wait until the next day to see if they remain at an increased level and if so I give it one more day.  If for three days in a row, a steady increase of symptoms - then I put on the brakes and hold until I smooth out.

 

I follow this rule so I do not panic or over react to just one out of the blue oddly symptomatic day.  Most of the time if I have an "off" day, the next day is just fine.  My belief is that the healing from the clonazepam is still taking place for me and I am just going to have an off day every now and then.

 

What caused me to implement a hold last week was three days in a row of steadily increasing symptoms.  I stopped, up-dosed to where I was four days prior and held until today.  The good thing about daily tapering is that you can catch this before you get into the weeds like with cut and hold if you are paying close attention to your symptoms. 

[[...]]

Eliz-

I really wanted the progesterone to work. I tried 3 different topical and also an oral. I started at low doses. I recently talked to another pharmacist who uses sublingual and thinks I actually just needed more. I'm gonna hold off on trying again because it really was a disaster everytime I tried it. Thank you for the info. I think I did talk to Diaz a Pam in the past about her experience.

Mm

 

MM, I, like Diaz-Pam, am a strong believer in bioidentical prescribed progesterone instead of compounded over the counter stuff.  I also do not think it is beneficial to take progesterone only even though there is a strong following of this practice.  There is just too much evidence that it is estradiol and not progesterone which is what women of menopausal age need.  The progesterone is really only necessary to keep the uterine lining from becoming too thick with the estrogen therapy.  It is the estrogen that makes the positive difference in how we feel and how our bodies age.

 

Of course there are many differing theories out there, but if I end up needing a hystorectomy in the near future, I will be happy to not need the progesterone any more and just stick to the estradiol.

[[et...]]

MM welcome from me too. Lucky you finding one of  the coolest threads around. Looks like you need a change in ideas by looking at your sig. Ask questions and get to know the gang and you'll get straightened around. I would read back to the startof this thread and get a feeling for how we do things. There are many similarities here and enough differences to make us a diverse group with lots of options.

You'll be fine get stable and hold a few weeks at least come up with a new or massaged plan and get back to it when you feel mentally prepared to attack!

 

3 day rule eh? Yes I use this too. If I do too much or get stressed or over stimulated I may have a day or 1 1/2 days of crap but that is my fault. If there are 3 24hr days in a row where my symptoms are persistent and for me some of the mental symptoms I talked about a few days ago rear their ugly heads its time for something to change....always!. Do not push through symptoms that's if you want a low symptom based taper. If you want the battle of your life push through!

etown

[[et...]]

Posted this a while ago but enjoy again!

etown

[[Di...]]

Eliz-

I really wanted the progesterone to work. I tried 3 different topical and also an oral. I started at low doses. I recently talked to another pharmacist who uses sublingual and thinks I actually just needed more. I'm gonna hold off on trying again because it really was a disaster everytime I tried it. Thank you for the info. I think I did talk to Diaz a Pam in the past about her experience.

Mm

 

MM, I, like Diaz-Pam, am a strong believer in bioidentical prescribed progesterone instead of compounded over the counter stuff.  I also do not think it is beneficial to take progesterone only even though there is a strong following of this practice.  There is just too much evidence that it is estradiol and not progesterone which is what women of menopausal age need.  The progesterone is really only necessary to keep the uterine lining from becoming too thick with the estrogen therapy.  It is the estrogen that makes the positive difference in how we feel and how our bodies age.

 

Of course there are many differing theories out there, but if I end up needing a hystorectomy in the near future, I will be happy to not need the progesterone any more and just stick to the estradiol.

 

Hi MM

 

Eliz has already weighed in on this subject, and we are pretty much in synch with our opinions about HRT. I would strongly suggest you don't mess around with progesterone creams (or any kind of progesterone), unless it is used under proper medical supervision. If you start using progesterone, without making sure your estradiol levels are balanced with it, you can end up with all sorts of problems.

 

IMO, this is why so many women you read about on BB have problems with progesterone. A lot of them are self-medicating with the stuff and their hormones get totally out of whack. Also, IMO, estradiol is far more important than progesterone. The progesterone therapy idea, that a lot of people and internet sites tout, is just a way for them to make money. It harks back to the very unproven theory, back in the 90s, of John R. Lee and Virginia Hopkins about "estrogan dominance". This was then taken up by the alternative therapy community, but it is unproven and generally not recognized by mainstream medicine.

 

As Eliz said, the only real purpose of prog in meno or peri-meno is to keep the uterine lining healthy. If you don't have a uterus, it's really not recommended you take prog at all, unless there is a specific medical reason for you to do so. Also, while there is some evidence that taking progesterone transdermally, or even in troches (sublingually), is absorbed into the blood stream, there is still no evidence that the absorption is sufficient to protect the uterine lining. However, that also depends on the quality of the progesterone cream. A lot of what you buy OTC or on the internet is just basically very expensive moisturisers.

 

I have just created another link below (boy I'm getting a lot of links) to all the meno/HRT information I posted a few pages back, so it can always be easily accessible if anyone wants it.

[[Co...]]

I love the music. Music is my go to for everything. I go there when I am happy. When I am sad. When I am sick. I spent so time in my office at home listening to music this past year when I was too sick to talk. I could still hear. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[[dr...]]

CC-favorite songs when happy or sad?  Anything special to pull you out of a funk?

 

I like Depeche Mode's Never Let Me Down when I need to get out of a funk.  Many others of all genres for different situations.

[[Co...]]

Drew,

 

I am into blues. I have been all of my life. I was born and raised 22 miles outside of Manhatten. My friends and I would go into the city to every blues club that we could get in, We were not of age. We would take the bus in.

Albert Collins

Albert King

T. Bone Walker

Muddy Waters Ry Cooder

Billy D and the Houdoos

Etta James

James Booker

Odetta

Charlie Patton

JJ cale

Johnny Winter

SO MANY OTHERS

[[or...]]

Guys this is off topic but I wanted to ask the question anyhow. It's etiquette.

 

I often look in on the Ashton/Cut & Hold thread. Just because.

 

So today they were talking about canker sores and I happen to know a dynamite OTC aid for them . . . but they have asked us microtaperers not to post on "their" thread. So I guess I don't? It seem nuts not to share this. Aren't we all supposed to be helping each other on this journey?

 

What do you guys think?

 

Okatz

 

 

[[Di...]]

TBH, I don't bother even reading that thread anymore, after being totally jumped on by the OP and told that I had "invaded" the thread. My only reason for posting there in the first place was to clear up someone's misperception over what micro-tapers, slow tapers and daily tapers actually meant. The OP's "invasion" response came after I replied to a question she specifically asked of me... go figure. These types of threads come and go, because they usually end up getting way too volatile. I'm trying to learn to keep away from them. 

 

Anyway, my grumble aside, I've never experienced canker sores, but if you have a really good treatment for them, and you don't want to post on that thread, perhaps you could put it in the "Other Medications" section. That way everyone will see it, and not just the Ashton Method people.

[[...]]

Etown-

Thanks for the welcome. I hope I can find a taper that works for me. I tried the daily micro taper for a year and was only losing .1mg a month. I was always too afraid to try a higher rate. Something just wasn't working right plus I kept on playing around with my hormones.

Eliz and diaz-Pam-

I am 39 and still menstruating normally. Not exactly 28 days but more like 35 days. My last trials of progesterone were with a doctor that specializes in bio identicals. I had  a 28 day hormone panel done to access my hormone situation. Not sure why I reacted poorly. I have a few theories but after the full day of panic attacks I swore I would never try it again. I'm hoping with nutrition I can balance things out in that I don't think I'm peri menopause yet , Atleast I hope not. I thank you for the information you have to offer in case I decide to try the hormone route again.

Mm

[[jj...]]

okatz, I get canker sores, so why don't you post it here?    While we're at it. I have awful seasonal allergies and I absolutely have to use antihistamine eye drops or my eyes swell up so big they almost shut, it's excruciating. Does anyone know if antihistamines have any effect on w/d sx?