Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[Guest [Sa...]]

Sarah welcome to this thread. I have read about Lyrica but not for a while mainly because I figured why trade one addiction for another? As Smiff says you put a medication or supplement in your mouth not without consequences (not a direct quote). If Lyrica was a miracle drug for Benzo withdrawal there would be little need for Benzobuddies. I hope you get the answer you want. Sorry

etown

Hi etown,

Thanks, I've been here for a while, I replied to you earlier on here.. but nobody replied to my last post..I can't keep up with the pages of chat. I'm feeling very lost and out of the 'clique' of this site  :'(

 

Anyway,  the thought that I'm just adding another drug to come off is my main concern. But if it helps does it really matter?

 

Lyrica makes the side effects of this particular withdrawal so much easier to deal with. It takes away the cold I get a few days after I drop my dose, the hot flushes (NOT menopause)  It also stops the 'depression' I feel in the second week and I actually feel like getting up and doing stuff.

 

Hopefully someone else has had experience with Lyrica and will see my post... :/ 

 

This is my last attempt at this site. Others seem to have no problem private messaging me for advice, as I'm happy to share my experience when others post. It'd be nice to get some back.

 

Sarah I'm a very inclusive person and I feel this is one of the better threads for me. Sometimes you have to be persistent as the thread moves very fast. My other concern with Lyrica is lets say you were at 2mg of Valium and struggling to get the the illusive 0 mg. It may make sense to me to try anything to get there. You are at a higher dose right now and knowing what we know about drugs, they often have a period where they work well and then stop working almost like another tolerance. Adding drugs or supplements that affect Gaba or glutamate has one major flaw IMO. When ever we take a drug the brain creates a "new normal" in an effort to regain homeostasis or balance. It eventually does but the "new normal" is still not normal. So eventually we still have to deal with how do I allow the brain to get to a natural real normal. If you take Lyrica or anything else you will prolong the inevitable. The brain still has to heal and eventually you will be faced with allowing drug free time for this to take place. As I have said tirelessly in the past the best drug/supplement for Benzo withdrawal is called TIME. Don't give up on this thread. Don't be a stranger, post often ,and you will get to know everyone better. It's human nature the more you talk the more people talk to you. I know your input is important to me!

etown

 

Thanks etown, I'm just not used to these thread sites, and yes they do move fast! As my brain is already struggling, I'm finding it hard to get used to a new way of interacting with ppl online.

I understand what you're saying re: a "new normal" I just need to work out if it's worth using it to get the benzos out of me, then go back to using it when I need it for pain, after my withdrawal.

I'm posting as much as I can..i'll keep trying, thanks!

[Guest [Sa...]]

SarahHope I don't know much about Lyrica other than it is chemically similar to Neurontin, which I do take. I've taken N before benzos for a foot neuropathy (not diabetic). A neuropathy from a bungled back surgery. Like you, I noticed an odd thing about this drug -- let's call them brothers or sisters as they are very similar. I used to believe that when I took my valium all at night, that it was the valium that was making me feel "good". But now that I take my valium in a split dose and still feel the same "good" at night . . . I realize it could well be the Neurontin. Because my tiny little dose of valium can't be doing a thing for me. Except keeping me out of w/d.

 

I recently had to bump up my Neurontin as I got into a bout of horrid nerve pain . . . and noticed that I felt extra "good" at night.

 

So, if it's any help to you, yes, you may be onto something. And if it means that Lyrica is helping you through your taper, well, IMO so be it. It can always be tapered off.

 

The only thing I plan to do differently is to drop some of my Neurontin once I am certain the nerve pain is gone to stay. And I will keep on my "maintenance" dose of Neurontin post-taper as it does help me.

 

So our situations are not quite the same, but they do share some similarities.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Okatz

 

Okatz,Thank you so much for your input! I stumbled onto Lyrica helping too. I was having a bad neuralgia day and took my usual PRN dose. The next day I felt amazing! When it happened the second time a few weeks later I thought it couldn't be a coincidence, so I tried again and sure enough it kept working.

My main aim is to just get off benzos. 2 down, 1 to go. I'll always need Lyrica as my nerves are now totally ruined to the point where I need opiate pain relief daily. I'm the type of Woman who just gets it done. I know I'll feel like crap for a while, but I've come off enough meds now to know that it's worth the jump off to feel the relief of being free from it. I feel the fear and do it anyway, just to be free of these meds.

It's great to hear that someone else has had this experience, thank you for replying! I hope you can make the final jump and get yourself off these horrid meds. Feel free to message me, as we are having a similar experience with nerve pain and withdrawal. :>

Peace

[Guest [Sa...]]

Sarah,

 

I will weigh in here also. I do not take Lyrica but I know someone that has. Lyrica is similar to Gabapentin but stronger. It is a schedule V drug, an anti-seizure med that produces withdrawal if used for very long. I was given an r/x to Gaba abt a month ago and told it did not produce w/d. Not true. I think that we all have to be very careful in what we take. I take valium to help temper klonopin w/d. I take a low dose and have tapered since day one. I am well aware that it is a benzo also. I think the concern here is genuine. The help we give each other is invaluable. It takes time to get to know everyone and keep up with responses.

Good luck.

 

Hi, Yep, all medication has some withdrawal if you use it long term in my experience. Sometimes it doesn't even need to be long term! It seems everyone is using SOMETHING to help them come off, mainly ppl seem to be using other benzos which I understand as Klonopin is much stonger than valium!

I wish you the best of luck with your taper, and thanks for taking the time to respond to my post :>

Peace

[Guest [Sa...]]

Hi Sarah

 

I'm fairly sure I have responded to some of your posts, but I don't recall exactly what they were about now. The thing is that this thread moves very fast sometimes, and sometimes that can mean that posts you make can get missed, or you can even miss replies that people make to you. No one is snubbing you. This is a very helpful and friendly section, but sometimes people don't respond if it's something that they don't have any experience with.

 

You actually need to target the actual areas that are going to give you the best response. This is possibly not the best section to post a question about Lyrica, because not many of us are experienced with. However, a quick look over at the "Other Medications" section shows a current thread about Lyrica, which you don't seem to have posted on. Perhaps it might be worth posting your question there, because then you are going to target the people who have experience.

 

This is the link.... http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=97292.0

Hi, I didn't know there was an actual section for this particular question. I'm trying to learn this site as fast as possible so I can get some support! I finally found this page for just valium withdrawal but it seems everyone wants to talk about klonopin and other benzos. I'm so confused about what to post where. Seems I can't get it right! I'll follow your link, thank you.

[[or...]]

gts thanks for the amber glass jar link. 

 

Okatz

[[jj...]]

Sarah, I don't know if you've moved along to another thread regarding your question about Lyrica. As you can see in my signature line, I was on a very high dose of gabapentin which is essentially the same drug. In my experience, I had no problem coming off that drug. I tapered for about a month and had no w/d.

 

However, and I have no evidence obviously to back this up. I believe that the reason I became tolerant so fast to klonopin is because I was on such a high dose of gabapentin. Even before my c/t I was having the first signs of tolerance i.e. insomnia, morning brain zaps, increasing depression and DR. And this was only after four or five months. Also, one of the reasons I was lulled into using this dangerous drug in the first place is that I have siblings that have used k for years with great results and no problems cognitive, physical or emotional. One sibling still swears that it saved her life. Now that might catch up with them at some point, but right now they are still singing in the k choir. Why was I different? Well just a guess, but I think that it was because I was on the equivalent of 7mgs of k before I ever started on it. 

 

Gabapentin was a horrible drug for me. But at least I didn't have a hard time coming off of it. I'll admit that I LOVED the k because I took it at night, it helped me sleep (at first) it really helped the neuropathy and the next day I didn't feel like I was in a carnival funhouse, but one from hell where you wanted to kill yourself. I truly thought I found my miracle drug. I couldn't have been more wrong! Anyway, I agree with others that yes, there is a risk that what are are taking might be harming more than helping. On the other hand, if it seems like it's helping you, I'd say worry about the benzo first and you'll have plenty of time to getting around to the Lyrica.

 

BTW, those of you who are using Lyrica must be millionaires!  Even with my insurance it would have cost me $200 just for 50 mg for a month. 

[[Ks...]]

Does anyone know if Valium is stored in fat tissue?

[[jj...]]

Hi Sarah

 

I'm fairly sure I have responded to some of your posts, but I don't recall exactly what they were about now. The thing is that this thread moves very fast sometimes, and sometimes that can mean that posts you make can get missed, or you can even miss replies that people make to you. No one is snubbing you. This is a very helpful and friendly section, but sometimes people don't respond if it's something that they don't have any experience with.

 

You actually need to target the actual areas that are going to give you the best response. This is possibly not the best section to post a question about Lyrica, because not many of us are experienced with. However, a quick look over at the "Other Medications" section shows a current thread about Lyrica, which you don't seem to have posted on. Perhaps it might be worth posting your question there, because then you are going to target the people who have experience.

 

This is the link.... http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=97292.0

Hi, I didn't know there was an actual section for this particular question. I'm trying to learn this site as fast as possible so I can get some support! I finally found this page for just valium withdrawal but it seems everyone wants to talk about klonopin and other benzos. I'm so confused about what to post where. Seems I can't get it right! I'll follow your link, thank you.

 

Hey Sarah, the reason a lot of us are talking about other benzos is because we have or are in the process of crossing over to valium because of it's long half life and because it comes in less potent dosages so you can control the taper better. Also, there are many people who post regularly on this thread who are using a daily taper method and so there is a lot of valuable info and experience for those of us who want to take that approach as opposed to the "cut and hold" method others use. That's why I'm here, despite the fact that I'm still yakin' on about my good buddy klonopin.

[[Sm...]]

KS: yea I'm pretty sure benzo is stored in fat. I read the other day - sorry no link - that Drs should think twice about prescribing Diaz to 'obese' people (they should think twice anyhow but anyway..) because their fat stores mean they metabolise it slower and store it.

 

SarahHope: If you are planning on dropping 2mgs V per week all the way down and being done with 16 mgs in 4 months you'll definitely need Lyrica. I haven't gone down an one of those drugs because I didn't want to taper another thing next. Some people claim tapering neurotonin and others as harder than benzos. This is post a benzo w/d though and it is likely the use of the other drugs covered a fair amount of the benzo w/d so it is impossible to compare. I sure understand hating this drug and wanting off.

 

In any case

Good luck

Smiff

[[Sm...]]

oh here is the thing re obese patients. So it says nothing about 'storing' in fat

The plasma half-lives of benzodiazepines may be prolonged in obese patients, presumably due to increased distribution into fat. Marked increases in distribution (> 100%) have been reported for diazepam and midazolam, and moderate increases (25% to 100%) for alprazolam, lorazepam, and oxazepam. Therapy with benzodiazepines should be administered cautiously in obese patients, with careful monitoring of CNS status. Longer dosing intervals may be appropriate. When dosing by weight, loading doses should be based on actual body weight, while maintenance dose should be based on ideal body weight to avoid toxicity.

http://www.drugs.com/disease-interactions/diazepam.html

 

[[dr...]]

Oh well...evening one with the visiting family didn't go so well.  We went out to eat and I was profusely sweating and the food took forever. By the time it arrived I was shaking so bad I couldn't even lift food to my mouth on a utensil.  I didn't eat for close to five hours before which is unusual for me. I paid the price. My parents are so worried about me but there is really nothing I can do about it except lie to them on how I feel. I think that may be the best strategy going forward. I did leave dinner early and we regrouped at my house. Big dinner out tomorrow for my dads 76th.  It will go better. 

[[Sm...]]

Oh well...evening one with the visiting family didn't go so well.  We went out to eat and I was profusely sweating and the food took forever. By the time it arrived I was shaking so bad I couldn't even lift food to my mouth on a utensil.  I didn't eat for close to five hours before which is unusual for me. I paid the price. My parents are so worried about me but there is really nothing I can do about it except lie to them on how I feel. I think that may be the best strategy going forward. I did leave dinner early and we regrouped at my house. Big dinner out tomorrow for my dads 76th.  It will go better. 

 

Yeah

[[Co...]]

Drew,

 

Sorry to hear that the first night did not go well. My parents are both gone now. When they were alive my brother and I sat through many times with them that were rough... w/o benzo issues. I can't imagine how uncomfortable that is. I have a hard time sitting in a restaurant these days. Tinnitus comes front and center and I feel like I am on a desert island. Your folks are worried about you b/c it is hard for them to understand how you feel. I hope the rest of your time is better.

[[dr...]]

Day 2 here we go.

 

Cc-yeah...restaurants are tough for me and throw in parental stress it's a bad mix. I wonder what it is about family that sets off anxiety bombs?  I have a loving family but who the heck knows.  Well, there would need to be a whole new support site for that issue. Lol.

 

Hi Smiff!

[[or...]]

Well, I can't relate about family since all mine are gone . . . but I can sure relate to restaurants . I simply can't go into one. I tried and ended up waiting in the car while the others ate. The noise, the stimulation of people talking and laughing, the coming and going, the (seemingly) interminable wait for food. And then there's ordering and eating food that I am not used to -- I am very careful about what I eat. So, unfortunately, I've missed social occasions with my friends  because of this "disability". I don't even try to go now. And the sad thing is that my friends don't even ask me anymore. Another thing benzos have taken away. 

 

Okatz

[[mr...]]

At the higher doses of valium, my mom was able to go out to restaurants and shopping, but she rarely ever goes out now.

She doesn't want to be seen using oxygen.

I sure hope she doesn't get too weak from not doing anything for so long.

 

[[...]]

Oh well...evening one with the visiting family didn't go so well.  We went out to eat and I was profusely sweating and the food took forever. By the time it arrived I was shaking so bad I couldn't even lift food to my mouth on a utensil.  I didn't eat for close to five hours before which is unusual for me. I paid the price. My parents are so worried about me but there is really nothing I can do about it except lie to them on how I feel. I think that may be the best strategy going forward. I did leave dinner early and we regrouped at my house. Big dinner out tomorrow for my dads 76th.  It will go better. 

 

Drew do you think your blood sugar tanked and that is why you had the shakes waiting for dinner?  Sometimes that happens to me so I keep a bag of organic nuts and dried berries in my purse for times like that.  Just a handful usually helps a lot.

[[...]]

Sarah welcome to this thread. I have read about Lyrica but not for a while mainly because I figured why trade one addiction for another? As Smiff says you put a medication or supplement in your mouth not without consequences (not a direct quote). If Lyrica was a miracle drug for Benzo withdrawal there would be little need for Benzobuddies. I hope you get the answer you want. Sorry

etown

Hi etown,

Thanks, I've been here for a while, I replied to you earlier on here.. but nobody replied to my last post..I can't keep up with the pages of chat. I'm feeling very lost and out of the 'clique' of this site  :'(

 

Anyway,  the thought that I'm just adding another drug to come off is my main concern. But if it helps does it really matter?

 

Lyrica makes the side effects of this particular withdrawal so much easier to deal with. It takes away the cold I get a few days after I drop my dose, the hot flushes (NOT menopause)  It also stops the 'depression' I feel in the second week and I actually feel like getting up and doing stuff.

 

Hopefully someone else has had experience with Lyrica and will see my post... :/ 

 

This is my last attempt at this site. Others seem to have no problem private messaging me for advice, as I'm happy to share my experience when others post. It'd be nice to get some back.

 

Hi Sarah,

Please don't give up on us.  Those who do not respond are likely those who do not have any experience with the topic.  I see you did get some responses and I hope they help you find the answer you are looking for. 

 

We are not all able to help with everything, but I think there is a diverse enough group here that at least a few will be able to help with almost any question.  I hope you stick with us and let us all help each other through this journey.

[[...]]

Well, I can't relate about family since all mine are gone . . . but I can sure relate to restaurants . I simply can't go into one. I tried and ended up waiting in the car while the others ate. The noise, the stimulation of people talking and laughing, the coming and going, the (seemingly) interminable wait for food. And then there's ordering and eating food that I am not used to -- I am very careful about what I eat. So, unfortunately, I've missed social occasions with my friends  because of this "disability". I don't even try to go now. And the sad thing is that my friends don't even ask me anymore. Another thing benzos have taken away. 

 

Okatz

 

I hear ya.  This is what I mean about wanting my real life back.  I used to be able to go out with my friends a few nights a week, eat dinner, have drinks, see movies or the theater, musicals and such, but now all of these have to be avoided in order to get to sleep properly or avoid side effects.  The one plus is I know for a fact not being able to participate is the main reason I have lost 59 pounds now.  Can't get fat or stay fat if all you are eating is whole foods cooked at home and all you are drinking is water! 

[[or...]]

eliz yes I hear ya about the weight. You're ahead of me . . . I lost just over 30 lbs. My weight loss though was mainly due to being nauseated and not feeling like eating. But some of it was from eating healthy lol. Shows you what I was eating before!!! Anyhow, I am trying to gain some weight back as all my clothes are hanging on me. The things that benzos do!

 

I am tentatively thinking about going with my partner to a restaurant she likes for Sunday brunch. It's pretty quiet and I can select from the buffet. I might try my wings with that. It's a personal goal of mine. Got to push myself a little, I think.

 

Okatz

[[mr...]]

Has anyone else noticed that sometimes w/ds pop thru during the taper even tho there was no cut or holding doesn't stop it?

My mom's symptoms seems cyclical and so do the improvements.

She was doing well on daily taper, but then got a couple bad symptoms and I held, but the hold didn't stop it.

I decided to keep cutting and she is getting better.

Could this just be underlying lorazepam w'd's coming thru no matter what we do?

 

[[or...]]

mrtm if I'm reading your sig correctly, your mom has been off lorazepam for quite awhile. I know that when I did my step-wise c/o from Ativan to valium, my w/ds from Ativan disappeared almost immediately once I was on an all valium regimen. I would doubt her distress is from lingering lorazepam w/ds. I think the drug would be long gone from her body. But I could be wrong. That's just my opinion, based on my experience. But it is confusing, you're right, why w/ds appear without any rhyme or reason. I think it's the incomprehensible nature of benzo w/d. But maybe someone else can chime in here with some more enlightened and useful thoughts.

 

Okatz

[[mr...]]

mrtm if I'm reading your sig correctly, your mom has been off lorazepam for quite awhile. I know that when I did my step-wise c/o from Ativan to valium, my w/ds from Ativan disappeared almost immediately once I was on an all valium regimen. I would doubt her distress is from lingering lorazepam w/ds. I think the drug would be long gone from her body. But I could be wrong. That's just my opinion, based on my experience. But it is confusing, you're right, why w/ds appear without any rhyme or reason. I think it's the incomprehensible nature of benzo w/d. But maybe someone else can chime in here with some more enlightened and useful thoughts.

 

Okatz

Hi okatz,

thanks for the response.

I am basing it off of if she had quit lorazepam, it would take a year for recovery.

those w/d's will still be underlying if the valium doesn't take over the same receptor sites.

This is why the valium did not resolve her oxygen desaturation problem, but the lorazepam did.

The valium helped, but not enuf to get her off the oxygen like lorazepam did.

 

Direct taper off of lorazepam is just way too harsh and she was not able to make it to the next doses.

I'm glad I got her switched to the valium.

Her breathing improves around the same time every month and hasn't gone all the way backwards.

It just gets better and gets a little worse after with a lasting improvement every month.

When she was at her worst during valium taper, she was needing 2.5 LPM oxygen.

She is down to 1.5 LPM and has windows where her oxygen is 97% without supplemental oxygen.

for the past 2 months she got down to 1 LPM and each time it lasts longer.

 

Hope this makes sense.

[[dr...]]

Oh well...evening one with the visiting family didn't go so well.  We went out to eat and I was profusely sweating and the food took forever. By the time it arrived I was shaking so bad I couldn't even lift food to my mouth on a utensil.  I didn't eat for close to five hours before which is unusual for me. I paid the price. My parents are so worried about me but there is really nothing I can do about it except lie to them on how I feel. I think that may be the best strategy going forward. I did leave dinner early and we regrouped at my house. Big dinner out tomorrow for my dads 76th.  It will go better. 

 

Drew do you think your blood sugar tanked and that is why you had the shakes waiting for dinner?  Sometimes that happens to me so I keep a bag of organic nuts and dried berries in my purse for times like that.  Just a handful usually helps a lot.

 

It was definitely a blood sugar thing which transferred into an anxiety thing.  I didn't freak out, I was just uncomfortable. 

[[...]]

Hi. I'm just popping in on this thread as I feel I need a support system with others tapering Valium . I was an active member on another site doing daily micro tapering but was recently locked out and unable to log back in for some unknown reason. I recently updosed as I was not stable anymore. Not sure what happened. I was using liquid v then switch to milk solution. Now I am having a compounding pharmacy make the solution. I'm not sure if I will try the daily micro taper again or try small reductions every 10 days or so, as this is what my new benzo wise doctor would like me to do. Anybody having good results cutting 2-3 percent every 10 days? I'm working at the moment and hope to continue working throughout my taper. I've been doing this a long time. I had hormonal issues that really messed me up. They are not completely resolved but better. Birth control pills made me worse and bio identical progesterone threw me into panic attacks. I dose 3 times a day evenly. Currently holding at 7.5mg and waiting to start taper when feeling stable throughout the day.

Mm