Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[et...]]

First way to go B-Man. You have been a good mentor and friend. You are going to help thousands of people my man!

 

Mike- fast acting Benzos like Xanax are irritating to the brain.Valium,although a huge pain in the butt is a much smoother Benzo. I would suspect if you cross over to an equivalent dose of Valium as per Ashton Manual you will a) get rid of any tolerance issues b) be tapering at a nice slow clip long before March with nearly no symptoms if done correctly.

 

The rest of the best - we have our family Christmas on the 26 and 27th so we just kissed the last of the 20 people bye bye Whew!

 

etown

[[et...]]

I have a Gemini Pro20 and it is perfect and very accurate. I think there is a cheaper Gemini and I've heard a few complaints about it. It should cost about 60 bucks in the States. You could return that one, buy a different one (don't skrimp on cost get a good one) or talk to a local jeweler or pharmasist and see if they have any input.

etown

[[jj...]]

Oh man, I had a question w/ that comment that I totally spaced. For people with two or three doses, how does the taper work? Do you work back and forth between the doses reducing one at a time, or do you reduce all of them together?

[[Sm...]]

Hello all, I hope that everyone is recovering well from whatever Christmas holiday adventures that they had.

 

I'm going to go talk to a pharmacist today about compounding my current dose of k into three doses so that I can get started with my c/o next week when I see my pdoc. I don't want to put myself behind, but I was thinking about asking to increase my dose to .6mg k to make it easier for myself and my pharmacist and also hoping to get a little more functional and stable in the process. The pharmacist said that he would be able to provide the v drops (with an Rx, of course) but didn't know about the k when I talked to him on the phone. Anyway, in the long run, I guess it won't matter since I'll be able to just make the liquid suspension myself thanks to the info on this site!

 

I had a really rough night last night, felt like I was on fire and totally drenched the sheets, so I'm already experimenting with splitting up my doses suspecting that I'm not only in just regular w/d but maybe having interdose w/d. Hope I don't end up regretting it tonight!

 

Sounds like a good plan 

I think Ashton bumps up the overall dose during cross over too so a bit of a bump up now should be ok. It would certainly be preferable to cross over without already being in withdrawals. Once that benzo withdrawal kicks in the brain gets finickity about any changes.

 

Good luck and Peace

Smiff

[[Sm...]]

Oh man, I had a question w/ that comment that I totally spaced. For people with two or three doses, how does the taper work? Do you work back and forth between the doses reducing one at a time, or do you reduce all of them together?

 

At the moment I'm reducing 1 at a time. Probably next mg I'll reduce it all together. It shouldn't be too hard to make up your dose with the reduction in the morning and then drink 1/3 of it 3 times a day. I wont make a full cross to liquid next mg however. But I'll make it so I dont have to mess with tablet crumbs so for instance, I'll be going from 6-5 I'll probably take 1mg 3x daily as tabs and make up my 1mg mixture reduce from that and then add another 2mg liquid V on top and drink 1/3ish 3 times daily. We'll see how my body copes with the transition to that much liquid V. Liquid V is a different beast. I may end up being more cautious and loading half mg tab on to my two last doses and only have 1mg liquid dose plus 1mg reduction dose. As always though.. you don't know till you've tried.

 

Hope that makes sense

Good luck and peace

Smiff

[[Di...]]

Diaz-Pam,

 

Sorry you had withdrawals.  I'm right there with you. I'm sure others will soon be posting the same. The holidays are brutal on us. Glad they are almost over.

 

Drew

 

Hi Drew

 

I’m sorry you’re not doing so well, but like you said, the holidays are almost over and we can get back to normal – or normal for us valium taperers that is..lol…

 

 

Of course you have a lot to be optimistic about! You were in the zone: tapering and symptom free. You'll get there again This is just a blip in the road as there always are.

 

 

Hi Smiffy

 

Yes, I’m viewing this as one of those minor bumps in the road. I’ve been in a good place for a while, so I know I will get back there. I hope you are doing well.

 

Pam, smiff and Drew:  Hope you are all recovered soon. I was sick over the holiday so didn't get a chance to indulge. My taper is where it was. Holding. Will re-commence in the New Year.

 

Let's all be well!

 

Okatz

 

Hi Okatz

 

I’m sorry to hear you aren’t well. Holding is good. It helps you get back to a good place and then you can get going again when you feel better.

 

 

Diaz-Pam, I am sorry that you had to up-dose and that your insomnia came back.  You were in the zone for a long time and you will be again.  Your success as you get lower is inspiration to me and I hope you make it back to smooth sailing quickly.

 

Hi Eliz

 

Well, such is life I guess. I hope you are doing well. Soon you’ll be by-passing me and I’ll be looking to you for inspiration..lol…

 

[[Di...]]

 

Hi DP

Sorry to hear about your symptom increase. Mine flared up too this Holiday season, no doubt due to way too much sugar, missed workouts, etoh, missed meditation sessions, etc. I also went to 0 on my dose.  So far I won't clean up my act until after New Years as I'm having too much fun and the symptom increase isn't too bad and and most of the time remains gone. If things get worse and symptoms start persisting, I'll have to clean up my act a little. Just do what you need to do and you will be fine. Life is fun.

Bart

 

Hey – a big congratulations on being a zero!!!!  I guess we now have to call you Bart the Finished!!!

 

[[Di...]]

 

Hi Everybody,

I hope this finds you all doing as well as can be expected with all of the added stress and temptations associated with the holidays.

Take care everyone 

Hi Eliz,

I hope your tapering is going smooth.

My mom has had some breathing improvements again and I hope they last this time.

She is down to .94mg and I am cutting .01mg per day.

I wonder if I should be slowing this down or not to something like you are cutting, .009mg?

 

I’d suggest that you just watch her closely and if you see any deterioration in her symptoms then hold and decrease her taper straight away.

 

[[hu...]]

Hi everyone, I am on ativan not Valium but was advised to ask on this thread about the Gemini scale. Mine is not working. The scale gives me different readings every time I put a pill on, even if it is the same pill and I take it off and put it on again. I wait 30 seconds for it to get a reading. Then when I try to shave off the dose, in spite of shaving off the same amount every time, sometimes the scale will tell me the exact same weight as if I haven't shaved off anything. I am micro tapering because I am having such problems with tapering and have gotten nowhere basically, and this is just making it more impossible.  I have tried re calibrating with the given weights but according to the scale one of the weights is 9.940g not 10, a significant difference, thus re calibrating it has in fact made it more inaccurate. Every time I re calibrate it gives me lower and lower values for the weights. Is there a better scale? I am trying to see if I can return it...I just am so fed up, nothing is working...

 

I understand that the Gemini scale can be frustrating at times!

 

I asked my stepdad to help me because he was an engineer. We quickly figured out that his readings were in a much tighter range than mine! We were measuring a test pill and I was amazed that he was able to consistently get a variation of only 1 mg. To be as specific as I can, he measured a test pill and he either got .020 or .021 ten times out of ten. Then he said "Well, the problem is you!"

 

It turns out I must have more static electricity buildup. I'm not sure why. It might be my hair. It might be that I walk often on the carpet in my socks. So now I try now to avoid doing that before I take a reading. I also remove any polyester articles of clothing before I use the scale now.

 

I also came up with a few other tricks:

 

1) I bought a can of Static Guard (about $4-$5) at the supermarket. You can find it with the laundry supplies. Then I sprayed both the scale and the tweezers. I got that tip from a site about using milligram scales for ammunition weighing.

 

2) I keep a few Bounce-type dryer sheets by the scale and I wipe down my hands, the tweezers and the scale before use.

 

3) The advice to press "tare" before every reading is correct, I believe. I wasn't doing that before, but my stepdad told me to do that.

 

I believe all of those tricks helped a bit. I suspect the Static Guard had the biggest impact.

 

The thing is that I can't totally confirm how well those tricks are working. I do suspect that they made a big difference, but as I was implementing them I was getting down to under 14 mg (actual weight - that is, .014 on the scale readout) of the Klonopin and them I jumped at 4 mg (actual weight - that is, .004 on the scale readout). The crumb was getting so ridiculously tiny that I would have expected it to be difficult to weigh at that point.

 

Now I'm holding on a full 2 mg of Valium and enjoying not having to use the Gemini scale every day. I won't know for sure how much of a difference the little tricks made until I start tapering the V pill and using the Gemini scale again.

 

I hope that helps! Let me know if it makes a difference ... I'm very curious to see what someone else's experience is.

[[hu...]]

Hello all, I hope that everyone is recovering well from whatever Christmas holiday adventures that they had.

 

I'm going to go talk to a pharmacist today about compounding my current dose of k into three doses so that I can get started with my c/o next week when I see my pdoc. I don't want to put myself behind, but I was thinking about asking to increase my dose to .6mg k to make it easier for myself and my pharmacist and also hoping to get a little more functional and stable in the process. The pharmacist said that he would be able to provide the v drops (with an Rx, of course) but didn't know about the k when I talked to him on the phone. Anyway, in the long run, I guess it won't matter since I'll be able to just make the liquid suspension myself thanks to the info on this site!

 

I had a really rough night last night, felt like I was on fire and totally drenched the sheets, so I'm already experimenting with splitting up my doses suspecting that I'm not only in just regular w/d but maybe having interdose w/d. Hope I don't end up regretting it tonight!

 

jjrosk,

 

It really sounds to me like you are making sound, informed decisions!

 

As I think about it now, if I had it to do over again I would have updosed slightly right before the crossover. I say that because I had a couple of very rough weeks during the crossover and I would have gladly traded those for ending up at a slightly higher dose of Valium.

[[hu...]]

Ks1994,

 

I wanted to add that I am using the silver Gemini scale (the cheaper of the two, not the Pro model). I ditched that little metal tray a long time ago and I felt it made it a lot easier. It was just too difficult to get that little tray centered and it seemed like an extra variable.

 

I suppose it's possible that I could now get particles down into the weighing mechanism and screw it up, but I don't believe that has happened yet and I'm not too worried that it will.

 

Best, Human

[[jj...]]

I got some great news today! I went to talk to a compounding pharmacist and brought a spreadsheet of what the c/o would look like. He said that they could absolutely compound .2mg and 1.mg k doses and that I could easily use the v drops and showed me the syringe and liquid v that I would use. Then he wrote out what the Rx would look like to make things easier for my pdoc when I go to see her. He said that he had helped another woman in benzo w/d with a slow taper and so was familiar with it. It's so amazing to find supportive people in this process! So it looks like I will start the c/o on Friday if my pdoc signs off on it. I'm a little nervous but optimistic. Now if I can just get some sleep tonight!

[[mr...]]

Great news JJ, sleep well!

 

 

[[Ks...]]

Hi everyone, I am on ativan not Valium but was advised to ask on this thread about the Gemini scale. Mine is not working. The scale gives me different readings every time I put a pill on, even if it is the same pill and I take it off and put it on again. I wait 30 seconds for it to get a reading. Then when I try to shave off the dose, in spite of shaving off the same amount every time, sometimes the scale will tell me the exact same weight as if I haven't shaved off anything. I am micro tapering because I am having such problems with tapering and have gotten nowhere basically, and this is just making it more impossible.  I have tried re calibrating with the given weights but according to the scale one of the weights is 9.940g not 10, a significant difference, thus re calibrating it has in fact made it more inaccurate. Every time I re calibrate it gives me lower and lower values for the weights. Is there a better scale? I am trying to see if I can return it...I just am so fed up, nothing is working...

 

I understand that the Gemini scale can be frustrating at times!

 

I asked my stepdad to help me because he was an engineer. We quickly figured out that his readings were in a much tighter range than mine! We were measuring a test pill and I was amazed that he was able to consistently get a variation of only 1 mg. To be as specific as I can, he measured a test pill and he either got .020 or .021 ten times out of ten. Then he said "Well, the problem is you!"

 

It turns out I must have more static electricity buildup. I'm not sure why. It might be my hair. It might be that I walk often on the carpet in my socks. So now I try now to avoid doing that before I take a reading. I also remove any polyester articles of clothing before I use the scale now.

 

I also came up with a few other tricks:

 

1) I bought a can of Static Guard (about $4-$5) at the supermarket. You can find it with the laundry supplies. Then I sprayed both the scale and the tweezers. I got that tip from a site about using milligram scales for ammunition weighing.

 

2) I keep a few Bounce-type dryer sheets by the scale and I wipe down my hands, the tweezers and the scale before use.

 

3) The advice to press "tare" before every reading is correct, I believe. I wasn't doing that before, but my stepdad told me to do that.

 

I believe all of those tricks helped a bit. I suspect the Static Guard had the biggest impact.

 

The thing is that I can't totally confirm how well those tricks are working. I do suspect that they made a big difference, but as I was implementing them I was getting down to under 14 mg (actual weight - that is, .014 on the scale readout) of the Klonopin and them I jumped at 4 mg (actual weight - that is, .004 on the scale readout). The crumb was getting so ridiculously tiny that I would have expected it to be difficult to weigh at that point.

 

Now I'm holding on a full 2 mg of Valium and enjoying not having to use the Gemini scale every day. I won't know for sure how much of a difference the little tricks made until I start tapering the V pill and using the Gemini scale again.

 

I hope that helps! Let me know if it makes a difference ... I'm very curious to see what someone else's experience is.

 

Thank you, that is really interesting. I have no idea if I am too static-y. I don't know if I can keep it now thoug because we've already looked into taking it back. What surface do you use it on? Maybe I can get a replacement since the weights are off. Who did you order your scale from?

[[Wo...]]

Can you guys that made the switch please tell me why you went over to valium? If I am some what stable on .5  Xanax three times a day, would it be best to taper with that or do the switch? What are the pro and cons? I need to move 1200 miles in March to a new home, I can not see how I can start a taper before that. what do you think? I was thinking of taking that 1 /1/2 mg of X and splitting it up 5 or 6 times a day to keep that steady level to act like a V.. any thoughts? thank you

 

Hi Mike,

I crossed from Xanax to Valium because I was having bad interdose w/d from Xanax and could not stabilize. There was also something about Xanax in itself that was making me feel very sick. Valium smoothed everything out very nicely and I have had a symptom-free taper so far. I also did a lot of reading on here and came to the conclusion that the people who were faring the best were the ones tapering valium. I have a few friends who came off of Xanax and suffered for months or even years. I decided the risk of crossing over was worth it and it really was, I feel great. One more thing, I think they make a Xanax XR now (extended release). That might be easier to taper from, ask your doctor.

Good Luck,

Workin

[[Wo...]]

First way to go B-Man. You have been a good mentor and friend. You are going to help thousands of people my man!

 

Mike- fast acting Benzos like Xanax are irritating to the brain.Valium,although a huge pain in the butt is a much smoother Benzo. I would suspect if you cross over to an equivalent dose of Valium as per Ashton Manual you will a) get rid of any tolerance issues b) be tapering at a nice slow clip long before March with nearly no symptoms if done correctly.

 

The rest of the best - we have our family Christmas on the 26 and 27th so we just kissed the last of the 20 people bye bye Whew!

 

etown

 

That's exactly how I felt, like my brain was irritated

[[Wo...]]

Oh man, I had a question w/ that comment that I totally spaced. For people with two or three doses, how does the taper work? Do you work back and forth between the doses reducing one at a time, or do you reduce all of them together?

 

I reduce my morning dose by .1, then my evening dose by .1, and switch back and forth that way

[[hu...]]

I got some great news today! I went to talk to a compounding pharmacist and brought a spreadsheet of what the c/o would look like. He said that they could absolutely compound .2mg and 1.mg k doses and that I could easily use the v drops and showed me the syringe and liquid v that I would use. Then he wrote out what the Rx would look like to make things easier for my pdoc when I go to see her. He said that he had helped another woman in benzo w/d with a slow taper and so was familiar with it. It's so amazing to find supportive people in this process! So it looks like I will start the c/o on Friday if my pdoc signs off on it. I'm a little nervous but optimistic. Now if I can just get some sleep tonight!

 

Wow! You're really doing an impressive job of attacking the situation head on. Good stuff.

[[hu...]]

Thank you, that is really interesting. I have no idea if I am too static-y. I don't know if I can keep it now thoug because we've already looked into taking it back. What surface do you use it on? Maybe I can get a replacement since the weights are off. Who did you order your scale from?

 

I've tried a few surfaces. I didn't find that the surface made much of a difference, so I ended up putting it on a sturdy coffee table where I could sit on the floor comfortably to use it . For a while I was sticking about 100 sheets of paper under it, thinking that might help level it somehow. But I really don't think that made a difference.

 

The only place I wouldnt put it would be on metal or something magnetic.

 

I ordered mine from Amazon. Looks like they have it for $19.99:

 

http://www.amazon.com/American-Weigh-GEMINI-20-Portable-MilliGram/dp/B0012TDNAM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1388217469&sr=8-1&keywords=gemini+scale

 

By the way, i didn't notice initially but the tweezers are anti-magnetic. So I think it is probably a good idea to use the tweezers that came with it to put the pill on the scale and take it off. You may have already known that.

[[Sm...]]

I got some great news today! I went to talk to a compounding pharmacist and brought a spreadsheet of what the c/o would look like. He said that they could absolutely compound .2mg and 1.mg k doses and that I could easily use the v drops and showed me the syringe and liquid v that I would use. Then he wrote out what the Rx would look like to make things easier for my pdoc when I go to see her. He said that he had helped another woman in benzo w/d with a slow taper and so was familiar with it. It's so amazing to find supportive people in this process! So it looks like I will start the c/o on Friday if my pdoc signs off on it. I'm a little nervous but optimistic. Now if I can just get some sleep tonight!

 

sweet easy peasy

[[co...]]

Hi to all in this group. I have not been in touch for awhile due a stomach bug, the holidays and also just trying to get into the swing of daily tapering.

 

I have now been tapering steadily starting at 8mg on 12/16/13, starting at .02 an now .03 daily and if all goes well I would like to increase to .04 and hopefully by the time I get to around 7mg, try to maintain a .05 daily cut till I get to about 5mg if possible. Then I most likely will have to go lower again based on my symptoms...

 

Is tapering at .05 daily reduction a reasonable goal at this stage as I don't want to over reach however I got the impression from many of you that you were able to taper higher amounts at higher doses of Diazepam and had to go lower as you got lower down. If my body can't tolerate it, of course I will go down to .04 or .03 again sooner, however I was wondering if anyone had success at .05 daily micro tapering dose coming from 7mg? I want to take advantage of being on a higher dose now as I am certain i will be going much slower down the road.

 

I am getting used to the micro tapering now combining the capsules wight the liquid 1mg I use for reduction. I still need to take several small doses throughout  the day however that method seems to be working so far so I am doing that and staying within my daily limit.

 

So far, so good. I am a bit more lethargic then normal and my body is tighter then normal  however beyond that, I seem to be ok which is a good thing.

 

LooKing for feedback on this question? Concerned

[[dr...]]

Concerned-there is no set amount to reduce as our bodies are all different. At higher doses I was able to do larger cuts.  Give he .05 a try and if you are okay stick with it. If not, go to .04 and so forth. Your body will let you know what it can handle. Don't even assume you may have go slower as you get lower.  Part of the nightmare/frustration of withdrawing from these drugs is there is no "path" one can expect except the unexpected. Lol

 

Drew

[[Ks...]]

Thank you, that is really interesting. I have no idea if I am too static-y. I don't know if I can keep it now thoug because we've already looked into taking it back. What surface do you use it on? Maybe I can get a replacement since the weights are off. Who did you order your scale from?

 

I've tried a few surfaces. I didn't find that the surface made much of a difference, so I ended up putting it on a sturdy coffee table where I could sit on the floor comfortably to use it . For a while I was sticking about 100 sheets of paper under it, thinking that might help level it somehow. But I really don't think that made a difference.

 

The only place I wouldnt put it would be on metal or something magnetic.

 

I ordered mine from Amazon. Looks like they have it for $19.99:

 

http://www.amazon.com/American-Weigh-GEMINI-20-Portable-MilliGram/dp/B0012TDNAM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1388217469&sr=8-1&keywords=gemini+scale

 

By the way, i didn't notice initially but the tweezers are anti-magnetic. So I think it is probably a good idea to use the tweezers that came with it to put the pill on the scale and take it off. You may have already known that.

 

I put it on a coffee table too, which is on a carpet floor. I completely forgot about the tweezers. I got mine from amazon too but we're trying to find another seller since this was a fluke...

[[J-...]]

Hi everyone,

I would like to join the Valium support group. Some of you may know

The Rock who's been posting on my behalf. I would like to share in this thread

And ask a few questions, some regarding my taper.

(sorry..this will be a long post)

 

As you can see from my signature I've been all over the place esp all of last year.

I was on different types of benzos, for diff amounts of time and dosages.

Eg. Was put on 30 mg of Valium for akathesia in a clinic which I developed from zyprexa

Withdrawal, tapered very quickly down to 15 mg. developed wiithdtawal effects.

Switched dr, who put me on Xanax, don't remember dose, soon after was switched

To Ativan ending on 3 mg for about 5 months, then ended up back in clinic, switched abruptly

Back to 30 mg Valium, tapered down to 5 mg Valium..20 Tamezpam.

Was put on different AD's and abruptly switched ending up on 75mg Zoloft.

 

Endless ER visits so god knows how many extra doses of Valium was given.

Finally nov last year ended up in psych ward. Was c/ t off benzos was bumped up Zoloft

From 75 mg to 200 mg. Went psychotic after 2 weeks and had a near seizure.

Again top up with lots of Valium in hospital, stablished at home on 10 mg.

Needed to taper of Zoloft, developed serotonin syndrome, so Valium went back up to 20 mg.

 

In july this year started proper taper for the first time ever, been very difficult.

Housebound, mainly breathing problems, severe anxiety, insominia.

 

All this craziness of last year, could that still be affecting me? Most people are on a steady

Dose then begin to taper. I was all over the place. I'm worried of the affects of that now.

Anyone else been on such a roller- coaster? Will I ever recover?

 

How do I continue with tapering, I'm barely holding on. Have had no life for 2 yrs.

Affecting my family severely.

 

Any advice, comments much appreciated. I'm on Lyrica too, so that's worrying me a great

Deal...all the negativity surrounding it.

 

Thanks..sorry for the long rant. How do I stabilize enough to continue taper?

 

J-Bird

 

 

 

[[Sm...]]

Hey J-Bird

 

Don't apologise for the long post. It is a long story. My reply is a little long too.

 

So from my experience it is easier to withdraw from stable because you can kinda hopefully stay 'stable' (I guess by stable people mean not in full benzo withdrawal/ few/manageable if any side effects). It seems from looking around if you are one of the lucky people - actually probably the majority do - who gets stable you can kind of stay there but you do have to go really slow (slower then you are going now).

 

The sad truth is not everyone gets that option. Many people have tried updosing, reinstating, going slower and never got 'stable'. There could be lots of reasons for this. Previous kindling whether it is with benzos or alcohol seems to predispose one to have difficulty ever getting stable. Going too fast early and finding yourself somewhere waayyy too far from your healing rate but not updosing till stable will mean no stability too unless you are willing to do a long hold maybe.

 

Anyway there are 2 answers on how you get stable: 1) you may not be able to; 2) you hold or updose till you do (again not everyone can 'stabilise' despite this).

 

If it were me I'd want to make sure I was on a really stable dose of my other psych meds and stick with that and then try to stabilise on benzos (if you want to risk it). Like me, it sounds like you need a bit of a SSRI but not too much. Lots of SSRIs can hype up - as you know - which isn't great for benzo withdrawal. Still at this stage I don't know whether you should worry about the Lyrica unless you think it is making things worse. You can tweak your other psych meds with far more clarity once off benzos. Till then it is a crap shoot as to what you are hitting/changing/effecting. I'm no psych or a dr however. Nor have I lived your experience. So this is just an opinion based on my experience.

 

It sounds truly horrible though. I'd have trouble living with it. You must be nothing short of emotionally and mentally exhausted. I hope if you do decide to get stable before recommencing a taper you can do so.

 

Take Care

Smiff