How many people HAVE to work while tapering

[[...]]

Etown

My weekends are usually detail free but my daughter does not have to work tomorrow for the first Saturday in I can't remember when.  We are going to catch a movie, go to a charity benefit enchilada lunch, buy some slacks (I have lost so much weight, when I stood up from my desk on Tuesday, my britches started to fall down!!) and cook one of her favorite breakfasts; Pancakewich.

 

OK she named it not me.  It is 2 3" pancakes made from almond flour and between them, a poached egg and a homemade chorizo sausage patty.  Sort of our version of an egg mcmuffin if you will.  Top the whole thing with a tablespoon of organic agave syrup.  Sounds simple but you have noooooo idea how good it is!

 

Liver - we don't need no stinkin liver!!!

 

Have a good one 

 

 

[[Mr...]]

Hello just a question the last 5 nights I have been jolted awake at 4:30 am with body tremors and instant anxiety, plus feeling hung over... I've been holding my 4.5 mg valium for two months I was feeling great before my hip surgery and since I stopped taking then pain med hydromorphine about 15 days ago... My day time anxiety is Back and my sleep is only about 3 or 4 hours.... What's going on??? Any input would be great... Thank you so much Mr scared in Ottawa.

Btw I'm holding my 4.5 mg until I feel better ... Any thing else I could do???

 

 

[[et...]]

Sorry for the boring answer Ottawa but time is your only friend right now.

etown

[[Mr...]]

Hello ... Yes time , wish time would tick faster for me lol I'm so sick today my stomach, not much sleep... It's gonna be a rough Sunday.... I can't wait to get back to the 70/30% rule... I'll keep u posted.... Chat soon Mr scared

 

[[...]]

Hey Everyone,

Here's to the start of another work week.

 

Etown good to see your dose drop in your sig.  I am currently holding at my posted dose and actually got some sleep over the weekend.  I am feeling much more stable and will probably hold the rest of this week and resume cutting on Friday.  I looked at my signature and did the math and since I started this, I have reduced an average of 5% per week and that is even with the hold at 2mg so I do not feel like my rate is overall too slow nor am I going to let myself feel bad about this hold.

 

As long as week keep moving down, right?

[[et...]]

Eliz - you are doing fabulous. Who cares about the hold. You do what you have to do and that's it. My hold worked very well and I have reduced my daily cut to .015mg/day. I guess I've found my maximum daily cut rate. too bad .017mg/day just seemed better. I still might sneak the odd one in though lol. Have my pm back btw.

etown

[[On...]]

Welcome back Monday, everyone!

 

Nice to know you can PM again, etown.

 

I'm coming up on a work deadline in 9 days, yikes! And getting ready to have my 2 preschool age grandbabies here for a week. Wish to high heavens I was in the good condition I enjoyed this time just last year.

 

I have a question:  given that I reached tolerance to .5 mg of Ativan in only 3 weeks, how long would you guess I could be safe holding a 2.58 mg dose of Valium?  I am really skeered of tolerance. But I keep hoping for that elusive thing called "stability". Odd thing is, I've never had anxiety issues, just various pain and extreme discomfort as a side effect of the medication. Grrrr. 

 

Okay, here's a link for anyone interested. This is a documented story of a young med student who was prescribed, what else but benzodiazepines, for anxiety. He tried various things to relieve his benzo symptoms til he finally got a successful hit! The article has interesting info on up regulating GABA receptors. I wish we could find out who he is; he went on to finish med school. I wish he'd write a book about his experience. I'd schedule an appointment with him if I could find him. 

 

http://www.jonathanprouskynd.com/uploads/Nicotinamide___Anxiety_-_Case_Report.pdf

[[...]]

OneLove,

This is a great article.  I have niacinamide but have only been taking 500mg each morning.  Should I be a test subject for the written dosages of 1000mg morning, 500mg noon and 1000mg night time?

 

I am holding this week anyway.  Let me think about this and let you know.  I may taper up slowly to make sure I don't have a bad reaction.

 

 

[[et...]]

One - don't be afraid of tolerance. First it probably won't happen and second tolerance may be a welcome thing in comparison to what you have been through. When I look back tolerance was a piece of cake compared to a free fall.Don't be afraid to make the right choice.

etown

[[On...]]

Oh gee, etown, I never realized you were ever in tolerance. I'm so sorry. How does one "get out" of tolerance? I thought once you hit it, even slow daily micro tapers were hell every step of the way down. There's so much I don't know or understand. I guess that's what got me in trouble in the first place, huh? 

 

 

[[On...]]

Eliz, I had bought 500 mg capsules also. I've only taken it 2 days before today, and being conservative, I broke the capsule and emptied half of it. Today, after finding this case study, I took an entire 500 mg, hahah!  I'm a bit hesitant about taking any one of the Bs without the others though as I don't want to create deficiencies of the others. Hmmmmm.  Not sure what to do about that because NONE of the studies I've read on niacinamide mention that aspect. And I believe Bart took niacinamide several times a day for the duration of his taper. He certainly seems to be doing well.

 

If you up your doses, I will be eagerly watching to see what you think. I may follow soon anyway if I have no adverse effects from my once a day 500 mg. with my very bad symptoms and high pain levels, I "should" perceive a change for the better quickly if it is going to happen.  It would be a dream come true if it allowed us to taper more quickly, but I don't think it worked that way for Bart. Maybe he would step in and comment on this?     

 

[[et...]]

Tolerance to me is when the brain says " I need more or I need less". In my case I chose I need less. BUT, a little less at a time.

No it was not fun but much better than the free fall or daily endless symptoms.

etown

[[Sk...]]

[[...]]

Hi OneLove,

I took 1000mg last night at 8:15pm along with 300mg mag/citrate mixed with 1/2 tsp cream of tartar in my chamomile tea and slept for 6 1/2 solid hours before waking up.  This is a first for me since I started my taper in July.

 

I took another 1000mg this morning and will take 500mg at lunch.  I will repeat the 1000mg at bed time tonight and report back.

 

So far no flushing or revving up of any kind.

[[On...]]

WOW!  An uninterrupted sleep for 6 & 1/2 hours is terrific!  I am super impressed.  I do notice a difference when I do the sea salt and cream of tartar but am not doing it every night.  But it seems like it may be the niacinamide that made the difference for you last night? I hope it makes a difference for you during the day today also. You are brave to be trying this full-on!  Bart might want to consider anointing you Lab Rat status for this. 

 

Etown, I like how succinct your definition of tolerance is. I need to work harder to keep things simple.

 

I noticed back when I updosed to 3 mg and held, I distinctly felt the additional buildup of metabolites in my smooth muscles as my limbs became quite weighted, and in my eyes as they became blurry. This was pretty distressing to me but other sx did get better.

 

When I felt stable and started dropping again, it took a few weeks to realize that 'weightiness in limbs' symptom had improved, although others had worsened.

 

Recently, I updosed again slightly to 2.58 and have been holding for several weeks now. I am again starting to feel that additional weightiness in my limbs, like walking through thick mud. Should I just be prepared for this sx to be with me throughout my taper or does this get better as doses get lower? Does anyone know the answer to this?

[[La...]]

you might want add me as lab rat #2 to the niacinamide test. Though I am likely to start out at smaller doses and increase it gradually. I should add that I have been sporadically taking hydroxyzine for the rebound insomnia and most of the time it works very well. After a few days it becomes ineffective but this may be due to the very low dose I am taking (12.5 mg) as I am very cautious about drug interactions with the lorazepam and trazodone I am currently taking. for me, the most severe wd sx is the mind blowing anxiety that manifests and intense runaway fear. I just cant describe how bad this is and part of its severity may be due to IDW I experience since I am only taking lorazepam once at bed. I am just too scared to rock the boat and either: c/o to valium or spread my doses out. The devil Iknow is less scay than the devil I don't know.

[[pe...]]

I've been following the gingko thread and the niacinamide thread. They're both getting a lot of activity. Which do you guys think is better to try while tapering? I started gingko 12 days ago and was feeling pretty good until yesterday. I'm not sure what to do but want to tread very carefully because things have been going well. I've even been able to enjoy being at work - but right this minute I'm feeling like I might float away.

 

Thanks,

Peace

[[et...]]

Laser welcome to this thread

Peace how,s it going?

I have 2 health food stores and 20 years+ experience in Natural Medicine. I have tried oodles of products and I will re-post my take for all its worth. When we take Benzo's there are so many changes in brain chemistry that our brain creates a "new normal" for itself to bring itself back to homeostasis or balance. Then as we continue on the benzo the brain finally says no more and stops the balancing act. That's when tolerance sets in so we either need more drug to let the brain create yet another "new normal" or we get rid of the drug and let our brain heal itself.  My son has a friend who is a PhD in cellular biology and he said the problem with finding any substance that seems to "work" for the symptoms of Benzo withdrawal is that taking chemical or natural substances that effect Gaba or glutamate simply force the brain to create a "new normal" again and again. It seems that any supplements I've tried or seen on BB's "work" for short periods of time only. This is simply because our brain needs time to heal and has all its needs to do so. I take supportive supplements but nothing that effects Gaba or Glutamate.

As much as it sucks time is the best supplement that we can take

etown

[[Mr...]]

I agree with you E town I have tried many supplements and noticed just a small improvement maybe for a week or so then they seem to stop working. I'm finding my body is not stable any more since I took that hydromorphine after my operation so I'm just holding on my 4.5 mg till I stabilize again. Today I started walking again so one thing at a time. That's all I can do... I'm just getting tired at living like this..... Sorry to be a downer... Just had all day anxiety about 7 out of ten... Any more then this and I will go to the ER even though I know they can't help me... Days like this just take the soul from me.... Thanks for listening everyone...

Mr scared in Canada.

 

 

[[et...]]

Ottawa - your body has been through major trauma. If you were stable once you will be stable again. You could taper up at the same rate you are plannimng to go down and see if you can stabilize a little faster. We got lots of time buddy. Matter of fact time is all we got!

etown

[[pe...]]

Etown- I always appreciate your perspective. I was hoping you'd chime in.  I totally agree with you. I just have a hard time sitting with it. I feel like I've 'missed' half of my two year old's life and I would do anything I could to make it back to him even a little bit faster. I've been ok. Compared to others I really can't complain. I sleep most nights, I work full time, I smile and laugh at least once most days.  I just want off this train wreck. I will try to chill out and heed your advice. Thanks for being the broken record I seem to need to hear.

 

Peace

[[et...]]

Hey peace I totally get it. I have 4 kids and 7 little grand kiddies and I,m just over 50. I want to be there for them and have tried to find the illusive magic bullet but there is none so I'll slow taper and live as close to normal as I can and be there for them now come hell or high water. Thanks for caring for your little one and believe me you'll get your chance to make it up big time.

 

etown

[[Sk...]]

  I do notice a difference when I do the sea salt and cream of tartar

Cream of tarter!  Eewww!

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/funny/1/vomit.gif

[[...]]

It's hump day everyone!

 

Yesterday was a very good day.  Very little side effects so I am enjoying this hold.  Will start cutting again Friday and resume the downward march.

[[La...]]

etown, thanks for your insightful comments. Yes, my experience and intuition tells me that there is no magic bullet. But even if a supplement can soften the blow a bit transiently, then it is worth trying to me. I realize that this this march to zero (and beyond) will not be pleasant, but little things that make it just a bit more tolerable can also offer psychological support in addition to limited efficacy in sx reduction. I don't claim to know of any supplements that do this but I will continue to try new things so long as I see some potential.