Tapering off Ativan Support Thread

[[Ma...]]

It is so hard!

Just have an appointment with my GP, and she doesn't understand that the lorazepam has made me so ill. She thinks it is my GAD. She wants me to try Seroquel and return to work as soon as possible... I am so panicked!!! I dont want to take other drugs, I just want to be benzo free!

I am so discouraged...

[[Au...]]

JuJuBi,

Thank for your reply and information.

 

That’s correct. I’m currently just on Ativan 1.5mg 6am, 0.5mg 1.30pm, 0.5mg 9.30pm. I wasn’t able to do the switch to Valium. I introduced Valium 2.5mg initially then 5mg last November then in December decreased Ativan 1/4 tablet. I’ve been so unwell since. Usually the cut and hold on Ativan is brutal but ‘semi’ stabalise after 3 weeks. This time I just got sicker and sicker. I seemed to feel more anxious, heart racing, panic when I started on Valium before reducing my Ativan dose. I thought it was just an adjusted phase. We live and learn!

 

I’ve been off Valium just over a week and I’m scared that l’ll never stablise. The Ativan is providing no relief.

 

I read your posts and they inspire me to be patient. I will stablise, it’s just not knowing when. All this uncertainty makes us all scared...

 

Looking back I wish I never tried to cross over to Valium but it seemed the most logical thing to do at the time.

 

You are so close to finishing, that must feel so good. I’m really excited for you.

How are your symptoms? I’m glad the liquid gave you the relief and the opportunity to taper.

 

[[Ju...]]

Marie

It is so hard when our doctors don’t get it.  I am so sorry you are going through this.  I can understand you being panicked. This is truly a hard process but you will be ok.

 

Aussiegalrecovery

 

The cross to valium works well for some and not others.  I am sorry you have struggled so much in all this.  You are right that this process is full of uncertainty.  There are no guarantees and that makes it all very scary.  It would be so much easier if someone could just tell us when we will heal or feel better. 

 

Acceptance and patience are the weapons we have as Benzo warriors.

 

I am close but still far away.  In 7 days I will reduce again and be in the .2s !  Taking this one day and one tiny reduction at a time. I have no time line. I will be off when I’m off.  I am in no hurry.  Right now I am very close to symptom free. In the last 3 days I have felt like my normal self.  I still have a few bothersome symptoms but nothing to write home about.  The lower I go the stronger I feel.  Taking this low and slow.

 

Hang in there it does get better.

 

Hugs  JuJuBi

[[Bi...]]

It is so hard!

Just have an appointment with my GP, and she doesn't understand that the lorazepam has made me so ill. She thinks it is my GAD. She wants me to try Seroquel and return to work as soon as possible... I am so panicked!!! I dont want to take other drugs, I just want to be benzo free!

I am so discouraged...

 

 

Marie,

 

I encourage you to empower yourself. Just because your doctor (who is not benzo wize) wants you to take Seroquel, does not mean that you have to take Seroquel. That decision is completely up to you:)

 

Praying peace over your decision,

Bibs jo

[[Ma...]]

Thank you so much Bibsjo and Jujubi.

I know I can decide what I will put in my body, but my doctor is the one who sign my health assurance paper that allow me to be of work and being paid. I know when she fills this form, she likes to write what we are doing to improve my condition. And throwing pills seem to be proactive.

I know that all my actual troubles are caused BY all those drugs.

I have been trapped by Benzo because I was having troubles with my mirtazapine taper.

I don’t want to add another drug in this cocktail, when I know that the only thing that will remove all my crazy anxiety symptoms is removing all those drugs of my life.

I think I don’t have other choices. I will lie to her and put the seroquel pills in the garbage.

 

[[Ho...]]

Hey guys!

 

Today is day 1 of switching one of my doses to a new liquid compound. Already dealing with insomnia tonight.

 

My plan is to do 3 days of one dose switch, 3 days of 2 dose switches and then transition all 3 after that.

 

I’m currently at .201mg/day - .067mg 3 times a day.

 

I had a failed attempt at doing my own liquid and the pills are crumbs at this point (weighing).

 

I really need some encouragement that I’m making the right decision transitioning to the liquid compound and that I will stabilize with this transition.

 

I don’t want to give up because I don’t see another way to get off of this medication safely. It’s just so hard feeling unstable after getting to a stable point.

 

Any words of advice/encouragement?

 

So thankful for this chain. JuJuBi, you’re giving me so much hope, friend.

[Guest [ba...]]

You may need to updose the liquid slightly (~10%) to realize the same level of coverage that you had with the pill.  Many people feel they don't absorb as much medicine from liquids.

[[Ho...]]

You may need to updose the liquid slightly (~10%) to realize the same level of coverage that you had with the pill.  Many people feel they don't absorb as much medicine from liquids.

 

Okay so I’m at:

 

Day 1

.067mg pill

.67ml liquid (.067mg)

.067mg pill

 

How should day 2 look?

If I’m at .201mg/day - increase would go to .221mg/day

 

Should I do:

Days 2-3 (Wednesday & Thursday)

.067mg pill

.73ml (.073mg)

.067mg pill

 

Days 4-6 (Friday-Sunday)

.73ml (.073mg)

.73ml (.073mg)

.067mg pill

 

Days 7-until stable to taper (Monday-Until Stable)

.73ml

.73ml

.74ml

(Total .22mg)

 

Let me know what you think or if I should do anything differently!

 

Or should I do .74ml substitutions? Putting me at .222mg - (.021mg increase from .201mg)

[Guest [ba...]]

Maybe let's concentrate on Day 1 until it works for you.

 

I'd consider taking the 0.067mg pill for two doses and increasing the liquid to somewhere around 0.075.

 

See how that goes before making any future plans.

 

If you tend to suck on the pill pieces (or let them sit in your mouth for more than an instant), it may take 0.085 or more to deliver the same dose equivalent.

[[Ho...]]

Maybe let's concentrate on Day 1 until it works for you.

 

I'd consider taking the 0.067mg pill for two doses and increasing the liquid to somewhere around 0.075.

 

See how that goes before making any future plans.

 

If you tend to suck on the pill pieces (or let them sit in your mouth for more than an instant), it may take 0.085 or more to deliver the same dose equivalent.

 

Okay so do .067mg pill, .075ml, .067mg pill and just see how insomnia/sleep goes? Or how long should I hold here?

 

I don’t normally suck on them but they do sometimes sit there or I’ll take it with a quick sip of water and can tell it didn’t go down all of the way possibly? So there’s no telling.

 

When I did the liquid dose, I got sleepy/drowsy immediately for an hour or so. With that, I was hopeful insomnia wouldn’t come but here she is!

[Guest [ba...]]

I think it's good that you got drowsy with the liquid dose.  Maybe a small increase will put you over the top??

 

All we're trying to do is see how much liquid seems to equal 0.067 mg of solid (for you).  If 0.067 of solid brought you sleep, how much liquid will do the same?  Hopefully, a small change will be sufficient.  It sounds like you're close.

 

This is how I understand the reason for this 'problem'...  When a pill (especially pill pieces) sits in your mouth, you absorb some of the medicine sublingually.  The drug you absorb sublingually by-passes your liver (so avoids first pass metabolism) and enters your bloodstream directly.  So you absorb more of the drug that's in the pill.  We need to compensate for that extra-efficient absorption by using a little extra liquid.  (there could be other reasons, but I've not aware of them)

 

How long?  I'd say as long as it takes for you to determine that the liquid dose is (or isn't) close to the pill dose.  Probably just a day or two.  If you make additional adjustments, just make small changes. 

[[Ho...]]

I think it's good that you got drowsy with the liquid dose.  Maybe a small increase will put you over the top??

 

All we're trying to do is see how much liquid seems to equal 0.067 mg of solid (for you).  If 0.067 of solid brought you sleep, how much liquid will do the same?  Hopefully, a small change will be sufficient.  It sounds like you're close.

 

This is how I understand the reason for this 'problem'...  When a pill (especially pill pieces) sits in your mouth, you absorb some of the medicine sublingually.  The drug you absorb sublingually by-passes your liver (so avoids first pass metabolism) and enters your bloodstream directly.  So you absorb more of the drug that's in the pill.  We need to compensate for that extra-efficient absorption by using a little extra liquid.  (there could be other reasons, but I've not aware of them)

 

How long?  I'd say as long as it takes for you to determine that the liquid dose is (or isn't) close to the pill dose.  Probably just a day or two.  If you make additional adjustments, just make small changes.

 

Makes total sense. This is the first night in a long time I’ve had complete no sleep and restlessness. Stinks because I’m super sleepy, just feel wired at the same time. The last time I had sleep issues was several weeks ago transitioning to liquid when I found out they switched up the manufacturer on me. Before then, it was when I tried to make too big of a dry cut.

 

 

I will try .067mg, .075ml, .067mg tomorrow and see how I do.

 

Hoping better because I desperately want to trust this liquid compound. Not sure how I’ll ever get off of this doesn’t work *face palm*

Before this, I was getting 8 hours easy so hoping the increase in liquid amount will do the trick.

[[Ho...]]

I think it's good that you got drowsy with the liquid dose.  Maybe a small increase will put you over the top??

 

All we're trying to do is see how much liquid seems to equal 0.067 mg of solid (for you).  If 0.067 of solid brought you sleep, how much liquid will do the same?  Hopefully, a small change will be sufficient.  It sounds like you're close.

 

This is how I understand the reason for this 'problem'...  When a pill (especially pill pieces) sits in your mouth, you absorb some of the medicine sublingually.  The drug you absorb sublingually by-passes your liver (so avoids first pass metabolism) and enters your bloodstream directly.  So you absorb more of the drug that's in the pill.  We need to compensate for that extra-efficient absorption by using a little extra liquid.  (there could be other reasons, but I've not aware of them)

 

How long?  I'd say as long as it takes for you to determine that the liquid dose is (or isn't) close to the pill dose.  Probably just a day or two.  If you make additional adjustments, just make small changes.

 

Just an update -  I did my second dose today at .75ml so equivalent to .075mg.

 

Felt okay after. I’m having quick  waves of fear/anxiety come over me and some irritability/just feeling a little rough.. I’ll see how I sleep tonight but praying it’s better.

 

How long should I hold here before adding another dose of liquid? Until sleep is better?

[Guest [ba...]]

The change in dose should take effect pretty quickly.  So hopefully you know if the updose helps your sleep in a day or two.

[[Ju...]]

Hoping your sleep is improved.

 

I agree with badsocref you should know in a few days.

There is no hurry here. It is good to give these changes some time to settle.

 

JuJuBi

[[Ho...]]

The change in dose should take effect pretty quickly.  So hopefully you know if the updose helps your sleep in a day or two.

Hoping your sleep is improved.

 

I agree with badsocref you should know in a few days.

There is no hurry here. It is good to give these changes some time to settle.

 

JuJuBi

 

Thank you both so much! I slept well last night, thank God. Still feeling a bit woozy/off with some heightened fear/anxiety but hanging in here. So thankful I slept okay.

 

I see where some people just go straight to liquid. Do they do that so they can just get the transition over with or is it smarter to transition this slow? I don’t want to extend the length of the yucky feelings of transitioning if it’s better to just get it over with and have a shorter time to stabilize.

 

What do you guys think?

[Guest [ba...]]

I'm glad you slept well.  Again, very encouraging.

 

I'd repeat yesterday's dosing for another day and see if the wooziness resolves a bit.  Klonopin builds up in your system a lot faster than valium, but it should build up a little more today.

 

Is it better to do this switch all at once?  Let's say that the solid -> liquid thing caused absorption to drop by 10%.  You switched one dose (of three), so you saw a drop of 3.3%.  We're now tinkering with that one dose now which might vary your daily dose by just a few percent.  That should be gentler to your system than if you had dropped all three doses and realized a 10% drop for all three doses, and were now doing 10% adjustments in your daily dose to try to compensate.

 

Doing it this way is admittedly slower, but a more careful approach.

[[Ho...]]

I'm glad you slept well.  Again, very encouraging.

 

I'd repeat yesterday's dosing for another day and see if the wooziness resolves a bit.  Klonopin builds up in your system a lot faster than valium, but it should build up a little more today.

 

Is it better to do this switch all at once?  Let's say that the solid -> liquid thing caused absorption to drop by 10%.  You switched one dose (of three), so you saw a drop of 3.3%.  We're now tinkering with that one dose now which might vary your daily dose by just a few percent.  That should be gentler to your system than if you had dropped all three doses and realized a 10% drop for all three doses, and were now doing 10% adjustments in your daily dose to try to compensate.

 

Doing it this way is admittedly slower, but a more careful approach.

 

Makes total sense! Thank you so much for explaining.

 

I will repeat yesterday’s dose today and report back tonight to let you know how it goes.

 

I dose 3 times a day - 5:30am, 1:30pm, 9:30pm

 

If I sleep well tonight, should I go ahead and do my 5:30am dose tomorrow as liquid (with the slight updose) or wait another day?

 

Trying to be strategic and smart here.

[Guest [ba...]]

It's your call when to try the 2nd (and 3rd) switch.  But if today goes at least as well as yesterday, it's certainly worth consideration.  If you're not sure, there's no harm waiting another day.

[[Ho...]]

It's your call when to try the 2nd (and 3rd) switch.  But if today goes at least as well as yesterday, it's certainly worth consideration.  If you're not sure, there's no harm waiting another day.

 

Thanks again!

 

I’ll see how I do this evening/tonight and decide from there.

 

I’ll keep you all posted!

[[Ju...]]

 

 

Thank you both so much! I slept well last night, thank God. Still feeling a bit woozy/off with some heightened fear/anxiety but hanging in here. So thankful I slept okay.

 

I see where some people just go straight to liquid. Do they do that so they can just get the transition over with or is it smarter to transition this slow? I don’t want to extend the length of the yucky feelings of transitioning if it’s better to just get it over with and have a shorter time to stabilize.

 

What do you guys think?

 

Good news on the sleep! Thank the Lord above.

 

I went straight to the liquid but honestly that was before I knew what I know now.  Now I am a turtle in all things Benzo.  Slowwwly is the way to go.  I never found that going slow has hurt me in this process but going too fast has caused some pain.

You seem to be doing a good job of watching your symptoms and will make the right decision.

 

JuJuBi

[[Ho...]]

 

 

Thank you both so much! I slept well last night, thank God. Still feeling a bit woozy/off with some heightened fear/anxiety but hanging in here. So thankful I slept okay.

 

I see where some people just go straight to liquid. Do they do that so they can just get the transition over with or is it smarter to transition this slow? I don’t want to extend the length of the yucky feelings of transitioning if it’s better to just get it over with and have a shorter time to stabilize.

 

What do you guys think?

 

Good news on the sleep! Thank the Lord above.

 

I went straight to the liquid but honestly that was before I knew what I know now.  Now I am a turtle in all things Benzo.  Slowwwly is the way to go.  I never found that going slow has hurt me in this process but going too fast has caused some pain.

You seem to be doing a good job of watching your symptoms and will make the right decision.

 

JuJuBi

 

Thank you so much JuJu! I think the slight updose is helping the transition a little more. Thank God! So thankful for you and Badsocref’s help.

 

A little more stable today. Kind of feel fatigued/out of it but I think that’s just the transition. Hoping that will stabilize once im on the liquid only and hold for a tad.

 

How long did you hold on the liquid compound before cutting?

 

Also, how do you cut? Do you drop .01ml every so often or do you have a schedule?

 

Trying to plan ahead.

[[Ju...]]

Hope

 

I held for a week. If I could go back I would hold for at least 2 weeks and likely longer.

 

I have a schedule for each month.  I decide my next month percentage based on how I am feeling, what's going on in my life and go from there.

I reduce anywhere from 2-6% a month.  I find that is where I have few to no symptoms.

I was reducing once a week .003. but at these low doses those percentages creep up on you. March will be a reduction of 4.7%.  I reduce .003 every other Monday.  So April will be a reduction of 5.7%.  With the ratio of my liquid .1mg/ml and the syringe limitations the smallest reduction I can do is .001. 

 

Current doses  .1  .1  .1

on the 28th  I will drop .001 each dose  .097  .097  .097    Into the .2s!

 

I am never afraid to hold it I feel symptoms kick up.

 

JuJuBi

[[Gi...]]

The change in dose should take effect pretty quickly.  So hopefully you know if the updose helps your sleep in a day or two.

Hoping your sleep is improved.

 

I agree with badsocref you should know in a few days.

There is no hurry here. It is good to give these changes some time to settle.

 

JuJuBi

 

Thank you both so much! I slept well last night, thank God. Still feeling a bit woozy/off with some heightened fear/anxiety but hanging in here. So thankful I slept okay.

 

I see where some people just go straight to liquid. Do they do that so they can just get the transition over with or is it smarter to transition this slow? I don’t want to extend the length of the yucky feelings of transitioning if it’s better to just get it over with and have a shorter time to stabilize.

 

What do you guys think?

 

I switched from pills to liquid in one day.  It's the same med, the same dose, so I did not expect any problems and there weren't any.  We are all different though.  Hang in there.  You will make it.  Ginger

[[Ho...]]

Hope

 

I held for a week. If I could go back I would hold for at least 2 weeks and likely longer.

 

I have a schedule for each month.  I decide my next month percentage based on how I am feeling, what's going on in my life and go from there.

I reduce anywhere from 2-6% a month.  I find that is where I have few to no symptoms.

I was reducing once a week .003. but at these low doses those percentages creep up on you. March will be a reduction of 4.7%.  I reduce .003 every other Monday.  So April will be a reduction of 5.7%.  With the ratio of my liquid .1mg/ml and the syringe limitations the smallest reduction I can do is .001. 

 

Current doses  .1  .1  .1

on the 28th  I will drop .001 each dose  .097  .097  .097    Into the .2s!

 

I am never afraid to hold it I feel symptoms kick up.

 

JuJuBi

 

It's your call when to try the 2nd (and 3rd) switch.  But if today goes at least as well as yesterday, it's certainly worth consideration.  If you're not sure, there's no harm waiting another day.

 

Thanks again!

 

I’ll see how I do this evening/tonight and decide from there.

 

I’ll keep you all posted!

 

Hey guys! Another night of decent sleep, thank you Jesus.

 

As far as other symptoms, I have an uptick in anxiety and irritability. Some nausea.

 

I didn’t replace my morning dose this morning - just wanted to try another day.

 

I hate the irritability!!! So not me at all. Do you think these are withdrawal symptoms or side effects of liquid transition?

 

Anyways, should I go ahead and switch another dose tomorrow?

 

Just FYI - I would love to be somewhat stable or functional for Easter next Sunday. I’m wondering if I do the next 6 days transitioning, if that’s possible?

 

So fully switched by next Thursday.

 

I know it’s hard to tell. I guess I could try the 2nd transition and see how it goes?