Medical Cannabis and Cannabis CBD Oil Group

[[Af...]]

Wouldn't it be a miracle if through this forum we could start a solution to this horrible benzo addiction with the use of CBN and other forms of medical marijuana

 

Magnolis, I think of this often. There's a lot of knowledgable people here. Studies have been done, and publicized, on how effective cannabis is for opioid-addiction recovery, I think MJ could be equally valuable to people recovering from benzos. I never could have imagined how much it would help me. I'm not done healing yet, but sleep is key for healing, and for the first time in my life I'm getting 'enough' sleep without a psych med. Here is a link to Dr. Dustin Sulak's study on MJ and opioid recovery. His site is also very valuable for general cannabis education. Challis introduced me to this site, and along with Badsocref, I consider her to be one of the most informed people on the forum.

http://healer.com/category/cannabis-and-opioids/

 

Thanks, Aft... the more I learn, the more I realize how much MORE there is to learn. 

Push benzodiazepines in to Schedule 1 and cannabis out.

 

 

:clap: Love yah, California Chal -

[Guest [ba...]]

Yikes! Thx Bads, too much THC was my concern, exactly. I have a cannabis-wise friend in NY, I may have to pay her a visit and get a lesson on how to do this myself. There’s not much demand for CBN here in CT yet. I don’t think most people even know what it is. We're still fledglings in the MMJ world. I think I will also contact the growers and plead, for what it’s worth. 

 

It's not the growers.  CBN is a post-harvest process done in a lab/kitchen - the same kinds of places that make oils, gummy-like bears and brownies.  Your local dispensary will know who makes their edibles.  They're the people to pester.

[Guest [ba...]]

Thanks, Aft... the more I learn, the more I realize how much MORE there is to learn. 

Push benzodiazepines in to Schedule 1 and cannabis out.

 

 

Blasphemy!

 

[and now a paid promotional announcement by Pfizer]

[[St...]]

I don't see a specific study on elimination of CBN, but since most cannabinoids are eliminated via P450 enzymes (predominantly by the CYP3A and CYP2C), it's logical to assume that CBN will follow a similar elimination path.  But unless you have a known deficiency of these enzymes, I don't see how that would matter???

 

So what I'm getting through all of this is that a high CBD, low THC plant might be best for me to try. And to smoke it as that doesn't go through the liver. Correct?

[Guest [ba...]]

It still goes through the liver.  That's how it's eliminated.

 

Which ratio of cannabinoids you want depends on you and what symptoms you're trying to control.  I preferred high THC stuff because it helped me to sleep. 

[[St...]]

I thought it didn't go through the liver then because the liver only processes things after they've gone through the digestive track.

[[Ma...]]

High thc affects gaba receptors like benzos.  Minimal to no thc in the form of cbn  for sleep and cnb are  non psychoactive and gaba is not affected.  There is a product by marys medicinal that is a cbn transdermal patch that bypasses the liver.

[[St...]]

Okay. Thanks. Do you use that patch? And how would you use a patch like that while tapering? Just daily on your body regardless of how you feel? Or is there a way to change dosage with that?

[Guest [ba...]]

I think you're thinking of the liver's first-pass function where chemicals which are taken orally pass through the liver before entering the rest of the circulatory system.  But that's just the first pass.  The liver is still there, and blood (perhaps carrying drugs) will still pass through the liver which will still perform elimination. 

 

At least, that's my understanding, but I'm not a physiologist.

[[Ma...]]

I have not used the patch yet because I am still crossing over and do not want to add any more substances to this mix, yet. I will begin as I taper down on valium. The patches are expensive and 1 time use only. ($10) Its a 10mg cbn patch. Some people split them in half. 

[[Ma...]]

I stand corrected... 1st bypass for the transdermal is eliminated.

[[St...]]

So what does that mean? Still confused. Or benzo brain.

[[Af...]]

From solice and peace.   

 

Im different than most in the fact that high CBD strains or CBD oil cause me increased pain. Same with chia seeds and flax oil. Both indica and sativa strains relieve my anxiety but I have stuck with hybrids and indicas during my taper.

 

I don't grow it myself and the menu changes frequently at the delivery service that I use, so I don't stick to just one strain, but my favorite so far has been Sunshine Daydream which is listed as one of the more potent psychoactive strains. People with anxiety are supposed to avoid the psychoactive stuff but not me! It helps me relax and let go of my control freak nature.

 

In fact, being open to trying new strains all the time has been good for my anxiety too. You have to relax into it and be willing to experience whatever each one happens to feel like. It's been two years now since I started smoking daily and it has been one of the most positive and rewarding things I've ever done.

 

But you do have to start really slow. Don't puff on it like a cigarette. Tiny puff. Wait 15 minutes before deciding if you want another tiny puff. Burning it hotter makes it more psychoactive. Tiny puffs that aren't burning too hot are better for beginners. I really believe that most people who get paranoid with it are just overdoing it too soon. I did that a couple of times when I first tried it and I thought it wasn't for me.

 

My mom really likes the CBD oil and everyone that I know likes the CBD strains for pain, but for me, it's just more headaches and more body pain with those. Increased anxiety too! As with everything else, you have to try things in small amounts and listen to your body.

 

Magnolis - at first I didn't realize this was a quote from solaceandpeace, but I just went over to the Valium/Diazepam Support thread to read her other entries....

I have had the same reaction to CBD! In some formulations, it gives me intense anxiety. I assumed it had something to do with my psych med history, but it happened to my husband too, and he's never had a psych med. I gave him a CBD capsule when he was having a stressful period at work, and it made him so sick and shaky he had to lie down for the rest of the day. So I guess there's a few of us out there with paradoxical reactions. And I don't know if all formulations of CBD would do this to me, but right now I only take CBD when it is blended with other cannabinoids.

 

I think all of these little anomalies will makes sense to us as MJ medications become more mainstream. There will be studies, and we will understand the nuances. But for now, I feel a bit like I'm part of an unofficial clinical trial, and I'm very grateful to be a part of it, even if I take some missteps along the way. That said, I would love to find a low dose CBD that helped me with breakthrough anxiety. Every year, during the holiday season, my anxiety gets the best of me, in spite of my best efforts with coping skills. It has to do with the trauma in my past, and I continue to work on that. But it sure would be nice to have some help along the way. So I haven't closed the door on CBD, but I sure do need more guidance. And the pharmacist in CT simply just don't know enough. Maybe our collective experiences shared here at BB will lead us to some answers!

[[Af...]]

So what does that mean? Still confused. Or benzo brain.

This is dense stuff, Stephen, go easy on yourself. When I was where you are I couldn't have even type let alone process scientific information - you're doing great! 

[[Be...]]

Hello everyone!

 

I just found this thread. Glad that we are able to share info re medical MJ  on the forum  

 

I have been off of benzo poison for 3.5 yrs now. I am almost healed but still experience some waves & insomnia. I am now considering using MJ to induce sleep. CBN seems to be the way from my research. The CBD hemp stuff does not agree with me, so yesterday I made a 60ml batch of oil using a .5oz of male plant &  .25g of indica bud. I used a double boiler & slow cooked on low for 9 hours.  Hopefully the THC fron the indica bud will mostly be converted to CBN & will be enough to induce a good nights sleep. I will be trying the oil tonight.

 

Thinking of starting with .125ml & see if it helps me to sleep. Any thoughts? (btw, I have used MJ recreationally for 45yrs only abstaining for 3 yrs (since 2011 when I jumped/tapered benzo poison)

 

Does anyone have info on the male plant? I know it is low in THC. I cannot seem to find much info on the male plant & medicinal uses.

 

Thxs! 

[Guest [ba...]]

Leaves typically contain 0.5 to 1.0%  (dry weight percent) of THC if it is a THC-dominant plant.  It can be higher (or lower), but this is the usual range.

 

Using a boiling temperature for 9 hours will certainly decarboxylate the cannabinoids.  However, in my (limited) experience, higher temperatures are needed to efficiently convert THC -> CBN.  I did a small experiment last year to examine the times and temperatures to do that conversion.  While not a complete experiment by any means, I achieved a maximum yield using a temperature of 160C (320F) and 8 hours of time.  My container was open and I lost a fair amount due to evaporation (stunk up the lab really good).  If done in a sealed container (seal after temperature is achieved to avoid pressure/explosion issues), the yield should be significantly higher.

 

For you nerds out there, here is the dataset.  This is un-replicated data.  Use at your own risk.

 

http://enchantedskies.net/THC_to_CBN.jpg

[[Ch...]]

High thc affects gaba receptors like benzos.  Minimal to no thc in the form of cbn  for sleep and cnb are  non psychoactive and gaba is not affected.  There is a product by marys medicinal that is a cbn transdermal patch that bypasses the liver.

 

For what it's worth, this is still unknown.  I attended a conference in April that hosted a number of experts in the field of medical marijuana and asked this question directly of Dr. Dustin Sulak (Healer.com) and Dr. Donald Abrams of UCSF, who is an oncologist.  Both said that no one knows the answer to this question at this time.  Research is needed, and research is prohibited as long as cannabis is a Schedule 1 substance.

 

What is known is that cannabis affects CB1 and CB2 receptors and the endo-cannabinoid system, which is perfectly designed to utilize cannabinoids.

[Guest [ba...]]

fwiw - That resin that accumulates in your pipe is enriched for CBN (cannabinol).  I just cleaned out my old pipe and about 1/4 of the THC had converted to CBN. 

[[li...]]

Well folks,

 

I just came back from a local dispensary, and the Mary's Medicinals CBN patches were $15 each.  They are good for up to 12 hours of wear, but for me, who needs this almost every night for pain and sleep,  it is not at all cost effective.  Darn....

 

[[Ma...]]

Livestrong. 

If you live in Colorado there is a dispensary selling the mm patches for $8. I was also told you can sit them in half.

 

 

[[Af...]]

Leaves typically contain 0.5 to 1.0%  (dry weight percent) of THC if it is a THC-dominant plant.  It can be higher (or lower), but this is the usual range.

 

Using a boiling temperature for 9 hours will certainly decarboxylate the cannabinoids.  However, in my (limited) experience, higher temperatures are needed to efficiently convert THC -> CBN.  I did a small experiment last year to examine the times and temperatures to do that conversion.  While not a complete experiment by any means, I achieved a maximum yield using a temperature of 160C (320F) and 8 hours of time.  My container was open and I lost a fair amount due to evaporation (stunk up the lab really good).  If done in a sealed container (seal after temperature is achieved to avoid pressure/explosion issues), the yield should be significantly higher.

 

For you nerds out there, here is the dataset.  This is un-replicated data.  Use at your own risk.

 

http://enchantedskies.net/THC_to_CBN.jpg

 

Thx Bads, I have no idea what this means  but I have a friend who does!

[[su...]]

Happy to see the thread I started get so much action but sorry I missed it.  I'm using a CBD oil syringe that tastes exactly like cannabis. The first time I used it I felt it big time. I tried it during the day when I was having high anxiety and nothing happened that I noticed. The next day I tried again but took more and that was a mistake because I felt kind of high but not in a good way. That said, it did help with sleep and pain!  It's $80 for a syringe so it's expensive. My state is medical only and the prices are steep. You can't really shop around, you have to pick a dispensary.

 

I've tried vaping some low THC strains but I think I like the oil the best. It's called Sweet Relief.

 

Anyone using flowers with good results?

[[Ma...]]

I am so happy to see this thread! I have been using cannabis to help with my taper for almost a year now. I used to use high CBD Indica strains and edibles to help with pain, stomach and GI issues, and sleep. I am now using CBD oil every day to help with many Sxs. CBN oil many nights to help with sleep. I am going to try using MM topically more.

 

I have been seeing a MM consultant and he is helping others get off harmful meds including benzos. He has helped some of my friends. He is doing a free online class about MM for people harmed by benzos. He will talk about the different cannabinoids and answer questions. If you are interested PM me and I will give you more info. It's Oct 5th at 7pm eastern time.

 

I am excited to talk to others about how MM is helping them. I know it's not for everyone but it has helped me.

 

XO Maya

[[mi...]]

I'm seeing a functional medicine doctor in two weeks. I'm really excited about it. Out of curiosity, though, did you quit the Prilosec after quitting benzos? My understanding is that most people already on a PPI (17 years on Prilosec for me) should wait to quit until they've tapered.

 

Yes, I was 1Yr free before I found him. You have very good questions. I would wait to take any action until you have your consult. I hope this doc is a good fit for you!

 

Thanks. I'm definitely going to wait. I was just wondering your situation. Looking at your sig it looks like you fought a tough battle. Congratulations. Gives me hope as someone who was polydrugged for 13 years that I might have a chance.

Yes, we have a similar background, and it sounds like you're doing all the right things. I wish I had found my functional medicine MD sooner - I'm still repairing collateral damage that might have been prevented if I was better informed. You have every reason to have hope - count on it!

 

I'm looking into d-limonene for acid reflux. My Dr is trying to put me on a PPI, and apparently taking one capsule of this every other day for 20 days can cure reflux for up to 6 months. I'm still going to do more research, but it sounds promising. It also has supposed cancer preventing mechanisms.

[[Ma...]]

I found this article in Leaf Science concerning Gaba and Marijuana. I am just beginning this journey into learning about this. Could someone read this, with knowledge, and comment? I think it indicates that Gaba receptors are bypassed when ingesting cannabinoids.

 

http://www.leafscience.com/2014/05/10/marijuana-dopamine-science/

 

 

When compared to this explanation of how Benzo's affect  Gaba by "enhancing", it appears that marijuana does the opposite by "Blocking"or "bypassing" these receptor's.

 

http://www.reconnexion.org.au/how-do-benzodiazepines-work/w1/i1023212/