Medical Marijuana

[Guest [ba...]]

Great chart badsocref!  I'm on a CBD oil which helps with appetite promotion some but, would like to increase it even more to maintain my weight during withdrawal/tapering. I'm, leery of THC and psychological benzo withdrawal affects.  Any suggestions?  Thanks!

 

Sorry to say that I don't have any suggestions.  THC is pretty much the cannabinoid that brings on the munchies.

[[Bu...]]

Thanks anyways Badsocref.

 

Best wishes Aft35yrs!

[[Af...]]

I’m back to give an update - I’ve had my MMJ card for 3 weeks now, and have tried quite a few different products, but so far, none has been the answer to my sleeplessness. There’s a bigger learning curve involved with MMJ than I realized.

 

Oddly, the CBD capsules actually made me anxious instead of calming me. I also tried sublingual strips that contained equal parts THC and CBD, but the effect was very mild. And I tried a tincture that was mostly THC, from an Indica strain, and it was very relaxing, but the effect only lasted a couple of hours. Then I tried a capsule with much higher THC – 50mg/pill – and it was way too strong. In fact, it was really uncomfortable – I felt like I was back in acute, and the effect didn’t wear off for 18 hours.

 

So far, my best results have been from vaping an Indica oil cartridge. I use it at bedtime, and again when I wake up in the middle of the night.

 

I bought a vaporizer, for flower, but the dispensary doesn’t have any ‘nighttime indicas’ in stock right now. (I hadn’t thought about the fact that their stock is constantly changing as different crops are harvested –duh.) But I’m told that a really good strain for sleep is due in another week or so. There are only 4 growers for the program in my state, so the variety and selection is much more limited than, say, CA or CO.

 

So it’s an ongoing process, and I’m quite sure I will find a good match for my needs, but I’m taking quite a few missteps along the way. And the cost of the products adds up quickly. I’ve been through $600 already- that’s a lot of start-up cost.

 

I just found out that the pharmacist may be able to special order some CBN oil from one of the state’s growers for me. But it’s expensive. Not sure exactly how much, but I think I will try it at least once, because I’ve read so many good things about CBN.

 

Sorry for the long post, but I thought maybe others who are also thinking of beginning this process might like to hear what it’s been like for me so far. I was especially unprepared for the sheer variety of products available, and the costs of ‘trying’ things. That would be my take home message for others – be prepared to spend more than you think you’ll need to, until you get it right.

 

Thanks again for all the education I've gotten here - you've all been really helpful!

 

 

[[Bu...]]

Thank-you for posting Aft35yrs.  Sorry a lot of those things aren't helping your sleep more.  Too bad the CBD oil made you more anxious...ugh.  I find that the CBD oil helps my anxiety and to relax usually but, doesn't do a lot for sleep..  Others here have said that the CBN is the way to go for sleep. Please let us know if it helps you.  I'm thinking of trying it, too.  Take care!

[[Ma...]]

Aft35yrs,

Thanks for the update. I meant to post to you awhile ago. If you are in MA PM me and I can help you with a couple things. I also have a consultation with a MM expert this week. I will give updates on what he said, if anyone is interested. He does know about Benzos.

 

Capsules and tincture do not work for me. I am a rapid metabolizer of most meds and I wonder of this is why. Edibles do work on me though. I am surprised the CBD capsule made you anxious. I would start with 5-10mg of anything. That, unfortunately, would not do much for me now. It would in the beginning. I am surprised CBD made you anxious. It does the opposite to me and many. I am so sorry.

 

I think it sounds like the indica oil is best. I like it, but it is harsh for my lungs right now. I find vapimg easier. I have had some respiratory issues while tapering. For sleep indica nuggets have been most helpful for me. Sleep is one of the main things I want to talk to the mm consultant about. Also he said he can help me use cannabis more effectively. You are right about the cost adding up. I also have not found any CBN. There have been protests in MA about a lot of this issues. I also notice that the dispensaries are getting more and more products in. The people who work there told me that more new products will be coming. Also if in MA it is hopefully going to be completely legalized here this year. Also many dispensaries let you return products if you tried them once or twice and most of it is still there.

 

I hope that this was of some help. I know it can be hard to find the right products etc. I am hope your dispensary gets in some more helpful products.

 

XO Maya

[[Af...]]

Hi BurnedOut, I told my Functional Med. MD about my anxiety reaction to CBD, and he said he’s heard of it before - kind of paradoxical. Like how most people take benadryl and get sleepy, but some take it and get revved up. I guess my point was just for people who are trying it for the first time to be careful. Interestingly , when the CBD is blended with THC, I’m OK. I’ve read that there’s a sort of synergistic effect when the cannabinoids are all kept together, and not isolated, and maybe there’s something to that. I’ll come back and post about the CBN product, for  sure, if I ever get my hands on it.

 

Hi Maya, I would LOVE to know what your MM expert has to say! Especially with regards to staying asleep. Medibles work for me too. Before I started this whole process, I was given a brownie by a friend, and slept 7 hours. I haven’t made my own yet, partially because I’m trying to stay away from sugar, and partially because I don’t want to stink up the house with MJ (I have a young son). But that may be the answer. I wish I did live in MA so we could compare notes on strains, but I live in CT. Our products are still pretty limited here.

 

It took me a couple of weeks before I figured out that the official dispensary Strain Names are mandated by the state to have no resemblance to the common names for the strains. So in order to read up on the different strains in a resource like Leafly, I first have to consult a third party database that translates all the CT strain names into the common names that everyone else can relate to. For example, the bud I have now is called Indicol H, but it’s street name is Star Killer. So the state is making things more oblique then they need to be. Big surprise.

 

So, yes, let’s share notes as we move forward - lots to learn!

Aft 

[[jo...]]

Although rare some people have a very bad reaction to pot during their first try. I was a paramedic for 30 and I dealt with a lot of overdose cases. I also ran into some people that had a severe anxiety reaction to smoking pot. Out of curiosity I spoke to a neurologist  about that and He said Yes some people do have a problem. Its up to the individual to decide. 

 

Between My 30 years working rotating shifts and My life long genetic depressive illness the benzo did in My sleep completely. It was extremely hard to get back what I have now which is between 4 to 6 hours a night. I personally use breathing meditation along with 1mg of melatonin and 500mg of L tryptophan power blended in to a cup of hot milk and a half teaspoon of honey. Works for Me and obviously I avoid stimulants like caffeine etc.

[[Bu...]]

Aft35yrs,

 

Unfortunately, paradoxical reactions seem to be fairly common trying to titrate off benzos-they just mess with our systems so much...ugh!  I had many paradoxical reactions for awhile to even vit c and b.  Maybe you will be able to tolerate the CBD at a later date. Glad you are ok with the blended though.  That's great you are doing a lot of research on all this-so much to learn indeed!  I'm finding that the CBD oil is really helping me with the anxiety as I get lower on my dose.  I am grateful.  Take care!

 

 

[[Ma...]]

 

Hi Maya, I would LOVE to know what your MM expert has to say! Especially with regards to staying asleep. Medibles work for me too. Before I started this whole process, I was given a brownie by a friend, and slept 7 hours. I haven’t made my own yet, partially because I’m trying to stay away from sugar, and partially because I don’t want to stink up the house with MJ (I have a young son). But that may be the answer. I wish I did live in MA so we could compare notes on strains, but I live in CT. Our products are still pretty limited here.

 

It took me a couple of weeks before I figured out that the official dispensary Strain Names are mandated by the state to have no resemblance to the common names for the strains. So in order to read up on the different strains in a resource like Leafly, I first have to consult a third party database that translates all the CT strain names into the common names that everyone else can relate to. For example, the bud I have now is called Indicol H, but it’s street name is Star Killer. So the state is making things more oblique then they need to be. Big surprise.

 

So, yes, let’s share notes as we move forward - lots to learn!

Aft 

Hey Aft,

I see him later today. The main reason I started using MM was my stomach Sxs. Now I use it for sleep too. I will ask about both and let you know. I can't eat brownies because of my stomach issues. I buy lozenges or caramels. It adds up. You can buy MM coconut oil and things like that at other dispensaries. I have star killer too. Here they let us have the name. There have been protests here about the dispensaries costs and lack of products. There are also people who have to drive hours. The process of opening a dispensary is a long one. There are issues with a lot states. I didn't realize it was like that in CT. The worst is NY. It is sad becasue it is such a wonderful medicine. Things will keep improving at the dispensaries product wise etc. I would love to share notes!

XO Maya

[[Bu...]]

Thanks Maya!    Hugs

[[Af...]]

Hi everyone, I just learned of a great educational resource for MMJ.

Dr. Dustin Sulak, from Maine, has just launched a Cannabis Education website (4 weeks ago).

- Healer.com http://healer.com/#

It’s free, but you do need to register in order to view the instructional videos. A monetary contribution is optional, but not mandatory. I just joined and am viewing some right now….. He's really good!

[[Af...]]

I’m back with good news – I want to report on my experiences with using CBN for sleep:  IT’S HELPING!!!

 

My dispensary finally got some CBN oil concentrate.  $22.

1ml syringe = 75mg THC, 50mg CBD, 104mg CBN = 5 doses.

So each dose has approx. 20mg CBN. (For comparison, Mary’s Medicinals sells CBN patches with 10mg CBN).

 

I mix the oil concentrate with a teaspoon of applesauce, and take it 2 hrs before bedtime. It doesn’t help me go to sleep, but it really helps me stay asleep. I’m sleeping 6+ hrs/night, and that’s a miracle for me! Very little psychoactivity, just deep muscle relaxation, and no ruminating thoughts to keep me awake.

 

I’ve also tried making my own CBN by converting the THCA in  MJ flower to CBN through a process of double decarboxylation.  Again, I mix the double-decarbed flower (1 teaspoon) with some applesauce and eat it about 2 hrs before bedtime.

It’s a little bit more psychoactive this way, but that’s probably adjustable by choosing a different strain of bud.

 

I can’t have my house smelling like MJ because I have a child, so I bought an odorless decarboxylator, and I just love it.  It’s expensive, but it makes the MJ last so much longer that I’m sure I will recoup the cost within 6 months. It’s called the Ardent Nova, and the woman who designed it lives in MA. She's been very helpful to me. Here's her story:

http://www.ardentcannabis.com/founders-story/

 

If you’d like to learn more about decarboxylation, she has a free pdf download on her site called “Decarb Myths Debunked,” that is very well done.

http://www.ardentcannabis.com/education/

 

I won’t put a link to her product, because that would be a commercial link, but I do highly recommend it. It’s easy and it makes the flower sooo much more effective, I can use much less.

 

Hope this is useful to someone. I’m giving a big thumbs-up to CBN for sleep.

[Guest [ba...]]

Good to hear that it's working for you.  I downloaded the decarboxylation document.  Would have been better for her to share temperatures and times for efficient decarboxylation, but she probably wants to sell her units.

 

Oil and applesauce, eh?  Doesn't sound very tasty. 

[[Af...]]

Bads, Ha! Actually, all I taste is the applesauce, but it does sound gross.

I thought of you when I bought the Nova, because i know you can do all of that processing-stuff really well, and it probably seems like a gimmick - but it;s truly a life-saver for me, b/c my husband couldn't stand the smell of the vaporizer, let alone if i tried to baked the stuff for a few hours in the oven!

btw- I asked a mutual friend about your screen name - I said, "bad soccer referee?" - and she confirmed. I love it! (i get it, I still don't know the rules either) 

[[Li...]]

I would like to report my experience since it was just last weekend. I went to Denver for a conference and tried a VERY small amount of an edible indica strain from a recreational dispensary (cheeba chews).  I had about an hour or so of anxiety, and I was unable to fall asleep at all that night. However, since that time, I have slept better than I have in months. Granted it's only 4 days sample size, but last night I actually got 8 hours (with a few awakenings) and I haven't been able to say that in years! Is it possible the MJ has helped me that long? I dread when this good wave ends; if it is related to the MJ then I'm out of luck as my ultra conservative home state of South Carolina probably won't legalize medical MJ for a long time.

[[Af...]]

Lightfoot, too bad you live in an illegal state; it’s nice to at least have the option of exploring medical cannabis. Hopefully, as the medical applications of MJ are better documented, the laws will relax. But I know that doesn’t help you now. 

 

I haven’t heard of a delayed and sustained reaction like you may have experienced, but I’m new to cannabis too, so hopefully some other members may be of more help to you. Still, it’s awesome that you got some sleep, even if you don’t quite know why!

 

Insomnia is also my achilles heel, and during my taper and w/d I experienced a broken sleep pattern and early wake-ups like you are.  I’d be jolted awake with my heart pounding, full-body sweats, and wild dreams. But I wasn’t a medical marijuana patient at that time. Instead, I used and alpha blocker called prazosin for the intrusive dreams, and a beta blocker called propranolol for the racing heart. After about a year, I tapered off both of them with no problem. 

 

Would I have preferred to make use of the more natural medical benefits of the various cannabinoids? Definitely. But I mention my experience because there’s no one right way to get through this benzo mess, and my blood pressure meds did me no harm, and enabled me to function better. It was the best I could do at the time.

 

BB member BurnedOut reports using CBD oil from hemp for her w/d sxs with success. And it’s legal to ship to any state.  Might be worth investigating. She posted about it recently:

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=157199.10

 

I hope your sleep continues to improve, and if it doesn’t, I hope you find a few coping tools that make it more bearable. My sleep is finally improving, but it's been a long road. Hang in there, things will continue to get better.

[Guest [ba...]]

Consider writing your elected state and national officials about decriminalizing or legalizing MMJ.  Party politics are strong, but most congressmen/senators at least tally the letters they receive on a given subject.  Enough letters will help (at least a little).  Even Texas has passed some kind of legislation which would allow high CBD cannabis to be available to some individuals. 

 

I think that if Hillary prevails, we might finally see a federal relaxation in the schedule I designation.  States will follow the federal lead (some slower than others).

[[An...]]

I am hoping to bring this topic to a current status in that I am interested in others' experience who have tried this.  Is this legitimate?  Does MM help with issues such anxiety and insomnia, or does it merely rev up symptoms in general? If it helps, how do you go about it?

[[Ch...]]

There are some other threads about medical marijuana, let me see if I can round them up for you and post some links here.  In general, I would recommend CBD oil that is not psychoactive for withdrawal issues.

 

Hang on, let me go see what I can find for you.

[[Ch...]]

Here's a long thread from Alternative Therapies: http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=91680.0

Any posts by badsocref are likely to be spot on.

[Guest [ba...]]

Here's a long thread from Alternative Therapies: http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=91680.0

Any posts by badsocref are likely to be spot on.

 

You're much too kind.  The State did approve our testing lab!!

 

AndrewLuke - MMJ might help with anxiety (or not).  Some people find it very relaxing; some get anxious.  Same for sleep.  It can be a godsend to help relax the mind at bedtime, but if you are one of those individuals who gets nervous / paranoid when you use it, then it won't help much of anything that you probably care about.

 

How to go about it??  I'd start by smoking a small amount (1 hit) of something mellow (not 28% Girl Scout Cookies) to see how it affects you.  I would stay away from edibles until you know more (edibles can last a long time).  If you have a favorable reaction, then you can try a little more.  If you are feeling pretty good about your experience, you can try an edible (start in the 5-10 mg range - no higher).  Edibles can last for 6-8 hours and can give a wonderful night's sleep (and a very mellow feeling in the morning).  There's so much info out there these days.  No way to communicate it in a few paragraphs.  Feel free to PM me if you want to know anything specific.  You'll need a script unless you're planning a trip to Colorado or the Pacific Northwest.

[[Ch...]]

By the way, bads, thanks for this...great reference.  I use it all the time.

 

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk166/Challis2/980x_zps3r00ltbx.jpg

[[Ch...]]

And congrats on the lab approval! 

[[Ar...]]

I live in Michigan where it is legal to buy MM.  I got my MMJ card and for the next year almost I tried one strain after another to help with pain and insomnia.  Nothing worked.  Being a non smoker I have only bought edibles.  Maybe that is my problem.  I would love to know how you go about finding a strain that works.

[Guest [ba...]]

Several things come to mind...

 

Strong as it is, it's often not quite as strong as the benzos that it's trying to replace.  I used cannabis a lot during my withdrawal, and sometimes it didn't work well.  Even when it did, I often would get only 3-4 hours of sleep.  It was better than nothing.  It got a lot better a few months after I was off benzos.

 

What dose (of edibles) did you take?  Did you feel any effect?  Do you know any of the concentrations of the various cannabinoids from the edibles that you tried?

 

Smoked cannabis tends to hit harder (but shorter) than ingested cannabis.  There's also a little conversion of THC to CBN when you smoke it, and CBN (cannabinol) is a pretty good sedative.

 

It's hard to recommend a particular strain, since there isn't always good uniformity for a particular strain from producer to producer.  But fwiw - I've got an OG Kush that's working pretty good for me now.