Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[Ju...]]

 

 

I am also open to doing liquid titration if I need to. I just prefer to dry cut MT now, if possible. I don't drink milk and it seems like a lot to dissolve my pills in alcohol and then put in water. Again I really appreciate the help! I don't know how I would of continued tapering without finding this site.

 

XO Maya

  It's a whole lot simpler (and more reliable) than cutting/filing/weighing pills.  It takes about 5 minutes to prepare enough lqiuid to last 7-10 days.

 

Maya, I have just started my liquid titration and it is very very easy. I got some oral syringes from the pharmacy but had to get the 1ml from the vet. I dissolve my .5mg K with 2ml of vodka and then add 100ml of water. I remove what I am supposed to toss and then add another 100ml of orange juice. It makes it far more palatable. So far so good, I'm on day 10 and have not had any WD symptoms. I would like to go faster but after some good advice on this forum will keep it the same.

 

Good luck to you!

[[jj...]]

Maya, not to contradict your doctor, but other than both being benzos, valium and klonopin are very different drugs. First, klonopin is much more potent, binds more tightly to the receptor sites and doesn't break down into active metabolites. This makes it harder to taper from. Second, although k is considered a drug with a longer half life, it's pretty short compared with v making interdose withdrawal more of a possibility. Some people can't crossover from k to v or don't want to risk it, but they are very very different drugs.

[[Ul...]]

Just like Robert Plant, I'm "dazed and confused" ♫ ♪

 

Out of here for 2+ days for work. No computer. All of y'all be safe!!

 

Catch ya soon (keep rockin', Maya).

 

Jeff

 

Geaux Tigers

[[...]]

 

 

I am also open to doing liquid titration if I need to. I just prefer to dry cut MT now, if possible. I don't drink milk and it seems like a lot to dissolve my pills in alcohol and then put in water. Again I really appreciate the help! I don't know how I would of continued tapering without finding this site.

 

XO Maya

  It's a whole lot simpler (and more reliable) than cutting/filing/weighing pills.  It takes about 5 minutes to prepare enough lqiuid to last 7-10 days.

 

Maya, I have just started my liquid titration and it is very very easy. I got some oral syringes from the pharmacy but had to get the 1ml from the vet. I dissolve my .5mg K with 2ml of vodka and then add 100ml of water. I remove what I am supposed to toss and then add another 100ml of orange juice. It makes it far more palatable. So far so good, I'm on day 10 and have not had any WD symptoms. I would like to go faster but after some good advice on this forum will keep it the same.

 

Good luck to you!

 

Hi Judy B,

  I just noticed you add 100ml of water to your two mls of vodka with the K in it. Probally should be adding it to 98mls of water to be accurate with your micro tapering. Rose

[[Ma...]]

 

 

I am also open to doing liquid titration if I need to. I just prefer to dry cut MT now, if possible. I don't drink milk and it seems like a lot to dissolve my pills in alcohol and then put in water. Again I really appreciate the help! I don't know how I would of continued tapering without finding this site.

 

XO Maya

  It's a whole lot simpler (and more reliable) than cutting/filing/weighing pills.  It takes about 5 minutes to prepare enough lqiuid to last 7-10 days.

 

Maya, I have just started my liquid titration and it is very very easy. I got some oral syringes from the pharmacy but had to get the 1ml from the vet. I dissolve my .5mg K with 2ml of vodka and then add 100ml of water. I remove what I am supposed to toss and then add another 100ml of orange juice. It makes it far more palatable. So far so good, I'm on day 10 and have not had any WD symptoms. I would like to go faster but after some good advice on this forum will keep it the same.

 

Good luck to you!

Judy,

That makes me feel better. It seems confusing. I'm sure I will get the hang of it. I'm glad it's going so well for you! I am going to try liquid titration after I get the hang of MT with the scale because I just need to get MT first. I'm also on a high dose. That's great that you have no sympto,s and are at such a low dose! Thank you! I hope your taper continues to be easy and you are off soon!

 

XO Maya

[[bu...]]

 

Hi Judy B,

  I just noticed you add 100ml of water to your two mls of vodka with the K in it. Probally should be adding it to 98mls of water to be accurate with your micro tapering. Rose

  You are correct regarding the proportions.  But if she always does it the same way, it really won't make any difference.

 

Consistency is more important than accuracy.

[[ga...]]

Just like Robert Plant, I'm "dazed and confused" ♫ ♪

 

Out of here for 2+ days for work. No computer. All of y'all be safe!!

 

Catch ya soon (keep rockin', Maya).

 

Jeff

 

Geaux Tigers

 

Happy no computer, Jeff! See you back soon.

[[ga...]]

 

Hi Judy B,

  I just noticed you add 100ml of water to your two mls of vodka with the K in it. Probally should be adding it to 98mls of water to be accurate with your micro tapering. Rose

  You are correct regarding the proportions.  But if she always does it the same way, it really won't make any difference.

 

Consistency is more important than accuracy.

 

I was thinking the same thing, builder. She needs to be consistent. Add the exact same amount of diluting liquid every time. I like the 2+98=100 better, though.

[[dp...]]

Have any of you guys still gotten severe symptoms crop up even with the micro-tapering? Cut from 5.5mg Val to 5.0mg Val in the past 3 weeks and am now getting slammed hard holding at 5.0mg... breathing issues, severe memory issues, dp/dr, hard to walk and get out of bed, very dizzy and disoriented, sick... etc.

[[ga...]]

Have any of you guys still gotten severe symptoms crop up even with the micro-tapering? Cut from 5.5mg Val to 5.0mg Val in the past 3 weeks and am now getting slammed hard holding at 5.0mg... breathing issues, severe memory issues, dp/dr, hard to walk and get out of bed, very dizzy and disoriented, sick... etc.

 

At one point I was doing a daily taper that I thought was micro, but really was too fast for me. And I was slammed really, really bad. This could be what is happening to you. I'm sorry to hear about it. I suggest you hold at the same dose until it passes. It will pass. And then start again at a much slower pace.

[[St...]]

Quick question for everyone. I switched to liquid a couple of months ago. I've been using a small syringe to basically take down my dose when I feel comfortable doing so. So basically like a cut and hold more than a micro-taper. My doctor isn't very smart about taper plans per se and I'm not sure if I'm ready to "taper" officially yet. All the same, I've managed to cut down to 4.6 to see how I feel (down from 5mg) and so far I feel fine. No symptoms of withdrawal. Is that a sign that I can keep drawing it down gradually? I'm going in increments of 0.05 every week or so.

[[jj...]]

Quick question for everyone. I switched to liquid a couple of months ago. I've been using a small syringe to basically take down my dose when I feel comfortable doing so. So basically like a cut and hold more than a micro-taper. My doctor isn't very smart about taper plans per se and I'm not sure if I'm ready to "taper" officially yet. All the same, I've managed to cut down to 4.6 to see how I feel (down from 5mg) and so far I feel fine. No symptoms of withdrawal. Is that a sign that I can keep drawing it down gradually? I'm going in increments of 0.05 every week or so.

 

Hi Stephen, IMO, if you want to really want come off and stay off, you need some determination to get to zero. The goal isn't necessarily to have a symptom free taper, it's to taper at such a rate that the symptoms of withdrawal don't become incapacitating. Trying to stay symptom free just keeps a person updosing or reinstating when there are problems and then never getting off and actually healing from the drug. If you've had withdrawal before, it's unlikely that you won't again even if you go super slow. Not to say that it doesn't sometimes happen that way, just that it doesn't happen very often. The more likely outcome is that you eventually go into tolerance withdrawal the way you are going now. Just my $.02.

[[St...]]

My body went into extreme shock last time and I had to reinstate. I went from 3MG of Klonopin to 0mg of Valium in about 10 months. So I'm trying to strike a balance. I mapped out the cut and hold in a spreadsheet and it's way to slow. Even weaning 0.05mg per week has me off 5/20/2017. That seems too long as well, but I don't know. Thoughts?

[[Ju...]]

 

Hi Judy B,

  I just noticed you add 100ml of water to your two mls of vodka with the K in it. Probally should be adding it to 98mls of water to be accurate with your micro tapering. Rose

  You are correct regarding the proportions.  But if she always does it the same way, it really won't make any difference.

 

Consistency is more important than accuracy.

 

I was thinking the same thing, builder. She needs to be consistent. Add the exact same amount of diluting liquid every time. I like the 2+98=100 better, though.

 

I stand corrected. You folks are too good.  My mistake in communicating. I am doing what I was told, ie 2ml + 98ml for 100 total. Thanks for clarifying my post as it was my mistake!

[[...]]

.05mg a week is .007mg/day if you were doing a daily taper.  That is a VERY slow rate and it is almost certain you can handle quite a bit more than that and still feel fine.  You might even be able to handle .05mg a day at your current dose so I am not at all surprised you don't feel symptoms.  It is not uncommon to see people on daily tapers cutting .05mg V a day at your dose so that gives you some idea to figure how much time it will take.  21 months, while it could happen, is not the norm.  More like 6-10 months.  As you drop lower you will need to slow, but this will happen gradually.

[[Ju...]]

 

 

I am also open to doing liquid titration if I need to. I just prefer to dry cut MT now, if possible. I don't drink milk and it seems like a lot to dissolve my pills in alcohol and then put in water. Again I really appreciate the help! I don't know how I would of continued tapering without finding this site.

 

XO Maya

  It's a whole lot simpler (and more reliable) than cutting/filing/weighing pills.  It takes about 5 minutes to prepare enough lqiuid to last 7-10 days.

 

Maya, I have just started my liquid titration and it is very very easy. I got some oral syringes from the pharmacy but had to get the 1ml from the vet. I dissolve my .5mg K with 2ml of vodka and then add 100ml of water. I remove what I am supposed to toss and then add another 100ml of orange juice. It makes it far more palatable. So far so good, I'm on day 10 and have not had any WD symptoms. I would like to go faster but after some good advice on this forum will keep it the same.

 

Good luck to you!

Judy,

That makes me feel better. It seems confusing. I'm sure I will get the hang of it. I'm glad it's going so well for you! I am going to try liquid titration after I get the hang of MT with the scale because I just need to get MT first. I'm also on a high dose. That's great that you have no sympto,s and are at such a low dose! Thank you! I hope your taper continues to be easy and you are off soon!

 

XO Maya

 

I may be on a low dose but my dr recommended a fast taper which on day 2 I knew was a mistake. So even at my small dose the large % he had me cut caused horrible wd symptoms. The micro taper for me is very slight but is minimizing any side effects. At this rate it will be Jan or Feb before I'm completely off. A long time and I'm impatient but I'm going to stick to it. I created an excel spreadsheet to help me know exactly what to cut each day.

[[jj...]]

My body went into extreme shock last time and I had to reinstate. I went from 3MG of Klonopin to 0mg of Valium in about 10 months. So I'm trying to strike a balance. I mapped out the cut and hold in a spreadsheet and it's way to slow. Even weaning 0.05mg per week has me off 5/20/2017. That seems too long as well, but I don't know. Thoughts?

 

I'm sorry Stephen, I saw .05 and my mind registered .005 which is how I finished the last tiny bit of my taper. Yeah, 3mg k to zero in 10 months was crazy fast. Maybe try .02 daily or even .01 daily for a while and see how it goes. You can always speed up if you are doing fine. Personally I think that cutting and holding even small amounts like that are more irritating than finding a rate that you can daily taper at. You might actually find yourself cutting faster that way and still felling reasonably okay.

[[sh...]]

Quick question for everyone. I switched to liquid a couple of months ago. I've been using a small syringe to basically take down my dose when I feel comfortable doing so. So basically like a cut and hold more than a micro-taper. My doctor isn't very smart about taper plans per se and I'm not sure if I'm ready to "taper" officially yet. All the same, I've managed to cut down to 4.6 to see how I feel (down from 5mg) and so far I feel fine. No symptoms of withdrawal. Is that a sign that I can keep drawing it down gradually? I'm going in increments of 0.05 every week or so.

 

Yes.  If you are feeling good then cut again.  Of course smaller more frequent cuts seem to be easier to handle.  Each cut from diazepam can take up to 10 days to feel from what ive read here.  So if you are cutting and holding, i would wait at least 10 days between each cut.

 

Stay strong!

sharkey

[[Ma...]]

 

 

I am also open to doing liquid titration if I need to. I just prefer to dry cut MT now, if possible. I don't drink milk and it seems like a lot to dissolve my pills in alcohol and then put in water. Again I really appreciate the help! I don't know how I would of continued tapering without finding this site.

 

XO Maya

  It's a whole lot simpler (and more reliable) than cutting/filing/weighing pills.  It takes about 5 minutes to prepare enough lqiuid to last 7-10 days.

 

Maya, I have just started my liquid titration and it is very very easy. I got some oral syringes from the pharmacy but had to get the 1ml from the vet. I dissolve my .5mg K with 2ml of vodka and then add 100ml of water. I remove what I am supposed to toss and then add another 100ml of orange juice. It makes it far more palatable. So far so good, I'm on day 10 and have not had any WD symptoms. I would like to go faster but after some good advice on this forum will keep it the same.

 

Good luck to you!

Judy,

That makes me feel better. It seems confusing. I'm sure I will get the hang of it. I'm glad it's going so well for you! I am going to try liquid titration after I get the hang of MT with the scale because I just need to get MT first. I'm also on a high dose. That's great that you have no sympto,s and are at such a low dose! Thank you! I hope your taper continues to be easy and you are off soon!

 

XO Maya

 

I may be on a low dose but my dr recommended a fast taper which on day 2 I knew was a mistake. So even at my small dose the large % he had me cut caused horrible wd symptoms. The micro taper for me is very slight but is minimizing any side effects. At this rate it will be Jan or Feb before I'm completely off. A long time and I'm impatient but I'm going to stick to it. I created an excel spreadsheet to help me know exactly what to cut each day.

A fast taper is a big mistake on any dose. Most Drs recommend too fast a taper IMO. It's the % of the dose that matters not the amount. It seems some people find it harder the lower they go and have to go even slower. I really hope that's not the case with me. I just think it's great that you are on a low dose. I haven't been on a dose that low in 12 years. It will be over before you know it. I totally get being inpatient. I try not to be. It will probably take me over a year. I am just glad to be on the right track. A year or even two is worth it. That is a good idea. Looks like you have it figured out. I need to figure out how and how much to taper still. I hope your taper continues to be smooth!

 

XO Maya

[[NY...]]

My body went into extreme shock last time and I had to reinstate. I went from 3MG of Klonopin to 0mg of Valium in about 10 months. So I'm trying to strike a balance. I mapped out the cut and hold in a spreadsheet and it's way to slow. Even weaning 0.05mg per week has me off 5/20/2017. That seems too long as well, but I don't know. Thoughts?

 

I'm sorry Stephen, I saw .05 and my mind registered .005 which is how I finished the last tiny bit of my taper. Yeah, 3mg k to zero in 10 months was crazy fast. Maybe try .02 daily or even .01 daily for a while and see how it goes. You can always speed up if you are doing fine. Personally I think that cutting and holding even small amounts like that are more irritating than finding a rate that you can daily taper at. You might actually find yourself cutting faster that way and still felling reasonably okay.

 

Ah this makes me a bit nervous.  Cutting from 7mg k to .125, nearing final stretch in 3.5 months, so ten months total for me.  If sxs are in check, you think I'm safe?  So far so good, down to 1.62, began taper end of Feb. 

[[jj...]]

My body went into extreme shock last time and I had to reinstate. I went from 3MG of Klonopin to 0mg of Valium in about 10 months. So I'm trying to strike a balance. I mapped out the cut and hold in a spreadsheet and it's way to slow. Even weaning 0.05mg per week has me off 5/20/2017. That seems too long as well, but I don't know. Thoughts?

 

I'm sorry Stephen, I saw .05 and my mind registered .005 which is how I finished the last tiny bit of my taper. Yeah, 3mg k to zero in 10 months was crazy fast. Maybe try .02 daily or even .01 daily for a while and see how it goes. You can always speed up if you are doing fine. Personally I think that cutting and holding even small amounts like that are more irritating than finding a rate that you can daily taper at. You might actually find yourself cutting faster that way and still felling reasonably okay.

 

Ah this makes me a bit nervous.  Cutting from 7mg k to .125, nearing final stretch in 3.5 months, so ten months total for me.  If sxs are in check, you think I'm safe?  So far so good, down to 1.62, began taper end of Feb.

 

You could keep dropping at a reasonable rate, once or if you hit your taper wall you can figure it out from there. The other option would be to preemptively slow down the rate to give yourself a little better chance of avoiding more serious withdrawal. You can look at my sig line for how I did the later when I was tapering v. Took me longer to taper the last 2mg than it did for the first 10, lol.

[[NY...]]

My body went into extreme shock last time and I had to reinstate. I went from 3MG of Klonopin to 0mg of Valium in about 10 months. So I'm trying to strike a balance. I mapped out the cut and hold in a spreadsheet and it's way to slow. Even weaning 0.05mg per week has me off 5/20/2017. That seems too long as well, but I don't know. Thoughts?

 

I'm sorry Stephen, I saw .05 and my mind registered .005 which is how I finished the last tiny bit of my taper. Yeah, 3mg k to zero in 10 months was crazy fast. Maybe try .02 daily or even .01 daily for a while and see how it goes. You can always speed up if you are doing fine. Personally I think that cutting and holding even small amounts like that are more irritating than finding a rate that you can daily taper at. You might actually find yourself cutting faster that way and still felling reasonably okay.

 

Ah this makes me a bit nervous.  Cutting from 7mg k to .125, nearing final stretch in 3.5 months, so ten months total for me.  If sxs are in check, you think I'm safe?  So far so good, down to 1.62, began taper end of Feb.

 

You could keep dropping at a reasonable rate, once or if you hit your taper wall you can figure it out from there. The other option would be to preemptively slow down the rate to give yourself a little better chance of avoiding more serious withdrawal. You can look at my sig line for how I did the later when I was tapering v. Took me longer to taper the last 2mg than it did for the first 10, lol.

 

Thanks. I've been giving this a lot of consideration actually, really want to end my taper safely.  Cut hold 10% 10 days is working great right now, and throughout taper, but doesn't seem to make sense at the end (cuts less or equal to a micro).  Because I have been tolerating this rhythm well, I have a general plan:  continue cut hold 10/10 until .5, then switch to micro, trying .003, if that feels different sx wise, then .002.  If .002 is harder than what I experience now, then nice and steady .001.  Some concerns are cuts not too bad now at all, and on my kk klub, many who micro seem to be having a harder time than me, although yes...at lower doses, and most doing .001.  I also love my five day windows, and will be sad if daily cuts take them away.  And of course I don't really trust my amazon scale to accurately measure micto cuts, so will need to invest in more equip just as I finish.  I like having plan, but perhaps should cross that bridge when I get to it.  Thank you!

[[ga...]]

http://jgardnerscollection.weebly.com/uploads/5/6/6/2/56621493/5085920_orig.jpg

 

Sorry this photo is a bit fuzzy. Ignore the numbers on the far right. They are potential sleep aids I am alternating. The black 5=5mg Librium. The red numbers are the Xanax 10% dilution.

 

I just upped my bedtime Librium and got rid of the bedtime Xanax, which makes my evenings less confusing. I plan to taper the X now using an alternating-days micro taper. You see, I cut one dose by .02ml of the dilution one day and then I cut 2 doses by .02ml of the dilution the next day, alternating days. My syringes are marked at .02 milligrams, so I can't cut .03 every day.

 

My middle-of-the-night dose is such a small portion that I figure if take it too early or too late or miss it entirely and just add it to the morning dose it won't make much difference, right?

 

I'd rather not add any more Libirum. I'd like to try to taper away the Xanax as far as possible. I like not having to guess and wait for a dose cut to hit me. The one good thing about Xanax is you know pretty quickly if you went too fast!

 

Does this look do-able? See any funny math? See anything illogical? The .02XD cut every day I have been doing is simple and tolerable but will take me 2 years!

 

Thanks!

[[St...]]

My body went into extreme shock last time and I had to reinstate. I went from 3MG of Klonopin to 0mg of Valium in about 10 months. So I'm trying to strike a balance. I mapped out the cut and hold in a spreadsheet and it's way to slow. Even weaning 0.05mg per week has me off 5/20/2017. That seems too long as well, but I don't know. Thoughts?

 

I'm sorry Stephen, I saw .05 and my mind registered .005 which is how I finished the last tiny bit of my taper. Yeah, 3mg k to zero in 10 months was crazy fast. Maybe try .02 daily or even .01 daily for a while and see how it goes. You can always speed up if you are doing fine. Personally I think that cutting and holding even small amounts like that are more irritating than finding a rate that you can daily taper at. You might actually find yourself cutting faster that way and still felling reasonably okay.

 

Ah this makes me a bit nervous.  Cutting from 7mg k to .125, nearing final stretch in 3.5 months, so ten months total for me.  If sxs are in check, you think I'm safe?  So far so good, down to 1.62, began taper end of Feb.

 

This stuff is so complicated. I was on it for 14 years as well as withdrawing from Wellbutrin and Testosterone shots at the same time. Between those factors and differences in body chemistry you're not necessarily guaranteed to experience what I did. The one thing I'd ask is if you're having any physical symptoms you're brushing off. I was having pretty bad muscle spasms and tremors and kind of pushed through it. In hindsight I should have seen that as an opportunity to hold, honestly.

[[dp...]]

I think I need to switch over to liquid titration. My body feels like it is survival mode and I have been going at a rate of .02mg/day... using a scale and scraping 2mg pills.

 

I just got back from the ER for dehydration and low blood sugar... I thought I was losing it and I was... I'm just scared as hell to try the Rx Liquid Valium again, because when I've tried, it's felt like an enormous cut.

 

Smh. I don't know anymore... my blood sugar is bottoming out, I'm losing muscle/weight, and I've been going at a pace of AT MOST 10% a month.

 

Feel defeated.