Reassurances from professionals that we will heal

[[NY...]]

Wave-whoever told you two months? It might be but I wouldn't count on it.  It'll just lead to disappointment.    I tapered for 26 months from 3mg of K and at 12 months off I'm now having more good than bad.  The average heal on bb is 14 months.

 

Yep that sucks. Thought that was considered paws. Sigh.  Panic.

 

Need to take break from bb so I don't do something stupid like ct.

 

Onward with your reassurance thread...

[[La...]]

Everyone is different, and that must be kept in mind when reading anything. Our genetics determine certain things, and I don't think the point of this thread is to give specific numbers that apply to all people, all the time, everywhere. Some heal quickly; Others take longer. What's clear is that getting off benzos is a good thing for most people, and it's likely best to do that in slow, methodical way so that the GABA receptors can adapt over a period of time.

 

If I'm not mistaken, that 14-month BB average comes from the survey that was done a couple of years ago. From what I can see, though, it wasn't a random sample, and so the results are just a snapshot of folks who responded at that particular time. It was a survey rather than a study, too, so bear that in mind. If you read the Success Stories, the healing rates are all over the place.

[[...]]

Bump. 

[[Ni...]]

Abcd,

Thanks for the bump.  Good info.

[[ma...]]

bump

[[Be...]]

This one is for the ones who are miserable with their ear symptoms.

 

My ENTs told me that the tinnitus which comes along with a deug use or withdrawal will diminish eventually but it may take its time.

 

Hang in there

[[Cr...]]

My doctor, who is an internist and addiction specialist, who has been about the only good thing that has come out of all this due to her honesty, willingness to listen and intelligence, admits psychiatry is a joke and drug companies are slime, said that it can take 5+ years to get better from this and that some things can be permanent. Obviously these numbers are on the outer limits. She said on average it will take 1-2 years, with some taking longer and some unfortunates that will never fully heal to their pre benzo state.

 

[[br...]]

It's nice to hear about a dr. who actually acknowledges those things.  But still sad that there is no treatment and nothing that can be done for those of us suffering so severely from what these drugs have done to us.  There is no recourse available but to suffer and get sicker and sicker and weaker and weaker hoping that one day maybe things will improve. Our lives have been taken away from us by man-made means and so much lost ......our health, jobs, once in a lifetime moments, and on and on.  I expect to be on one of the unfortunate ones......at 24 months off, I have pretty much every x/s possible to the worst degree possible....with no improvements....no windows ever....just sicker and sicker and weaker and weaker with absolutely no quality of life.  No dr. can fix what has been done to many of us.  :tickedoff:

[[Cr...]]

I know you've probably heard this all before, but you are still well within the time to get better. I'm not gonna pretend to know your situation or tell you that I know you will heal, but there is still some hope since you aren't THAT far out. Although I know all too well how frustrating not getting better while everyone else seems to be is.

[[Cr...]]

I don't put much faith in the "everyone heals" mantra. It's just not true. I think a fair amount heal fully and everyone gets better to a degree, but there is plenty of evidence on this site alone that not everyone heals. I was just reading posts from a woman who joined back in 08 that has permanent ataxia. My doctor was very honest with me that in some areas, I may never be the same.

[[br...]]

I also do not believe that "everyone heals".  It's frustrating and disheartening that there is so much suffering for so long and to know that there is a possibility that it may be permanent.  I already know that even if I get to a point where things improve, my health will have forever been compromised and I will never be my pre-benzo self......and I will also be left with the aftermath of the storm.  I know hindsight is 20/20 but I wish I had been smart enough to research this stuff first instead of trusting the dr. who prescribed it and told me it was no different than taking a vitamin.  :tickedoff:   Then I would have known how severely wrong he was and that it's only meant to be prescribed "as needed" for no more than two weeks b/c of how severely potent and dangerous it is......not 3 Xs/day everyday for two years the way he prescribed it......potentially lethal and I didn't even know it.

[[Cr...]]

I fully believe you will get better than you are now.

[[br...]]

Thank you, Crazy, for your words of encouragement.  I hope that you are well and I pray that all those suffering find healing, recovery, comfort and peace. 

[[La...]]

Crazy Pants, did the doctor give the source of the info? They can't do proper studies on these things, since they can't control for all variables. And there are many, many variables when it comes to benzo withdrawal. I have yet to come across a study that followed people beyond one year.

 

I'd be so curious to know where those stats came from. Personal experience? A scientific study? More than one study? Did she have any ideas about what factors contribute to someone healing vs. someone not healing? The particular drug, or the dose, or the amount of time the person took it, or their genetics, or whether they took other meds at the same time, or drank alcohol, or whether they did a cold turkey vs. a taper, or any of the other possible factors? There really are so many.

[[Cr...]]

She didn't give specifics aside from her many years in the field of addiction treating both benzo and alcohol patients, but I'm guessing that involves a continuing education from speaking with other doctors as well as studies she has reviewed. She is a very proactive doctor and is also an internist, which is commonly referred to as the doctors doctor (aka very knowledgeable) Even Ashton has said that some things can be permanent due to possible irreversible changes to the receptors. It's not like what she is saying is out of the realm of reality, look how many people are on here still suffering well beyond 2 years.

 

I think the factors are far too many to draw any kind of conclusion. As we have seen here, there really is no rhyme or reason to this. From my own surveying of the landscape of this site, I think it is safe to say that in general, the longer you have used, the more trouble you are potentially going to have and also that repeated on and off use and CT's seem to also bring much more intense and drawn out suffering, but even those aren't set in stone.

[[Ki...]]

They can't do proper studies on these things, since they can't control for all variables. And there are many, many variables when it comes to benzo withdrawal. I have yet to come across a study that followed people beyond one year.

 

This is very true, Lapis. Generalized statements can be both scary and hopeful depending on the slant. Bottom line, the answers will only ever be clear with a proper study where all variables are taken into account....and even then, we need a lot more than one. 

[[La...]]

I hope that it will be possible -- within our lifetimes, that is -- to get these things sorted out. When I think about the number of variables that can contribute to this issue, I see how difficult it might be to do so. Genetics determine a lot, and then add in the different stengths and half-lives of each of the benzos, and then dosages....

[[Ke...]]

I started reading this thread because I thought it was going to give me hope...

It sure didn't do that...

K

[[Cr...]]

I wouldn't worry too much. Find comfort in the fact that you are doing the right thing by tapering and that some people finish their tapers and have little to no symptoms. That's far from a guarantee, but by tapering, you are putting better odds in your favor. I wish I would have known to taper. The hell I am suffering is not one I would wish on anyone.

[[Lo...]]

Following

[[Li...]]

Thank you! Im

At seven weeks post I was worried because I thought that was to long. I feel better now, even know I still have awhile.

[[ca...]]

Bump & following !

[[so...]]

CP,

 

This condition is TEMPORARY.  Try to name one positive thing that comes from thinking this may be permanent. 

 

You will heal 100% from the damage the drugs have done to your GABA receptors.  Read up on neuro plasticity.  We grow new receptors every few months.  They mature and they learn to work with their neurotransmitters.

 

Believing you may not heal and that this may be permanent is Stone Age thinking.  So much has been learned about the brain in just the last ten years that overturns centuries of faulty assumptions.

 

Believe, CP.  Have faith in the recent research and discoveries about the brain.  Don't scare yourself and others with benzo lies about permanent damage.  The world is not flat.  It is round and it rotates around the sun.

 

Sofa

[[He...]]

"Reassurances from professionals that we will heal"

 

Are these the same "professionals" that advised us that:

 

benzos are not dangerous addictive drugs?

we could just stop whenever we want?

you cant get addicted from a short course?

withdrawals only last a few weeks at most?

2.5mg valium is subclinical and cant have any effect?

 

Hi all, I wanted to quote Laser because I was having some of the same thoughts and I don't think he was being sarcastic but there are two "camps" so to speak. BTW Laser, glad you're healed for the most part and thanks for sharing to all. Good thread. I was reviewing my interactions with docs because I moved and have gone through a couple of med systems since my move. Wanting this to be positive, I thought of my current "helper" who is a psychiatric nurse practicioner. Now SHE is of the absolute faith that we all heal completely. I believe we have the high probablility of healing completely, too. Caveat on her, though: she is one who is entrenched in the system that takes the course of action as follows: put patient into short detox, give a lot of other meds, antidepressants, barbiturates "to keep them comfortable" and then a long course of outpatient therapy accompanied by these meds. (We get into serious arguments). She couldn't put me into her detox as my insurance doesn't cover it and I wouldn't go anyway.

 

The intriguing thing about her is, she has seen a lot. I'd say she's in her 60's and is in cognitive dissonance between what she's seen and the paradigm of the holy psychiatric field. Yes, she's seen people "successfully" do her detox/lt w/d routine and smugly went about her business thinking she's doing well for people. However, I believe she's also seen some cases that didn't go so well. I gave her some Ashton material (she'd never seen it) and she said she read it. I'm her first patient to do a microtaper or any taper, with. She vacillates between grudging respect for my knowledge and determination and a condescending attitude which suggests I'm just stalling and a thorn in her side. I believe she means well. But here I am, blowing apart the paradigm she has worked in for all these years. So I'm a bit of a threat, although she hopes to learn from my experience and that I will help a lot of people. BTW I'm a substance abuse counselor (20 years now) and they didn't tell US anything about benzos either; I had to learn through my own experience and finding Ashton and BB. How I can help people on my level I don't know. The doc who is also a sub counselor sounded great. But we were always told to refer people with benzo's to doctors "because they can have a seizure". Anyway my psydoc thinks everyone will heal. I know it's a bit mean but I'd love to have her experience moderate benzo w/d for say, 1 hour. Actually if that could happen to all these docs, the benzo Rx system would change overnight. 

My original, real, family doc on Maui was encouraging when I told her I was planning to get off V. She did say, with a concerned look, that it takes time and that "many people never get off their prescriptions". I loved her so much. She has true compassion. And I think she believed that people all heal eventually, too, and knew more than most docs here on the Mainland. She supported me through the early days when I tried and got very sick.

 

 

[[Mo...]]

She didn't give specifics....

<snip>

I think the factors are far too many to draw any kind of conclusion. As we have seen here, there really is no rhyme or reason to this. From my own surveying of the landscape of this site, I think it is safe to say that in general, the longer you have used, the more trouble you are potentially going to have and also that repeated on and off use and CT's seem to also bring much more intense and drawn out suffering, but even those aren't set in stone.

 

I like the way you think about this stuff and generally agree with your conclusions.

I've been solid stage 3 for about a month and wonder at my good fortune despite long use

so no on/off or C/T

I'm concluding long taper put my EFFECTIVE jump date earlier than my actual jump date.

 

Does that ring true?