Tenacious Tinnitus Club – Ear Pressure, Noise and Hyperacusis

[[pe...]]

Sorry to hear that :'( :'( :'( :'(

 

I'm not thrilled to hear it either. 

[[sn...]]

Wow Birdie! I never thought of that. That's like decaffeinating coffee, then recaffeinate it...and then selling it as decaf. The stuff they get away with.

 

So, its oatmeal, corn and potato. Thanks for the good info again. You need a radio show. You could call it "Ask the Bird"  :laugh: :D But...seriously.

 

Sno

[[ov...]]

Hey Bird:  You are a wealth of knowledge.  I thought gluten free bread was GLUTEN free.  Also thought the same thing with gluten free oatmeal.  There are so many GMOs around especially wheat and corn, I avoid those like the plague.  Haven't noticed gluten free helping with tinnitus.  I think it is a common benzo s/x unfortunately.  Mine gets worse when I am in a noisy room or when someone speaks loudly.

xo OC  :smitten:

[[Bi...]]

Wow Birdie! I never thought of that. That's like decaffeinating coffee, then recaffeinate it...and then selling it as decaf. The stuff they get away with.

 

So, its oatmeal, corn and potato. Thanks for the good info again. You need a radio show. You could call it "Ask the Bird"  :laugh: :D But...seriously.

 

Sno

 

Thanks sno

[[Bi...]]

Hey Bird:  You are a wealth of knowledge.  I thought gluten free bread was GLUTEN free.  Also thought the same thing with gluten free oatmeal.  There are so many GMOs around especially wheat and corn, I avoid those like the plague.  Haven't noticed gluten free helping with tinnitus.  I think it is a common benzo s/x unfortunately.  Mine gets worse when I am in a noisy room or when someone speaks loudly.

xo OC  :smitten:

 

Hi overcomer,  Read the label carefully, they have all sorts of labeling tricks.  I true bread made without any gluten can't hold together, it would crumble like dust.  It needs something to GLUE it together.  GLUE is from GLUTEN 

 

SEE VIDEO 

 

Enjoy

[[Bi...]]

Hi, 

I am happy to report that my tinnitus dropped by 50% today.  How??  I did a 10% up-dose,  the first one in 12 months.  It was proof enough that I was tapering just too freaking fast.  I now figure a LOW tinnitus taper will take me an extra 6 months so I have a total of 16 months to go still :'( 

There is no hurry to get off quickly as the benzo's can't harm me as long as I go slowly down.  I am done rushing and pushing too hard as it gets me no where fast and just makes me miserable

 

Lesson learned ??

People with tinnitus as their main symptom need to go extra extra slow

 

The door-prize for tapering too fast is PAWShttp://www.retrojunkie.com/gif/hooray.gif

 

Don't try to win that trophy!!

Hugs to all my buddies. :thumbsup:

[[sn...]]

Hi Birdie. I'm glad that you are doing better. Minor adjustments can make all the difference. You always seem to know what dials to turn to get yourself fine tuned.

 

 

Snoball

[[No...]]

Glad you're feeling better with the T and updose.♤♡♢♧

 

    Keep on keeping on.  RESPECT the power of the drug.

      Notforme ~~~

       

[[Bi...]]

Hi Birdie. I'm glad that you are doing better. Minor adjustments can make all the difference. You always seem to know what dials to turn to get yourself fine tuned.

 

Snoball

 

Hi Snoball, I played with your KOTH sound-board, funny stuff

 

Hi NFM, this is my last chance to taper so I have to make sure I have a clean jump.  I am healing as a 10% up-dose a year ago would have been meaningless so I have come a long way but boy does healing slow down at the bottom end of a taper,  IT'S TOUGH!!

 

Hugs Birdie  

[[Dr...]]

Hey Birdie and all here in the noise zone. Birdman, you are so right about the healing slowing down at the bottom. I think that is what made me decide to just jump and get it over with. Not sure that was a good idea at this point. But since I only had three pills left anyway I don't think it matters much. Through the entire taper I believed that the tinnitus was the worst part, even with all of the weird stuff going on. Of course I was wrong. It is the whole picture wrapped together that is the bad part. Then when you jump everything REALLY gets strange. I'm so happy for all of you who can find any humor in this.  :laugh: :D :laugh: :laugh: Be cool.

[[sn...]]

      Hi Snoball, I played with your KOTH sound-board, funny stuff

                                                                                       

 

I'm glad you enjoyed it Birdie.

[[li...]]

Perseverance sent me this while doing some research for her Dr.  This is the reason we develop tinnitus from Benzos.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Benzos cause myoclonus in the muscles in the inner ear.  That causes tinnitus.  Buzzing is listed.  I made remarks in italics inbetween the paragraphs:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Myoclonus /maɪˈɒklənəs/ or /maɪəˈkloʊnəs/ is a brief, involuntary twitching of a muscle or a group of muscles. It describes a medical sign and, generally, is not a diagnosis of a disease.

 

Palatal myoclonus is a regular, rhythmic contraction of one or both sides of the rear of the roof of the mouth, called the soft palate. These contractions may be accompanied by myoclonus in other muscles, including those in the face, tongue, throat, and diaphragm. The contractions are very rapid, occurring as often as 150 times a minute, and may persist during sleep. The condition usually appears in adults and can last indefinitely. People with palatal myoclonus usually regard it as a minor problem, although some occasionally complain of a "clicking" sound in the ear, a noise made as the muscles in the soft palate contract.

 

Middle Ear myoclonus occurs in the muscles of the middle ear. These muscles may include the Tensor Tympani and Stapedius muscles. It can also involve the muscles surrounding the Eustachian Tube which include the Tensor Veli palatini, Levator veli Palatini, and Salpingopharyngeus. Sufferers describe it as a thumping sound or sensation in the ear. (1)

 

This is also known as Middle Ear Myoclonus (MEM) and the associated tinnitus has also been described as:

 

“MEM tinnitus is commonly characterized as clicking, suggested to be due the tensor tympani movement,2 or buzzing, suggested to be due to stapedius movement;3 however, it has also been described as throbbing, tapping, crackling like a grasshopper, bubbling, ticking, twitching, blowing, drum-like thumping, fluttering like a butterfly, whooshing or gushing.”(2)

 

Myoclonus may develop in response to infection, head or spinal cord injury, stroke, stress, brain tumors, kidney or liver failure, lipid storage disease, chemical or drug poisoning, as a side effect of certain drugs (such as tramadol[5] and quinolones), or other disorders.

 

Although some cases of myoclonus are caused by peripheral nervous system injury, most myoclonus is caused by a disturbance of the central nervous system. Studies suggest that several locations in the brain are involved in myoclonus. One such location, for example, is in the brainstem close to structures that are responsible for the startle response, an automatic reaction to an unexpected stimulus involving rapid muscle contraction. (1)

 

The Central Nervous System (CNS) is affected by Benzos.

 

The specific mechanisms underlying myoclonus are not yet fully understood. Scientists believe that some types of stimulus-sensitive myoclonus may involve overexcitability of the parts of the brain that control movement. (1)

 

Benzo withdrawal causes overecitability of neurons.  This is due to neuroadaptations that decrease GABAA receptor activity in response to the presence of the drug and LTP like occurrences that set up upon upon discontinuation of the drug which increase AMPA receptor activity.

 

These parts are interconnected in a series of feedback loops called motor pathways. These pathways facilitate and modulate communication between the brain and muscles. Key elements of this communication are chemicals known as neurotransmitters, which carry messages from one nerve cell, or neuron, to another. (1)

 

Benzo usage and withdrawal affects many neurotransmitter levels.

 

Neurotransmitters are released by neurons and attach themselves to receptors on parts of neighboring cells. Some neurotransmitters may make the receiving cell more sensitive, while others tend to make the receiving cell less sensitive. Laboratory studies suggest that an imbalance between these chemicals may underlie myoclonus.

 

Some researchers speculate that abnormalities or deficiencies in the receptors for certain neurotransmitters may contribute to some forms of myoclonus. Receptors that appear to be related to myoclonus include those for two important inhibitory neurotransmitters: serotonin, which constricts blood vessels and brings on sleep, and gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), which helps the brain maintain muscle control. (1)

 

Benzo affect both GABA and Serotonin levels.  If Benzo tolerance has been reached, Benzo withdrawal leaves the affected neurons in a state of GABA deficiency.

 

Other receptors with links to myoclonus include those for opiates, drugs that induce sleep, and for glycine, an inhibitory neurotransmitter that is important for the control of motor and sensory functions in the spinal cord. More research is needed to determine how these receptor abnormalities cause or contribute to myoclonus. (1)

 

Benzos are considered to be hypnotic- meaning they induce sleep.

 

1)      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myoclonic#Other_forms

 

2)      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3629860/?report=classic

 

Linder

 

[[Ju...]]

Perseverance sent me this while doing some research for her Dr.  This is the reason we develop tinnitus from Benzos.

 

 

Benzos cause myoclonus in the muscles in the inner ear.  That causes tinnitus. Buzzing is listed.  I made remarks in italics inbetween the paragraphs:

 

Myoclonus /maɪˈɒklənəs/ or /maɪəˈkloʊnəs/ is a brief, involuntary twitching of a muscle or a group of muscles. It describes a medical sign and, generally, is not a diagnosis of a disease.

 

Palatal myoclonus is a regular, rhythmic contraction of one or both sides of the rear of the roof of the mouth, called the soft palate. These contractions may be accompanied by myoclonus in other muscles, including those in the face, tongue, throat, and diaphragm. The contractions are very rapid, occurring as often as 150 times a minute, and may persist during sleep. The condition usually appears in adults and can last indefinitely. People with palatal myoclonus usually regard it as a minor problem, although some occasionally complain of a "clicking" sound in the ear, a noise made as the muscles in the soft palate contract.

 

Middle Ear myoclonus occurs in the muscles of the middle ear. These muscles may include the Tensor Tympani and Stapedius muscles. It can also involve the muscles surrounding the Eustachian Tube which include the Tensor Veli palatini, Levator veli Palatini, and Salpingopharyngeus. Sufferers describe it as a thumping sound or sensation in the ear. (1)

 

This is also known as Middle Ear Myoclonus (MEM) and the associated tinnitus has also been described as:

 

“MEM tinnitus is commonly characterized as clicking, suggested to be due the tensor tympani movement,2 or buzzing, suggested to be due to stapedius movement;3 however, it has also been described as throbbing, tapping, crackling like a grasshopper, bubbling, ticking, twitching, blowing, drum-like thumping, fluttering like a butterfly, whooshing or gushing.”(2)

 

Myoclonus may develop in response to infection, head or spinal cord injury, stroke, stress, brain tumors, kidney or liver failure, lipid storage disease, chemical or drug poisoning, as a side effect of certain drugs (such as tramadol[5] and quinolones), or other disorders.

 

Although some cases of myoclonus are caused by peripheral nervous system injury, most myoclonus is caused by a disturbance of the central nervous system. Studies suggest that several locations in the brain are involved in myoclonus. One such location, for example, is in the brainstem close to structures that are responsible for the startle response, an automatic reaction to an unexpected stimulus involving rapid muscle contraction. (1)

 

The Central Nervous System (CNS) is affected by Benzos.

 

The specific mechanisms underlying myoclonus are not yet fully understood. Scientists believe that some types of stimulus-sensitive myoclonus may involve overexcitability of the parts of the brain that control movement. (1)

 

Benzo withdrawal causes overecitability of neurons.  This is due to neuroadaptations that decrease GABAA receptor activity in response to the presence of the drug and LTP like occurrences that set up upon upon discontinuation of the drug which increase AMPA receptor activity.

 

These parts are interconnected in a series of feedback loops called motor pathways. These pathways facilitate and modulate communication between the brain and muscles. Key elements of this communication are chemicals known as neurotransmitters, which carry messages from one nerve cell, or neuron, to another. (1)

 

Benzo usage and withdrawal affects many neurotransmitter levels.

 

Neurotransmitters are released by neurons and attach themselves to receptors on parts of neighboring cells. Some neurotransmitters may make the receiving cell more sensitive, while others tend to make the receiving cell less sensitive. Laboratory studies suggest that an imbalance between these chemicals may underlie myoclonus.

 

Some researchers speculate that abnormalities or deficiencies in the receptors for certain neurotransmitters may contribute to some forms of myoclonus. Receptors that appear to be related to myoclonus include those for two important inhibitory neurotransmitters: serotonin, which constricts blood vessels and brings on sleep, and gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), which helps the brain maintain muscle control. (1)

 

Benzo affect both GABA and Serotonin levels.  If Benzo tolerance has been reached, Benzo withdrawal leaves the affected neurons in a state of GABA deficiency.

 

Other receptors with links to myoclonus include those for opiates, drugs that induce sleep, and for glycine, an inhibitory neurotransmitter that is important for the control of motor and sensory functions in the spinal cord. More research is needed to determine how these receptor abnormalities cause or contribute to myoclonus. (1)

 

Benzos are considered to be hypnotic- meaning they induce sleep.

 

1)      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myoclonic#Other_forms

 

2)      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3629860/?report=classic

 

Linder

 

Hi Linder.  I can't tell exactly which are your words vs Perseverance's words in the quote above.  However, I believe you are misinterpreting the info Perseverance provided.  In this quote she is describing a very particular type of tinnitus that is believed to be due to Middle Ear Myoclonus.  This type of tinnitus is often described as a clicking, crackling or wooshing or other generally lower frequency sounds.  Middle Ear Myoclonus does not cause extremely high frequency tinnitus, IMO.  An example of an extremely high frequency type of tinnitus would be the high pitched sound of a cricket sound or something that sounded like Cicada's.  This type of tinnitus is not of muscular origin, IMO.  This is my opinion, but I am an expert in neurological hearing and communication disorders in real life and have taught this type of thing at the graduate level.

 

Thanks for the post Linder.  Greatly appreciated.

[[Ra...]]

So Juliea, I have had some minor bouts with high pitched tinnitus since I started tapering even at these teeny 2% reductions.  They are usually short lived but are very high pitched.  Usually the volume is low, but there have been a couple of times where it is fairly loud.  It never occurs in both ears at the same time, thank goodness.  So your thoughts on this?

[[Ju...]]

So Juliea, I have had some minor bouts with high pitched tinnitus since I started tapering even at these teeny 2% reductions.  They are usually short lived but are very high pitched.  Usually the volume is low, but there have been a couple of times where it is fairly loud.  It never occurs in both ears at the same time, thank goodness.  So your thoughts on this?

 

Bilateral and unilateral tinnitus is quite common in benzo withdrawal, Rabbit.  Tapering very slowly can hopefully help this from becoming worse or occurring more frequently.  My tinnitus started when I developed tolerance long before my taper, so it's been with me a long time.  Mine waxes and wanes and now at one year off is usually very soft.  It's much better than tolerance or like it was during my taper now.    I'd continue taking it slow and easy Rabbit. 

[[Ra...]]

So Juliea, I have had some minor bouts with high pitched tinnitus since I started tapering even at these teeny 2% reductions.  They are usually short lived but are very high pitched.  Usually the volume is low, but there have been a couple of times where it is fairly loud.  It never occurs in both ears at the same time, thank goodness.  So your thoughts on this?

 

Bilateral and unilateral tinnitus is quite common in benzo withdrawal, Rabbit.  Tapering very slowly can hopefully help this from becoming worse or occurring more frequently.  My tinnitus started when I developed tolerance long before my taper, so it's been with me a long time.  Mine waxes and wanes and now at one year off is usually very soft.  It's much better than tolerance or like it was during my taper now.    I'd continue taking it slow and easy Rabbit.

 

Thank you Juliea!

[[Ne...]]

So Julia, I have had some minor bouts with high pitched tinnitus since I started tapering even at these teeny 2% reductions.  They are usually short lived but are very high pitched.  Usually the volume is low, but there have been a couple of times where it is fairly loud.  It never occurs in both ears at the same time, thank goodness.  So your thoughts on this?

 

Bilateral and unilateral tinnitus is quite common in benzo withdrawal, Rabbit.  Tapering very slowly can hopefully help this from becoming worse or occurring more frequently.  My tinnitus started when I developed tolerance long before my taper, so it's been with me a long time.  Mine waxes and wanes and now at one year off is usually very soft.  It's much better than tolerance or like it was during my taper now.    I'd continue taking it slow and easy Rabbit.

 

 

 

 

Welcome Julia and Rabbit to this support group started by Birdman. We have discussed supplements that helped NO ONE, Maskers, Pink Noise and White Noise, various  excellent you tube explanations of what's going on in the brain.

 

But the bottom line was when my doctor was in dis belief that my tinnitus from benzo w/d. it made me furious. Yes he's history on principal. So it's a frustration of hearing it's not w/d, there's no medication except a benzo that works, and it seems all we have is hope for healing as our brain re regulate GABAa...diminishes excess Glutamate as we try to maintain our sanity.

NSH

 

[[Ra...]]

Yeah, one just has to hope really that you are one of the lucky ones that doesn't get it or you don't get it very bad.  Now that I know it's going to be one of my sxs, I hope it doesn't get worse.  I've been following this thread for some time now and it just seems there's not much that can be done about it except trying to avoid it to start with.  Hopefully a slow taper will do the trick.  Thank you for the support!

[[Bi...]]

Yeah, one just has to hope really that you are one of the lucky ones that doesn't get it or you don't get it very bad.  Now that I know it's going to be one of my sxs, I hope it doesn't get worse.  I've been following this thread for some time now and it just seems there's not much that can be done about it except trying to avoid it to start with.  Hopefully a slow taper will do the trick.  Thank you for the support!

 

We are a group I call  "HIT IN THE EARS"  that's our worst s/x and it dominates our pain.  We have to taper extra slow!!!  We also have to hold for longer.

 

I had a good day today with low T.  I also up dosed a bit last week and slowed my taper again, BIG plus for the T :thumbsup: 

 

Hugs to all  :smitten:

[[Ra...]]

Good for you Birdy!  Glad to hear things are a bit better 

[[Dr...]]

Has anyone had this one? Yesterday I was just sitting there watching a movie and I suddenly realized that all was very quiet. I muted the TV and low and behold I "thought" I could not hear the T.   Like a fool    I was actually trying to hear it. I stopped that right away and just kept on listening without letting my withdrawing brain know what I was up to. The quiet lasted for about ten minutes. Then the T reared its ugly face once more. Today it has resumed the jet whoosh mixed with the cicadas, crickets, various sine waves and the steam. Ain't Benzo withdrawal grand?   

[[Bi...]]

Has anyone had this one? Yesterday I was just sitting there watching a movie and I suddenly realized that all was very quiet. I muted the TV and low and behold I "thought" I could not hear the T.   Like a fool    I was actually trying to hear it. I stopped that right away and just kept on listening without letting my withdrawing brain know what I was up to. The quiet lasted for about ten minutes. Then the T reared its ugly face once more. Today it has resumed the jet whoosh mixed with the cicadas, crickets, various sine waves and the steam. Ain't Benzo withdrawal grand?   

 

I never had it that good   Count your self lucky

[[Bi...]]

Good for you Birdy!  Glad to hear things are a bit better 

 

Thanks Rabbit

[[Bi...]]

Well here's a new medication for me to play with, Betahistine. They say it helps benzo related tinnitus.

 

Betahistine has a very strong affinity as an antagonist for histamine H3 receptors and a weak affinity as an agonist for histamine H1 receptors. Betahistine seems to dilate the blood vessels within the inner ear which can relieve pressure from excess fluid and act on the smooth muscle.

 

Betahistine has two modes of action. Primarily, it has a direct stimulating (agonistic) effect on H1 receptors located on blood vessels in the inner ear. This gives rise to local vasodilation and increased permeability, which helps to reverse the underlying problem of endolymphatic hydrops.

 

More importantly, betahistine has a powerful antagonistic effects at H3 receptors, thereby increasing the levels of neurotransmitters histamine, acetylcholine, norepinephrine, and serotonin released from the nerve endings. The increased amounts of histamine released from histaminergic nerve endings can stimulate receptors. This stimulation explains the potent vasodilatory effects of betahistine in the inner ear, that are well documented.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betahistine

 

 

The fluid in the ear (found in a structure called the labyrinth) provides continual feedback to the brain about our body position. When something disturbs the balance of this fluid, for example an increase in its pressure, this can cause sensations such as nausea, dizziness or spinning sensations (vertigo), ringing in the ears (tinnitus) and hearing problems. This is what happens in Ménière's disease and benzo withdrawal.

 

Betahistine works by acting on histamine receptors that are found in the walls of blood vessels in the inner ear. By activating these receptors, a process is started which ultimately reduces the pressure of the fluid that fills the labyrinth in the inner ear which substantially reduces tinnitus. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :smitten: :smitten:

 

[[Bi...]]

TINNITUS IN BENZO w/d  is a vestibular disorder  so this stuff may work :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

Betahistine in the treatment of tinnitus in patients with vestibular disorders.

[Article in English, Portuguese]

Ganança MM1, Caovilla HH, Gazzola JM, Ganança CF, Ganança FF.

Author information

Abstract

Betahistine is a medicine used to treat vestibular disorders that has also been used to treat tinnitus.

AIM:

 

To assess the effects of betahistine on tinnitus in patients with vestibular disorders.

MATERIAL AND METHOD:

 

Retrospective data were collected from patient records for individuals presenting with vestibular dysfunction and tinnitus. Patients included had received betahistine 48 mg/day and clinical outcomes were compared with a control group comprising individuals who were unable to receive betahistine due to gastritis, ulcers, pregnancy, asthma or hypersensitivity to the drug. Patients underwent control of any aggravating factors and also standard vestibular exercises as a basis for treatment. The intensity, frequency and duration of tinnitus were assessed on the first day of dosing and after 120 days of treatment. Clinical improvement was defined as a total or partial reduction of tinnitus after treatment.

RESULTS:

 

Clinical improvement was observed in 80/262 (30. 5%) of patients treated with betahistine and 43/252 (17. 1%) of control patients. Betahistine significantly (p<0. 0001) improved tinnitus in treated individuals.

CONCLUSIONS:

 

The daily dosage of 48 mg of betahistine during 120 consecutive days is useful to reduce or eliminate tinnitus in patients with vestibular disorders.

 

REF:  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21860977