Bioidentical progesterone cream causes withdrawal similar to benzo-

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The hormones sure are a mess. So much conflicting info. My doctor suggested 50 mg of the oral days 12-25. This would mimic my normal cycle. I'm 38 and still menstruating. He usually starts at 100-150 but because of my bad reactions to the bio identical creams we are starting lower. I told him that my problem times are when my progesterone is lowest on days 1-14. He's afraid I won't get a period if I take continuously. So I will take 25 for the first half of cycle and then 50 for second half and hopefully that will be enough of a drop that I'll menstruate but not too much of a drop that I feel terrible. My hormone tests showed very low prog. throughout my cycle but I was getting a period every 4-6 weeks. I might have skipped one month. I've talked to other women who take the same dose of prog. continuously and still get a regular period. I guess this is because your body is still producing its own prog. From what I understand it is not a negative feedback when supplementing with progesterone.

 

Pd- I understand the logic to take the progesterone during the first days of your cycle to relieve symptoms of the progesterone dropping. I would think that it is confusing your body though, thus giving you irregular periods. The progesterone is naturally higher days 12-25.

It seems so many doctors have different approaches. If it seems to be working for you then that's great.

I plan on starting the oral this weekend. I really hope it helps.

Mm

[[Su...]]

I have been off benzos now for 2 years and 7 months. I have been hoping that since I have been off them so long and I feel relatively healed, that my progesterone levels would rise on their own, or at least balance out more. They haven't. I am as low as I was during withdrawal.

 

So I am left with the decision to take BHT progesterone, or just be miserable. I am 41 years old, not over weight, I eat very healthy and exercise regularly! I have done everything I can to raise my levels naturally through diet, taking out soy, phyto-estrogens, etc. 

 

Any suggestions?

 

 

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Sunny 71-

What symptoms are you having that you are miserable? What testing did you have to show that the progesterone was low?

I've seen people react positively and negatively. The prog. is going to act like a benzo. Some people said it was what they needed and felt great. Others said it made them nuts and they had to go back on the benzo or go through w/d again. I think it's a decision you have to personally make. I think most reputable doctors are using the bio identical micronized oral prog. prepared by a pharmacy. Prometrium is the same thing from what I understand but only comes in set doses of 100 or 200mg. This is the FDA approved form. Anybody can correct me if they disagree. This is just what I have found on my own research.

Mm

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Sunny 71-

What symptoms are you having that you are miserable? What testing did you have to show that the progesterone was low?

I've seen people react positively and negatively. The prog. is going to act like a benzo. Some people said it was what they needed and felt great. Others said it made them nuts and they had to go back on the benzo or go through w/d again. I think it's a decision you have to personally make. I think most reputable doctors are using the bio identical micronized oral prog. prepared by a pharmacy. Prometrium is the same thing from what I understand but only comes in set doses of 100 or 200mg. This is the FDA approved form. Anybody can correct me if they disagree. This is just what I have found on my own research.

Mm

 

Mainly that problem is that as soon as I ovulate I have terrible PMS...very tender breasts, bloating, insomnia, really irritable, high anxiety.

 

I had my testing done with saliva testing...and all I know is the doctor has the progesterone cream compounded. He's a medical doctor but does a lot naturally too. I'm not saying I would use his progesterone, but I'm just thinking about in general. Early in benzo withdrawal my naturopath gave me something called ProgonB...it was sublingual progesterone pills. I took them for a few months and really did notice no PMS symptoms, but I got so sick in benzo withdrawal I just quit them and waited til now to revisit the thought of it again.

[[pr...]]

The hormones sure are a mess. So much conflicting info. My doctor suggested 50 mg of the oral days 12-25. This would mimic my normal cycle. I'm 38 and still menstruating. He usually starts at 100-150 but because of my bad reactions to the bio identical creams we are starting lower. I told him that my problem times are when my progesterone is lowest on days 1-14. He's afraid I won't get a period if I take continuously. So I will take 25 for the first half of cycle and then 50 for second half and hopefully that will be enough of a drop that I'll menstruate but not too much of a drop that I feel terrible. My hormone tests showed very low prog. throughout my cycle but I was getting a period every 4-6 weeks. I might have skipped one month. I've talked to other women who take the same dose of prog. continuously and still get a regular period. I guess this is because your body is still producing its own prog. From what I understand it is not a negative feedback when supplementing with progesterone.

 

Pd- I understand the logic to take the progesterone during the first days of your cycle to relieve symptoms of the progesterone dropping. I would think that it is confusing your body though, thus giving you irregular periods. The progesterone is naturally higher days 12-25.

It seems so many doctors have different approaches. If it seems to be working for you then that's great.

I plan on starting the oral this weekend. I really hope it helps.

Mm

 

Mm,

 

i am confused now. since progesterone is higher on days 12-25--wouldn't it makes sense to take the prometrium(prog) on days 1-12 when the progesterone drops?

thanks, pretty

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Sunny,

 

i had posted up before that if we eat natural organic free range eggs everyday (if one doesn't have an allergy to eggs) that is a great way to raise your own progesterone. and that is not only from Ray Peat--i've read it in so many other articles.

and eating ruminant liver is also really good to raise those prog levels my themselves, once or twice a week. i am not really into that idea--but i had also heard this from Natasha McBride creator of The GAPS diet--so i am going to start eating some liver--(from "ruminant" animals) i know it's a hard thing especially when one has been a vegetarian so long but i'm learning that also is a reason i am so deficient in so many vitamins & minerals.

and butter, i think butter can also help the level.

 

be patient with your body because benzo withdrawal is such a stressful event.  and i've read that progesterone can be converted into cortisone to handle stress, (which would explain why some women athletes sometimes miss their periods)

it can take time--but it can level out. i am in that waiting game too!

 

pretty

 

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Pretty-

Yes, I agree it would make sense to use the progesterone days 1-12 because that's when it's lowest as this will help with symptoms. The only problem is that it's not mimicking your body's natural progesterone cycle so I would expect your periods to be irregular. If its giving you relief using it that way, I'm glad for you.

Mm

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Mm,

 

well, i would love for my periods to be regular and if this is why they are not regular. how do you think i should be taking the prometrium to mimic my body's natural progesterone cycle? that is my ultimate goal. i don't always agree with doctor's by the way a far from it so any help with how i can start taking this to help for my cycle to be regular would be of great help?

 

thanks, pretty

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I take prometrium 300mg everyday and never cycle.  I still have a period.  The progestrone is vey helpful to me and I plan to stay on it forever. 

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GG,

 

how to you take it? orally, vaginally? i have just been poking a hole in the 200mg. and then i put the inside on my legs.

i'm not sure how to use it now?

 

Mm, if you see this, let me know how i can use the prometrium so it will give me my cycle?

 

thanks,

pretty

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Pretty-

To mimic your cycle you should take it days 12-25 of your cycle. Atleast that's what my doctor told me. But I guess if you take it everyday, some people still get their period normally.

Mm

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Gods grace-

Did you  start prometrium before or during benzos?

Mm

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Mm,

 

i am so confused about this. the doctor told me to take the 200mg prometrium days 1-12 vaginally so then i will get a period.

well, i have to say that i haven't been using it vaginally, i've just been poking a hole in it and then putting it on my legs.

but why do you say if i take it 12-25 days of my cycle that will bring my period back? aren't you supposed to take it when your progesterone is the lowest?

i am really confused by this? should i try to use it vaginally on days 1-12 and see of my period comes back?

 

thanks,

pretty

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Pretty-

I'm sorry to confuse you. That's just what my doctor said.

I'm not hsving good results with this oral progesterone myself. This is my second night at only 25mg orally. I'm wide awake at 1:30 am and can't go back to sleep. I don't think I'm going to be able to tolerate this, just like the creams.

Mm

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Mm,

 

so sorry you're having trouble sleeping. so you think it's from the progesterone?

so, your doctor said to take the prometrium days 12-25 to mimic a cycle? because if so, i guess i will try that.

so do you think you're going to just have to stay off the progesterone if you can't tolerate it?

 

pretty

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Yeah-

This is my third try with progesterone. Has never calmed me. Just makes me hyper and anxious. Not sure if its the progesterone activating the estrogen receptors or if I'm just reacting opposite to what I should. I expected this. Would be too nice to actually find something to help with my hormones.

Mm

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Hi Pretty

 

I don't think it really matters if you take it days 1-12 or days 12-25. It's more or less the same thing, just at a different time of the month. A lot of doctors say days 1-12 (or 1-7 or 1-10 or whatever their particular preference is) mainly because it's just easier to remember to do it with the start of the month. If you already have a cycle it should probably be used in accordance with that to bring on a period at your normal time, but if you're not having any periods at the moment it won't matter when you use it.

 

If I was you I would try taking the 200mg vaginally and see what happens. Prometrium/Utrogestan isn't designed to be used externally like the progesterone creams. It's meant to be either taken orally or vaginally. If you find the effect of 200mg is too much, you can always reduce it to 100mg (that's assuming you are using 100mg capsules?).

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Mm,

 

are you on anything hormone of bio- identical wise for your estrogen levels? i just told you in the PM that i just got off the vivlle dot estradiol patch--have you ever heard of that?

 

pretty

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Hi Pretty

 

I don't think it really matters if you take it days 1-12 or days 12-25. It's more of less the same thing, just at a different time of the month. A lot of doctors say days 1-12 (or 1-7 or 1-10 or whatever their particular preference is) mainly because it's just easier to remember to do it with the start of the month.

 

If I was you I would try taking the 200mg vaginally and see what happens. Prometrium/Utrogestan isn't designed to be used externally like the progesterone creams. It's meant to be either taken orally or vaginally. If you find the effect of 200mg is too much, you can always reduce it to 100mg (that's assuming you are using 100mg capsules?).

 

Hi Diaz-Pam,

 

Mm said something to the fact that her doctor told her to take the prometrium on 12-25 days so as to mimic the progesterone in the cycle?

i will try the prometrium vaginally this month and see if that helps to bring about my period. but see, i was also on the vivelle dot estradiol patch mg. 0.1

and i tapered for about 3 months and now i'm off it completely--i think that could also be a reason my period hasn't been since Feb.

and also because of the acute benzo sxs i am still having. i am making all these changes during a benzo withdrawal and i am really revved up still. so i guess i should be patient. but it would be nice to have my period/cycle back without the use of any extra hormones. i don't know if that will happen since i pretty much screwed things up being on benzo's for so long and a million c/t's under my belt.

 

ah the virtue of benzo withdrawal! and the virtue of my own progesterone! so tired, must got to bed. see you tomorrow!

pretty

[[Di...]]

I suppose it depends on what "days 12-25" means. It's still 12 days (well 14 actually which seems a long time to be taking it to me), but is that going by the calendar or going by a person's particular cycle? It all gets very confusing. You can really use it any time of the month if you aren't cycling at the moment. You just pick the days that are most convenient to you.

 

Do you mind if I ask what you age is? I think you said you aren't peri or menopausal? If so I'm just a bit confused as to why you were being prescribed Vivelle patches. Is it possible you are peri/meno and your periods have just stopped naturally?

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I'm not on anything hormonal wise. I recently stopped bc pill. It was causing too many side effects.

Mm

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I suppose it depends on what "days 12-25" means. It's still 12 days (well 14 actually which seems a long time to be taking it to me), but is that going by the calendar or going by a person's particular cycle? It all gets very confusing. You can really use it any time of the month if you aren't cycling at the moment. You just pick the days that are most convenient to you.

 

Do you mind if I ask what you age is? I think you said you aren't peri or menopausal? If so I'm just a bit confused as to why you were being prescribed Vivelle patches. Is it possible you are peri/meno and your periods have just stopped naturally?

 

i am 40! they gave it to me when i was in tolerance w/d i was having weird sxs but i was still having my period. they took some test and my levels were okay as far as estrogen but they put me on it to see if certain sxs at the time would go away. i didn't know i was in tolerance w/d. that was the problem or else i would have never gone on the vivelle dot. and now i'm sorry that i did. they didn't diagnos me with peri/meno but i'm sure being on benzo's for most of my life has not done my hormones any good. but this is the first time i've gone 2 months without my period. and i'm only 89 lbs so i was wondering if that has anything to do with it? and also, i am totally off the vivelle dot patches and only on 200mg prometrium and i was poking a hole in it and just putting the inside on my legs.

 

i plan to have some testings of my hormones and my thyroid whenever i'm able to get out of bed during the day but i haven't yet and it's been a full year since i c/t'd. so now i'm not sure how to use the prometrium but i think i will try it vaginally during days 1-12 and see if that brings on a period.

 

pretty

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When I was referring to take it days 12-25, I meant with your cycle. If you don't have a period, I guess it wouldn't matter what days you take it. I think you should take it either orally or vaginally, whatever your doctor said. I don't think it was made to rub on your skin. If that's what you want to do, you'd be better off buying the prog. cream or having your doctor compound a cream for you. I stopped the oral. I don't know why I can't tolerate it. I don't know if I need more to overcome the estrogen or what. My doctor thinks I can't detox the hormones metabolites properly. Wants me to take a capsule which is like eating 2 lbs of broccoli. I've told him that I'm suppose to avoid cruciferous vegetables so it doesn't disrupt my benzo levels. I'm at a loss what to do. Now when I get my period I'm going to feel intense w/d symptoms and not be able to function for 10 days like it has been my whole taper. This is what makes me just want to give up.

Mm

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When I was referring to take it days 12-25, I meant with your cycle. If you don't have a period, I guess it wouldn't matter what days you take it. I think you should take it either orally or vaginally, whatever your doctor said. I don't think it was made to rub on your skin. If that's what you want to do, you'd be better off buying the prog. cream or having your doctor compound a cream for you. I stopped the oral. I don't know why I can't tolerate it. I don't know if I need more to overcome the estrogen or what. My doctor thinks I can't detox the hormones metabolites properly. Wants me to take a capsule which is like eating 2 lbs of broccoli. I've told him that I'm suppose to avoid cruciferous vegetables so it doesn't disrupt my benzo levels. I'm at a loss what to do. Now when I get my period I'm going to feel intense w/d symptoms and not be able to function for 10 days like it has been my whole taper. This is what makes me just want to give up.

Mm

 

Mm,

 

if your doctor tells you that you can't detox the hormones metabolites properly, i would consider trying the eating of a raw carrot or raw carrot salad everyday. i am doing this now and i really think it has helped with my PMS issues. it is supposed to detox endotoxin's from the body. old estrogen's so it's not recycled. let me see if i can find some things about it that i've already read.

 

well, here is something about it but you can google it and yes i did get this from Ray Peat but also Danny Roddy, Hans Seyle, Constance D Martin so i've been doing some research about it and i've been doing it everyday for about a month and a half.

 

“Endotoxin or other material absorbed from intestinal bacteria contributes to a variety of autoimmune problems, including thyroiditis (Penhale and Young, 1988). Combining an indigestible fiber, such as raw carrot, with mild germicides, such as vinegar and coconut oil, can improve the hormonal environment, while reducing the immunological burden.”

 

“Coconut oil added to the diet can increase the metabolic rate. Small frequent feedings, each combining some carbohydrate and some protein, such as fruit and cheese, often help to keep the metabolic rate higher. Eating raw carrots can prevent the absorption of estrogen from the intestine, allowing the liver to more effectively regulate metabolism.”

 

“Things that protect the bowel, such as raw carrots, have far-reaching effects on hormones and immunity.”

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Thanks. I saw you wrote that earlier and I am trying to eat more raw carrots. I think my liver is sluggish too.

Mm