2400+ Days Off - My Insomnia/Benzo Advice

[Guest [An...]]

I highly doubt you "trained" your brain that you need Mirt or you won't sleep.  Psychological dependence is a real thing, but if your body is going to sleep it will sleep with or without the Mirt.

 

I've read about a lot of people having success with sleep on low dose Mirt, 7.5mg or less.  Your 6 hours is almost certainly due to the Mirt?

 

Also, I'd be careful with supplementing too much.  Some supplements amp up your nervous system and some work paradoxically.

 

You'll get there!

 

Thanks man.

 

Yeah, I know Mirt is a very strong anti-histamine. 1/4 of a tablet is about as good as 1 tablet of Unisom based on my personal experience. I'm not "too" worried about using it because at 3.75mg, the only withdrawal I've experienced, is a headache for 2-3 days after going off it for 1 and 1/2 months.  Also many buddies have recovered successfully while using it. But I'm trying to manage it because I don't want to updose it. Which is why I'm now on THC instead, and been on it for a couple of weeks. Not sure the safety of it, but it seems many buddies have also recovered with it.

 

My job requires a lot of thinking and concentrating. Zero sleep for days means I lose my job. I'm thankful this stuff works for me, but you're probably right about sleep happening no matter what.

 

Maybe in a month I will try sleeping off everything for a few days, and see how my body does.

[[Th...]]

I pretty much tried everything Rx, OTC and Herbal to get some sleep.  Nothing worked for more than a night or 2 so I ditched everything and let sleep come back on it's own.

 

It's the only alternative I had.  I wouldn't recommend that to others, especially if you have to work.

 

If 3.75mg of Mirt would have worked for me...I tried every dosage all the way to 30mg per night, I would have taken it.

 

I almost lost my job too...I am so glad I didn't.  I am going to retire at the end of next year....December 2022.

 

Given enough time, you'll be able to get off the Mirt and sleep on your own

 

Take care and good luck!

 

 

[Guest [An...]]

I pretty much tried everything Rx, OTC and Herbal to get some sleep.  Nothing worked for more than a night or 2 so I ditched everything and let sleep come back on it's own.

 

It's the only alternative I had.  I wouldn't recommend that to others, especially if you have to work.

 

If 3.75mg of Mirt would have worked for me...I tried every dosage all the way to 30mg per night, I would have taken it.

 

I almost lost my job too...I am so glad I didn't.  I am going to retire at the end of next year....December 2022.

 

Given enough time, you'll be able to get off the Mirt and sleep on your own

 

Take care and good luck!

 

Thanks man. I'm glad things worked for you. This Benzo and Z-Drug business is very cruel, and the sheer stupidity of the medical community is just mind blowing.

 

My GP is nice, but she thinks it's all mental now. I've asked for second opinions and they too, think it's psychological now.

 

Yeah I lucked out with the Mirt. THC also seems to work, although not as well (but still 4-5hr sleep is better than nothing).

 

Hopefully in a couple of months I can finally get back to normal, but I am thankful at least I can manage my condition for now.

[[Sh...]]

Well andros were all here to validate that it’s not psychological.

 

These meds have messed us up.

 

I’ve been having chronic insomnia since I hit tolerance. I’m pretty sure it’s impossible to keep urself awake for days on end or weeks on end psychologically. The body clock would override it. I was so bad in tolerance at the start that I got 2 hrs sleep after taking 2 rohypnol. Yes. Rohypnol. My dr asked me to do it because she said u need to sleep. There is no way possible that I psychologically woke myself up after taking 2 rohypnol. That is impossible. That is a heavy hitter and is used as a date rape drug! Im devastated I agreed to take it but in the beginning I had no idea what was wrong and only did what my dr suggested. She was shocked. A similar thing happened to southern belle I believe.

 

Think about before u took sleep meds. If i stayed awake for even one night I would not have been able to function. 2 nights I would be falling apart. The body will fight until a point and then it must sleep. That feeling doesn’t happen for us. I slept 3 hours last night and don’t feel sleepy at all. My eyes sting, my body is sore but I’m not sleepy. It’s not psychological because I am sitting relaxing reading right now. I’m not stressed or freaking out, I’m just not sleepy.

 

That’s just their go to bullshit excuse coz their medication is “safe” and for the most part people don’t have these issues. But we are the exception unfortunately.

 

U will get better, u just need a little longer. I wish I could get 6 hrs from mertazapine. 3.75 is a small amount. If it’s helping u take it. Give urself some time then chip away at it.

[Guest [An...]]

Well andros were all here to validate that it’s not psychological.

 

These meds have messed us up.

 

I’ve been having chronic insomnia since I hit tolerance. I’m pretty sure it’s impossible to keep urself awake for days on end or weeks on end psychologically. The body clock would override it. I was so bad in tolerance at the start that I got 2 hrs sleep after taking 2 rohypnol. Yes. Rohypnol. My dr asked me to do it because she said u need to sleep. There is no way possible that I psychologically woke myself up after taking 2 rohypnol. That is impossible. That is a heavy hitter and is used as a date rape drug! Im devastated I agreed to take it but in the beginning I had no idea what was wrong and only did what my dr suggested. She was shocked. A similar thing happened to southern belle I believe.

 

Think about before u took sleep meds. If i stayed awake for even one night I would not have been able to function. 2 nights I would be falling apart. The body will fight until a point and then it must sleep. That feeling doesn’t happen for us. I slept 3 hours last night and don’t feel sleepy at all. My eyes sting, my body is sore but I’m not sleepy. It’s not psychological because I am sitting relaxing reading right now. I’m not stressed or freaking out, I’m just not sleepy.

 

That’s just their go to bullshit excuse coz their medication is “safe” and for the most part people don’t have these issues. But we are the exception unfortunately.

 

U will get better, u just need a little longer. I wish I could get 6 hrs from mertazapine. 3.75 is a small amount. If it’s helping u take it. Give urself some time then chip away at it.

 

I know. I believe you guys. When I was normal, sure I could go 2-3 days awake on a boatload of coffees or RedBulls, but my eyes would be closing by force and I'd fall asleep anyway by the 3rd day.

 

With a mental trauma, I was staying awake for 3 days straight, but the 4th day I'd get a gigantic 12hr sleep.

 

That's not happening now. But I can function with Mirt and THC. I'm alternating between the two in 2 week increments, that way my body does not get used to one thing.

 

I am a short term user and months out I still need a drug to sleep. I can't imagine some of you guys being on this shit for years. My heart truly goes out to you.

 

And most doctors are truly some of the stupidest mothereffers on the planet. I've been told 4 times it's in my head now, and at my worst, when I went to the ER, desperate for help, that doctor just screamed at me that he was a cardiologist and he couldn't do anything for my insomnia, and why was I there and not talking to my GP.

 

Is it any wonder we become fearful of them?

[[Re...]]

Yeah I had the same with doctors, I went to A and E (your equivalent of ER) on christmas fucking day because it was so bad, I’d gone four nights without sleep and my heart rate was really erratic, and they just wanted me on more pills and wanted to sign me up to some shitty online cbti nonsense. Every time I said it was the pills that caused this they refused to believe me. I’m really struggling with how to deal with my anger towards the medical system and their ignorance to the devastating effects of these drugs.

 

I’m the same in that I’ve gone two nights without sleep before pre zop and couldn’t keep my eyes open the third day, I remember once trying to drive and literally pulling in to a supermarket car park to sleep because I was falling asleep at the wheel. Since I took Zopiclone I can’t even nap anymore. But sleep is coming back now, it’s not the quality restorative sleep yet but I am finally sleeping every night on my own. I went two periods of 4 nights without sleep when I first came off in December, and totalled 30 zero nights through December and January. It was the worst time of my life. No supplements worked. No sleep hygiene or anything else. Just time. I still don’t have the sleepy feeling yet. When I get in bed at night I read until I feel tired then shut my eyes and now it seems to work, but before February it was hours of misery and frustration. I’ll never forget it.

 

I am absolutely positive that most of what you are experiencing is the effect of what that drug did to your nervous system and I think you just have to bite the bullet at some stage and allow the sleep deprivation to really prompt those gaba receptors to upregulate. It will come back.

[[Sh...]]

Well andros were all here to validate that it’s not psychological.

 

These meds have messed us up.

 

I’ve been having chronic insomnia since I hit tolerance. I’m pretty sure it’s impossible to keep urself awake for days on end or weeks on end psychologically. The body clock would override it. I was so bad in tolerance at the start that I got 2 hrs sleep after taking 2 rohypnol. Yes. Rohypnol. My dr asked me to do it because she said u need to sleep. There is no way possible that I psychologically woke myself up after taking 2 rohypnol. That is impossible. That is a heavy hitter and is used as a date rape drug! Im devastated I agreed to take it but in the beginning I had no idea what was wrong and only did what my dr suggested. She was shocked. A similar thing happened to southern belle I believe.

 

Think about before u took sleep meds. If i stayed awake for even one night I would not have been able to function. 2 nights I would be falling apart. The body will fight until a point and then it must sleep. That feeling doesn’t happen for us. I slept 3 hours last night and don’t feel sleepy at all. My eyes sting, my body is sore but I’m not sleepy. It’s not psychological because I am sitting relaxing reading right now. I’m not stressed or freaking out, I’m just not sleepy.

 

That’s just their go to bullshit excuse coz their medication is “safe” and for the most part people don’t have these issues. But we are the exception unfortunately.

 

U will get better, u just need a little longer. I wish I could get 6 hrs from mertazapine. 3.75 is a small amount. If it’s helping u take it. Give urself some time then chip away at it.

 

I know. I believe you guys. When I was normal, sure I could go 2-3 days awake on a boatload of coffees or RedBulls, but my eyes would be closing by force and I'd fall asleep anyway by the 3rd day.

 

With a mental trauma, I was staying awake for 3 days straight, but the 4th day I'd get a gigantic 12hr sleep.

 

That's not happening now. But I can function with Mirt and THC. I'm alternating between the two in 2 week increments, that way my body does not get used to one thing.

 

I am a short term user and months out I still need a drug to sleep. I can't imagine some of you guys being on this shit for years. My heart truly goes out to you.

 

And most doctors are truly some of the stupidest mothereffers on the planet. I've been told 4 times it's in my head now, and at my worst, when I went to the ER, desperate for help, that doctor just screamed at me that he was a cardiologist and he couldn't do anything for my insomnia, and why was I there and not talking to my GP.

 

Is it any wonder we become fearful of them?

 

Yep I had a cardiologist say I was “stressed and depressed “ with a smirk on his face. Yep and ER said they can’t do anything for insomnia. The problem is they really don’t understand sleep. I’d love to see any of them deal with what we go thru. They’d be scared and stressed too.

[[Sh...]]

Yeah I had the same with doctors, I went to A and E (your equivalent of ER) on christmas fucking day because it was so bad, I’d gone four nights without sleep and my heart rate was really erratic, and they just wanted me on more pills and wanted to sign me up to some shitty online cbti nonsense. Every time I said it was the pills that caused this they refused to believe me. I’m really struggling with how to deal with my anger towards the medical system and their ignorance to the devastating effects of these drugs.

 

I’m the same in that I’ve gone two nights without sleep before pre zop and couldn’t keep my eyes open the third day, I remember once trying to drive and literally pulling in to a supermarket car park to sleep because I was falling asleep at the wheel. Since I took Zopiclone I can’t even nap anymore. But sleep is coming back now, it’s not the quality restorative sleep yet but I am finally sleeping every night on my own. I went two periods of 4 nights without sleep when I first came off in December, and totalled 30 zero nights through December and January. It was the worst time of my life. No supplements worked. No sleep hygiene or anything else. Just time. I still don’t have the sleepy feeling yet. When I get in bed at night I read until I feel tired then shut my eyes and now it seems to work, but before February it was hours of misery and frustration. I’ll never forget it.

 

I am absolutely positive that most of what you are experiencing is the effect of what that drug did to your nervous system and I think you just have to bite the bullet at some stage and allow the sleep deprivation to really prompt those gaba receptors to upregulate. It will come back.

 

I visited the ER many times. I know theway went a few times too. It’s very sad we are just dismissed for insomnia and not believed the drugs have caused it. There’s a boatload of people on another forum I found healthunlocked that are in the same boat. Im trying to get them over here, I know 1 has joined BB. As for cbti I spent 8 months visiting an “expert” and nope. He told me it wasn’t possible I was sleeping as little as I was telling him and that I was sleeping more than I thought. Hilarious. Why would anyone lie about it? Last night I slept for 1.5 hrs, then was wide awake. I had a really busy day yesterday, I was exhausted, but that’s all I got. Then I took half a unisom it did nothing and now I feel like I’ve been hit by a truck. But u know, I probably slept more snd I just imagined it was only 1.5 hrs?!

 

So essentially my sleep drive should be overwhelming me right now and it isn’t. We don’t get those rebound sleeps normal people get. That is not “in our heads”.

 

Snd I’m with u redone, I plan on biting the bullet with taking nothing... u just feel worse for taking something I think, for me that’s the case anyway.

 

I am so glad u are doing better, andros u will be too soon. It won’t be long x

 

[Guest [An...]]

I have no idea why there aren't a boatload of people complaining about these drugs. It's like there's a 5% amount of people that get hit really hard, and the rest don't even notice it. A pharmacist told me he knows people taking Zopiclone for years.

 

I'm like WTF? How do you take this for years? After 2 weeks, the interdose side effects were absolutely horrendous, worse than any other pain I've ever had.

 

When I went to the ER, I was hoping they would prescribe me a benzo. I was in such bad shape I would have taken Valium if they had given it to me. I'd probably still be tapering it.

 

But the jackass just dismissed me and told me he wasn't a specialist on insomnia. I was thinking in my mind "ok bud, I don't care, CALL someone that IS an expert then! That flier on the wall says you have people on call for any type of emergency".

 

BUT the last thing I want is to be written up as a "hostile patient". So I just nodded happily and said "Thank you for your help doctor". In hindsight that may have been better. I probably did not completely blow away my receptors, just enough so I can't initiate sleep on my own (but enough for some mild doses of Mirt, or THC to help).  If they had given me a benzo, I'd probably be tapering it now. I just bit the bullet and suffered a month straight of the most unimaginable hell, and waited to get slowly better.

 

What's weird now is literally the only side effect I have now is the insomnia. I might try to go for a few days without any help, and see if my body kicks in on its own. I've tried 2 days in a row and it's usually literally zero sleep.

 

and wanted to sign me up to some shitty online cbti nonsense

 

I did the following essentially the same week I started having the massive withdrawal side effects:

 

1. Stopped drinking pop

2. Stopped drinking coffee. No tea either.

3. Stopped eating any chocolate sweets that could have hidden caffeine.

4. Since October, all I have been drinking is Reverse Osmosis filtered water. Sometimes I put a packet of Stevia in it. Sometime a squirt of lemon juice.

5. Bought RGB lightbulbs, and run them at the minimum brightness on amber 2hr before I'm going to bed.

6. Same with the computer monitor. I do the F.Lux thing, and minimum brightness.

7. Go to bed at exactly the same time every night.

8. Practice my breathing, and meditation stretching.

 

None of those things have done a damn shit for me except the going to bed at the same time. That guarantees that I will get 4hr sometimes 5hr sleep if take THC, or 6hr if I take Mirt. But on Mirt, I feel like crap the entire day, a drowsiness that lasts until bedtime.

 

But I built the habit, so I am now doing them autonomously now, used to the process.

[[Sh...]]

I know it’s crazy. On another forum a lady took them for over ten years, tapered off and she’s sleeping better than you or I! That’s why some drs say it’s all in our heads because they only encountered the people that don’t have issues.

 

I know it’s hard but I bet u will suprise urself one night and sleep some without help. I do, check out my signature... so if I can u will be able to too.

 

I’m not completely benzo free but I’m close x

 

U will be ok!!

[Guest [An...]]

I know it’s crazy. On another forum a lady took them for over ten years, tapered off and she’s sleeping better than you or I! That’s why some drs say it’s all in our heads because they only encountered the people that don’t have issues.

 

I know it’s hard but I bet u will suprise urself one night and sleep some without help. I do, check out my signature... so if I can u will be able to too.

 

I’m not completely benzo free but I’m close x

 

U will be ok!!

 

It truly break my heart to see you, and others that have nothing to help them. I kinda feel bad posting that I am at least having some success.

 

Yeah I'm psyching myself to maybe try next week without sleep for a few days. I have a work call the entire night next Tuesday, so I have to stay up all night anyway. That night I'm not taking anything. I will be exhausted the next day. I'll try to sleep on nothing Wed night and see what happens.

 

One thing that is absolutely terrible is how stupid the body is. We get these "microsleeps" (I've had them, you're basically dreaming half awake) and the body thinks "hey that's good enough, I won't die now". And it's happy to keep you suffering like that for months.

[[Sh...]]

Don’t feel bad. I’m really happy for anyone having an easier time than me. I’m ok. I’m cooking and listening to love shack on the radio dancing around my kitchen. 1.5 hrs sleep. I’m ok!

 

We have to do what theway says and give the middle finger to insomnia. Some days that’s easier said than done but it’s all we’ve got until our bodies decide we’ve had enuf

 

Good plan about staying up for work call Wednesday. If u don’t try u will never know? Maybe take a pill (even a panadol) then psychologically u have taken something?

 

U have nothing to lose! It won’t kill u.. as u know 

[Guest [Ka...]]

Bump

[[Sh...]]

Where is the way ? He hasn’t been around much lately

[Guest [An...]]

Where is the way ? He hasn’t been around much lately

 

I bet that since his life is pretty much back to normal, there's no real point in hanging out here. I'm almost 100% and I still stay away from the horror story posts, not because I'm scared of it, but because my heart breaks for the poor souls suffering this torture and there's very little we can do.

 

The pharma industry is basically up there with Satan himself, for unleashing these drugs on people, and not even having the decency to research a way to reverse the damage quickly.

[[Sh...]]

Yeah I get that. Hopefully one day it will be years since we’ve been here too. I appreciate all the help I’ve been given but one day I’d like to put it behind me.

[[Pa...]]

Where is the way ? He hasn’t been around much lately

 

I imagine he'll return one of these days, he takes breaks every so often but he's very good about coming back to help. 

[[Sh...]]

He is isn’t he! We miss u theway! 

[[Ka...]]

I needed to read this first thread. Hi fellow sleepers, I'm learning.

[[Ne...]]

Thank you for this. It was very encouraging to me, and I appreciated the positive advice. I was placed on a benzo for the wrong diagnosis. I was blessed to never have mental health issues but I have been starting to wonder as I seem to agonize about every little symptom I have now. It is good to remember that it is all benzo related and just move on instead of dwelling on it. It is what it is. Thanks again!

[Guest [An...]]

I'm just frustrated that I have no symptoms left at all........................except the insomnia. If I take nothing, I will struggle to fall asleep at all, sometimes takes me 4hr to fall asleep. If I can do that, I can get 4-5hr naturally. But it's off and on.

[[Sh...]]

Have u tried cbti andros? It’s sounds like ur clock is out. It could help u x

[Guest [An...]]

Have u tried cbti andros? It’s sounds like ur clock is out. It could help u x

 

I'm starting to try some of the protocols again, like the breathing, etc.

 

I always go to bed at 12midnight or 1am the latest. Either it takes me 3-4hr to fall asleep, or I don't fall asleep at all and have a zero sleep night.

[[Sh...]]

U should keep the same wake up time. Set ur alarm for 6 am every dsy and get up regardless of how long u have slept. Sleep drive should kick in and u will be falling asleep much easier. Worth a try?

[[Ka...]]

Hi Andros, Shay, Pamster, NeverAlone and others. How's it going?

 

This is good to read, the original post and your current conversations, glad I found it.

 

And Andros I can learn some polite thoughts toward doctors from you! And I like how you let it rip here!

 

Because the deepest fear in me that is there every day is that I'll not sleep. But actually it's the mental anguish that scares me about not sleeping.

 

Looks like I'll need to buy the calm app!

 

<3