Someone found something, Jordan Peterson's family

[[Bl...]]

From what I have read here, I haven't found Maugham's posts in any way an abuse of freedom of speech. Maugham brought out the thought of ones freedom to speak in an earlier post.....I'm basically restating it.

 

He seems to be sincere and diplomatic when expressing his thoughts. And although I don't profess to understand a lot of what has been written in the entirety of this thread, I do appreciate hearing from all sides.

 

I dare say, most people value their right to free speech. Granted there are boundaries in this area of what we say...I just don't see that having been the case in Maugham's posts.

[[Sh...]]

Of course he has a right. But is it going to be on every post where someone suggests something that might help and then 70% of the thread is him arguing with people about insignificant details of who said what? This thread is 13 pages now and half of it is him every 2nd post. Great.

[[Ma...]]

Hi guys,

I've caught up on this thread and wanted to make a few points it spilled over into what i spoke with pacenik with the last few days, i will tell you guys what i told him, since this thread should be renamed glutamate vs gaba. I read the article on Xenon blocking receptors. We have medication that does exactly the same thing (it blocks AMPA, NMDA, and kainate and more!) all of you can get it right now (either over the counter in serbia  or from your doctor with a good explanation in low dose), its called topirimate, here's excerpt from an article and rationale in benzo withdrawal:

 

Topiramate: Topiramate (TPM) is a sulfamate-substituted analog of fructose-1,6-diphosphate, whose efficacy in the treatment of SUD is thought to be through three mechanisms of action. Firstly, TPM facilitates Gamma-Aminobutyric Acid (GABA) transmission by binding to a non-BZD site on GABA-A receptors [75] and inhibits glutamatergic transmission at ionotropic Alpha-amino-3-hydroxi-5-Methilisoxazole-Propionic Acid (AMPA) and kainite glutamate receptors [76], which mediate voltage-dependent sodium [77] and L-type calcium currents [78]. Secondarily to these actions, TPM neuro-stabilizes and downstream reduces DA release in the corticomesolimbic system, which is involved in the mechanism of reward and reinforcement. In addition, TPM's blockade of AMPA-type GLU receptors in the nucleus paragigantocellularis appears to inhibit noradrenergic neuron in the locus coeruleus, the activation of which plays an essential role in producing autonomic symptoms of withdrawal states. Finally, because of its weak inhibition of carbonic anhydrase, it could contribute to an anticonvulsant effect, a potentially important property in the treatment of withdrawal syndromes [79]. It has a specific pharmacokinetic profile, which is characterized by: 1) a biovariability of at least 80%; 2) it reaches its maximum concentration between 1.3-1.7 hours post-ingestion; 3) it has a half-life of 19-23 hours; 4) it reaches steady-state plasma concentration in about 4 days; 5) it has low binding potential to proteins; 6) less than 20% of it undergoes metabolism to inactive metabolites; 7) up to 80% unchanged excretion in the urine; and 9) has little drug-to-drug interactions [32].

 

from: http://www.heraldopenaccess.us/openaccess/anticonvulsant-agents-for-the-management-of-benzodiazepine-dependence

 

In the article it further describes two cases (a shocking one where some kid was snorting 90mg of midazolam a day over 7 years and was took 500mg of topirimate and tapered off over 3 days (sounds like a miracle to me).

 

I took topirimate 2 years ago, its an interesting medication (for my mood disorder), you can rapidly stop it (although i dont recommend it), anticonvulsants (other than gabapentoids) are nothing like antidepressants/antipsychotics. In higher doses, its called dopamax (because it causes cognitive impairment). Its the best psychiatric med for losing weight for all those interested, they combine it with phen phen for all those who remember than fiasco in the 1990s. I slept better on it for sure

 

Anyway if you want proven glutamate reduction/gaba increase, then why is nobody mentioning lamictal/depakote/topirimate etc? Its very possible (pacenik's idea) that i had a more positive reaction to flumazenil is because i am currently taking 1250mg of depakote every day (which is also an excellent medication!). Anyway something to chew the fat on.

 

Good that you brought this up. Topiramate in clinical studies failed to alleviate symptoms of benzo withdrawal highlighting that this approach is not feasible.

 

I was responding to this above but clicked the last one posted since the word "failed" appeared twice , so apologies from my side. I was never denying the bone marrow issue, every drug has a serious adverse issue. you know tylenol kills people. What percentage of people get the bone marrow issue? how many fatalaties? its still OTC... that doesnt mean its dangerous... 

 

carbamazepine is not firstline treatment for anyone i would try anyway and yes you do have to measure blood levels on it. There are 10 other ones. There is oxcarbamazepine which doesn't require measuring levels and is a much more side effect friendly version of the same. As I said, tens of millions of people take these medications and most of them are considered safe. I hope we can agree on the points above .

 

I accept your apologies

 

To answer your question, about 2% of the people who take carbamazepine have more serious blood issues and mild changes occur in 30% of the people: "Blood dyscrasias (moderate and severe leucopenia and 1 case of thrombocytopenia) occurred with an incidence of 2% with mild changes detected in up to 30% of patients." I got this from here: https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/Profs/PUarticles/carbam.htm

 

Tylenol is a much safer drug.

 

You read what you like to read . Firstly it doesn't say serious blood issues it says the blood issues are mild (thats the heading in big letters), and that they show up with monitoring which is what the point is, it goes away within 2 weeks with switch to another med. The rashes are also mild. Not only that it ends the article with the phrase that carbamazepine is a "relatively safe drug." If it such a relatively safe drug, imagine how safe depakote or lamictal are

 

I opened three prescribing guides on side effects, nobody lists bone marrow suppression as even a "rare side effect." you really had to research hard to find that and i give you kudos for it, your very good at scaring people, and i never even wanted to suggest carbamazepine to anyone and you got me discussing it for the last five posts .  Anyway we need to move on with life, i can't keep trying to refute every misstatement or judgement (or what is in my opinion).

 

I ask kindly if you say something is a failure or doesn't work to say why you think its not a failure and provide some evidence as to why its not (as in the case of topirimate, such as a study where a study or case report where it doesnt work) rather than just say its a failure, and i apologize full for quoting the wrong post when i responded. Goodnight

 

Further reading on the toxicity of carbamazepine:

 

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10072-014-1701-0

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8112238/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8385460/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/1454149/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2536179/

[[ra...]]

Well this went south.  How the F did we get on carbamazepine and other antipsychotics??!?!

 

Jordan Peterson, a man of substantial wealth, found himself F-ed up like us, but unlike us, he has substantial wealth, so his family literally scoured the globe, incredulous that so serious a condition did not have a known treatment.

 

From pretty good inference, we have determined, he received some combination of flumazenil, ibogaine, and in my opinion most relevantly, xenon, from a clinic in Serbia.

 

I am reposting this in a new thread.  Buddies, let's stay on point.  Yes free speech, but while sometimes tangents can help, clearly we are all over the place here. . .

[[Ch...]]

I’m interest in Flumazenil and xenon.

 

Anecdotal accounts.

 

I.e “I went and this made me better or worse”

 

The majority of these  sufferers here can’t understand the science and do not care.

 

I’m trying based on anecdotal evidence. Because science and white coats got me here and didn’t accept any responsibility.

[[pi...]]

I emailed Mikhaila Peterson and will let everyone know if I get a response.

 

I also emailed that Belgrade detox center I mentioned, still unsure if that's where Jordan went, but it meets a lot of the criteria?

 

I talked to them and all they would tell me is that, for benzo patients, they would do their detox therapy(?), 'psychostabilizers', and would recommend doing treatment with 'Ibogaine' as well...

 

https://heroindetoxeurope.com/benzodiazepines-addiction-program/

 

No mention of Xenon specifically on their benzo detox page, or what medications or 'psychostabilizers' are used.

I tried to pry a little bit, but they wouldn't give me any further details and said they'd have to do further diagnostics to determine exactly.

 

But a quick search of Ibogaine is enough to scare me away I think. It's a psychoactive substance and apparently creates a very intense experience. It is used by various places to treat addictions, and appears to be an NMDA antagonist(?), but 'pyschoactive' or psychedelic is literally the last thing I would want to try with my fragile brain.

 

Unless Jordan Peterson comes out and says it was the greatest thing that happened to him and solely responsible for his 180 healing, then that's one thing I am not going to attempt. 

 

Looks like there are various clinics in Europe that offer treatment with Xenon gas though. Not sure if that was actually part of Jordan's protocol, hopefully we'll find out, but it looks interesting.

 

One of the stem cell clinics I was looking at, before I decided on the Mexico one, actually offers it and can even pair it with stem cells.

 

https://www.startstemcells.com/xenon-gas-inhalation-therapy.html

 

hey did you ever get a response from Jordan or Mikheala. and how did you find their email?

 

I thought about reaching out to her as well. I have some background with this that i thought i could help a bit.

[[wo...]]

This thread is turning into the presidential debate ... I will put in my last two cents on the topic and i hope we can all be civil.

 

- Not all science and medicine has been discovered. Saying something works or doesn't just because there aren't studies is wrong. Until we discover that it works, there's no way to know.

 

A good example is ketamine, which was discovered in the 1960s. If i asked a psychiatrist in 1995, he would say it doesn't and that its probably dangerous when the complete opposite is true. We don't have all information today on all compounds that exist.

 

- Doing many controlled studies and having extensive proof requires $$$. Intensive studies on drugs and treatments are mainly done by the private sector. If there is no reason to study treatments for elements (like xenon or lithium), existing medications, then very few studies are done, and even then the private sector will try to create a different molecule or different treatment so they can commercialize it and make profit.

 

I mentioned lithium because it might be the closest situation to xenon. Lithium was known anedctodally for centuries to help for depression and mood issues. People went to spas with high lithium content to get better. Even 7-up was advertised to help your mood as it used to contain lithium. An Australian scientist John Cade in 1948 discovered that high doses stabilized bipolar patients, and based and guess on what? On the anecdotal evidence that existed before, he might have heard from his grandma lithium helps her mood and said, why not, lets try it. It took 22 years for lithium to be FDA approved. It took 49 other countries and their research to convince the FDA to approve lithium. Even today, with overwhelming evidence that lithium is the most effective medication for bipolar disorder, it is prescribed less than other medications in the USA that big pharma created. Xenon, like lithium, is an element. You can buy the gas anywhere and nobody can patent it. If a mechanism is found where xenon is effective, pharma companies will scramble to research analogs of xenon but never actually xenon because they cannot profit from it. They will want to understand the underlying mechanism, but not actually use the treatment.

 

- Given the above, there is no reason to say not to try xenon. Its safe, it can't do harm, and maybe, just like lithium if enough people notice that it works and has some potential, some scientist just like John Cade can take it to the next step.

 

- Xenon will never be studied to the point where it can meet the same study criteria as any medication with commercial promise

 

- You can pursue multiple strategies to getting better. You can taper and take medications to make it easier and diet and vitamins and whatever else at the same time. its not mutually exclusive like you have to choose between tapering and another strategy.

 

 

To Maugham:

- Its important that people have hope. Different people have a different risk profile than you. Its important to respect that. If something shows promise and is available, why say it doesn't work when you have no evidence of the same.

- Even things that do work (there are many studies including RCT ones on anticonvulsants that show they assist benzo w/d and we debated in other thread), your immediate response is to find the most dangerous side effect on the strongest one and then say its dangerous. It is rather hypocritical what you have been writing for the last few pages saying something should be considered if there is scientific evidence, then dismissing everything with any promise as "dangerous".

 

- You choose to do a "pure" microtaper over 3 years. That is your choice, not everyone has that choice. If your having a hard time and you feel you lost many years of your life, that was your choice. There is no reason you should try to convince everyone else to make the same decision you did. I made a decision to taper over a few months, eat keto, exercise, and some help from flumazenil (and very likely depakote), today i am almost 11 months free and 95% better.

 

I am really happy i choose not to microtaper. Yes it was very hard for me, but i fought and looked for every solution i could. I am happy that today i am not taking 1.323mg valium and tomorrow 1.321mg. That is my happiness, and i would never tell somebody who is microtapering to do the same. Different stokes for different folks.  I don't put down your decision, it was yours, maybe it even worked out better for you. Good luck with that. Don't scare and manipulate information to try to scare people into your path. I wish you luck and hope your jump off day comes soon

[[Ma...]]

This thread is turning into the presidential debate ... I will put in my last two cents on the topic and i hope we can all be civil.

 

- Not all science and medicine has been discovered. Saying something works or doesn't just because there aren't studies is wrong. Until we discover that it works, there's no way to know.

 

A good example is ketamine, which was discovered in the 1960s. If i asked a psychiatrist in 1995, he would say it doesn't and that its probably dangerous when the complete opposite is true. We don't have all information today on all compounds that exist.

 

- Doing many controlled studies and having extensive proof requires $$$. Intensive studies on drugs and treatments are mainly done by the private sector. If there is no reason to study treatments for elements (like xenon or lithium), existing medications, then very few studies are done, and even then the private sector will try to create a different molecule or different treatment so they can commercialize it and make profit.

 

I mentioned lithium because it might be the closest situation to xenon. Lithium was known anedctodally for centuries to help for depression and mood issues. People went to spas with high lithium content to get better. Even 7-up was advertised to help your mood as it used to contain lithium. An Australian scientist John Cade in 1948 discovered that high doses stabilized bipolar patients, and based and guess on what? On the anecdotal evidence that existed before, he might have heard from his grandma lithium helps her mood and said, why not, lets try it. It took 22 years for lithium to be FDA approved. It took 49 other countries and their research to convince the FDA to approve lithium. Even today, with overwhelming evidence that lithium is the most effective medication for bipolar disorder, it is prescribed less than other medications in the USA that big pharma created. Xenon, like lithium, is an element. You can buy the gas anywhere and nobody can patent it. If a mechanism is found where xenon is effective, pharma companies will scramble to research analogs of xenon but never actually xenon because they cannot profit from it. They will want to understand the underlying mechanism, but not actually use the treatment.

 

- Given the above, there is no reason to say not to try xenon. Its safe, it can't do harm, and maybe, just like lithium if enough people notice that it works and has some potential, some scientist just like John Cade can take it to the next step.

 

- Xenon will never be studied to the point where it can meet the same study criteria as any medication with commercial promise

 

- You can pursue multiple strategies to getting better. You can taper and take medications to make it easier and diet and vitamins and whatever else at the same time. its not mutually exclusive like you have to choose between tapering and another strategy.

 

 

To Maugham:

- Its important that people have hope. Different people have a different risk profile than you. Its important to respect that. If something shows promise and is available, why say it doesn't work when you have no evidence of the same.

- Even things that do work (there are many studies including RCT ones on anticonvulsants that show they assist benzo w/d and we debated in other thread), your immediate response is to find the most dangerous side effect on the strongest one and then say its dangerous. It is rather hypocritical what you have been writing for the last few pages saying something should be considered if there is scientific evidence, then dismissing everything with any promise as "dangerous".

 

- You choose to do a "pure" microtaper over 3 years. That is your choice, not everyone has that choice. If your having a hard time and you feel you lost many years of your life, that was your choice. There is no reason you should try to convince everyone else to make the same decision you did. I made a decision to taper over a few months, eat keto, exercise, and some help from flumazenil (and very likely depakote), today i am almost 11 months free and 95% better.

 

I am really happy i choose not to microtaper. Yes it was very hard for me, but i fought and looked for every solution i could. I am happy that today i am not taking 1.323mg valium and tomorrow 1.321mg. That is my happiness, and i would never tell somebody who is microtapering to do the same. Different stokes for different folks.  I don't put down your decision, it was yours, maybe it even worked out better for you. Good luck with that. Don't scare and manipulate information to try to scare people into your path. I wish you luck and hope your jump off day comes soon

 

Wolfie,

 

I actually stopped posting on this thread more than 10 days ago.

 

I agree with you about many of the things you said about lithium, the corruption of big pharma, the random and sometimes fortuitous nature of drug discovery.

 

There can always be further such discoveries. The chances for this are now lower than before as many of the so called low-hanging fruits have been picked. In other words, diseases that are easier to treat we can treat. New technology appears to be coming to the fore, illustrated by the development of effective antibodies to treat diseases as wide ranging as arthritis and migraine.

 

I didn't say that xenon was dangerous. I said it is potentially dangerous for people with benzo dependence. It's safe for healthy people but we don't know if it's safe for benzo-dependent people. The potential danger of Xenon was just one of the reasons why I dismiss it. A more important reason is that the person who raised this issue did so because they think that this was what Jordan Peterson was taking which was helping him feel better. There are several huge problems with this. We do not know whether he is/was taking Xenon or not. Second, we do not know if he is feeling better now. Third, even if it works for him, it doesn't mean it will for you or me. Just can you entertain the thought for a second that he is not taking it or he is but he is not feeling better? At the same time, visiting such a clinic costs money, time, and if the treatment doesn't work disappointment.

 

While I agree with you that conducting clinical studies is expensive and in most cases are done by pharmaceutical companies, this is not always the case. The NIH in the US does this as do universities and other government agencies worldwide. But most importantly, what is stopping Serbian or other clinics using Xenon from publishing their results? If it really works and they publish this, they will have not just the glory but people from all over the world spending their hard-earned money at their clinics.

 

Thank you for your nice words. I don't microtaper in the classical sense as I decrease my valium intake by 0.1 mg every 2 weeks or so. I do this because I read the Ashton manual and my psychiatrist prefers this method. It's taking much longer than anticipated but I don't suffer and live an almost completely normal life.

 

Hope is important, I agree with that too. I think it's clear from this board that (almost) everybody heals sooner or later with the passing of time. So there is hope. However, false hope is not helpful, it's harmful.

 

Yes, everybody can choose whatever method they want to quit. I never questioned this.

 

Again, thank you for your encouragement. I'm happy you are much better and I'm always happy for everybody who feels better and heals.

 

M

[Guest [Mi...]]

Jordan Peterson is an incredibly high profile celebrity that felt that he couldn't afford a long, slow taper. I believe that is why he opted for the coma. He also has a host of other immune system issues that add to his situation being very specific and very different than most of us here.

[[Ma...]]

Jordan Peterson is an incredibly high profile celebrity that felt that he couldn't afford a long, slow taper. I believe that is why he opted for the coma. He also has a host of other immune system issues that add to his situation being very specific and very different than most of us here.

 

He is just like anybody else.

[[Be...]]

What are his other immune system problems? 

[[pi...]]

What are his other immune system problems?

 

depression, anxiety

[[pi...]]

Jordan Peterson is an incredibly high profile celebrity that felt that he couldn't afford a long, slow taper. I believe that is why he opted for the coma. He also has a host of other immune system issues that add to his situation being very specific and very different than most of us here.

 

He is just like anybody else.

 

except in all the ways hes not

 

[[Be...]]

I didn't think depression and anxiety were immune problems?  Does he have Lupus or MS or something like that?  Positive ANA test?  Did he reveal any of his blood test results?

[[st...]]

What are his other immune system problems?

 

depression, anxiety

 

Depression and anxiety have nothing to do with the immune system.

[[pi...]]

What are his other immune system problems?

 

depression, anxiety

 

Depression and anxiety have nothing to do with the immune system.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3002174/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6658985/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_and_immune_function

https://www.mqmentalhealth.org/posts/could-depression-be-caused-by-our-immune-system

 

Peterson has stated his food sensitivities and mental health illnesses are hereditary and familial i.e. there is an immune mediated effect. This is an open field of investigation in medicine.

 

Mikheala also had rheumatoid arthritis along with her anxiety and depression.

 

chronic inflammation tends to me immuno-modulated. chronic inflammation contributes to depression and anxiety. thats how its linked. i suggest you read up.

[[Ma...]]

What are his other immune system problems?

 

depression, anxiety

 

Depression and anxiety have nothing to do with the immune system.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3002174/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6658985/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_and_immune_function

https://www.mqmentalhealth.org/posts/could-depression-be-caused-by-our-immune-system

 

Peterson has stated his food sensitivities and mental health illnesses are hereditary and familial i.e. there is an immune mediated effect. This is an open field of investigation in medicine.

 

Mikheala also had rheumatoid arthritis along with her anxiety and depression.

 

chronic inflammation tends to me immuno-modulated. chronic inflammation contributes to depression and anxiety. thats how its linked. i suggest you read up.

 

Hereditary and familial doesn't mean they are immune mediated.

 

There is a theory that inflammation in the brain can contribute to depression but after more than 30 years of research, this is still just a theory.

[[pi...]]

What are his other immune system problems?

 

depression, anxiety

 

Depression and anxiety have nothing to do with the immune system.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3002174/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6658985/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_and_immune_function

https://www.mqmentalhealth.org/posts/could-depression-be-caused-by-our-immune-system

 

Peterson has stated his food sensitivities and mental health illnesses are hereditary and familial i.e. there is an immune mediated effect. This is an open field of investigation in medicine.

 

Mikheala also had rheumatoid arthritis along with her anxiety and depression.

 

chronic inflammation tends to me immuno-modulated. chronic inflammation contributes to depression and anxiety. thats how its linked. i suggest you read up.

 

Hereditary and familial doesn't mean they are immune mediated.

 

There is a theory that inflammation in the brain can contribute to depression but after more than 30 years of research, this is still just a theory.

 

theories are commonly accepted as scientific fact, the theory of gravity, the theory of evolution etc.

 

Happy to educate you on this - basically the word theory is different to laymen than it is in the scientific community.

 

definition:

 

"in everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. ... " A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment."

 

this theory has been reproduced in lab conditions, hence its considered scientifically correct.

 

The "just a theory" line of reasoning is commonly observed among science deniers and laymen who do no have any scientific literacy or education. 

 

Here's a reference that helps educate laymen about this universally understood and ubiquitous idea within the scientific community:

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/just-a-theory-7-misused-science-words/

 

which means jordans belief that hereditary and familiar conditions like this tend be associated with atopy and hypersensitivity reactions is backed up by the relevant literature.

[[Ma...]]

What are his other immune system problems?

 

depression, anxiety

 

Depression and anxiety have nothing to do with the immune system.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3002174/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6658985/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_and_immune_function

https://www.mqmentalhealth.org/posts/could-depression-be-caused-by-our-immune-system

 

Peterson has stated his food sensitivities and mental health illnesses are hereditary and familial i.e. there is an immune mediated effect. This is an open field of investigation in medicine.

 

Mikheala also had rheumatoid arthritis along with her anxiety and depression.

 

chronic inflammation tends to me immuno-modulated. chronic inflammation contributes to depression and anxiety. thats how its linked. i suggest you read up.

 

Hereditary and familial doesn't mean they are immune mediated.

 

There is a theory that inflammation in the brain can contribute to depression but after more than 30 years of research, this is still just a theory.

 

theories are commonly accepted as scientific fact, the theory of gravity, the theory of evolution etc.

 

Happy to educate you on this - basically the word theory is different to laymen than it is in the scientific community.

 

definition:

 

"in everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. ... " A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment."

 

this theory has been reproduced in lab conditions, hence its considered scientifically correct.

 

The "just a theory" line of reasoning is commonly observed among science deniers and laymen who do no have any scientific literacy or education. 

 

Here's a reference that helps educate laymen about this universally understood and ubiquitous idea within the scientific community:

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/just-a-theory-7-misused-science-words/

 

which means jordans belief that hereditary and familiar conditions like this tend be associated with atopy and hypersensitivity reactions is backed up by the relevant literature.

 

Oh, so you don't want to use lay terms. Fine by me. Lets' analyze your following contention scientifically, which I do, and not the way a pharmacutical rep who projects one slide after the other would:

 

"Associated". When two processes are associated, that in no way means there is causation involved.

 

See here: https://sphweb.bumc.bu.edu/otlt/MPH-Modules/PH717-QuantCore/PH717-Module1A-Populations/PH717-Module1A-Populations6.html

 

Let's also analyze the following thought:

 

"Peterson has stated his food sensitivities and mental health illnesses are hereditary and familial i.e. there is an immune mediated effect. "

 

Hereditary/familiar means inherited from parents:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heredity

 

Immune mediated means it has to do with the immune system.

 

Because a disease is hereditary, it doesn't mean it has to do with the immune system.

 

"chronic inflammation tends to me immuno-modulated"

 

This I don't even understand.

 

 

[[pi...]]

firstly correlation doesn't equal causation. this is another basic tenet of research.

 

secondly, these are Jordan's claims, not mine. I stated that his claims are based in scientific rationale, which they are, and then provided proof. 

 

i then provided scientific literature and sources to help educate you on a broader understanding of the concept. which you ignored.

 

i encourage you to read up on those sources i gave. very educational to help increase your awareness and understanding of basic science literacy, as well as some basic information on how inflammation is cytokine mediated and involves the immune system in depression and anxiety.

[[Ma...]]

firstly correlation doesn't equal causation. this is another basic tenet of research.

 

secondly, these are Jordan's claims, not mine. I stated that his claims are based in scientific rationale, which they are, and then provided proof. 

 

i then provided scientific literature and sources to help educate you on a broader understanding of the concept. which you ignored.

 

i encourage you to read up on those sources i gave. very educational to help increase your awareness and understanding of basic science literacy, as well as some basic information on how inflammation is cytokine mediated and involves the immune system in depression and anxiety.

 

Let's not believe everything Jordan claims. I wouldn't base my scientific and worldview on Jordan Peterson's. He is not a doctor or medical scientist. I know some people idolize him, they are in love with him, but let's try to be objective here.

[[pi...]]

focusing on the first step of learning can be difficult, as it takes some emotional work.

 

but admitting ignorance and then asking for help, is really the toughest part.

 

if your having trouble addressing the points, or accessing the resources, please let us know so we can help. we can easily find simpler and easier content that you can start on and build from there. then we are happy to engage with any points you might have, rather than these ad hominums. lets keep it civil. 

 

you got this bud. learning can be fun! 

[[Ma...]]

focusing on the first step of learning can be difficult, as it takes some emotional work.

 

but admitting ignorance and then asking for help, is really the toughest part.

 

if your having trouble addressing the points, or accessing the resources, please let us know so we can help. we can easily find simpler and easier content that you can start on and build from there. then we are happy to engage with any points you might have, rather than these ad hominums. lets keep it civil. 

 

you got this bud. learning can be fun! 

 

Ad hominem. Not ad hominum. It's a Latin expression.

[[pi...]]

we can wait. take your time. google any words or concepts you dont understand. Im happy to answer any questions you have?

 

do you need reminding of the topic or the points raised?