Z-Drug Support Group (Lunesta, Imovane, Zimovane, Ambien, Sonata, Zopiclone)

[[mo...]]

Hey everyone, I've got a question

 

I'm 23 been on ambien for about year, tolerance set in quick and gradually increased dose to 30-40mg.

 

last few months I've been getting symptoms which i have only just discovered are classic benzo withdrawal symptoms, (burning skin, dry mouth, shakes, extreme anger etc).

Doctor assured me it couldn't be ambien since it's non addictive , sent me to a neuro which did a million tests which all came back fine.

 

Now I read about benzo withdrawal and even though it isn't a benzo its very similar and the symptoms are spot on.

So my question basically is, how long will this last, I know it's individual but given that I've only been on it a year and it's ambien and not benzos, it shouldn't be months to years right?

 

I'd appreciate it if some people would say how long they had their symptoms, i'm talking mostly about the physical ones. 

[[Wo...]]

I'd appreciate it if some people would say how long they had their symptoms, i'm talking mostly about the physical ones.

 

Unfortunately nobody can give you a definite answer. It varies greatly from person to person. Ambien does the same thing as a benzo so there is little difference from that perspective. I have a theory that young people develop tolerance faster but also recover faster. Hopefully it won't last more than a few months for you. Most of my symptoms have greatly improved after 3 months. The only one that remains that is troublesome is muscle twitches.

[[mo...]]

wow it can actually last a few months? thats disappointing..

I know it subjective but when is it you feel the peak, how long until symptoms start improving.

 

Thanks replying and hopefully your muscle twitches will be better soon.

[[Wo...]]

wow it can actually last a few months? thats disappointing..

I know it subjective but when is it you feel the peak, how long until symptoms start improving.

 

Thanks replying and hopefully your muscle twitches will be better soon.

 

I started to feel better as soon as I started my dose reductions. Interdose withdrawal was the worst part for me.

[[mo...]]

hopefully it'll be the same for me even though I cold turkey it a week ago.

 

thanks

[[ge...]]

Someone pls explain the points of good sleep hygiene?

 

thx

[[Wo...]]

Someone pls explain the points of good sleep hygiene?

 

thx

 

1. Turn down the lights about 2 hours before going to bed. That includes computers. TV is okay but not recommended.

2. Don't use your bed for anything but sleep. And don't go to bed until you are really tired.

3. Don't exercise inside 4 hours of bed.

4. Stretch or meditate to calm your mind and muscles before bed.

 

Those are my key ones but there are many others...

 

http://www.sleepfoundation.org/article/ask-the-expert/sleep-hygiene

[[Ca...]]

Hey everyone, I've got a question

 

I'm 23 been on ambien for about year, tolerance set in quick and gradually increased dose to 30-40mg.

 

last few months I've been getting symptoms which i have only just discovered are classic benzo withdrawal symptoms, (burning skin, dry mouth, shakes, extreme anger etc).

Doctor assured me it couldn't be ambien since it's non addictive , sent me to a neuro which did a million tests which all came back fine.

 

Now I read about benzo withdrawal and even though it isn't a benzo its very similar and the symptoms are spot on.

So my question basically is, how long will this last, I know it's individual but given that I've only been on it a year and it's ambien and not benzos, it shouldn't be months to years right?

 

I'd appreciate it if some people would say how long they had their symptoms, i'm talking mostly about the physical ones.

 

I don't want to scare you. maybe you will be quick to feel better just like worrieddad .

but my story is much more extreme.

 

I got the same answers from doctors. (oh no, zopiclone could not possibly be your problem etc)

 

That attitude, sent me down a path of a lot more zopiclone and other drugs, until I figured oh what was wrong with me.

 

I thought I would be healed in 6 months. It did not happen that way.

Good luck.

Carol

[[ca...]]

Carol, sees like you had a very difficult time with this taper.  How was your taper? fast or slow? I've been getting ready to stop this drug and have been on it for almost 10 years at 10 mgs.  I'm either going to go with the 3/4 of tablet first or I will start shaving off some.  Still not sure which methods will work.  I have been starting my sleep hygiene as WorriedDad pointed out.  Im still learning much from the posts here and don't want to go to fast but I do need to start this very soon.  Thank you

[[Ca...]]

Carleeta

 

You can look at my signature and see that I did not Really taper.

I was one sick puppy by then and did a 3 week taper.

I was taking zopiclone every 3 hours by then along with trazadone .

 

Anyways, I found that crushing the pills and then Splitting them up with a knife into 6 fairly equal parts worked ok.

Are you getting any interdose withdrawal or are you just to the point where it is no longer effective for sleep? I think that depending on how Ill you are now, could dictate how you want to move forward with your taper.

everyone reacts differently to reducing, so it depends on what is right for you.

If I could do a do-over I would have done a cross over to something with a longer half life.

 

If you have no interdose withdrawal then maybe just reducing at night will work for you.

 

I was also a pretty long term user and I guess my down finally downregulated my own receptors and it hit me hard! After all it is a substance meant to knock you out in 15 minutes !

Don't be fooled into thinking that it is somehow less potent or harmful just because it is a benzo cousin. That isn't synonymous with less dangerous.

 

I had severe anxiety due to interdose withdrawal and cog fog.

At first I had no idea that it was even being caused by the zopiclone.

I had used it with no problems for quite a few years.

I scoffed at people who were aghast at me using sleeping pills.

 

I have a blog called "carol bears/bares all" if you want to come by.

I never did write my story out at the beginning but there is still a lot of my story scattered about in there.

 

Wishing you well

Love Carol

 

 

[[mo...]]

This so frustrating and the worse part, I'm not even sure it's ambien withdrawal.

 

The burning skin, dry mouth, shakes etc are all symptoms of benzo withdrawal, everytime I look for info on ambien withdrawal it's just insomnia and anxiety

 

 

[[Wo...]]

This so frustrating and the worse part, I'm not even sure it's ambien withdrawal.

 

The burning skin, dry mouth, shakes etc are all symptoms of benzo withdrawal, everytime I look for info on ambien withdrawal it's just insomnia and anxiety

 

A complete list is given here...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzodiazepine_withdrawal_syndrome

 

The page is entitled "Benzodiszepine Withdrawal Syndrome" but specifically states...

 

Daytime symptoms can occur after a few days to a few weeks of administration of nightly benzodiazepine use[31][32] or z-drugs such as zopiclone;[33]

[[mo...]]

Thanks that's reassuring.

This is exactly the kind of information I wouldn't get with no one but very specific specialists who don't even exist in my country.

 

Thanks god for the internet

 

 

[[Wo...]]

Thanks that's reassuring.

This is exactly the kind of information I wouldn't get with no one but very specific specialists who don't even exist in my country.

 

Thanks god for the internet

 

No problem. This is another comprehensive listing of symptoms from Dr. Ashton who is considered the preeminent benzo expert...

 

http://www.benzo.org.uk/manual/bzcha03.htm

[[Ma...]]

I took Ambien and Xanax for 10 years.  Xanax-free for 7 months (since July 19, 2013).  Still having withdrawals that come in waves. Now I'm trying to taper off Ambien and finding it very hard.  Would it be a good idea to do a crossover with either diazepam or trazodone?  I'm worried about interfering with the Xanax withdrawal...I've unwittingly become a mad scientist...

[[Ca...]]

I used a lot of trazadone and I really don't feel it was very useful.

Some people (I believe people who have not been compromised from zopiclone)

Find that it helps with sleep but for me, someone who was dangerously ill, it didn't help with anything.

I ended up taking more and more of it and that was the beginning of a brain vibration that I have to this day.

I am not a fan of it.

Amitryptiline on the other hand did help slightly with sleep.

It is not a benzo So it doesn't interfere with GABA.

 

Carol

[[Ca...]]

Also, just a side note, I'd you were taking ambien while tapering, it is would have softened the withdrawal effects of the Xanax taper. Although Ambien is known as a hypnotic, it also is a anxiolitic. Now with trying to cut down on the ambien, you will feel the full effects of the Xanax withdrawal that you did not feel before.

They are not separate things.

 

Carol

[[ka...]]

So, here is how not to do an ambien taper... I was getting only about 2 hours of "sleep" on ambien, and was non-functional. Got an idea that I could taper off ambien by taking seroquel (and in any case, I desperately needed more sleep). Despite warnings from WorriedDad, I started on Seroquel and over the course of several weeks decreased my ambien dose (made it from 3.75 to 1.25.) was so close!  But the seroquel stopped knocking me out (at first it was great), and now, I am on two sleep meds!! YAY me.  I hate seroquel but on the other hand thats why I am getting real sleep at all.

My  plan is to do a month (or so) taper of Ambien in May when work allows. I figure the seroquel can be tapered (should be) tapered more slowly.

 

Need to update my signature, but I have been on Ambien since the end of November 2013 after crushing anxiety prevented sleep.  Have done my best to take the lowest possible dose, hence the 3.75mg. After several weeks am currently on 100mg seroquel as well.

[[Ca...]]

So, here is how not to do an ambien taper... I was getting only about 2 hours of "sleep" on ambien, and was non-functional. Got an idea that I could taper off ambien by taking seroquel (and in any case, I desperately needed more sleep). Despite warnings from WorriedDad, I started on Seroquel and over the course of several weeks decreased my ambien dose (made it from 3.75 to 1.25.) was so close!  But the seroquel stopped knocking me out (at first it was great), and now, I am on two sleep meds!! YAY me.  I hate seroquel but on the other hand thats why I am getting real sleep at all.

My  plan is to do a month (or so) taper of Ambien in May when work allows. I figure the seroquel can be tapered (should be) tapered more slowly.

 

Need to update my signature, but I have been on Ambien since the end of November 2013 after crushing anxiety prevented sleep.  Have done my best to take the lowest possible dose, hence the 3.75mg. After several weeks am currently on 100mg seroquel as well.

 

Unfortunately there is no easy way off.

They prescribed me seroquel (200 mg) i didn't even sleep wih that.

 

You could research amytryptlin . It is not so potent and I got a very little sleep with it .

 

Good luck

Carol

[[be...]]

wow it can actually last a few months? thats disappointing..

I know it subjective but when is it you feel the peak, how long until symptoms start improving.

 

Thanks replying and hopefully your muscle twitches will be better soon.

 

Hi:

 

I guess  am one of the lucky ones. I did a C/T off of 12.5 mg of Ambien CR and while I did have a difficult time for the first four days after that I was fine. I had no s/x while taking the drug and no s/x after that four day period. I did, however, had both K and valium in my system so I am sure that helped lessen the sx. I would recommend that you drop 25% every week. If you have a benzo in your system, then it will make it much easier for you. However, I think it's important to add that I was only on Ambien for 3-4 weeks. Betsy

[Guest [ma...]]

So, here is how not to do an ambien taper... I was getting only about 2 hours of "sleep" on ambien, and was non-functional. Got an idea that I could taper off ambien by taking seroquel (and in any case, I desperately needed more sleep). Despite warnings from WorriedDad, I started on Seroquel and over the course of several weeks decreased my ambien dose (made it from 3.75 to 1.25.) was so close!  But the seroquel stopped knocking me out (at first it was great), and now, I am on two sleep meds!! YAY me.  I hate seroquel but on the other hand thats why I am getting real sleep at all.

My  plan is to do a month (or so) taper of Ambien in May when work allows. I figure the seroquel can be tapered (should be) tapered more slowly.

 

Need to update my signature, but I have been on Ambien since the end of November 2013 after crushing anxiety prevented sleep.  Have done my best to take the lowest possible dose, hence the 3.75mg. After several weeks am currently on 100mg seroquel as well.

 

I have posted a lot about Seroquel on both the insomnia threads and the other med threads. The lower the dose of Seroquel the higher the binding affinity for the histamine receptors and the alpha-2 adrenergic receptors. If your dr had prescribed a 25mg dose it would have had even more of a sedating effect on you.  At higher doses it begins to bind Dopamine and to a lesser extent Serotonin hence it's use as an atypical anti-psychotic.

 

I was on Serquel for 4 years and I now know for a fact that it masked w/d from benzos in part b/c of the binding of the adrenergic receptors. When I began to "taper" which was stopping in 3 weeks after taking it for 4 years, I found that 6mg would knock me out. This was b/c of the high binding affinity of the histamine receptors. Same biochemical mechanism of action as Benadryl/Gravol etc.

[[ka...]]

Um, so what would you suggest I do about the seroquel, Mandala? I have only been on it about 3 weeks max, so I am not too frightened of dependency yet. Should I try a 25mg dose? Should I take it at bedtime when I take the ambien or when I wake up from my 4 hours or so of ambien "sleep".? Does it have a long enough half life?  I would be pretty excited if a lower dose would be better, trust me.  Does it matter that I am cutting them to get to 25mg? (I have 50mg tablets, but it is normal seroquel, not seroquelXR) . 

 

(My doses of seroquel to date have bounced around from 50mg to 150, with only 2 nights at 150, most have been 50 until recently where I have had several at 100mg). Still at about 3.75 mg ambien.

 

Yeah, I should have known it would not be so simple, but in any case i really felt the need for some real sleep, which I did get for a while.

 

thanks so much for your help, you and everyone! Sometimes I think I make myself more anxious by being on BB but then when you get some solid info and encouragement, its great!

[Guest [ma...]]

Um, so what would you suggest I do about the seroquel, Mandala? I have only been on it about 3 weeks max, so I am not too frightened of dependency yet. Should I try a 25mg dose? Should I take it at bedtime when I take the ambien or when I wake up from my 4 hours or so of ambien "sleep".? Does it have a long enough half life?  I would be pretty excited if a lower dose would be better, trust me.  Does it matter that I am cutting them to get to 25mg? (I have 50mg tablets, but it is normal seroquel, not seroquelXR) . 

 

(My doses of seroquel to date have bounced around from 50mg to 150, with only 2 nights at 150, most have been 50 until recently where I have had several at 100mg). Still at about 3.75 mg ambien.

 

Yeah, I should have known it would not be so simple, but in any case i really felt the need for some real sleep, which I did get for a while.

 

thanks so much for your help, you and everyone! Sometimes I think I make myself more anxious by being on BB but then when you get some solid info and encouragement, its great!

 

Hi Kayden, I understand the need for sleep. In my opinion it's a good thing you are educating yourself with regard to this drug and that you have only been on for 3 weeks.

 

Seroquel has a half life of about 9-12 hours. Towards the end of taking Seroquel I was cutting 25mg pills into quarters (about 6 mg) and that little amount would make me sleep. I hope you understand that I can't give direct advice regarding your dose. However if you keep in mind the information in my post below about it being more sedating at a low dose, and acting more like an antipsychotic at a higher dose that might help you. It's a good thing you have the non XR as you can't cut those drugs.

 

[[ka...]]

I totally get it that you can't advise re:dose.  Although rereading my post that is what I was asking!

 

If anyone else cares to weigh in, please do.

 

[Guest [ma...]]

I totally get it that you can't advise re:dose.  Although rereading my post that is what I was asking!

 

If anyone else cares to weigh in, please do.

 

Hi Kayden,

 

I'm not really sure why you feel your questions were not answered. If you read all the information in my two replies I think I answered your questions. Nobody can give direct advice on BB regarding drugs and dosages. But when I told you that Seroquel was sedating a lower doses, and I gave you the half life which you asked about, I thought you would pick up on what I was telling you.

 

Sorry if you felt my answer to your question did not provide you with enough info. Hopefully someone else can reply and help you out.

 

All the best, mandala