Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[so...]]

Well, the funeral was tonight (viewing, I should say, funeral is Wednesday), and though I didn't do that Ativan cut on Sunday because I didn't want to have any symptoms, I ended up having a mini panic attack in the break room at the funeral home. I cried a little, for the right reasons, about losing my uncle, not about my panic, and I followed the Claire Weekes advice and floated through the panic, letting it do its worst and knowing that it would pass. Not only did it pass, but I chose to stay till 9pm instead of 7pm as I'd planned. Cheers to small victories! Thanks to everyone for your support.

 

Oh honey, that's a huge victory not just a small one and you did SO well! It's totally understandable that you felt that panic rising, because I've definitely found (and maybe others have too?) that emotions seem more intense and cause a sense of higher vulnerability and sensitivity during benzo withdrawl, and losing someone in your family is hard enough even without coping with benzos too so you are amazing and I hope you're feeling better. Well done with "floating" through it, I've been following your suggestion looking into Claire Weekes techniques and trying my hardest to do that too. Even made it through a job interview yesterday despite feeling panic and nausea the whole hour through, and that's due to your help with the Claire stuff. Thank you. And once again, you're doing incredibly well!

 

Thank you so much for that wonderful post! That really made me feel good! And I'm beyond thrilled that the Claire Weekes advice has been working for you to! She was both a doctor and a scientist and she helped thousands and thousands of people with anxiety, and it's so simple too! So I've been spreading the word. I'm in the middle of her second book right now. I wish she were still alive so I could send her a thank you note, because it really has already made such a difference!

 

Well, I tried calling the two psychiatrists in my area that didn't look terrifying in their pictures and/or have bad reviews , and one only sees people who see a primary doc at the same location (which I could do but this is about a half hour drive and I just prefer to have my main doc closer to home, AND I can't switch pdocs right now anyway) and the other has no appts until March and supposedly doesn't take my insurance though I found her through my insurance website. I'm taking this as a sign to wait and see what happens at my next appointment. I am going back to my 85-year-old doc which may or may not be a mistake, because I will not quite be off the ativan by the appointment and I think he will me more accepting of that, whereas the new guy was insistent that I cut the full 1 mg in one month. I'm not really worried about that because I have extra A. What I worry about is the fact that he felt that 2 mg of V was equivalent to 1 mg of A. I'm afraid he's going to take me down to 4 mg per day from the 10 mg I'm on now. But all I can do is stop worrying and hope for the best. That appt is on the 27th so... we'll see how it goes.

 

Where did that doc learn to do maths? That's a huge drop (1mg of Ativan is 10mg of Valium, not 2mg... at least from every single thing I've ever read, but I'm not medically trained so it will pay to ask others who are) I really hope you find a doctor who can give you a safer, slower taper. I'm glad that at least you know that what they're telling you is potentially not safe. Because that puts you ahead of literally millions of others who don't know that their doctors advice on benzo reduction isn't always safe. I wish we could tell them. Maybe we can put giant billboards on the side of every highway saying "slow down, benzo taper ahead, proceed with caution" You are wise, and I think that whatever your doctor says you know what is right for your body and you're going to find a way somehow.

 

Thank you, I am doing my best! I'd like to get off the valium 1 mg per month following this Ativan taper, but I'd also like to do it with the approval and supervision of a doc, so I am indeed going to keep looking. Having said that, I can only change primary docs once per month with my insurance, and they don't let you do a consultation first, so if any new doc just says, "Nope, not gonna prescribe Valium for you at all, adios," then I'd REALLY be screwed. So it might be best to find an addiction specialist (if my doc is willing to work with someone else's schedule) or a psychiatrist because they would then be in control of the prescribing. Considering thar we're all people dealing with anxiety, isn't it crazy that we have to go through all this on top of it? Such a crazy process. I guess it'll just make us stronger in the end, though, if we let it.

 

Hello Everyone,

 

I want to share this pearl of hope, I'm having the best window ever, Is almost 5 days without SX, I'm feeling almost 95 % normal,

what a great feeling,  I'm at 0.8 ml Valium, holding,  It is the best experience ever, after the dark place where I was,  Anxiety,  Panic Attack, Benzo addition, are 3 different things, we have to work against them very careful,

 

I'm very thankful to BB,  They saved my life.   

 

Hope soon I can jump and have a great story to tell!!!!

 

HOPE, HOPE, HOPE , HOPE.....    THERE IS HOPE !!

 

TEX

 

:D :D :smitten: :smitten:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Congrats Tex!! That is wonderful news. Just don't be discouraged if that window closes a bit and remember that it will open up again! You are not alone, so many wonderful supportive people here! Lean on us and rely on us. I'm certainly glad that I decided to. 

[[Al...]]

Hello Everyone,

 

I want to share this pearl of hope, I'm having the best window ever, Is almost 5 days without SX, I'm feeling almost 95 % normal,

what a great feeling,  I'm at 0.8 ml Valium, holding,  It is the best experience ever, after the dark place where I was,  Anxiety,  Panic Attack, Benzo addition, are 3 different things, we have to work against them very careful,

 

I'm very thankful to BB,  They saved my life.   

 

Hope soon I can jump and have a great story to tell!!!!

 

HOPE, HOPE, HOPE , HOPE.....    THERE IS HOPE !!

 

TEX

 

:D :D :smitten: :smitten:

 

Way to go ! Tex

 

Show us the way.

 

I am so very happy for you getting down to .8 mg. V.ng

 

Great news!  :thumbsup:

 

ATU

[[ro...]]

Tex,

This post made me smile for you..

I hear the joy in your words....

 

Continue healing, feeling wonderful!

 

Terry. 

[[Te...]]

Diaz-Pam, ATU, Moo, Rosegal,  solaceandpeace,  Left Behind, mrtmeo,  all BB,

 

Thanks for your kind words,  I enjoy this window, but I know a wave can come any time, but the windows are getting bigger and bigger,

I'm not longer afraid of  waves, I just let it happen, and wait for the next window.

 

Hope for everyone.   

 

KEEP CALM, CARRY ON,  AND NEVER GIVE UP!!!

 

TEX

 

:smitten: :thumbsup:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[[be...]]

Hi Rex, so glad you are  having a good window period and glad you posted, it helps us all to know that what we are doing everyday, will bring us

 

to a better place. Gosh I am so glad I found BB, because otherwise, this is such a lonely Journey, I did it before, and I truly believe that having others

 

to share and support makes this so much easier to endure. Hoping that the windows keep coming more and more.   

[[Ho...]]

Taking another poll:  How do you dose your valium?  Two times a day, three times a day?  I'm currently doing 3 times a day (5,4,5=total of 14 mg).  At what dose does it make sense to drop down dosing to twice a day?  Do you feel interdose withdrawals at twice a day?  For those of you who do take twice a day, what times do you schedule your doses?  I know some people just do it once a day like in Ashton protocol, but I can't even fathom this.  Would totally freak me out.

[[bu...]]

Take you dose however you choose...most folks find 2X day just fine with V.

 

You should never have interdose WD with V.

[[fr...]]

  I dose twice a day, 15 mg. split between morning and bedtime. 

[[Al...]]

I also dose twice a day.

When I crossed over from Ativan I was dosing three times because that's what I was doing with Ativan but once the cross was complete. I just turned the three V doses into two equal doses. There will be no interpose withdrawal from the V because it has such a long half life.

Plus it makes it so much easier not having to travel with that mid day dose around with you.

 

You'll be fine! 

 

 

ATU

[[Di...]]

I only ever dosed once a day, but that was because I originally took valium for insomnia, so of course I took it at night. When I started tapering it never even occurred to me to change my dosing. By the time I got to the point where I realised most people seemed to be dosing twice a day there didn't seem to be any point in me changing.

 

Like they say "if it ain't broke don't fix it". Just dose whenever you think you need to dose.

[[la...]]

Taking another poll:  How do you dose your valium?  Two times a day, three times a day?  I'm currently doing 3 times a day (5,4,5=total of 14 mg).  At what dose does it make sense to drop down dosing to twice a day?  Do you feel interdose withdrawals at twice a day?  For those of you who do take twice a day, what times do you schedule your doses?  I know some people just do it once a day like in Ashton protocol, but I can't even fathom this.  Would totally freak me out.

 

this is so funny, I literally just came on to ask this very question!!!!

when I was on V last time I dosed 3xs a day until I got to from 15mg to 9 then I just dropped afternoon dose and added the mgs to am & pm

 

I just yesterday went to 2 doses I am starting at 8.5mg this time and see no reason for the 3xs a day.  I haven't felt any better or worse so far.

 

I would love to dose 12 hours apart but I can not wait that long in morning...anxiety is so bad  so I dose 6:00am & 10:00pm.....  that leaves me with 16 hours between doses but my evenings are my best time so I am usually ok...or at least I was last time around.

 

 

[[Kg...]]

Lainey if you go to sleep later than 10 than dose when you go to bed.  Take your Am dose when you wake up. With Valium I don't think it matters that much since it lasts so long. Glad to see you are making progress - off the Ativan and now dealing with the devil you know.

[[la...]]

I do go to sleep between 10-10:30pm

 

progress?  well I am off Zoloft for the 1st time in 15years  but I feel just as crappy as ever.. I must confess though that I felt this crappy last year on the V and I was still on the Zoloft...so I can't blame coming off the Zoloft for my crappiness

[[so...]]

I guess I'm the crazy one who doses 4x per day! lol. The effects of taking 2.5 mg at one time were so strong for me in the beginning that I am afraid to take the full 5 mg pill at one go, and I take 10 mg daily, so I cut them in half and take one half four times a day. I've been debating whether or not to just do 2x daily but those mid-day doses psychologically give me some placebo relief when I am feeling like the anxiety is coming up... I know I need to rely less on that though.

[[so...]]

If I've been on Ativan now for two years (1.5 mg daily) and now I'm about to be off of that, replaced by 10 mg of Valium daily, how long should I plan to take tapering off the Valium? I realize of course that it's a "go by feel" situation for the most part, but I'm just wondering what to expect. Any thoughts on this?

[[Le...]]

Solaceandpeace, no crazy peeps here! I dose 3xs a day. I can't answer your taper question. We're all uniquely different when it comes to tapering off valium. Maybe some more experienced members can give you a "ballpark" idea.

 

Sending peaceful, healing thoughts your way.

[[Di...]]

If I've been on Ativan now for two years (1.5 mg daily) and now I'm about to be off of that, replaced by 10 mg of Valium daily, how long should I plan to take tapering off the Valium? I realize of course that it's a "go by feel" situation for the most part, but I'm just wondering what to expect. Any thoughts on this?

 

The answer is really "how long is a piece of string" I'm afraid. Everyone's taper is going to be different. Some people might be able to do it fairly quickly, or it might take a number of years. I took 22 months to taper off 5mg. That doesn't mean it will take you that long, but it might. The best thing is to try not to look too far ahead because you'll never find the answer. Just take one day at a time, and try to keep your taper in line with how you feel to be sure you can still live a fairly normal life, then it really doesn't matter how long it takes. Also remember the lower the dose sometimes the slower you have to go.

[[la...]]

I agree with Diaz...last time I cut every 2 weeks on schedule never feeling good at all

 

this time I am not going by a "schedule" as much as my OCD will allow me to. try to just go as I feel I can

[[bu...]]

If I've been on Ativan now for two years (1.5 mg daily) and now I'm about to be off of that, replaced by 10 mg of Valium daily, how long should I plan to take tapering off the Valium? I realize of course that it's a "go by feel" situation for the most part, but I'm just wondering what to expect. Any thoughts on this?

 

As long as it takes!  That's not a smart-ass answer, its just the facts.  A suggested taper rate is 5-10% every 10days-2 weeks.  You could use that to calculate a taper schedule, but chances are it won't be very meaningful.

 

I suggest you start a taper somewhere around that rate, maybe 5%/10 days and see how you feel.  Then you can adjust your rate up or down if needed.  And its pretty common that as you progress, you will find your sxs will change and you may need to cut your taper rate at lower doses.

 

It takes as long as it takes.

[[jj...]]

Hey velium taperers,

 

It's been a long time since I checked in on the forum. Probably most of you all don't know me by now, but back in the day I was a regular poster here and this is the thread where I ended up getting the best tapering advice. Good to see that a couple of other old timers are still posting and helping folks out. Sensible tapering is the easiest path to freedom.

 

Quick update on me, in case anyone is interested. I'm over six months out and I'm going very well. Not entirely healed yet, but past the point where I think I'll have any serious backslides. Guessing I'm about at 90% recovered, with a couple of little niggling nuisance issues yet to be fully resolved. I could probably write my success story now, but I'm going to hold off for another couple of months. It does get better eventually.

 

Stay strong taperers!

 

jj

[[Di...]]

Hi JJ

 

Of course we remember you!! It's good to get an update from you, and it's also good to hear that everything is positive.

 

Great News!!

[[jj...]]

*posted in the intro a few days ago*

 

Hello,

 

My game plan is bone simple, but I was curious to hear what others here think. I have talked with a doctor, and she doesn't have the personal experience. Fortunately she supports my decision to not continue with benzos for life :

 

December 7 to December 10 :

15mg daily: 7.5 mg morning // 7.5 mg evening

 

December 10 to December 11 :

12.5mg daily: 7.5 mg morning // 5 mg evening

 

December 11 to December 18 :

10mg daily: 5 mg morning // 5 mg evening

 

December 18 to December 26 :

7.5mg daily: 5 mg morning // 2.5 mg evening

 

December 26 to January 11 :

5mg daily: 2.5 mg morning // 2.5 mg evening

 

*first hiccup* -- Anxiety issues, severe agitation, bad headache, tension, heart palpitations, perturbed breathing that lasted very intense for 3-4days, and lingering symptoms still. Unfortunately, I didn't cut more as I was hoping for my body to stabilize.

 

January 11 to present :

3.75mg daily: 2.5 mg morning // 1.25 mg evening

 

Tonight I will take only 1.25mg, bringing me to 3.75 mg / day from here on out, unless the symptoms are too unbearable. I am now not working and have good family support, albeit they are not aware that this addiction is more severe than nicotine or even opiates (for me).

 

What are some ramifications to be expected? I am aware of the Ashton Manuel, but would appreciate more opinions about a slightly expedited taper plan. I am proud that I have never been this low before, since I started in early 2007.

 

I have tried and failed in the span of 9 years at least 20 times. My dosage range has been consistently daily, but have oscillated from as high as 150mg+ to the lowest (5mg). I feel that my body is "almost" stable, and will start to quarter my 5mg tablets of diazepam. Eventually after 2.5mg, I will procure 2mg tablets, and half and quarter those, respectively. What do you think of this plan? Thank you in advance!

[[jj...]]

I am getting a panic attack just reading posts about how one must take it super slow. I was doing just fine. Can anyone tapering diazepam tell me if the withdrawal gets far worse after 3.75mg? Below was advice I gave to someone coming off 5mg, and while it does contradict the narrative of BB and Asthon, I do not feel it is draconian nor unreasonable to cut this in 1.25mg and reduce to 2.5mg... and then get the 2mg tablets and quarter and half those. That is more slow than my doctor advocates, but I want to be as easy as possible. But now it seems I am being too hard? People do not have the right health plans lined up to procure 2mg tablets. Some don't have the money to find a doctor whom is willing to give out 2mg diazepam, let alone have patience for people doing a super slow taper. Please respond as I want hear any ramifications of expediting a taper plan without following the 5-10% cut every 10 days. Thank you.

 

My opinion is not a doctor's, but what my psychiatrist suggested was way more extreme than what I am doing or what  Heather Asthon suggests. I am at 3.75mg from 5mg (4th day). It has been pretty good actually. Now before I suggest on how great it is so far: (1) valium withdrawal is not monotonic in that it could change tomorrow, or even later today; and (2) everybody is different.

 

I agree that cutting 10% is ideal every two weeks, but not everyone has that insurance to procure the medicine, and I have been trying to do this only to find myself even more frustrated with slower cuts. If you have some headaches and agitations, try toughening it out. Watch movies and eat a big meal before bed (so what about temporal weight gain). Try walking (or dancing) during the day but don't overdo the exercise. If you are working, I would try to hold often than cut. Honestly, when you add daily chores coupled with workload, it can be overwhelming and traffic doesn't stop for you nor people will have patience and truly understand what you are going through. What complicates matters is many people here are drug users, street and psychotropic, and have other medicine currently used that influence their progress.

 

My next cut (maybe in February) to make sure I am stable at 3.75 daily will be very hard. I will be attempting 3.75mg to 2.5mg. Yes, I have read it's hard and barbaric, but think ... what if you lost your autonomy or you were displaced suddenly? It could be far, far worse! I had a friend who went to jail and he had to stop from 2mg of xanax because he was forced. And the authorities didn't do anything to accommodate him. Similarily, my psychiatrist has said to me, "I don't think you need the 2mg tablets -- just go from 5mg in a couple days to 3.75mg in a couple days to 2.5mg in a couple days, etc." That is obviously insane, but here I read reducing 5mg to 3.75mg for two weeks is cruel and unusual. Sometimes I get a panic attack reading posts and overthinking about how this process must grind out. Just do it! You are very close, but you have to want it. Another quick example is my mother took 0.5mg of ativan daily for insomnia and anxiety for over a year, and just jumped off without ANY side effects. My advice is be careful to quarter carefully when that time comes, and please remember that each tablet doesn't distribute the medicine evenly when halving and quartering, but we do our very best. And if you have anxiety, try to do breathing exercises. Do not cheat and take a quarter or half ... that will almost make all progress devoid, especially for valium/diazepam. That is what stopped me from quitting years ago.

 

Yes, I advocate your plan. Cut to 4mg and hold. Work and see how you function. If you can take the stress and symptoms, then try 3mg for 2 weeks or longer. Please get out conveniently but as fast as possible. 5 months is nothing, try 9 years of daily use up to 150mg of valium with possibly 17 other benzodiazepines among other mind-altering drugs within the mix. Yes, I was pretty messed up in my party days. Of course those drugs were hindering my progress. I do not think a water/milk taper is necessary, but then again, I do not know you.

 

All the best for you. Again, I personally believe you can do it without compromising your CNS system even though it's not PC to admit that here. I hope in reading this it helps you and others alike within striking distance from eviscerating this poison from our lives.

[[Di...]]

Hi jjones

 

Welcome to BB. Just looking over your taper so far, you have dropped your dose very quickly. You’ve gone from 15mg down to 3.75mg in just over a month. That’s certainly a lot faster than most people on BB can go.

 

That’s not saying that you can’t do it. Lots of people can get off benzos fairly quickly. We hear lots of anecdotal stories about friends and family just stopping without any problems, but usually by the time people end up on BB they’ve already tried tapering by themselves, or under the direction of their doctor, and found they just can’t do it. We appear to be a portion of the population that has a specific sensitivity to the effects of benzos. It also doesn’t appear to matter how long a person who is sensitive has actually taken the benzo. They can become severely dependent within just weeks, and certainly within a few months. So you do need to be very careful about the tapering advice you give to other people, especially a fellow newbie.

 

How you will continue to go with your taper is really anyone’s guess, because every taper is going to be different. The thing that I do find with the people who end up on BB is that once they get below 10mg, doing any kind of cut and hold taper gets harder and harder, to the point where a large portion of these people can’t even make the absolute smallest of dry cuts and need to switch over to a daily/liquid taper. When my dose was 5mg I couldn’t even dry cut 0.25mg without going almost insane from the side effects. I would never have gotten off valium if it hasn’t been for BB and being taught how to do a daily liquid taper.

 

Seeing as you appear to have had very up and down doses over the years, and unsuccessful attempts to get off altogether, I will seriously offer a word of caution about how you proceed from here. You want this to be your very last taper. To continue to go down and then up again can result in kindling, and you really don’t want to go there, although you may already have that problem and that’s why it’s getting harder for you reduce. Kindling makes each successive taper even harder than the previous.

 

It’s fine to get input from your doctor, but quite often doctors are the worst people to give tapering advice because (a) they’ve never actually tapered off a benzo so have no idea what it’s like for some people and (b) they totally underestimate the effects that benzo tapering can have on some people.

 

If you are someone who has a benzo sensitivity, like the majority of people on BB, simply stopping the benzo and having it out of your system isn’t the ultimate goal. The ultimate goal is how you do it. There are many people on BB who either did a cold turkey or a rapid taper and they are still here months and even years later suffering really horrible post withdrawal symptoms. You definitely don’t want to be one of those people. You would be far better off investing a bit more time in a sensible taper and then being in a much better position when you do finally jump off.

 

[[Ho...]]

I am asking this question for a fellow BB who is very ill. He is on generic diazepam and was just switched from mylan to actavis. I know we just had a generic discussion recently but anybody out there made this switch on the diazepam?'did you feel the actavis were weaker, stronger, or the same?