INFJ functioning persons

[[Kr...]]

Cold. Yes, INFJs can act that way to protect themselves from unequal energy exchanges.  It's easier to slam the door on a person (temporarily or permanently) than to establish compassionate boundaries before it gets to the point where the INFJ becomes depleted of all emotional energy.

 

Even when they try to set boundaries to preserve the relationships, the other parties involved are often oblivious to the reasons as to why they were needed.  The others will slowly start to overstep them again or will attack the INFJ for pulling back.  It's a tricky dynamic - maintaining mutable boundaries.

 

They don't want to be cold.  With extraverted feeling (Fe) as their auxiliary function, they want nothing more than to have harmonious interactions where everyone's needs are met...including their own!  But since many don't sense this underlying dynamic, the INFJ just appears cold.

 

[[az...]]

Ace! 

[[az...]]

Cold. Yes, INFJs can act that way to protect themselves from unequal energy exchanges.  It's easier to slam the door on a person (temporarily or permanently) than to establish compassionate boundaries before it gets to the point where the INFJ becomes depleted of all emotional energy.

 

Even when they try to set boundaries to preserve the relationships, the other parties involved are often oblivious to the reasons as to why they were needed.  The others will slowly start to overstep them again or will attack the INFJ for pulling back.  It's a tricky dynamic - maintaining mutable boundaries.

 

They don't want to be cold.  With extraverted feeling (Fe) as their auxiliary function, they want nothing more than to have harmonious interactions where everyone's needs are met...including their own!  But since many don't sense this underlying dynamic, the INFJ just appears cold.

 

Perfection

[[Sh...]]

Cold. Yes, INFJs can act that way to protect themselves from unequal energy exchanges.  It's easier to slam the door on a person (temporarily or permanently) than to establish compassionate boundaries before it gets to the point where the INFJ becomes depleted of all emotional energy.

 

Even when they try to set boundaries to preserve the relationships, the other parties involved are often oblivious to the reasons as to why they were needed.  The others will slowly start to overstep them again or will attack the INFJ for pulling back.  It's a tricky dynamic - maintaining mutable boundaries.

 

They don't want to be cold.  With extraverted feeling (Fe) as their auxiliary function, they want nothing more than to have harmonious interactions where everyone's needs are met...including their own!  But since many don't sense this underlying dynamic, the INFJ just appears cold.

 

Excellent post KristinM.

 

I have faced this dynamic more than once in friendships.  One in particular followed your paradigm to a T.  I had to end it and it left many wounds as she is still active in my circle of friends and I see her often.  Just not 1:1 which used to be the case.  She pursued the friendship from the start, she overstepped boundaries frequently, I would attempt to reset them, she was a stun and just didn't get anything but blunt force trauma.  Frequent emails, texts, calls, setting up two more social opportunities even while we were in the middle of the current one.  Very needy emotionally with a history of a lot of loss in her life.  I felt so absolutely depleted at the end that I felt like I had to be cold and even cruel for her to get it.  Which I was, I admit it.  I have regretted it somewhat but not the ultimate outcome which was for her to back off and give me some space please!

 

It has made me even more wary of pursuing friendships outside a group setting where things stay casual and friendly and not too needy.

 

Does anyone here have any advice for just how you negotiate relationships and setting boundaries and still have a mutually supportive and enjoyable friendship?  Or is it fated to always be all or nothing?

 

She

[[Ma...]]

Cold. Yes, INFJs can act that way to protect themselves from unequal energy exchanges.  It's easier to slam the door on a person (temporarily or permanently) than to establish compassionate boundaries before it gets to the point where the INFJ becomes depleted of all emotional energy.

 

Even when they try to set boundaries to preserve the relationships, the other parties involved are often oblivious to the reasons as to why they were needed.  The others will slowly start to overstep them again or will attack the INFJ for pulling back.  It's a tricky dynamic - maintaining mutable boundaries.

 

They don't want to be cold.  With extraverted feeling (Fe) as their auxiliary function, they want nothing more than to have harmonious interactions where everyone's needs are met...including their own!  But since many don't sense this underlying dynamic, the INFJ just appears cold.

 

Excellent post KristinM.

 

I have faced this dynamic more than once in friendships.  One in particular followed your paradigm to a T.  I had to end it and it left many wounds as she is still active in my circle of friends and I see her often.  Just not 1:1 which used to be the case.  She pursued the friendship from the start, she overstepped boundaries frequently, I would attempt to reset them, she was a stun and just didn't get anything but blunt force trauma.  Frequent emails, texts, calls, setting up two more social opportunities even while we were in the middle of the current one.  Very needy emotionally with a history of a lot of loss in her life.  I felt so absolutely depleted at the end that I felt like I had to be cold and even cruel for her to get it.  Which I was, I admit it.  I have regretted it somewhat but not the ultimate outcome which was for her to back off and give me some space please!

 

It has made me even more wary of pursuing friendships outside a group setting where things stay casual and friendly and not too needy.

 

Does anyone here have any advice for just how you negotiate relationships and setting boundaries and still have a mutually supportive and enjoyable friendship?  Or is it fated to always be all or nothing?

 

She

 

A friend of mine (an EFNJ) and I are constantly struggling with boundaries. Luckily , there’s the benefit of us both trying to nurture and make the other happy, however the E vs the I is a terribly difficult scenario. I, of course,  will step back to take in the situation, whereas he just jumps in and goes with it. Now that's great for him, but for me, getting dragged into social situations where I'd rather be the fly on the wall is a extremely stressful. I don't really know how to enforce the boundaries and I feel like I'm always getting overrun by the extrovert. This doesn't feel healthy for me and I don't feel good when I'm with this person at all, and I think I just need to slam the proverbial door here, and will eventually lose a friend over it.

[[az...]]

 

Not sure how I can introduce the video I’m watching but it’s interesting even with the language

[[Sh...]]

A friend of mine (an EFNJ) and I are constantly struggling with boundaries. Luckily , there’s the benefit of Us both trying to nurture and make the other happy, however the E vs the I is a terribly difficult scenario. I, of course,  will step back to take in the situation, whereas he just jumps in and goes with it. Now that’s great for him, but for me, getting dragged into social situations where I’d rather be the fly on the wall is a extremely stressful. I don’t really know how to enforce the boundaries and I feel like I’m always getting overrun by the extrovert. His doesn’t feel healthy for me and I don’t feel good when I’m with this person at all, and I think I just need to slam the proverbial door here, and will eventually lose a friend over it.

 

Oh Manic I hear you!  Having an I-E friendship can be very stressful for the I.  The Es do tend to run their agenda and over run the more cautious I.  The only thing I learned from my previous friendship was to be very careful with Es and focus instead on developing relationships with other Is.  The problem is, that while we don't pursue friendships readily, the Es can and do pursue theirs with a passion.  I think they often target us Is because we are empathetic and malleable to a certain point because we like harmony.  We make great foils for their social needs when another E might create competition and havoc instead of focusing on them and their needs.  I did feel targeted by my ex E friend.  I notice that she tries the same thing with other Is in our group frequently, dragging them along in her wake until they run screaming away just like I did.  I don't have any answers, just observations from here inside my own introverted head.

 

She

[[az...]]

 

Not sure how I can introduce the video I’m watching but it’s interesting even with the language

Was thinking the ideas may apply in (true) friendships as well? I know, I know 😻

[[Kr...]]

Does anyone here have any advice for just how you negotiate relationships and setting boundaries and still have a mutually supportive and enjoyable friendship?  Or is it fated to always be all or nothing?

 

I don't think it's fated to be all or nothing.  I think it's incredibly difficult to find your people. Often we form friendships based on common interests or similar life situations (school, work, parenting, etc.) but they don't always feed that depth and connection we need.  If those convenient friendships start consuming our time and energy, then we will inevitably be let down or feel dumped on because they weren't right in the first place.  If, however, some of those friendships are operating from a place of mutual acceptance (not necessarily understanding), then we don't really need to set boundaries because there is an equal exchange of energy.  For example, I have an extraverted friend who is good for me - she keeps me in the loop with what is happening in the outside world, is not emotionally needy or deep, but is accepting of me and is loyal.  She knows I won't be coming to her Bunco group and I know she won't be engaging in any type of discussions like this.  She doesn't understand why I enjoy being alone at home, and I don't relate to how she finds it enjoyable to keep up superficial conversations week after week at Bunco.  It's not a soul-mate type of friendship but it works.

 

It's difficult to end friendships once the energy dynamics start to shift and you realize the relationship is no longer healthy.  If you want to act with integrity, you have to stop allowing yourself to be drained by the other person and I don't have the answer on how to go about this.  The way I've dealt with it may not be the most honest, but is the kindest way I know how.  It involves creating longer and longer gaps in between correspondences and then just making it appear as if we've drifted away.

 

Creating compassionate boundaries is the most difficult.  These are needed for people that you feel you just can't cut out of your life, or for relationships that are worth fighting for.  I've been able to have direct conversations with other intuitive introverts about when I felt boundaries were being crossed. The conversations were difficult but didn't end the relationships.  They actually made them stronger because they were coming from a place of authenticity which we recognized.  Some personalities just don't take to these conversations though and that's where you have to get creative.  If your true goal is harmonious interactions without depleting your energy, you can find creative ways to manipulate situations in order to meet your own needs first while also meeting the needs of others.  Knowing the personality types of others is helpful because you can understand what they need as well.  I have some examples but I've taken up enough space on this thread today.  And I have a lot of growth to do in the relationship department.  Carry on!

[[Kr...]]

 

Not sure how I can introduce the video I’m watching but it’s interesting even with the language

Was thinking the ideas may apply in (true) friendships as well? I know, I know 😻

 

I lied, I'm back.   Just wanted to say that YES, this absolutely applies to friendship.  You receive what you put out there. 

[[Ma...]]

 

Oh Manic I hear you!  Having an I-E friendship can be very stressful for the I.  The Es do tend to run their agenda and over run the more cautious I.  The only thing I learned from my previous friendship was to be very careful with Es and focus instead on developing relationships with other Is.  The problem is, that while we don't pursue friendships readily, the Es can and do pursue theirs with a passion.  I think they often target us Is because we are empathetic and malleable to a certain point because we like harmony.  We make great foils for their social needs when another E might create competition and havoc instead of focusing on them and their needs.  I did feel targeted by my ex E friend.  I notice that she tries the same thing with other Is in our group frequently, dragging them along in her wake until they run screaming away just like I did.  I don't have any answers, just observations from here inside my own introverted head.

 

She

 

I appreciate the insight. Es really scare me off but I have this interest in understanding how that behavior works, so I’m drawn to it. I ask myself what is turned “on” in them that’s turned “off” in me? I’m intrigued but not enough to warrant the constantly ‘in your personal space’ kind of situation. I sometimes think it can be almost aggressive, but perhaps that’s only from the perspective of an I. I would personally prefer to be be a conscientious observer. Almost like watching some Es in their habitat through the glass at the zoo. I don’t mean to sound condescending, but I need that glass “boundary.” I feel almost as if understanding them would help me better understand me. If that makes any sense?!?!?!

[[az...]]

What an interesting thread.  Thank you for starting it Azalea32.

 

I too am an introvert.  Probably an INFJ too, but the NFJ part has varied on different tests but the introvert part has remained remarkably consistent throughout my life.  I'm afraid we are living in an extroverted world.  Extroversion is considered the desired trait and introversion is considered less than desirable and even aberrant if further along on the spectrum than society deems acceptable.

 

When my daughter was growing up, some of the things she pursued and the ways she had to be in this world puzzled and perplexed me.  It was not until I understood that, while I was quite introverted, she was and is wildly extroverted, probably at the extreme end of the spectrum.  While we had a pretty good relationship all things considered, we simply did not "get" one another.  I can not believe I didn't understand this dynamic until she was grown, gone and with children of her own.

 

I value my alone time and am not ever lonely even when I spend great swathes of time alone.  I live in my head a lot, am intellectually curious, and am most happy surrounded by books, word games, puzzles and quiet pursuits like gardening, needle crafts and maintaining my tropical aquariums.  Although I want some social interaction, I find myself fending off opportunities right and left because I need so much less of it than others think I ought to need.  I do have a group of friends and I join in on the social whirl at times, but decline a lot too.  They seem to accept me nevertheless and keep the invitations coming.  I think all of us introverts want some social interaction, we just want less of it and we want it on our own terms.  Who doesn't!

 

I am married to another introvert, so we are in agreement about our social obligations.  We are happiest spending time together at home with our quiet pursuits.  Even having my husband around 24/7 is challenging though and I look forward to the times he goes out of town to visit relatives, leaving me completely alone for a few days.  Those times are like heaven to me!  Just being alone with my thoughts is calming and healing in so many ways. 

 

NOW.  I am sure my introversion led me down the benzo path.  I had to get out there, earn a living, interact with the world in ways that were challenging for me, creating a lot of anxiety.  I did what I had to do but it surely took a toll on this introvert.  I didn't have a lot of insight into this dynamic until recent years as I look back over the arc of my life and my experiences.  I'm betting many of us on this forum fell into the same trap as we tried to make sense of an extroverted world.

 

Thank you again Azalea32 for starting this thread.

 

She

 

She, Ive been swamped with the details of life and I have not felt I had adequate energy to really thank you for showing up and I’m so happy genuinely that I know you and all here can understand me. Maybe I am feeling fairly blessed here and need to rest and catch up with all that’s been happening for me in terms of pressure in growing through challenge. Ttys♥️

[[Fl...]]

INFP here!

 

INFJs are awesome.

 

[[Sh...]]

 

She, Ive been swamped with the details of life and I have not felt I had adequate energy to really thank you for showing up and I’m so happy genuinely that I know you and all here can understand me. Maybe I am feeling fairly blessed here and need to rest and catch up with all that’s been happening for me in terms of pressure in growing through challenge. Ttys♥️

 

Azalea32, jump back in when you feel like it, otherwise please make your needs a priority.  We all understand.  Obviously this subject has resonated with like minded buddies and I'm glad you started it.  Sending you lovely thoughts for healing.

 

She

[[Sh...]]

Does anyone here have any advice for just how you negotiate relationships and setting boundaries and still have a mutually supportive and enjoyable friendship?  Or is it fated to always be all or nothing?

 

I don't think it's fated to be all or nothing.  I think it's incredibly difficult to find your people. Often we form friendships based on common interests or similar life situations (school, work, parenting, etc.) but they don't always feed that depth and connection we need.  If those convenient friendships start consuming our time and energy, then we will inevitably be let down or feel dumped on because they weren't right in the first place.  If, however, some of those friendships are operating from a place of mutual acceptance (not necessarily understanding), then we don't really need to set boundaries because there is an equal exchange of energy.  For example, I have an extraverted friend who is good for me - she keeps me in the loop with what is happening in the outside world, is not emotionally needy or deep, but is accepting of me and is loyal.  She knows I won't be coming to her Bunco group and I know she won't be engaging in any type of discussions like this.  She doesn't understand why I enjoy being alone at home, and I don't relate to how she finds it enjoyable to keep up superficial conversations week after week at Bunco.  It's not a soul-mate type of friendship but it works.

 

It's difficult to end friendships once the energy dynamics start to shift and you realize the relationship is no longer healthy.  If you want to act with integrity, you have to stop allowing yourself to be drained by the other person and I don't have the answer on how to go about this.  The way I've dealt with it may not be the most honest, but is the kindest way I know how.  It involves creating longer and longer gaps in between correspondences and then just making it appear as if we've drifted away.

 

Creating compassionate boundaries is the most difficult.  These are needed for people that you feel you just can't cut out of your life, or for relationships that are worth fighting for.  I've been able to have direct conversations with other intuitive introverts about when I felt boundaries were being crossed. The conversations were difficult but didn't end the relationships.  They actually made them stronger because they were coming from a place of authenticity which we recognized.  Some personalities just don't take to these conversations though and that's where you have to get creative.  If your true goal is harmonious interactions without depleting your energy, you can find creative ways to manipulate situations in order to meet your own needs first while also meeting the needs of others.  Knowing the personality types of others is helpful because you can understand what they need as well.  I have some examples but I've taken up enough space on this thread today.  And I have a lot of growth to do in the relationship department.  Carry on!

 

KristinM, a lot of insightful observations in your post.  Yes, coming from a place of authenticity is ideal.  Actually, I think that the striving to do this, to mull over that other person's needs, to mull over our own needs and quirks, to mull over how to understand and meet all those needs, to endlessly observe ourselves and others and adjust our behaviours accordingly, this is what exhausts and depletes an introvert mentally physically and emotionally.  Our great strength is that we intellectualize and ruminate constantly and that is also our great weakness. 

 

If I understand extroverts correctly, they just do it and think about it much less.  I don't think they mull over the introvert's needs so much as they just instinctively try to pry them out of their heads and into the extroverted world.  We understand how pleasurable and invigorating it is for extroverts to be in a crowd of people.  I don't think they get us in reverse, how it often drains and exhausts us.  They just can't understand and the world mostly agrees with the desirability of their extroverted view. 

 

For me, I have to protect myself and not squander my emotional reserves in pursuing friendships with people that are simply not compatible with my needs.  Frankly, its just too damn much work for very little reward.  Where's the pleasure in that?

 

She 

 

 

[[Sh...]]

INFP here!

 

INFJs are awesome.

 

Hi Fluxwind!  Welcome to the forum but sorry you and all of us have a need to be here.  Jump right in.  Nothing like an interesting discussion to take our minds off that other mess.

 

She

[[Kr...]]

INFP here!

 

INFJs are awesome.

 

Welcome!  I think the same of INFPs.  Both of my daughters are this personality type.   I admire your spontaneity and how true you are to yourselves!  Talk about authenticity!  INFPs have got that down.

[[Kr...]]

 

KristinM, a lot of insightful observations in your post.  Yes, coming from a place of authenticity is ideal.  Actually, I think that the striving to do this, to mull over that other person's needs, to mull over our own needs and quirks, to mull over how to understand and meet all those needs, to endlessly observe ourselves and others and adjust our behaviours accordingly, this is what exhausts and depletes an introvert mentally physically and emotionally.  Our great strength is that we intellectualize and ruminate constantly and that is also our great weakness. 

 

If I understand extroverts correctly, they just do it and think about it much less.  I don't think they mull over the introvert's needs so much as they just instinctively try to pry them out of their heads and into the extroverted world.  We understand how pleasurable and invigorating it is for extroverts to be in a crowd of people.  I don't think they get us in reverse, how it often drains and exhausts us.  They just can't understand and the world mostly agrees with the desirability of their extroverted view. 

 

For me, I have to protect myself and not squander my emotional reserves in pursuing friendships with people that are simply not compatible with my needs.  Frankly, its just too damn much work for very little reward.  Where's the pleasure in that?

 

She

 

She, great observations as well.  I love how this conversation is developing.  Regarding the last part of your post, I think being sick for so long has made me keenly aware of how important it is to protect the limited energy I have for keeping up friendships and outside world interactions.  When I do have physical energy to go out, I want to use it for doing things that nourish my intuitive/spiritual/emotional needs.  I have a few friendships that can meet me in a space of calm and equal energy exchanges, but most social interactions do not, so I avoid them.  Or if I have to show up (things involving my children, some family events, etc.) I come up with ways to limit the small talk and the pressure to pretend I am feeling well when I'm not.  When I am physically healed, I hope that I continue to protect this energy, remembering just how precious it is, as opposed to just going along with the norms of an extraverted society.

 

I do agree that the challenge in forming relationships with extraverts is that they often don't understand our needs like we understand theirs.  But I think it would be the extraverts that are also paired with sensing.  Extraverts that are paired with intuition (ENXXs) would be more likely to understand how we work because they also use intuition as a dominant function and realize there is more going on behind the scenes.  They might not be the most compatible in friendships because our energy needs are so different, but they would have more of an understanding and acceptance of what it means to be an introvert.  I've had a hard time with my ESFJ mother in law who is a "more the merrier" type, both nurturing and overbearing, and completely unable to comprehend that my little family of introverts does not want to come to gatherings with all her friends and neighbors, which results in hurt feelings as she takes it so personally.  This is an example of where I've had to set compassionate boundaries because my family just doesn't enjoy those types of interactions. 

[[az...]]

:'( no hidden meaning here, simply the gravity (of being a real person and not just a human )

 

John Mayer - Gravity

 

[[Kr...]]

Azalea, it's too much sometimes. Hang in there. We care.

[[az...]]

✊

[[az...]]

INFJ Perfectionist Paralysis and the Ni-Ti loop (same man)

 

 

INFJ Depression

 

[[az...]]

 

INFJs can’t see the trees for the forest.

[[Kr...]]

That youtuber is great - relatable and informative!  I have so many thoughts while watching his videos.  The Ni - Ti loop really illuminates INFJ depression.  Been there too many times.  So stuck in an internal back and forth of skewed knowing and thinking, unable to see anything objectively, unable to reach out for help because you know there is no way to adequately express to another human the depths of your misery.  You don't even get it so how would they? 

 

And then if you finally become semi-aware that the only way out is to actually reach out, and the person says the wrong thing, you end up spiraling deeper into the loop, completely shutting off the extraverted feeling.

 

If you are lucky enough to find a person or people that just allow you to be sad in their presence, without trying to analyze why you are sad, or unconsciously insinuating that you have no reason to be sad through the advice that they offer, then that's the way out.  Let me cry.  Take me on a drive. Don't make me talk about it.  Just be with me until it ends.  Because the good news is, if you can remember it while in the loop,  is that it does end! 

[[az...]]

 

Perfect          🌅.  (  idealistic  )  Storm