Depressed Lately

[[Wa...]]

Hi Midnight,

 

Since I ended my taper on July 12th I have had many, many, intrusive thoughts.  My mom was very abusive when I was a kid and though we have mended fences, I have had counseling, and she goes out of her way to be nice to me now to try and make up for it, since taking my last dose on July 12th I have had increased nightmares about my childhood, very negative thoughts about ALL of my family members and very, very depressing thoughts.  It has been very hard.  They only think that is helping me get through this is knowing that it is just benzo withdrawals and I'm not crazy or holding a grudge for things I had forgiven people for long ago.  The oppressive feelings kind of hang on and are hard to shake and do get me down.  I feel I am just making my way through each day like a robot with very little desire for anything fun or that takes the least bit of energy.  I'm looking forward to feeling better and know I will soon.  I'm like you where I did smaller and smaller cuts and finally got to a point where I couldn't cut any smaller so my doses were not consistant so this is when I decided it was time to just quit.  My last dose was July 11th.  It has not been easy but I am lucky and have a supportive spouse.  The fact that you have nobody to talk to must be very very hard for you.  I am sorry about that.  Is it possible that part of the anger towards your parents is because they are the only people in your life?  That they have sheltered you to the point that there is nobody else?  This can cause resentment even thought you are the one who has control over meeting people or not.  Also, just because your parents are not happy smiling people doesn't mean that you can't be.  Maybe you are hoping for them to be people that they just are not for whatever reason.  Just food for thought.  And yes, the benzos will cause very intrusive thoughts, but if you get to the point you are wanting harm to come to someone, you really should seek some help because that doesn't sound very safe.

[[Mi...]]

I definitely don't want harm to come to anyone.  I just had images go through my mind and did NOT want them or agree with them.

 

They haven't shelterd me.  It's more that I sheletered myself and yes I do mostly talk to family and online people and that's practically it.

 

It's all the type of intrusive thoughts listed on that wikipedia page, so apprently it's normal.  I've never truly "thought" them.  I always know they're irrational and I would never hurt anyone.  But just weird thoughts themselves scare me because I feel like I shouldn't even have a bad thought randomly come out of nowhere like that.

 

I sure hope indeed it stops when the benzo is out of me.  I'm not at alls cared of anything happening, just the THOUGHTS showing up.

 

I hope you have an easier time soon.  All of these effects are depressing.  And yeah I wish I had a spouse, trust me.  I know one can't depend on someone else for everything, but any loving spouse can sure be a help I'm sure!

[[Mi...]]

Ya know back around when I first came to this site is when I noticed I was having interdosage withdrawal and had the idea to split my daily dose into two doses.  My body had been going through a lot of anxiety during the day becasue it wasnted more medicine in me since I was going from 1/2 a mg to zero.

 

Once I changed it to twice a day my symptoms mostly vanished.

 

Well see now I'm back to once a day, but only 1/16 of a mg.  NOW it's seeming to be nothing to go 24 hours between doses.  So I'm tempted to drop off totally to nothing soon, but may just keep doing this dose for another week or two or maybe pulling off tiny pieces to cut it slightly lower.

 

This is honestly really confusing...  Because if I were TRULY addicted before then it makes no sense that I would have LESS symptoms now on this small dose.  If my body already wanted more than 1/2 a mg why in the world would it not be giving me worse symptoms now and want more than 1/2 a mg still?

 

So I don't think I'm truly addicted, but who knows.

 

Anyway I feel great overall.  If I could think happy thoughts when thinking of my parents then a ton of my problem wouid be history!  Like you said... my whole life is my parents.  So when I feel bad I try to think of my mom to try to make me feel relaxed.  But I instead get anxious when thinking of ehr and I don't understand why.

 

By the way, though, I felt like that with someone I was dating years ago.  I would feel nervous about her and be scared she would hurt me even though she wasn't really doing naything.  And now that I think about it I was on the benzo then too.  And I don't recall it happening before the benzo.  Maybe some, but I'm almost 100% positive I have had more of those unwanted thoughts and feelings since starting benzos.

[[mt...]]

I am sure it is the drugs... And I am on .95mg of Valium and suprised I am feeling my S/X so much. I am not sure how your dose of K equates to in V terms.  Maybe Pam can help here.  But if you can't get nay lower with cutting pills it may be at good ting to TITRATE the rest off.  Again maybe Pam can help here....

 

The worst s/x is my thinking.  I am not obsessing over any one person(s) but everything is a HUGE deal.  Our thinking on Benzos is definately effected.

 

Fight back!  You sound better!!

Mimi

 

 

[[Mi...]]

yeah same with me... anything that happens becomes a big deal in my mind.  And it's not just my mom that I am nervous about, it's basically every person, but I just think about her more often.  Like if she or someone else calls I get all nervous.  When I went to pay my rent I was all nervous.  I must be expecting people to judge or hurt me.  And I think that makes my intrusive thoughts make more sense also.  It's because I'm scared of being hurt so my mind must be preparing me in case someone tried to physically hrut me or something.  Either way I know the thoughts are stupid and senseless.  So hopefully it will justs top.  I've had bad thoughts before and when I somehow felt better I would go a long time not having any at all.

 

Also I think your amount would be about 1.5 times what I'm taking.  I'm pretty sure valium is about 1/10 as strong per mg where yours would be like taking 0.095.  Not positive, but thinking I did read that somewhere.

[[mt...]]

You said..."So hopefully it will justs top".  I don't think it will stop until you are healed and that my take awhile.  You have to keep reminding yourself that this is just the drugs effecting my thinking.  And coming back here so people can tell you that over and over.  And one day you will be off.  If I am at about 1mg of V then 1.5 times that you make you at about 1.5mg.  So you are right behind me...  So if you want to make daily cuts you have 2 options....use your pills and titrate or get some liquid and use a syringe and take a tiny bit less each day.

 

So you think you can do one of those..

Mimi

[[Mi...]]

It's the other way around because the klonopin is stronger per mg, so for your 1 mg I would be takng about 0.67 or something like that.  Basically if I'm right that it's 10 times the strength then yours would be like 0.10 klonopin and I'm taking 0.0625 klonopin.

 

I'm not so sure there's anything to be healed.  My whole life I've had anxiety and depression, so it's hard to know if this has caused many new symptoms.

 

I doubt I will do either method unless I stop completely and need to get back on it and find a slower way off.  I can't think of an easy way to do them and I feel like it would still spread less perfectly than worth the trouble of doing it those ways.

 

I'm still sure some of my bad feelings are related to my normal mind.  Mostly I think I'm scared to death of my parents or others JUDGING me.  If they give advice, I panic and think of it as them judging me or hating me or something.  I've got to somehow fix that thinking and I'm not so sure the med is causing any of this.

[[Mi...]]

Now I am stressed trying to think of site names.  lol  I saw now you can get .co and it be similar to .com wheras it used to be just for Colombia.  And I've had several ideas and can't decide.  I get so stressed making decisions.  And when I think hard I then suddenly get anxiety as my mind sems to weaken and start thinking weird things again.

[[Mi...]]

I'm not so sure it's really helping me much still being on any of this.  Doesn't seem to do that much when I swallow it anymore.  I may just do this a few more days then take slightly smaller ones a few days then get off.  I dunno.

 

I wonder what some alternatives to benzos are... I am not going to take antidepressants.  One time st. john's wort seemed to help but then years later I tried it and it seemed to do nothing.  I'm kind of worried about the thought of getting anxious or depressed and NOT turning to a benzo.

 

For eyars a lot of times when I move my eyes from side to side there's kind of streaks.  I don't know if it's the benzo, my eyeballs comign loose and going to fall out, or what exactly.

[[Pa...]]

You're on a pretty low dose, it might be time to get off of it completely, what do you think?

[[Mi...]]

I don't know.  I'm just going on instinct.  But I'm really worried because I obviously still haven't fixed my problems so without a benzo I don't know what to do to fix them.  I think I'm mostly having self esteem issues where I depend on others to tell me how great I am or I feel bad... and if I do anything that my parents wouldn't do then I feel bad like I have to do things the way theyw ant.  I'm afraid of confrontations or people lecturing me.

[[Pa...]]

I don't know.  I'm just going on instinct.  But I'm really worried because I obviously still haven't fixed my problems so without a benzo I don't know what to do to fix them.  I think I'm mostly having self esteem issues where I depend on others to tell me how great I am or I feel bad... and if I do anything that my parents wouldn't do then I feel bad like I have to do things the way theyw ant.  I'm afraid of confrontations or people lecturing me.

 

Benzo's won't help you fix your problem, they dull you so you don't have to face them.

[[Mi...]]

I know, but that's what I mean is my bad feelings related to my problems will be there again.  Everyone ahs to get through their life somehow and I'm worried I won't find a way through the problems.  Although benzos don't solve them they do make them "seem" solved.

[[Mi...]]

I'm really not expecting to have much trouble once off of this.  Yeah many people say they have months of bad symptoms when off of it, but seriously I feel like it has almost no control over me anymore.  I have gone 24 hours between doses for a week and I feel like some weight has been lifted off of my head, I never get dizzy anymore, I'm not all shaky waiting on my next dose, and throughout this whole process I've had much less trouble than most people.  I still feel like I wasn't truly addicted.

 

I could always be wrong, but it "feels" like I'm almost myself again already even without being totally off.  I've been taking less than 1/8 of a pill for a few days and feel better rather than worse.  I had weird dreams when i slept yesterday, but it wasn't truly nightmares... and oddly my memory was so good that when I woke up one time I remembered like 4 or 5 different dreams... wheras usually I remember 1 or 0.

 

What I should do iss ee if I can get off of it on August 9th.  Because that would make it easy to rememebr when I quit since that date would be 8-9-10.  lol

 

I wish I could keep taking one eighth of a pill forever with my body never wanting mroe.  Because I feel great and then there would be no risk by quitting.  Eh I'm still honestly confused though HOW my body keeps adjusting to lowering doses as if it's nothing.  That seems to be saying I'm not addicted.  Becuase as I've said before... if your body wants more and more and more then how could it EVER adjust to one eighth of what you took for 4 years?  It just makes no sense.  Your body can't demand more than 0.5 yet a month later be all fine and dandy with 0.06. It's supposed to go OPPOSITE of that by stopping the symptoms when you RAISE the dose, not lower.  But for me I feel the ebst I have in years in my opinion and I'm barely putting any med in me.

[[Wa...]]

Midnight,

 

Are you hoping to not be addicted so you can keep taking benzos?  Why do you wish you could just keep taking them forever?  What would be the purpose of that?  Stop being afraid of what others think of you.  Stop living in fear.  Go out and meet real people.  You are never going to meet someone sitting at home by yourself.  Read chapter 4 of that book if you haven't read it yet.  I'm really happy for you that you are not suffering more physical w/d symptoms and the bad thinking should also go away with time, but that low self esteem is something you are going to need some extra help with.  Look in the mirror and say outloud as you look at yourself, "I am awesome!  I am really awesome!"  and mean it when you say it. 

 

P.S.  I don't think your eyeballs are falling out of your head! (lol)

[[Mi...]]

They could be falling out. Something sure is happening.  lol

 

I'm not hoping anything in particular, but just feel like my body would not be responding as it is to such a lower dose if I were addicted.  As far as why keep tkaing them forever, as I said I've felt great lately and I think even that small one eighth dose is still making me happy.  So if it were not giving me any effects why even risk getting off of it?

 

I just finished (or am about to) chapter 4.  I noticed the next chapter is about improving the self esteem.  But anyway sometimes I do think I'm great, but I think "others" don't think I'm great sometimes.  And when you want friends and a relationship it matters what others think in general.

 

I flat out don't have any big dreams, great things happening, and don't know how to make myself get out and meet anyone.  Thus why I keep thinking and obsessing over my relationship with my parents.  And everything I try to do such as programming I end up not being satisfied and not knowing which direction to go.  Was going to run another forum site and am torn on which direction to go with that still also.

 

So a lot of confusion more than anything else.  And a lot of people always say "you don't need a relationship to be happy" and every single one of the people who say that are ones who are married. 

[[Mi...]]

I really have several thigns I need to do.  I need to stop having bad feelings toweards anyone, somehow have more of a life where I won't even care 24/7 about parental relationship, and I ened to somehow stop telling practically everyone my problems since obviously that won't exactly get many friends or keep a girlfriend if you complain about everything.  I need to somehow get more positive and happy thigns in my lfie, but not sure how.

[[mt...]]

HI Midnight

I have really noticed how "self absorbed" I have become since I started taking a benzo.  I have to work hard to be able to NOT let it take over.  I see a therapist once a month to help me regain and retain my mental perspective.  I highly encourage you to get some support.  Once you are off COMPLETELY Benzos for a while your brain will heal and you will stop obsessing over yourself as you will not be as anxious.

 

You may have some genuine "natural" parent separation issues that are appearing MUCH MORE significantly as you are in a state of W/D.  One therapist told me that the hardest thing any one ever does in life is...leave home.  It could be that in your W/D your anxiety/fear kicks in and manifests on this very primal "separation anxiety" where your parents are concerned.

 

The good news is, that once we become aware of this or any fear, we can change everything, as we LEARN ro change our reaction to each and every situation.  But it is very hard to so ALONE because no matter where you go THERE YOU ARE.  It is good you are coming here and getting some feedback but it may be good to find yourself a therapist to help you refocus and see CLEARLY and ultimately make you feel less anxious about moving forward.

Happy Monday!!

Mimi

[[Mi...]]

I've gone to many therapists, but they never help much so i end up stopping going.

 

And by the way I'm naturally self absorbed.  lol  I keepw antign to change it, but it's hard to get out of that habit.  I am a carign eprson, but most of the time I still spend much mroe time thinkign about myself rather than trying to cheer up others.  No good to beat up on myself for it though so i try to just gradually change it some.  I'm so panicky that I have major issues that it's hard to get my mind on anything or anyone else.

[[Mi...]]

See although I felt "good enough" all day, when I took my med a little while ago it relaxed me. it still helps me so it's more confusing what to do.

[[mt...]]

Well in my opinion we all have read about the LONG TERM effects of Benzos.  I would either titrate off or step off now as Pam suggested and LET IT BE.  Give your self a few months- then 6 months and then a year to reassess how you are and your thinking....  You will not feel better overnight but really what is your choice... if you keep taking it eventually you will need MORE.

 

Mimi

[[...]]

 

I agree...in the end of course it is your choice...but....most likely you will have to increase your dose in time..and then increase it again..and again...to avoid tolerance...

 

You are this close () to being done..and honestly...the amount of drug you are on..isn't even considered a theraputic dose....it probably is doing nothing for you....although you may be pyschology attached to it..if your signature line is correct....that amount of benzo...really isn't doing much...

 

TC

[[Mi...]]

When I first swallow it it seems to relax me right off.  It may very well be psychological, but I do react mighty quick to most meds for some reason.  And yeah the sig is right except the past few days I've probably taken even slightly less.  Hard to tell exactly since I was still cutting.

 

I feel crappy again today.  Probably more due to me changing my sleeping schedule though.  I go through a pattern of sleeping normal hours and then gradually getting up later and later and then suddenly staying up nearly 24 hours to "fix" my schedule. I do that repeatedly many times per year since I can't seem to stay on any schedule at all.

[[Mi...]]

I don't know what to do.  Now I couldn't sleep well at all and I haven't had that problem before.  And I started panickign again that I am possessed or something.

[[Be...]]

You mentioned yesterday that you have a pattern of sleeping well and then not, so try not to freak out about it.  I know that's tough to do at 4 a.m. (been there, done that), but you can help to keep yourself from feeling worse by practicing good calming techniques ahead of time and then using what works best for you when you start to feel anxious.  For those sleepless periods, I always made a plan before I went to bed so that if I tossed and turned or woke up frantic, I'd start working my plan.  Taking control has a better calming effect than benzos imo.