Mentoring - those who are well (or better) reassuring those who struggle.

[[Fi...]]

Thank you, Stephanie.  Even people like me who are past the suffering stage like to receive affirmation!

[[wa...]]

thanks Finally J63 -- I look forward to the time when I can offer up good posts like yours.  It would signal the worst is behind me. 

 

Suffering is a weird thing.  When it lets up you wonder, "WHat the hell was that?" but when you're in it  - well it feels like the only thing you can do is describe it and seek the constant reassurance of those who survived the same symptoms and lived to tell the tale.  Thanks.  Auto suggestion is indeed powerful and it seems all one can really do.

 

[[Fl...]]

one after effect of the taper is a bad back, more specifically a facet joint that is in bad shape. I'm not sure, but it could have been caused by sitting for endless hours in my recliner, most often typing on BB. So, whatever you do, don't stay in one position too long.

 

This is supposed to make me feel better? I'm literally housebound from the physical pain of w/d, a preexisting bad back and knees that are so bad they need to be replaced ("bone on bone"). I thought this would be a safe place to go on BB for support.

 

LeftBehind - I know you are scared. I don't mean to scare you more. But here is the deal I made when I started this thread: I promised I would always tell the truth and I will.

[[Fi...]]

wannabebetter--I can't imagine there's any other pattern of healing from anything else that's as weird as what we're going through.  I hadn't found BB when I first started the rollercoaster ride and it was so crazy-making, feeling so good for awhile that I couldn't imagine what could possibly drag me back down only to fall into the pit again and not be able to remember what it felt like to feel decent.  Then you come on here and find out that's what the lucky people get.  The others are just depressed or whatever for months before getting a break.

 

To be honest, I don't think I actually got one bit better at being not quite as down mentally until the symptoms themselves actually eased up a bit so that I could hang onto the memory of having felt worse.  Also, there's the problem that even if you can notice that the symptoms aren't quite as bad as the last time you were in the pit....here you are in the pit....AGAIN!!!!  It's one more time that you thought you were well and you're not.  I can't tell you how many times I tried to explain this to my husband as he tried to comfort me and assure me I really was getting well!

 

I'm afraid it just drags out longer for just about everybody than they're hoping it will, but I'm a big fan of not knowing the future in cases like this.  Maybe it's AA where they say that you can do for one day what it would completely appal you to face doing for two years.

[[bo...]]

I like all these posts... I really think it is so important to be able to accept the reality of what is happening is happening but not get consumed in it. I did that for a while, but feel most importantly to have an awareness around That.

I can relate to those who can't exercise too. Diversify ! I do believe of the benifits of exercise in this process , unfortunately have a bung ankle that prevents a lot of walking etc. so improvise.. I brought an exercise ball and now get down on the floor an exercise... I swim in a friend's pool when I can ...

Just do what you can ..any movement is better than none at all..

I have read things on here that I don't like . Some posts I have experienced almost seem beligerant and unkind.. But it's like texting or emailing isn't it. Sometimes 'how ' we read something is about us ,not what the writer wanted to convey ..... There will be some who might read this in a different way to what I intend..

At the end of the day we are all fighting for the same thing ... To be free of benzo's . How we get there will be a different journey for each of us... Thank you for starting this thread Fliprain ..BB xx

[[Le...]]

There will always be posts...on whatever thread we pick, that have the potential to frighten us....what one person reads and experiences as a kindred spirit - one who is also suffering - another who is looking for positive reinforcement and encouragement will be scared.  I know!  I have been freaked out by all kinds of things on this site....

My Mana, thanks for the input and trying to help me see things from a different perspective.

[Guest [mo...]]

I posted this on Chewing the Fat but maybe it's appropriate here, too.

 

Don't Believe Everything You Think

 

Recently a fellow BB clued me into a book called You Are the Placebo: Making Your Mind Matter by Dr. Joe Dispenza.  I’ve found it so inspiring, I thought I’d try to pass along the main point which to me is—try telling yourself a better story!

 

People in benzo withdrawal naturally react negatively to the suggestion that all they need to do to get well is to think positively, and rightly so.  BW symptoms are completely real.  They’re not “all in our heads.”  We don’t feel lousy because we expect to feel lousy.

 

I expected to be dancing eight weeks after my knee replacement surgery as my surgeon predicted.  Not what happened.  I was slammed down by pain.  When I did a rapid taper off of Oxycodone, I was suddenly nauseated.  I didn’t expect that.  I didn’t even know it was a common symptom of drug withdrawal until I Googled it.  When I cold-turkeyed my small but long-time dose of Xanax eight months later, I had no expectations.  I hoped I wasn’t even addicted and I’d be feeling good right away.  Nope, slammed again.

 

When I first read in an addiction  book that I shouldn’t resent my symptoms because they were signs of healing, well, I really resented THAT!  It seemed pretty clear to me that the symptoms were signs my CNS was still a mess.

 

Somewhere along the way, though, I managed to relax into the whole thing a little bit.  I read the promises of eventual healing on the BB board and decided to buy into it.  I read Spark! by John Ratey and started making an active effort to work a little program of exercise to help my brain along.

 

And now, here’s the book You Are the Placebo.  Basically, the idea is that your thoughts actually can change what’s going on in your brain.  If you try to act more like a well person, your brain will reconfigure to accommodate that.  Likewise, if you’re telling yourself you’re going to be sick forever, your brain will go along with that, too.

 

In a wave, I used to lie there and think what we all do, “Oh, my God!  Look at this!  I’m sick!  I’m so sick!  I’m just a sick sick person and I will always be a sick person!”  At some point, though, I switched to blocking those thoughts with this:  “I have a beautiful mind and it’s doing the best it can to heal for me just as quickly as it can.  I have a beautiful mind and…..”

 

It’s pretty much impossible to think like this when you’re in acute.  You’re just trying to hang on and survive, right?  But I think people hit a point where they’re going back and forth between being a sick person and a well one, and maybe that’s the point where really paying attention to the story you’re telling yourself is important.

 

I can picture some of you getting ready to fire back why this won’t work for you.  Why you have xyz pre-existing conditions so that means you’re different.  Hey, I’m 64.  After a point, don’t MOST of us have pre-existing conditions?  Being alive’ll do that to you!

 

So please don’t waste your precious energy pleading your case to me, to fellow BBs or the universe.  Nobody can help you, really, but you yourself.  All the emotional energy here that goes into detailing symptoms and explaining why are you just aren’t well is just feeding a negative story to your brain.

 

I think it’s Megan who always says, “Distract, distract, distract.”  She’s right.  I’m just saying it a different way.  Put something less negative in your  brain than focusing on your symptoms.

 

Do you think it would be helpful to someone you loved to every day tell them a story of how damaged they are?  PERMANENTLY damaged?  How they are sick sick sick and no doubt different that all the people who heal?  That something was terribly wrong with their brain before they ever started on benzos and they obviously need some sort of drug, for God’s sake?

 

No, you wouldn’t do that.  So please don’t do that to yourself.  Tell yourself the story of how you are going to be well someday and then take whatever little steps you can today to push that reality forward.

 

I firmly believe that everyone can heal from these drugs eventually if they get their brain clean and stay off of everything.

 

Happy New Year!  2016 is going to be brilliant for me.  At least that’s the story I’m telling myself!

.

This is perfect for me today thank you dear

yeah, I am back in the pit....3 week wave over Christmas(probably complicated by flu), then a 6 day window, and back in the pit again.  I really don't freak out anymore over laying in bed literally for 7 hours without falling asleep....and these belly pains and now the addition of a burning esopogas at 4 am this morning!? So I like the idea of creating a brain that forces the world around you to respond to it----fake it til you make it--i love it. Thanks BB's

[[bo...]]

Finallyjoining... Your post was awsome and so very true.. I have been putting it into practise for some time ..

I am a big believer in the mind/ body connection. What my mind tells my body is often how my body will be. Obviously that is a two way street and I also need to be aware of what my body tells my mind  !!

So it's about being compassionate to myself . I too am in my 60's and have all the usual aches and creaks that go with that ! Ongoing sx from the cancer treatment , but it's about acceptance of what is simply is and learning to go forward incorporating all that I to my lifestyle .. It's totally up to me what I tell myself about how I feel ... Some days I absolutly do feel like crap and that's ok.. I can feel like crap that day and I can look after myself accordingly ... It's not about denying those ghastly days / weeks ... It's about keeping them in perspective for ehat they are..

I have recently cut my dose and this morning am not feeling so great.. So have altered today's plans around a little to fit with that ...

I come to BB for support encouragement and to offer the same where I can .  It's a great place  BBXx

[[Bu...]]

FinallyJoining,

 

If I remember correctly, you mentioned in your success story that you experienced a lot of anger during this process. I'm also struggling with periods of intense anger. Could you share more about that? What was the root of the anger? What helped you work with it? Feel free to PM me, although other buddies here might find your reply helpful.

 

Thank you!

Bubbles

[[Fi...]]

Well, before I even figured out I needed to get off of Xanax as well as Oxycodone and thought surely I must be just about well (ha!  Ha ha ha ha ha ha!  ) I sat there in my therapist's office and said I just couldn't understand why I was coming through this with so much anger.  I had signed on with her in the first place because I was so mad at my entire family, mad at the doctors who put me on this crap and couldn't help me get off etc. etc.  Mad at everybody wondering why I could just be my spunky old self and get well already.  I've always felt we can only change ourselves, so that's why I went to the therapist on my own.

 

Of course now I look back and see so clearly why I was so angry.  My brain was entirely fried and I was trying to live my life and accomplish a lot of work as if it weren't. And everybody was expecting me to.

 

The only thing that really fixes this in the end is to get well!  But in the meantime, I listened hundreds and hundreds of times to a meditation CD called Anger & Forgiveness by Belleruth Naparstek.  I was resistant to even listening to it because, like most people here, I had plenty to be mad about and why should I be the one doing the forgiving?  But this meditation is so brilliantly written and helps you understand how releasing the anger is TO YOUR OWN BENEFIT.

 

I've recommended this so many times, even had it sent to one BB, but so far nobody's ever reported back that they tried it!  But I'll keep recommending it because it's my one solid answer to what helps with anger.

 

 

[[Bu...]]

FinallyJoining,

 

Thank you! I am going to get the CD. I will report back to you!

 

Bubbles

[[Ja...]]

thank you for your post.

congrats on a job well done.

I am on 5mg of valium after transfering from ativan back to valium, in the beginning of this process

tried to do it in 6 weeks and it didn'twork. made me feel crazy, panic, like i needed the hospital

can i ask you how many mg you withdrew from for 22 mos?

and what do you think about doing it from 5mg? i am just on it for four days and able to do stuff around the house, forcing myself to yoga and walk. Going on a hike now. Slept last night. Don't want to get obsessed w forum but would love your feedback./ would 8-10 mos suffice?

I can't take this panic type of feeling everything else including fatigue i can handle

[[Fi...]]

Jackson--are you asking me, FinallyJoining, these questions?  Since I'm not sure, I'll just keep it short.  I'm not one to advise about tapering because I quit Xanax cold turkey.  The day it occurred to me it might be part of my problem was the day I didn't take any more.  I had been on a low dose,  several times a week for sleep, totalling no more than  1.5 mg PER WEEK.  This had been going on for five years.  I'd increased this a bit because of the stress of coming off the Oxycodone, and the week before I quit, my charts show I took .5 mg each day for four days. 

 

I didn't know what would happen.  Didn't even know if I was addicted.  Well, I was and I immediately went into horrid insomnia.  I was a wreck, but I never thought about whether it was tolerable or not.  I just figured I wasn't going to take another crumb of the stuff and that this was the way to get well and I would endure what had to be endured.  I did  take one rescue dose about ten days out, but none after that.

 

I can't really say what you should do.  Each person has to figure out their own thing.

[[Ja...]]

How are you feeling finallyjoining now? So it's been over two years since you last took anything?

Similar situation to me where I didn't take anything every day just pulled myself off one day and couldnt' sleep for four days straight into some kind of mania. Realized it was withdrawal and had to take a lot of benzos to stabilize then stabilized on 5mg and remeron 15mg

back to the beginning

I did that then tried to taper in a month. Same disaster. Back on 5mg for the last four days. pretty stable but traumatized.

didn't think i would make it

Are you feeling better? are you able to work and function?

[[Fi...]]

Jackson--sounds like you were on a higher dose than I was so yeah, you'd feel a lot worse just going cold-turkey.  I'm three years off of Oxycodone and 28 months off of Xanax and today I feel absolutely great!  I can't imagine holding down a nine-to-five job during all this, but since I basically work for myself, I did get a lot done in the past three years when I was feeling up to it.  My main job is writing, and I did write a book about all this.  Also worked on our tree farm property, rehabbed a couple of houses, moved my mom out of her house into an apartment and sold her house etc.  But also, I had long stretches where I was flattened on the couch with fatigue, accomplishing absolutely nothing.  It's just been a roller-coaster all the way.  I can't imagine if I'd had to report to a boss or still had a house full of little kids.  My hat is off to all who manage this sort of thing.

[[Co...]]

Does anyone feel very very anti-drugs, anti-pharma and get into trouble because of the persistent warning of not taking meds?  :'( i feel pretty much obssessed by it. It's unbearable watching other people take drugs.

It seems to me as if I want to go back in time and warn myself of not taking them, or wishing somebody was there for me 12 years ago.

But I get in a lot of trouble by doing that, I do not really want to do that. I can't help it.

I feel so alone and so scared. And angry.

[[Di...]]

Does anyone feel very very anti-drugs, anti-pharma and get into trouble because of the persistent warning of not taking meds?  :'( i feel pretty much obssessed by it. It's unbearable watching other people take drugs.

It seems to me as if I want to go back in time and warn myself of not taking them, or wishing somebody was there for me 12 years ago.

But I get in a lot of trouble by doing that, I do not really want to do that. I can't help it.

I feel so alone and so scared. And angry.

 

I think you do need to be very careful about doing that sort of thing. It's one thing to offer caution to people if we think it's warranted, but you could get yourself an unwanted reputation if you appear to be a bit evangelical about it. People don't want to be lectured, nagged or talked down to. Just be careful. You don't want people to start avoiding you because they don't want to keep hearing the same lecture. Sometimes you just have to let other people make their own mistakes, and then be there to help them if they need help.

 

Doctors, pharmacists and medications, generally speaking, are not bad things. They mostly are very helpful and beneficial. It's just that we've all had a very bad experience, but I've also had very good experiences too. I'm not going to let this one part of my life affect my overall feelings about the medical advantages we have these days.

[[Sa...]]

 

This movie doesn't so much attack the big pharma as much as it shows the alternatives that are being withheld.

Its called "That vitamin Movie" Andrew w saul.

[[Sa...]]

The documentary " The American Addict" is another about prescription drugs

[[Co...]]

Thank you, yes my behaviour is not the best. But you are right, it does uncover what I have been bottling up. And probably I will get more nuanced in a few years. But I am very stuck right now. Very sad about the life I lost. Angry. It's a whole range of emotions. I just feel like I cannot behave properly next to a person who says: ow  I stopped my AD's once, it did not work so I will just keep taking it, no problem.

I cringe every time. I think I will try to avoid ppl for now,

But it's a relief I'm not the only one who feels so  "strongly" about it. (for lack of a better word) The weird part is, I know how I'm acting, I know how black and white I see stuff but it's hard to not be this way. (right now?)

[[Fi...]]

Corsair--I hear you.  I've struggled with that kind of anger and what to say to others.  My solution was to pretty much isolate myself!  I figure what I have to say about all this will come across better when I'm radiantly well.  As long as we're still kind of compromised, it's too easy for others to blow us off as nut cases.

 

Now that my brain has healed, I've calmed down.  It's hard to be calm and NOT be angry when your brain is still struggling to produce the chemicals it needs to function properly.  When you've healed, I think you'll find that it's just easier to not be so angry.  Your brain will be pumping out all the stuff it needs to calm itself down.

 

Just hang in there and give yourself time to heal.  Right now YOU are your first priority.  You're not in a good state to worry about others.

[[Di...]]

Thank you, yes my behaviour is not the best. But you are right, it does uncover what I have been bottling up. And probably I will get more nuanced in a few years. But I am very stuck right now. Very sad about the life I lost. Angry. It's a whole range of emotions. I just feel like I cannot behave properly next to a person who says: ow  I stopped my AD's once, it did not work so I will just keep taking it, no problem.

I cringe every time. I think I will try to avoid ppl for now,

But it's a relief I'm not the only one who feels so  "strongly" about it. (for lack of a better word) The weird part is, I know how I'm acting, I know how black and white I see stuff but it's hard to not be this way. (right now?)

 

I totally understand. I was having coffee with a few friends this morning, and one of them mentioned she took diazepam "on and off" for anxiety, and another friend said "Oh that stuff's really weak. I could take 25mg of diazepam and it would do nothing for me".

 

I didn't have the energy, patience or interest to get into anything with them, so I just mumbled "you really need to be careful with that stuff", but I'm not even sure if they heard me or not.

 

I've learned I can't live other people's lives for them, or fight anyone else's battles. People are going to have their opinions about things and nothing will convince them otherwise, until maybe the day comes when something happens that forces them to change their opinions.

 

Please don't cut yourself off too much from other people though. You need to have friends, even if it's not to talk over your problems with, but to just get out of the house and have a laugh with occasionally.

[[Pe...]]

Howdy Y'all

While in w/d I don't think I could find an angry cell in my body.  I was like a starving baby bird, begging for mama to come back with some food.

When I started to get angry/irritated about things I took it as a good sign I was healing.  Weird, but any emotion besides complete despair was a welcome change.

Tune out the garbage/anger/negativity - it does no good.  Easier said than done but ANYTHING you can do to distract and change focus to something neutral or positive helps retrain the brain.

When you get healed, then you can carry the torch for the fallen.  This weekend I was trolling for anyone anti-benzobuddie, or anti-AA to give them a piece of my mind.  Started penning a scathing response to a review of "AA: Cult or Cure", then simply ran out of steam and discarded it.  I didn't care that I didn't follow through because it was a waste of time and negative.

I'll finish my posts here cuz I figure if one little thing I say helps someone connect, then I've done a good thing.

I firmly believe we all heal from this garbage.  Your brain and body does miraculous things and it's great to prove doctors wrong!

Healing thoughts to those who still suffer!

Dave

[[Fi...]]

Yep, Petronomicon, you said it.  I'm enjoying proving my doctors wrong.  I love that I've recovered completely without their help and mostly just their suspicion.

[[pr...]]

Howdy Y'all

While in w/d I don't think I could find an angry cell in my body.  I was like a starving baby bird, begging for mama to come back with some food.

When I started to get angry/irritated about things I took it as a good sign I was healing.  Weird, but any emotion besides complete despair was a welcome change.

Tune out the garbage/anger/negativity - it does no good. Easier said than done but ANYTHING you can do to distract and change focus to something neutral or positive helps retrain the brain.

When you get healed, then you can carry the torch for the fallen.  This weekend I was trolling for anyone anti-benzobuddie, or anti-AA to give them a piece of my mind.  Started penning a scathing response to a review of "AA: Cult or Cure", then simply ran out of steam and discarded it.  I didn't care that I didn't follow through because it was a waste of time and negative.

I'll finish my posts here cuz I figure if one little thing I say helps someone connect, then I've done a good thing.

I firmly believe we all heal from this garbage.  Your brain and body does miraculous things and it's great to prove doctors wrong!

Healing thoughts to those who still suffer!

Dave

 

 

Dave,

 

so good to read this as i've been so irritated and angry lately. i didn't know what was wrong with me but as you pointed out it is just another sign of the healing process and i am not like that starving baby bird anymore. maybe my feelings are coming back. hall la fukan  lulaja!