Vitamin C & Cortisol

[[Di...]]

 

Additionally one of the diagnostic criteria for my "health status" was to view my nails.  He suggested that my nails indicated problems with my liver and proposed well over 500 dollars worth of additional testing. He only glanced quickly at my nails and perhaps if he'd actually been looking for something real he would have noticed I was wearing acrylic nails.

 

 

Seriously, my herbal tea nearly squirted out my nose when I read that......... 

 

To be honest though, that guy's spiel sounds like the standard operating practice for the naturopaths that I've seen too. It doesn't give me a lot of faith in the practice.

[[...]]

The acrylic nail story is consistent with my general impression of that crowd. I'm sure there are well meaning ones out there, but I suspect the whole field is poorly policed and rife with assorted quacks and hucksters. 

[[Wi...]]

 

Additionally one of the diagnostic criteria for my "health status" was to view my nails.  He suggested that my nails indicated problems with my liver and proposed well over 500 dollars worth of additional testing. He only glanced quickly at my nails and perhaps if he'd actually been looking for something real he would have noticed I was wearing acrylic nails.

 

 

Seriously, my herbal tea nearly squirted out my nose when I read that......... 

 

To be honest though, that guy's spiel sounds like the standard operating practice for the naturopaths that I've seen too. It doesn't give me a lot of faith in the practice.

All I kept thinking was "Ah come on, you're kidding right?!?!"

[[Wi...]]

The acrylic nail story is consistent with my general impression of that crowd. I'm sure there are well meaning ones out there, but I suspect the whole field is poorly policed and rife with assorted quacks and hucksters.

Sadly I'm guessing my P-doc was well meaning too.  That didn't provide much consolation when taking into consideration the outcomes.

 

I agree entirely with your statement. 

[[Di...]]

I'm sure the majority of alternative practitioners have good intentions when they start out, but there is just so much scope for rip-offs because they generally prescribe their own in-house supplements. Human nature being what it is, there are naturally going to be a lot of practitioners who just won't be able to resist the temptation to over-prescribe, just so they can make more money.

 

The naturopath I saw was exactly like that. Her consultation fees were very inexpensive, and that should have set off my alarm bells. I realise now that she could afford to keep her fees low, because she was making all her money off supplements.

 

I will add that conventional medical practitioners are not as pure as the driven snow either, but there are far better prospects to rip people off when you are prescribing in-house without anyone looking over your shoulder.

 

[[...]]

After reading these boards, I'd think long and hard before going to a Pdoc either.

[[Wi...]]

I have autoimmune diseases to address now and am having one hell of a time trusting that doctors know what they are doing.  I know some of this is more than legitimate, but some of it is probably overkill.  I hope there is a balance to be found.

[[Di...]]

I've also seen some really bad conventional doctors as well. I saw one general practitioner who told me my menopause symptoms were psychological, despite the fact that he had my blood test results sitting in front of him. I saw another doctor once whose English skills were so bad that I couldn't understand anything he said. How he managed to become licensed to practise in Australia is beyond me.

 

I will never criticise my current doctor though because she has been so supportive and understanding throughout my taper. My only one criticism of her is that she should have slapped me over the head and told me to wake up to myself while she was writing the valium prescriptions to help during the time I was seeing the naturopath.

 

I've never seen a pdoc, but I know from friends who are nurses that pdocs often have bigger problems (including drugs) than their patients. It's apparently a well-known thing within the nursing arena.

 

I guess what we have to learn from all our experiences is that you do your own research as much as possible. That's often easier said than done because the internet is over-loaded with bad information and charlatans too, but if you can find legitimate reputable sites, hopefully you can find information to help. I’ve certainly had to do that to educate myself about menopause.

 

[[Wi...]]

If you have a good one, definitely keep her! 

 

I should get an honorary degree for the amount of research I've done since everything began lol 

[Guest [to...]]

OMG you really dont get!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

 

Ok....... supplements can be as dangerous as drugs..... when they are the partitioner level that only highly qualified practitioners prescribe.  You can not get them over a counter and they are made by the drug companies and compounded by a natural therapist!!!!!!!!!  I dont do this as it was not my speciality field and I believe it is similar to drugging in some cases.  Natural Therapist qualified ones are like Drs we go to University and college and have many many years of training before we can go into  private practice.  There are good and bad in every field.  I was registered with all the appropriate government bodies, my down fall was I didnt study pharmacoly or I wouldn't be in this mess.  Anybody who considers them self a natural therapist after doing research while tapering or being on drugs might as well think they are Drs as well.  When the brain heals they will realise there is much more science and training involved.

 

 

I done with this tread........

[[Du...]]

I agree with you Towardsthesun...as ive said before shotgunning supplements is dangerous. 'oh I take what i need, vitamin D etc', but are you taking the correct micro and macro nutrients to work with that supplement, alongside the additional supplements needed so you dont offset a body balance of nutrients?

 

Sure take loads of zinc because a test might show you are depleted, but in turn you will be lowering copper...same with magnesium, yes it feels good and is calming, but it will inevitably lower calcium and sodium, once sodium is low, potassium will go haywire. and the adrenals will get even more messed up. Its not that simple. Same with vitamin C, megadosing without a chelation agent lie NAC is dangerous in itself.

 

http://craighitchenstherapies.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Periodictable2pp.pdf

 

Seriphos is not a sleep drug either, and shouldnt be used as one. It should be used to regain cardiac rythmn and hpa function, taking one or two at night at different times, will not do anything productive and you are treating it as a benzo/sleeping aid in a way, which it is not.

 

Each to their own I guess

[[Wi...]]

OMG you really dont get!!!!!!!!

 

Ok....... supplements can be as dangerous as drugs..... when they are the partitioner level that only highly qualified practitioners prescribe.  You can not get them over a counter and they are made by the drug companies and compounded by a natural therapist!!!!!!!!!  I dont do this as it was not my speciality field and I believe it is similar to drugging in some cases.  Natural Therapist qualified ones are like Drs we go to University and college and have many many years of training before we can go into  private practice.  There are good and bad in every field.  I was registered with all the appropriate government bodies, my down fall was I didnt study pharmacoly or I wouldn't be in this mess.  Anybody who considers them self a natural therapist after doing research while tapering or being on drugs might as well think they are Drs as well.  When the brain heals they will realise there is much more science and training involved.

 

 

I done with this tread........

Towardsthe sun...Relax!

 

I never said  that I consider myself " a natural therapist after doing research while tapering or being on drugs ".  What I am saying is that after being provided medications that have been implicated as causative agents of my first  AI disease (an IBD), losing my gallbladder because the IBD was misdiagnosis, subsequently acquiring a second AI (Celiac) and then a third AI (Graves' disease) and going through this w/d process, I've learned that doctors know very little about any of that or don't have a financial interest in much of it. 

 

None of them are money makers and there are no cures and yet I have to live with them, most likely for life.  As a result it was up to me to figure out how to navigate all of this. They have less personal interest in these diseases than I do.  I consider myself an expert in each of these arena's now, more than the doctors who throw arbitrary meds at me that are dangerous at worst and ineffective at best, when they simply just don't want to deal with this.

 

I don't consider myself a "natural therapist" nor was that ever my intent.  I do consider that I posses more knowledge about my constellation of disease than most  out there, including drs., natural therapists or laymen. THAT's what I meant by suggesting that I deserve an honorary degree.

[[Wi...]]

I agree with you Towardsthesun...as ive said before shotgunning supplements is dangerous. 'oh I take what i need, vitamin D etc', but are you taking the correct micro and macro nutrients to work with that supplement, alongside the additional supplements needed so you dont offset a body balance of nutrients?

Sure take loads of zinc because a test might show you are depleted, but in turn you will be lowering copper...same with magnesium, yes it feels good and is calming, but it will inevitably lower calcium and sodium, once sodium is low, potassium will go haywire. and the adrenals will get even more messed up. Its not that simple. Same with vitamin C, megadosing without a chelation agent lie NAC is dangerous in itself.

 

http://craighitchenstherapies.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Periodictable2pp.pdf

 

Seriphos is not a sleep drug either, and shouldnt be used as one. It should be used to regain cardiac rythmn and hpa function, taking one or two at night at different times, will not do anything productive and you are treating it as a benzo/sleeping aid in a way, which it is not.

 

Each to their own I guess

I'm not going to disagree with you about the fact that supps can be as serious as prescription med and they should be used wisely (if used at all), but can you honestly tell me that, despite their "education" considering that suppliments and testing provided by these nature therapists, both of which are unregulated and unproven, that they really have expertise, any more than anyone else, about how these work, what levels are necessary, what benefit they provide, what the real consequenses are  and what they really do?

[[Wi...]]

After putting some thought into this, I think I am much more angry about this subject matter than I thought.  I apologize if my anger over the ineptitude I've experienced was directed at any one personally I'm going to bow out of this conversation (or attempt to)

 

WWWI

[Guest [to...]]

After putting some thought into this, I think I am much more angry about this subject matter than I thought.  I apologize if my anger over the ineptitude I've experienced was directed at any one personally I'm going to bow out of this conversation (or attempt to)

 

WWWI

 

 

I have a UNIVERSITY DIPLOMA  USED TO WORK WITH DR'S in Australia!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was a registered practitioner!!!!!!

 

 

The Drs I worked with did not prescribe BENZOs or I would have known what they were!!!!!!!!

 

 

Registered fully qualified Natural Therapists specialise just like Registered fully qualified Doctors/specialists and then you get the Drs like we have all had the just prescribe things without really knowing consequence that also goes for Natural Therapists too.

So what you are doing here is Doctor and Natural Therapist Bashing!!!!!!! without really knowing what you are talking about

 

 

There are some different levels of Traditional Medicine as there is with Orthodox.  

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[[Wo...]]

My original proc (the one who put me on Xanax) was just arrested for DUI and subsequently investigated for his prescription practices and lost his license b/c it was found that he was prescribing painkillers and someone had overdosed.

 

Kharma...

[[Di...]]

Well, I won't change my mind about naturopaths or whatever else they're called, because I haven't just seen one useless one, I've seen a number. Hopefully I’ve finally learned my lesson.

 

I’ll say again. If posters (including towardsthesun) are allowed to castigate doctors because of their negative experiences with them, then we have to be allowed to have our negative opinions too, even if it’s about her colleagues. If we're allowed to criticise one, we have to be allowed to criticise another.

 

It's also funny how Dubjam blows hot and cold. One minute he's advocating Seriphos, but then just because I agree with him, and say that it's helping my night time cortisol levels (and consequently my sleep) it now shouldn't be used for sleep. Who said I was using it just for sleep? I don't take it through the day because I simply don't have problems during the day. I’m using it for my night time cortisol levels. The good sleep is just a happy by-product.

 

Yes, Dubjam, you're very knowledgeable. You like to post endlessly about everything you know just to keep reminding us, but I've also seen you post some very questionable and dangerous advice (like it's okay to take up to 50mg of melatonin a day-wow), so I really implore everyone to take what you say with a lot of caution. btw - Just how many Seriphos capsules are or were you taking every day? You certainly weren’t using it as “recommended”. Let’s have a look at what you’ve said previously about it……..

 

“I know hundreds that have used Seriphos on curezone, and non had any negative effects from me..hells i was up to 8 tabs a day in the acute benzo wd stage and never had any reaction………

 

But the lowering cortisol, the best supplement is Seriphos, it has been an absolute god send for me, my morning anxiety/cortisol surges are  under control now thanks to Seriphos. Takes a while to work, but youll notice the difference from the first tab..I was on 12 tabs at the start throughout the day and night, now I am on 5. It not only plugs the cortisol receptors, but it also reprogrammes the hypothylmus when to release cortisol, adrenaline etc. Its also an essential fatty acid, so helps protect and rebuild your brain. Its amazing.”

 

This whole discussion is silly, and it all started because someone didn’t like me expressing my opinion, but they still want their right to express their opinion. Go figure…..

 

[[Di...]]

Oh, in response to towardsthesun's claim that I am "self diagnosing and using supplements just like a Naturopath would try too" ..... well here's the truth. I've been doing a damn sight better in my life since I stopped allowing the naturopath to "diagnose" me, started doing more of my own research, and began to follow conventional medicine protocol.

 

"Self diagnosing" is an interesting term. I prefer "self education". I trust me to know more about me, and how I feel, than I trust a naturopath or a doctor for that matter. As much as I believe I have a very good GP, I have had to educate her (which she readily admits to btw) about menopause and benzo withdrawal. Self education is not a bad thing. I'm not saying I always get it right, but neither does any medical practitioner or naturopath either.

 

[Guest [to...]]

Oh, in response to towardsthesun's claim that I am "self diagnosing and using supplements just like a Naturopath would try too" ..... well here's the truth. I've been doing a damn sight better in my life since I stopped allowing the naturopath to "diagnose" me, started doing more of my own research, and began to follow conventional medicine protocol.

 

"Self diagnosing" is an interesting term. I prefer "self education". I trust me to know more about me, and how I feel, than I trust a naturopath or a doctor for that matter. As much as I believe I have a very good GP, I have had to educate her (which she readily admits to btw) about menopause and benzo withdrawal. Self education is not a bad thing. I'm not saying I always get it right, but neither does any medical practitioner or naturopath either.

 

 

I HOPE WHEN YOUR BRAIN HEALS YOU REALISE I WAS'NT HAVING A CRACK AT YOU!!!!!!!!!!

[[Di...]]

 

I HOPE WHEN YOUR BRAIN HEALS YOU REALISE I WAS'NT HAVING A CRACK AT YOU!!!!!!!!!!

 

... and I hope that when you re-read your post, you will see that saying something like "when your brain heals" (and all in capitals no less) is a very disparaging thing to say, and probably worthy of reporting.  My brain is just fine thanks very much.

[[lk...]]

Whoa!!!!!!!!!!! What the heck has gone on here since I was away for a while. EEP!

 

What is with all the yelling? My lord. People can be quite rude and there is no reason.

 

I have to tell you Pam....my sleep is much better adding the C...YAAY Im taking the melatonin 3mg and then 1000mg c and it has made a ton of difference. I would love to be able to drop the melatonin. I would like to cut it in half and do the 1.5mg with the C and then eventually off but I wonder if I am really not producing the correct amt now. If that's the case it wont change right? I read somewhere and heard on some show that melatonin is really only meant to use short term too. Have you read anything on that?

 

What about you WWWI? I know you have researched a lot lol I have on various topics but the whole vitamin stuff starts to get jumbled to me. I just think I can't absorb it LOL

 

Workin.....did you ever suspect your pdoc having issues? I love mine.....I wouldn't say I would trust everything he would give me cuz it was super easy to get the xanax....but I think he is truly a decent doc. They are hard to find and I really don't think they get these drugs. Its sad. I hope you can find a doc or whatever you need that you feel comfortable with.

 

How are you all doing?

 

Lisa

[[Di...]]

Yeah, I have no idea what happened there. I don’t have a problem with people expressing differing opinions to me, but when they start shouting about it and making personal attacks....*shugs*  It's kind of disappointing though, considering they are supposed to be so highly educated. 

 

Anyway, I was hoping that someone would make another post to get this decision back on track. I'm so pleased that you are still having so much success with the Vitamin C Lisa. I'm actually taking a bit of a break from it at the moment, because I want to give the Seriphos a good test. It's been 10 days now, and things are still going well. I'm just taking one at night now, and that seems to have really settled my night time cortisol levels. I will go back to the Vitamin C soon though, because I do still believe in the benefits of it.

 

I have very mixed feelings about melatonin. I’ve never felt that it helped me very much, but then maybe lack of melatonin was never my problem, and others do seem to have success with it. I have read a lot about it though, and while it’s very difficult to know if what you are reading on the internet is correct, what would appear to be the more “reputable” sites do say that the dosage taken should be between 0.3-1mg and shouldn’t be taken long term because it can slow down the body’s ability to produce its own melatonin. However, other sites say that there is no “unsafe” melatonin dosage, but I really wonder about the sense and consequences of that, and what does “unsafe” actually mean. What about the side effects of depression etc? Our bodies produce such a small amount of melatonin naturally (less than 50mcg), so is taking such massive doses of it long term actually in our best interests?

 

However, I wouldn’t regard 3mg a very high dose though, especially if you are finding it helpful. Perhaps you could try reducing it down to 1.5mg and then gradually reduce it some more in case your body has slowed its own production of it. With the addition of the Vitamin C hopefully you will still get positive results.

 

[[lk...]]

Hey Pam!

 

I watched a whole show on Dr Oz on the melatonin and he stated that you don't need more then 1mg and it should be for extended use too. I had never had ANY luck with the melatonin before but had it in my closet. I tried it several times just in case during my taper with no result at all....NONE.....I just tried it by luck after my taper and it seemed to make a difference. I then proceeded to cut that in half to get closer to that 1mg dose and I didn't sleep!!!! I really don't want to be on it forever but I don't think I am ready to drop it since I am finally feeling like I am getting some normal sleep! I guess Im just chicken lol I will have to try it soon I suppose.....sigh..........I don't want to be on ANYTHING to help sleep. I didn't spend all this time getting off the stupid xanax to go onto something else I just want to sleep LOL Im too worried about it to stay on it so its only time.......

 

Are you still seeing good results from the Seriphos? Im not sure I really understand that...I will have to read on it. Is it for sleep as well but for adrenal support?? I hope it works!!!

 

Lisa

[[ih...]]

Hi Lisa, I have also found Seriphos really helpful with stopping that early morning cortisol rush which used to wake me any time from 3am on.

 

For day time use am a big fan of ginkgo, (thanks to Devant, Adie et al). It seems to control the glutamate really well during the day & I think it also helps with sleep if you can get into bed in a less wired state.

[[Di...]]

Hi Lisa

 

I'm also finding the Seriphos is helpful for my night time cortisol. Although the last few nights have been a bit more difficult sleep-wise, but I'm also taking some progesterone at the moment, and I don't always get on very well with that. Last night was the last night of taking it, so hopefully things will be better tonight or tomorrow as my prog levels drop.

 

I really haven't found the "right" dosage yet to take. I started out taking 1 capsule with dinner and another one before I went to bed, and that was good. Then I reduced it to just one capsule and that seemed good too, but the last 3 nights I've taken 3 capsules and last night I didn't sleep very well at all, but then it could be the progesterone - hopefully.

 

Re the melatonin - I think you should just do what you need to do for the time being to get your much needed sleep. If you need to do taper off the melatonin later on, once your healing is further along, then you will be in a much better position then to do it.