It seems to me it is taking more people a longer time to heal - anyone else feel

[[Ho...]]

I have been Benzo free for one year and 3 weeks.  And the more I talk to people on FB, or on BB or to other benzo sufferers, I am finding that there seems to be more and more people who are dealing with this for a longer amount of time.  I have a friend in the UK who was on benzos for a long long time and it took her 2 years to heal, however, she still has a lingering sx.  She works on the Helpline over there and she told me that one year is very early in the healing process and that is what they tell people who call them....."expect the healing to take two years and if you heal sooner, you are one very lucky duck!"  I have talked to some others on FB - 22 months and still healing; 3.5 years but finally healed; 5 years and healed.  If you look at Bliss John's Recovery Road success stories - many of the people took more than one or two years to heal.

      So is Dr. Ashton wrong?  Six to 18 months seems like a piece of cake....if only I could count on being healed by 18 months - I would throw a big party right now if I could be sure of that.

      So what is protracted withdrawal then?  Is it anything OVER 18 months?  Is it two years?  I have read here on BB of many who have healed at one year or earlier.  I hoped that would happen for me and for many of my friends on here, but that is not to be, obviously.  Six months came and went, 9 months,,,,12 months and now looking forward to 18 months.  But with dread - because I read of so many on here who are in the two digit number of months and still struggling.  Can we at least expect to start healing in the 2nd year?  I know that I am some better than I was a year ago, but I still don't have a real semblance of my life back yet. 

        I am going to go through my log and check out all my windows/waves and see what kind of improvement I can put down in some kind of graph - maybe seeing it visually will help. 

        Besides my own misery, what brought this to my mind and therefore to BB was that this morning as I logged on to BB, I read a post and there were at least 3 people who commented who were over 20 months out and still suffering....and they were not the ones we all know of like Stonyco and Helpme123 and Putter and Leena.  These were people I hadn't really seen before.  And I just don't remember that being the case when I first came on here a year ago. 

        Does anyone else see this as I do or am I just seeing the dark side of this?  Thanks for llistening and any comments or feedback would be very much appreciated. 

Love Hoping2BFree

[[he...]]

Hi hoping2Bfree,

I just started my taper so I've been reading and learning a lot in the last few weeks.  So happy to have found this information before I went c/t.

 

It seems to me (purely opinion here)  that the people who have the hardest time, and the longest recovery, are ones who have either c/t 'd it, tapered too fast, used antibiotics or some other Gabaergic unknowingly. 

 

The increase may also be that more people are aware...

 

just thoughts

[[Sa...]]

Many people do take longer than the 18 months to heal. "Most" people coming off benzos seem to heal within the 6 - 18 month time frame.  This is obviously not a fact but only my experience with posts and talking to people on this forum.

[Guest [Tu...]]

I think that the people who take a long, long time to heal are in the overwhelming minority. Still, their stories seem to scare everyone. I've been around here now for six months and I've heard a lot of people doing pretty well at 6, 7 months off. Everyone is really different. Some people who've only taken benzos for a month or two chime in with w/d sxs far more severe than anything I've experienced, and I'm c/t-ing from a 14 year addiction. All I can do is try and focus on the positives (when they reveal themselves!) and hope for the best.

 

Hang in there. In the end your experience will be unique and totally your own.

 

Best wishes,

 

Tucson

 

Me at 3 weeks, 2 days into a c/t:

[[Ho...]]

I have been Benzo free for one year and 3 weeks.  And the more I talk to people on FB, or on BB or to other benzo sufferers, I am finding that there seems to be more and more people who are dealing with this for a longer amount of time.  I have a friend in the UK who was on benzos for a long long time and it took her 2 years to heal, however, she still has a lingering sx.  She works on the Helpline over there and she told me that one year is very early in the healing process and that is what they tell people who call them....."expect the healing to take two years and if you heal sooner, you are one very lucky duck!"  I have talked to some others on FB - 22 months and still healing; 3.5 years but finally healed; 5 years and healed.  If you look at Bliss John's Recovery Road success stories - many of the people took more than one or two years to heal.

      So is Dr. Ashton wrong?  Six to 18 months seems like a piece of cake....if only I could count on being healed by 18 months - I would throw a big party right now if I could be sure of that.

       So what is protracted withdrawal then?  Is it anything OVER 18 months?  Is it two years?  I have read here on BB of many who have healed at one year or earlier.  I hoped that would happen for me and for many of my friends on here, but that is not to be, obviously.  Six months came and went, 9 months,,,,12 months and now looking forward to 18 months.  But with dread - because I read of so many on here who are in the two digit number of months and still struggling.  Can we at least expect to start healing in the 2nd year?  I know that I am some better than I was a year ago, but I still don't have a real semblance of my life back yet. 

         I am going to go through my log and check out all my windows/waves and see what kind of improvement I can put down in some kind of graph - maybe seeing it visually will help. 

         Besides my own misery, what brought this to my mind and therefore to BB was that this morning as I logged on to BB, I read a post and there were at least 3 people who commented who were over 20 months out and still suffering....and they were not the ones we all know of like Stonyco and Helpme123 and Putter and Leena.  These were people I hadn't really seen before.  And I just don't remember that being the case when I first came on here a year ago. 

         Does anyone else see this as I do or am I just seeing the dark side of this?  Thanks for llistening and any comments or feedback would be very much appreciated. 

Love Hoping2BFree

 

Yes many do take even longer than two years to heal, but imagine how many heal in just a couple of months and never have the need to find the forums. That has happened to me 3 times before this one. Thats why I ended up on benzos a fourth time, because the other withdrawals lasted only a couple of months. One time I only suffered a couple weeks. Milder addictions apparently. Boy if I knew then what I know now. Anyways back to the point, many, many people heal very fast and never make it here, so I guess thats why the "average" healing time is 18 - 24 months.

[[Ho...]]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts - Hope-Fiend - so sorry that you are 17 months and still healing.  Have you seen any improvements since the beginning months?  Can you see light at the end of your tunnel.....?  I just wonder why it takes some such a short time and others such a long time?  What do all we long-time sufferers have in common? 

Hoping

[[Ho...]]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts - Hope-Fiend - so sorry that you are 17 months and still healing.  Have you seen any improvements since the beginning months?  Can you see light at the end of your tunnel.....?  I just wonder why it takes some such a short time and others such a long time?  What do all we long-time sufferers have in common? 

Hoping

 

Thanks, and sorry you are suffering this far out as well. I have not been seeing too much light at the end of my tunnel, but did actually have a window yesterday morning and as the day preogressed, my symptoms came back. Well, at least it was better than nothing because I hadn't had a window in over 4 months. 

[[gi...]]

Hi Hoping,

I do agree with you.  I think putting a time limit on healing is pretty damaging to those that take a bit longer.  We're told 6-18 mos to heal by Ashton.  Well, if that does not happen then what is wrong?  We then begin to doubt everything and feel very alienated and doubtful.  I have been around here for a very long time and also have talked to many others that are going thru this and that are healed.  What I have found is that many do not heal until after the 24 month mark.  That seems to be a turning point for many.  I think that many get windows and claim healing and then they get slammed again and never come back.  Also, many choose to suffer in silence as they feel they get no support after a certain time period.  This would explain the lack of success stories on the boards.

However there are many of us who linger at about 75% healed , we still have symptoms that are sometimes debilitating but are somewhat functional although not back to what we used to be yet. We wait and suffer for that final healing and lifting of symptoms.

I do think that there is healing  under a year but it is very rare though. although I have seen it.  I think for the majority though that it does take much longer and is much slower then any of us anticipated.  Keep hanging in there,  you'll make it and will get better.       

[Guest [Si...]]

Hi there,

 

Yes I notice everyone is different with healing. I have to question if some people really are healed that say they are because they certainly don't say too much about their healing. They tend to kind of skip around questions. Another thing that I wonder about, if some ppl are really healed, then why stay around the forum... I understand coming around every now and then, but not everyday. I think if I was healed I would come back and give ppl hope, but to stay around, it makes one ponder and I don't think I am the only one who wonders this. I know I am not. I have been at this forum over a year and it has plenty of support and have seen ppl come and go. I have noticed most ppl who do take the longest was on Klonopin and that makes me wonder, there is something to "Klonopin"... I mean I took it for 6 years and my hope is fading. I am still tapering and yes.. I am determined to get off the valium. BUT here is the thing, I am giving myself 2 years to heal, if I am not healed by then, forget it, I will just go back on the Benzo along with other meds, so that is just my personal choice. I mean what would I have to lose by then? I think it can be taxing on a body for so long. I know ppl here are Anti-Psychiatric, but what is the choice? We do what we have to do to survive, if it takes getting back on a few psychiatric meds to go on for me, so be it. People claim some herbs and supplements work, well they must not work too well because they are still having a time of it. I just hope, and I cannot express hope enough I heal before two years or around that or I will just get back on and stay on, a person cannot live in torture everyday. I am going ok some days, and not ok some days in this taper, but we'll see. That is just my take and personal thoughts and decision.

Hang in there.

[[ma...]]

healthybodyandmin, can you explain what gabaergic means? I'm assuming it means taking something that would impede the receptors from healing. Would passionflower, hops and skulcap be in that category? They are supposed to work on the same receptors.

Would using those herbs in a tea impede healing?

[[...]]

Hi Hoping,

I do agree with you.  I think putting a time limit on healing is pretty damaging to those that take a bit longer.  We're told 6-18 mos to heal by Ashton.  Well, if that does not happen then what is wrong?  We then begin to doubt everything and feel very alienated and doubtful.  I have been around here for a very long time and also have talked to many others that are going thru this and that are healed.  What I have found is that many do not heal until after the 24 month mark.  That seems to be a turning point for many.  I think that many get windows and claim healing and then they get slammed again and never come back.  Also, many choose to suffer in silence as they feel they get no support after a certain time period.  This would explain the lack of success stories on the boards.

However there are many of us who linger at about 75% healed , we still have symptoms that are sometimes debilitating but are somewhat functional although not back to what we used to be yet. We wait and suffer for that final healing and lifting of symptoms.

I do think that there is healing  under a year but it is very rare though. although I have seen it.  I think for the majority though that it does take much longer and is much slower then any of us anticipated.  Keep hanging in there,  you'll make it and will get better.         

 

I can relate to this post.  I guess I am officially one of the "long timers" now, at almost 23 months off.  I have definitely made improvements since the beginning, but every time I think I am healing it seems that I am faced with another setback.  If you asked me where I was six months ago, I would have told you I was 85% healed, but now I am in the middle of a horrible wave and feel about 50% there.  Some symptoms that went away months ago are back and as bad as ever.  I've had many days in the past several months where I felt almost normal again and days when I could barely function (I'd say more of the good days, though). 

 

While I have given up on trying to predict how this will play out, I have definitely noticed that a lot of the protracted cases seem to have their most dramatic improvements in the third year of recovery.  I am quickly approaching that point and praying to God I am one of those people. 

[[Fl...]]

Hoping, Thanks for puting this subject out there. I often wondered about this myself.

 

Ginia, Thanks for your encouraging post. It really meant a lot to me. I am 5 days from my one year off of ativan. I c/t. I thought I was going to be the "one" that did not heal like everyone else. I am still doing badly and was feeling hopeless until I read what you wrote. You gave me the strength to keep going. You gave me my hope back. From the bottom of my heart I THANK YOU.

 

Rain

[[he...]]

healthybodyandmin, can you explain what gabaergic means? I'm assuming it means taking something that would impede the receptors from healing. Would passionflower, hops and skulcap be in that category? They are supposed to work on the same receptors.

Would using those herbs in a tea impede healing?

 

Maltesemom, sorry to take awhile to get back to you. My system disconnected, and I didn't know how to get back to your question.

 

I don't fully understand what GABAergic means other than these items interact in someway with GABA in our bodies.  I looked up your teas and passion flower and hops are considered Gabaergic.  Green Tea is discourage, not just because of caffeine but because of L-theanine.

 

For some reason the things that in the outside world are "relaxing", end up causing paradoxical symptoms - like anxiety , or causing symptom resurgence. 

 

But the trouble, with any of these definitions is that it is not necessarily true for everyone.  Some people find magnesium oxide relaxing, some find it irritating.  I have not heard anyone speak of essential oils, maybe some aroma therapy could be relaxing, as well as a bath, candle, music? 

 

I'm searching for a better understanding of all this, but for now, I read about GABA and google gagaergic and 'whatever' and see if they are connected before I use it.

 

hth,

healthy

[[ma...]]

So if they are gabaergic we should not use them, right? It that because it impedes healing our receptors? I don't want to impede healing but I do need to sleep and don't want to keep taking unisom and benadryl. After a while they don't work very well.

Is theanine bad for us too. I was thinking of trying that for sleep. Maybe we should make a list of all things that are gabaergic...otherwise bad for us. Then everyone would know to avoid those things.

If these things like the tea, don't worsen our symptoms and help with sleep are they still bad for us? Will they impede receptor healing. I think a lot of people, especially us insomniacs would like to know this.

There are about 5 of us in the insomniac group and we have thread called...for those who have trouble sleeping. If you can tell me the other things that are gabaergic I can post the list there.

Thanks so much for your help. That is why the forum is so great. We can all learn and help each other!

Kathi

[[On...]]

I have been doing research on alkalizing the body and found out that every drug we ever took gets lodged in our fat in the body....When you alkalize the body it dislodges it and sends it threw the blood to get rid of it...So my hunch is the healing cant be complete till its all out of the body tissue....I am wondering if our diets were 80% alkaline foods and 20% acidic foods maybe we could heal faster?....Maybe the ones who are healing faster are eating a more alkaline diet?...

[[...]]

Sigma that was an excellent post!  I have put the same time limit on myself, two years.  If I am not 95 to 100 percent by then I will be at the doctors to get back on whatever psych drugs I can get my hands on.  I think that many get confused between the actually w/d, and just symptoms they have from their anxiety, or whatever underlying problem they have.  I first used to hope that after all this I will just be myself before all this, but I think the unfortunate truth is that I will never be the person I was before the anxiety/panic/benzo episode, and this is the new me.  Sometimes I think I may be healed from the w/d and this is just anxiety.  But I think if your 24 months off and not any better I think it's time to trying to solve the problem instead of waiting around for something that isn't going to come.

 

[[...]]

Sigma that was an excellent post!  I have put the same time limit on myself, two years.  If I am not 95 to 100 percent by then I will be at the doctors to get back on whatever psych drugs I can get my hands on.

 

I would encourage you not to put time limits on yourself because as many of us have learned, there is no rhyme, reason, or pattern to recovery.  While you are unlikely to still be sick at two years off, your recovery is going to play out however it is meant to.  As far as taking any psych meds you can get your hands on, there is nothing you can take to make protracted withdrawal from benzos go away, including more benzos.  You are setting yourself up for a disaster if you decide to live out your life trying to pile more drugs onto an already compromised nervous system.  

 

I think that many get confused between the actually w/d, and just symptoms they have from their anxiety, or whatever underlying problem they have.  I first used to hope that after all this I will just be myself before all this, but I think the unfortunate truth is that I will never be the person I was before the anxiety/panic/benzo episode, and this is the new me.  Sometimes I think I may be healed from the w/d and this is just anxiety.  

 

Tell yourself whatever makes you feel better, but I can promise you that everyone in this thread is suffering real symptoms, not anxiety.  I got on these drugs for a short bout of anxiety and insomnia triggered by some issues I was having with my company.  I now have zero anxiety or insomnia, just a variety of neurological symptoms that I had never experienced until the week I finished my taper.  All of these symptoms have improved over time and have even gone away during some windows, so I know this is all typical post-benzo stuff.

 

But I think if your 24 months off and not any better I think it's time to trying to solve the problem instead of waiting around for something that isn't going to come.

 

We are all trying to solve the problem.  Abstaining from these poisonous drugs and focusing on true health and wellbeing is what is going to bring our complete recoveries.  And we will ALL recover completely.  

[[he...]]

Maltesemom,

 

I'm sorry, a list is way more than I understand.  What I've done is google gabaergic and camomile tea, and see that there is a connection. 

 

We should put this out to a larger group to get more informed people involved.

 

healthybodyandmind

[[...]]

@[...]

 

I know everyone here is experiencing actually w/d symptoms, but I don't think its not reasonable to rule out that if your 2 plus years out that some symptoms are related to anxiety or other underlying health issues.  

 

I hope everyone here returns to 100 percent, it's just very painful to go on multiple years with these kinds of things occurring, and if there are resources out there that can bring some relief I believe they should be explored.

 

These are just personal decisions for me due to I, as well as everyone else here, knows how hard it is to endure this everyday.  But life keeps going and for me I need to be the most functional I can, I don't have time to sit around and wait to feel better, but that is just my situation

[[...]]

@ryan

 

I know everyone here is experiencing actually w/d symptoms, but I don't think its not reasonable to rule out that if your 2 plus years out that some symptoms are related to anxiety or other underlying health issues.  

 

I hope everyone here returns to 100 percent, it's just very painful to go on multiple years with these kinds of things occurring, and if there are resources out there that can bring some relief I believe they should be explored.

 

These are just personal decisions for me due to I, as well as everyone else here, knows how hard it is to endure this everyday.  But life keeps going and for me I need to be the most functional I can, I don't have time to sit around and wait to feel better, but that is just my situation

 

A few things I would say:

 

1) You are correct that if you do have anxiety, you have to address those issues.

 

2) You cannot take drugs and expect them to work like they're supposed to when you're in benzo withdrawal.  I can't even take benign substances that I have taken my whole life without a massive uptick in symptoms like burning skin, heart flutters, pins and needldes, itching, electric shocks, muscle twitches, etc.  I cannot even imagine what would happen if I tried to put psych drugs into my body.  And I can say from two years of speaking to dozens if not hundreds of people going through this, I have never heard a single success story from people taking drugs to try and curb the symptoms.  I have, on the other hand, heard several disaster stories.

 

3) The way you feel at two years off in protracted withdrawal is far different than how you feel at a few months off.  For me, it is now a chronic condition that impacts my life, but still allows me to live again.  I have traveled extensively this year to multiple continents, I work out every day, and I am able to work again.  It's not as if I am still laying in bed crying all day.

[[...]]

Well a lot of these symptoms I'm dealing with could be put in either category so I believe it's hard to distinguish what is anxiety, and what it actual w/d.  So ultimately if I'm 2 years out and I'm still dealing with the symptoms that could be either or I'll probably attribute to anxiety.

 

For me it's just to hard to deal with the feelings of dread, the intrusive thoughts and feelings, obsessing and the list could go on forever ha ha.  There just isn't any true way to cope with these things even though the feelings are illogical, they still bring a lot of fear and worry.

[[ma...]]

Healthybodyandmind. I'm leaving in a few minutes for a week at the beach. Maybe you could start a new thread about things that are gabaergic and put it out to everyone. Then maybe someone more knowledgeable can respond. We are all looking to learn and want to avoid anything that would impede our healing.

I know the nighty night tea helped me sleep, along with tryptophan but if it is doing the same thing to the receptors that the benzo did, then I'm not helping myself heal. On the otherhand, I have to get some sleep. I was chugging along fairly well with the 2.5 melatonin and then it started making me headachy and nauseous so I had to stop. This insomnia is really hard.

[[Mi...]]

@[ma...]

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=5500.0

 

If the sleepytime tea is working for you, I say stick with it.  If you're not getting a bad reaction from it, I doubt that it is impacting your healing at all. 

 

 

[[...]]

I now have zero anxiety or insomnia, just a variety of neurological symptoms that I had never experienced until the week I finished my taper.

Same case here... my anxiety levels are totally normal, but my physical symptoms are awful, and I didn't have them prior to using this medication. 

[[he...]]

@maltesemom - This old post has a pretty comprehensive list of things that are either gabaergic or should just be avoided during withdrawal/recovery.

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=5500.0

 

If the sleepytime tea is working for you, I say stick with it.  If you're not getting a bad reaction from it, I doubt that it is impacting your healing at all. 

 

 

Thanks for that MikeID. 

 

I'm getting overwhelmed trying to figure out what GAGA is going to interfere with.  But your advice is right on, in my opinion.  If it is working, then it's okay. 

Everyone reacts differently.  Though certain things are unequivically disruptive to healing, like Quinolone Antibiotics. 

 

Do you agree? 

hbm