Menopause/Hormonal Support

[[Di...]]

Oh dear - don't get me started on Dr John Lee. He's the one who started the whole "estrogen dominance" stuff. I will never understand how a woman at menopause can be "estrogen dominant". If she was, she simply wouldn't be menopausal. It's just a nice way to create a market for all these OTC, compounded and online progesterone creams.

 

I suppose there could be benefits from having prog after a hyster, but from everything I've read, the only real need for prog at menopause is to oppose any estrogen supplementation. I suppose some doctors would prescribe prog for a woman who'd had a hyster, but I would think it would need to be monitered closely.

 

Medroxyprogesterone is a prescribed "synthetic" progestogen, as opposed to the bioidentical progesterone you can get on prescription called Utrogestan or Prometrium. As far as I'm aware it is still manufactured using plant material, but it's just not "bioidentical" or exactly like our own progesterone. Like Eliz, so far using medroxy has proven to be better for me than the bioidentical prog.

[[...]]

Thanks for info... This is why I love  this forum. We get all kinds of information, but more importantly "actual" experience from patients/consumers.

 

Yea, I don't know what to think about progesterone . I may give it up soon, and see how I feel. Your comment is a good one, about estrogen dominance in menopause. Peri-menopause different for sure . Last few years I was EXTREMELY high estrogen. Blood showed something like 450 versus zero for progesterone .... I couldn't even wear a shirt or bra, without pain in my breasts . I think I'm finally in true menopause. So hard to tell with no uterus . You can't determine if your still menstruating  or not. Have to go by watching FSH labs...

 

I can tell you for a fact , with all my on and off with these hormones ( all bio identical ), that being on progesterone , you are calmer, and sleep is much better. But now , for me it's a question of too much .... I do feel foggy, sleepy, and a little too lethargic . And again , only on a very  baby does of compounded.

 

Curious, what type and dose of estrogen are you using, and is it working? Do you think it helps mood, energy etc...

 

Could you also tell me why other progesterone didn't work for you? Why were you feeling on it, and the medroxyprogesterone obviously eliminated those side effects ??

 

Thanks for dialog .

[[be...]]

Why I am 55 years old and still have my period? Bets

[[...]]

Hi girls , just catching up . Eliz, I to had the dreaded fibroids and endometriosis . Had my uterus removed in 2008. Ovaries in tact . Not sure where you all are from, but I am east coast US . Majority of natural HRT replacement docs give progesterone "regardless "  of having a uterus it not. I'm not sure I agree, but I've been taking it anyway . The claim is that our brains need progesterone and we need it to balance estrogen etc ... Look up Dr John Lee and Progesterone...

 

It truly does calm you. For me this baby dose seems to be too calming and not sure if it's interfering with WD. All brain effects , so who knows what's going on upstairs right now !!!  Like you said , time will tell.

 

Help me with "medroxeyprogedterone "? Not sure what that is ?

 

Thanks !

 

The medroxy is just a "non-bioidentical" form of the oral progesterone.  If the progesterone is working well for you then that is great.  I don't know if I find it calming or not to be honest, I just know when I was taking the bio-identical oral progesterone it prevented me from sleeping and caused other side effects that the medroxy does not.

 

I am in Texas and here doctors do not prescribe the P unless a woman still has her uterus.  Weird how different it can be from region to region!

[[ih...]]

For anyone struggling with the bio-id progesterone, I use prometrium, (bio-id caps), vaginally, for 10 consecutive days a month & have established a regular "cycle", without any noticeable side effects.

[[...]]

Thanks Ihope,.... Benzogirl, not sure I know the answer to that one.

 

Eliz, , just FYI if your interested. The author of the book I mentioned earlier, Out Living Your Ovaries is in Dallas. Dr Marina Johnson, and endocrinologist . I went to visit her last year. Just hard to follow up. I'm in Va. The book is interesting if anyone intereted......

 

Have a good sleep everyone ( void of hot flashes )!!!!!!

 

DLW

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Why I am 55 years old and still have my period? Bets

 

Maybe you are holding on to your youth better than the rest of us 

 

Honestly, I cannot answer that one!

[[...]]

For anyone struggling with the bio-id progesterone, I use prometrium, (bio-id caps), vaginally, for 10 consecutive days a month & have established a regular "cycle", without any noticeable side effects.

 

Hi Ihope,

That is the one I was using previously, but for some reason it acted on me like speed and kept me awake all night.  I am glad it is working for you though.

[[...]]

Thanks Ihope,.... Benzogirl, not sure I know the answer to that one.

 

Eliz, , just FYI if your interested. The author of the book I mentioned earlier, Out Living Your Ovaries is in Dallas. Dr Marina Johnson, and endocrinologist . I went to visit her last year. Just hard to follow up. I'm in Va. The book is interesting if anyone intereted......

 

Have a good sleep everyone ( void of hot flashes )!!!!!!

 

DLW

 

Interesting that she is so close.  I know I have some more benzo healing to do, but if my hormone situation has not settled down by next fall, I just might make an appointment to see her.  I will keep her info handi, thanks!

 

Thankfully, since I went to the .375 mg patches my hot flashes are gone.

[[Di...]]

 

 

Curious, what type and dose of estrogen are you using, and is it working? Do you think it helps mood, energy etc...

 

Could you also tell me why other progesterone didn't work for you? Why were you feeling on it, and the medroxyprogesterone obviously eliminated those side effects ??

 

Thanks for dialog .

 

The bioident prog I was using was Utrogestan (which is the same as the US Prometrium) but it just got to a point where I was experiencing really bad insomnia for about 3 weeks every month (I was using it on a cycle). I have no idea why this happened because it didn't always affect me this way. Perhaps being on a benzo at the time was the reason, and maybe if I try it again one day it won't affect me.

 

However the progestogen I now use (medroxyprogesterone) so far hasn't affected me at all. I've only used it for one cycle though, so it's too soon to really know how it will affect me long term, or if I start to use it continuously. I'm hoping my issues stemmed from the benzo, and that it won't be a problem in future.

 

I use estradiol as my estrogen. I'm currently taking 2mg tablets, because I wasn't sure if the 50mcg patches I was using were working properly, but I will try the patches again later in the year because I would prefer to be on patches - mainly just for convenience. I feel good on the estradiol. It's only the prog that's ever been my problem.

 

[[Di...]]

Why I am 55 years old and still have my period? Bets

 

Hey lucky you. Hang on to those periods as long as you can. I now realise how naive I was when I used to wish for the day my periods would stop. Be very careful what you wish for.

[[...]]

Why I am 55 years old and still have my period? Bets

 

Hey lucky you. Hang on to those periods as long as you can. I now realise how naive I was when I used to wish for the day my periods would stop. Be very careful what you wish for.

 

Truer words were never spoken 

[[...]]

I have been off the medroxyprogesterone as of today for a full seven days.  The last few days I have been falling asleep as soon as my head hits the pillow and sleeping all night.  Is this why or am I just out of the benzo withdrawal insomnia curse?

 

Too soon to tell.  I am patiently waiting to see if I get a bleed but I honestly have no idea if I should expect one or not.  I was taking a small dose of 2.5 mg for a continuous regimen for 21 days straight before I slipped up and forgot to take it.  I guess I just need to wait it out and see.

 

Loving the sleep though!

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Hi!

I am going through perimenopause. I still get my periods but very irregular. Since my progesterone level was too low, i was put on Utrogestan a month ago. It did make me sleepy and tired but after two weeks my sleep got worse and my depression was unbearable. I was weepy and crying non stop for no reason. A mind sucking depression and feeling of hopelessness. With doctor's advice i stopped it two days ago and my depression got better. The first night i couldn't sleep but last night i slept through after a long time. But my depression is still continuing but not to the point of weeping uncontrollably. Did anyone have such experience with utrogestan. And how long will the depression last? I don't have hot flashes since my estrogen level is normal and even high. thanks.

[[Di...]]

Yes, I'm afraid Utrogestan (or Prometrium in the US) can have that effect. It is a natural progesterone, but I never got on very well with it, and apparently that's not an uncommon experience.

 

It could possibly have been the dose your doctor had you on and the method of delivery. Unfortunately with Utrogestan you can't take any less than 100mg. However in some European countries it is licenced to be used vaginally, instead of orally. For some women the vaginal method works better because it bypasses the liver and digestive system. You can usually take a lower dose that way too, although 100mg is the lowest you can get.

 

I'm not sure how long the depression will last, but if you were only on it for a month, and you've only been off a couple of days, hopefully things will settle over the next week. Perhaps you could try experimenting with some of the "synthetic" progestogens. We all want to be as natural as possible, but I've learned that you just have to use what works. I'm fully meno, but I've found that medroxyprogesterone seems to work okay for me, but I just take it for 10 days at a time to oppose the estrogen I take.

[[ma...]]

I was on estradiol  for almost twenty years. I discontinued it around a year ago during tapering.  I restarted it a little over a week ago @ 1mg.  My breast are so sore and painful.  Does this mean the dosage is too much for me?  I never had this problem during my twenty years on it.  I have had it to happen once when I tried the patch witch I stopped for this reason.

 

I have been having such a difficult time with physical symptoms since I have been benzo free, I was in hopes that the estrogen would be helpful.  Should I just continue with my dosage, and maybe as my body adjust it will abate?

 

Mama

[[...]]

Hi Mama2,

If you read some of the information in the links provided in the first post of this thread, tender breasts are a side effect of estrogen.  1mg is considered a medium to higher dose, is it possible to try a lower dosage before you give up altogether?

 

I was on 1mg last year and it was too much for me.  I never got the tender breasts but I was so over energized I literally could not fall asleep at night.  I tried .5 and finally settled on .375mg patches and that seems to be the sweet spot.

 

Of course all that being said, it has been advised by my doctor to give any new hrt regimen a few months to see if things smooth out.

 

Good Luck and I hope you feel better soon 

[[ma...]]

Thank you eliz! 

 

I think I will try .5.  I must be more sensitive since coming off the benzo.  If that is still to much I will try the patch.

 

Mama

[[...]]

What a help to me to read what you all have written. I'm struggling with both estrogen and progesterone dosing.  My GYN and my PC giving the standard advice. I've been trying to get stable on HRT for very long time !!! Like 4 years of trying . Never felt balanced ...

 

Currently taking Elestrin transdermal pump which equated to .52 mg estrogen , and compounded progesterone 10-20 mg. hot flashes are awful right now. But I also think that too much estrogen gives you too much energy. And not a good kind of energy either. A fee days ago had the heart pounding, high HR etc.... Doctors don't think estrogen can do that . Glad to hear you all think the same thing. Maybe just not metabolizing it very well But need to do something with these hot flashes .

 

I had always been told progesterone " helps calm you", or " helps sleep". I was sleeping fine when I restarted it, but now I wake up every night in the middle of the night for hours and can't go back to sleep..... My PC finally suggested I just stop the progesterone. Feel like a yo yo. On one day, off the next .... But will give it a try I guess ! I have no uterus , only ovaries, so I was on it just for the so called "other benefits " . I think Diaz-Pam, you suggested it was not necessary either. We had brief dialog about John Lee .....

 

In general, do you all think progesterone causes some depression ? As well as problems with sleeping versus helping And am I right that the hot flashes being worse means not enough estrogen ? Sometimes I want to just give up this whole natural HRT and put the synthetic patch on and forget about it. Some of my friends are doing really good with the combi patch. But I hate to try something new .... Re: side effects ....

 

Would love advice. Feel like I'm all over the board and with WD added, its not fun right now.

 

Thanks 

 

 

[[Di...]]

I was on estradiol  for almost twenty years. I discontinued it around a year ago during tapering.  I restarted it a little over a week ago @ 1mg.  My breast are so sore and painful.  Does this mean the dosage is too much for me?  I never had this problem during my twenty years on it.  I have had it to happen once when I tried the patch witch I stopped for this reason.

 

I have been having such a difficult time with physical symptoms since I have been benzo free, I was in hopes that the estrogen would be helpful.  Should I just continue with my dosage, and maybe as my body adjust it will abate?

 

Mama

 

Hi Mama

 

When you said 1mg, is that a patch or tablet? If it's tablet then that is a low dose. If it's a patch then it is high dose.

 

If you are taking 1mg tablet, then the dose you are on is considered low, so if you are getting soreness it could just be that your body is getting used to the higher level of estrogen. Hopefully it will ease off after a little while.

[[Di...]]

What a help to me to read what you all have written. I'm struggling with both estrogen and progesterone dosing.  My GYN and my PC giving the standard advice. I've been trying to get stable on HRT for very long time !!! Like 4 years of trying . Never felt balanced ...

 

Currently taking Elestrin transdermal pump which equated to .52 mg estrogen , and compounded progesterone 10-20 mg. hot flashes are awful right now. But I also think that too much estrogen gives you too much energy. And not a good kind of energy either. A fee days ago had the heart pounding, high HR etc.... Doctors don't think estrogen can do that . Glad to hear you all think the same thing. Maybe just not metabolizing it very well But need to do something with these hot flashes .

 

I had always been told progesterone " helps calm you", or " helps sleep". I was sleeping fine when I restarted it, but now I wake up every night in the middle of the night for hours and can't go back to sleep..... My PC finally suggested I just stop the progesterone. Feel like a yo yo. On one day, off the next .... But will give it a try I guess ! I have no uterus , only ovaries, so I was on it just for the so called "other benefits " . I think Diaz-Pam, you suggested it was not necessary either. We had brief dialog about John Lee .....

 

In general, do you all think progesterone causes some depression ? As well as problems with sleeping versus helping And am I right that the hot flashes being worse means not enough estrogen ? Sometimes I want to just give up this whole natural HRT and put the synthetic patch on and forget about it. Some of my friends are doing really good with the combi patch. But I hate to try something new .... Re: side effects ....

 

Would love advice. Feel like I'm all over the board and with WD added, its not fun right now.

 

Thanks 

 

 

 

Hi DLW

 

If you don't have a uterus then it really isn't necessary to use progesterone. Some women may use it, but only if it is providing some kind of benefit. If it's not giving you anything, then I would be inclined to skip it. Then you can just concentrate on getting your estrogen level right, without having to factor in what the prog is doing to you.

 

I'm not sure about the dosages of the estrogen gel. However if you are getting hot flashes that usually is an indication that your estrogen level is too low. So perhaps you could try taking an extra pump or two to see how you feel on the extra amount.

[[ma...]]

I was on estradiol  for almost twenty years. I discontinued it around a year ago during tapering.  I restarted it a little over a week ago @ 1mg.  My breast are so sore and painful.  Does this mean the dosage is too much for me?  I never had this problem during my twenty years on it.  I have had it to happen once when I tried the patch witch I stopped for this reason.

 

I have been having such a difficult time with physical symptoms since I have been benzo free, I was in hopes that the estrogen would be helpful.  Should I just continue with my dosage, and maybe as my body adjust it will abate?

 

Mama

 

Hi Mama

 

When you said 1mg, is that a patch or tablet? If it's tablet then that is a low dose. If it's a patch then it is high dose.

 

If you are taking 1mg tablet, then the dose you are on is considered low, so if you are getting soreness it could just be that your body is getting used to the higher level of estrogen. Hopefully it will ease off after a little while.

 

Hi Diaz-Pam.

 

It is the pill.  I was wondering that my body just need to get use to it again too.  The only thing that had me concerned was that I haven't ever experienced it before, except once when I tried the patch.  I guess my body is just more sensitive now since coming off a benzo maybe.

[[...]]

Hi everyone,

 

Thanks for the help Diaz... Another question ... Someone mentioned having too much energy on estrogen. That's where I am. Although I still have bad hot flashes, I get that high energy feeling ... Again , not a good energy ... A restless, out of control type feeling. With a little anger or short tempered. I thought was estrogen. Wondered if normal .Also thought maybe I'm just not metabolizing it correctly and it builds up... Or has something to do with the benzo or WD...

 

I am also taking DIM... Supposedly helpful for converting the bad estrogen into the safe/good estrogen ....

 

Was on th BC pill for many years . Stopped that about 11 years ago. But never had this kind of problem with BC pill ( synthetic). Just with trying bio identical.

 

Any thoughts /suggestions appreciated.

[[Di...]]

I was on estradiol  for almost twenty years. I discontinued it around a year ago during tapering.  I restarted it a little over a week ago @ 1mg.  My breast are so sore and painful.  Does this mean the dosage is too much for me?  I never had this problem during my twenty years on it.  I have had it to happen once when I tried the patch witch I stopped for this reason.

 

I have been having such a difficult time with physical symptoms since I have been benzo free, I was in hopes that the estrogen would be helpful.  Should I just continue with my dosage, and maybe as my body adjust it will abate?

 

Mama

 

Hi Mama

 

When you said 1mg, is that a patch or tablet? If it's tablet then that is a low dose. If it's a patch then it is high dose.

 

If you are taking 1mg tablet, then the dose you are on is considered low, so if you are getting soreness it could just be that your body is getting used to the higher level of estrogen. Hopefully it will ease off after a little while.

 

Hi Diaz-Pam.

 

It is the pill.  I was wondering that my body just need to get use to it again too.  The only thing that had me concerned was that I haven't ever experienced it before, except once when I tried the patch.  I guess my body is just more sensitive now since coming off a benzo maybe.

 

Okay, then it is definitely a low dose. I'd persevere with it for a little while. It’s probably just your body getting used to the extra estrogen. Of course if it's still bothering after another week or so make sure you talk to your doctor. Perhaps this particular estrogen isn't right for you and you might need a change to something else.

[[Di...]]

Hi everyone,

 

Thanks for the help Diaz... Another question ... Someone mentioned having too much energy on estrogen. That's where I am. Although I still have bad hot flashes, I get that high energy feeling ... Again , not a good energy ... A restless, out of control type feeling. With a little anger or short tempered. I thought was estrogen. Wondered if normal .Also thought maybe I'm just not metabolizing it correctly and it builds up... Or has something to do with the benzo or WD...

 

I am also taking DIM... Supposedly helpful for converting the bad estrogen into the safe/good estrogen ....

 

Was on th BC pill for many years . Stopped that about 11 years ago. But never had this kind of problem with BC pill ( synthetic). Just with trying bio identical.

 

Any thoughts /suggestions appreciated.

 

I've never used the estro gel, so I'm not sure what level of dosage you are on. You said it is equivalent to .52mg, but I don't know what delivery method that would be. If it's equivalent to .5mg patch then that would be a medium dose. However, if it’s equivalent to a .5mg tablet that would be a very low dose (half the normal low dose pill). I'll assume it's equivalent to a patch, because they are both transdermal delivery, so then you would appear to be on a medium dose, and I would have thought that it should have addressed your hot flashes.

 

It's difficult to know what to suggest to you because everything you are describing could be related to HRT or it could be related to your benzo w/d. That's the really frustrating thing about trying to sort all this out while you're tapering because the symptoms of both can be very similar.

 

I don't know very much about DIM, although I seem to remember that it was one of the many portions a naturopath had me on when I was trying to solve my menopause problems "naturally" - that was the biggest mistake I have ever made. So consequently I don't have a very high opinion of any of those supplements or phytoestrogen things that are supposed to help meno symptoms. At best they only seem to offer some kind of placebo effect, or maybe help slightly if your symptoms are very minor. At worst, some of them can have negative effects.

 

I did a quick google search on it and I came across this site http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-1049-diindolylmethane.aspx?activeingredientid=1049&activeingredientname=diindolylmethane

 

One of the things it says is “Diindolylmethane might act like estrogen in the body, but there is evidence that under certain circumstances it might also block estrogen effects”. So maybe taking the DIM could be fighting against the estrogen you are taking. Perhaps you could try stopping it for a little while and see if it makes any difference.