PLEASE DON'T DRINK ALCOHOL WHEN YOU FEEL RECOVERED

[[qu...]]

Queenscarlett88,

 

How long were you on Benzos and at what dose?

 

I took benzos for three years but not consistently; only for the last three months of that period did I take them daily. Not incidentally I developed a nasty case of insomnia over those three years and my anxiety got much worse.

 

At different times I took Xanax, Valium, Klonopin, Ativan, and Ambien. It's hard to come up with an average or typical dose over that time because I was buying the pills from friends in addition to getting them prescribed. It wasn't terribly high, though; it crept up to perhaps 20 mg Valium during the last three months.

 

I was also drinking alcohol and smoking weed those three years--which is why I started having panic attacks and taking benzos in the first place. That's probably part of why my withdrawal was so nasty and lasted as long as it did (about a year the first time through, and about five months after the alcohol rekindling). I'm 22 now and glad to have it behind me.

[[ka...]]

hi everyone. what dose kindling mean......thank you kate7

[[Pe...]]

Yep; at 5 years off, I still can't drink any alcohol without feeling like crap for at least a week afterwards, and once it was almost a month. I have tried a few times. It's kind of hard to accept, but a fact of life for me now. After the last time I had a beer, I got depressed and anxious, had headaches and chest tightness. Not worth it!

[[WT...]]

Yep; at 5 years off, I still can't drink any alcohol without feeling like crap for at least a week afterwards, and once it was almost a month. I have tried a few times. It's kind of hard to accept, but a fact of life for me now. After the last time I had a beer, I got depressed and anxious, had headaches and chest tightness. Not worth it!

 

Pedro, I am curious about these items mentioned:  Effexor, Buspar, Wellbutrin.

 

When was you last dose of those items? 

[[ha...]]

Dear mmir,

 

I almost hesitate to ask because I don't want to anticipate any other further struggels and s.x BUT

 

what is kindeling?  What does it mean?

 

Thanks so much

hanging in there

 

ps I am on my second w/d from Benzos  -does that have something to do with kindeling?  Thanks

[[Fl...]]

Sorry about the double-post, but I'm skeptical of flare-ups "just happening" once the first hellish part of withdrawal has ended. Looking back, the first five or six months of my withdrawal were infernal, and there really were flare-ups during that period which seemed to have no reasonable cause.

 

If you are always looking for a cause you are always going to find one.

 

I'm not saying that it is impossible to have a flareup from alcohol, but I do think that alcohol is something that could easily be blamed for a wave that was going to happen anyway. I can assure you that waves can and do happen completely independent of "triggers".

 

That said, I do think that the farther we do get away from our last dose the more the sensitive CNS thing plays into it. My trigger is lack of sleep. If I have to get up early and miss a few hours of sleep it messes me up for two days. Matter of fact I figured out that my alcohol issue these days isn't really an alcohol intolerance, it is from the alcohol causing poor sleep.

[[Wh...]]

Kate7 and Hanging in there have asked "what is kindling?"  I'll try to describe it.  Kindling is a term used to describe what happens when one has repeated withdrawal episodes from benzo's or alcohol.  It seems the system gets sensitized and each withdrawal is worse than the one before.  Hope that helps.

 

Thanks Queenscarlet and Pedro for adding your experience with alcohol after recovery to this thread. 

[[...]]

Whoppsie -

Glad to see you were on an Island, that's so awesome!  I plan on doing a really cool celebration as well.  Sorry about the setback too, it's so insane that it can happen but we see it.

Were you able to fly home with no issues and what type of symptoms did you have? Just curious, were you functional like working,etc..?

 

 

I've seen a lot of people on here & other places that were fine drinking with no ill effects after withdrawal, I too personally hate to see scenarios like this b/c I 1000% look forward to enjoy life like I used to and that will include fine wine & brews.  This is entirely my opinion as I feel deprived of everything as many of you do. 

 

The alcohol is so individual b/c I saw a member here who was drinking whiskey & doing illegal drugs during and after his taper and he was healed in ~6 months.  It's so crazy.  I would want some serious recourse towards the dr. or pharma if the improper long term prescription of xanax literally changed my chemistry so that I can't tolerate alcohol or caffeine among other things after. 

[[Pe...]]

 

Pedro, I am curious about these items mentioned:  Effexor, Buspar, Wellbutrin.

 

When was you last dose of those items?

 

I was put on Effexor about two weeks after ativan, due to anxiety. Then I started to get withdrawal symptoms from the ativan. Xanax was added in, and every time my effexor dosage was increased, I would have a horrible reaction. After about 4 months I took myself off Effexor; the reactions were horrible, in combination with the benzo w/d (I had no idea about this at the time). I felt better, as well the condition that was causing the anxiety had been resolved. But the interdose and tolerance withdrawal from the benzos was still there and getting worse.  Sometime after this, I tried Buspar for about a month, during which time I cold turkeyed the benzos (I thought my problem was some sort of anxiety, not withdrawal). This is when all hell broke loose. No one recognized what was going on; at this point I was put on wellbutrin because I complained of severe depression. I finally stopped trusting the docs, and researched what was happening to me, at which time I reinstated and crossed to valium, and started to taper. I stayed on the wellbutrin until 2 months after the taper was finished.

[[...]]

 

Pedro, I am curious about these items mentioned:  Effexor, Buspar, Wellbutrin.

 

When was you last dose of those items?

 

I was put on Effexor about two weeks after ativan, due to anxiety. Then I started to get withdrawal symptoms from the ativan. Xanax was added in, and every time my effexor dosage was increased, I would have a horrible reaction. After about 4 months I took myself off Effexor; the reactions were horrible, in combination with the benzo w/d (I had no idea about this at the time). I felt better, as well the condition that was causing the anxiety had been resolved. But the interdose and tolerance withdrawal from the benzos was still there and getting worse.  Sometime after this, I tried Buspar for about a month, during which time I cold turkeyed the benzos (I thought my problem was some sort of anxiety, not withdrawal). This is when all hell broke loose. No one recognized what was going on; at this point I was put on wellbutrin because I complained of severe depression. I finally stopped trusting the docs, and researched what was happening to me, at which time I reinstated and crossed to valium, and started to taper. I stayed on the wellbutrin until 2 months after the taper was finished.

 

Pedro,

 

I can relate to this, I was on the Buspare and Klonopin in the beginning and got all kinds of anxiety and side effects so they switched to Zoloft, then xanax and then celexa w/ xanax.  Right now I have no consistency and I"m still not really functional as in going wherever I want due to agoraphobia and anxiety caused by w/d.  The dr's just say to take an SSRI or another drug, I'm 10.5 months out and I know another drug may offer temporary relief until the body gets used to that too

[[hu...]]

 

If you are always looking for a cause you are always going to find one.

 

I'm not saying that it is impossible to have a flareup from alcohol, but I do think that alcohol is something that could easily be blamed for a wave that was going to happen anyway. I can assure you that waves can and do happen completely independent of "triggers".

 

That said, I do think that the farther we do get away from our last dose the more the sensitive CNS thing plays into it. My trigger is lack of sleep. If I have to get up early and miss a few hours of sleep it messes me up for two days. Matter of fact I figured out that my alcohol issue these days isn't really an alcohol intolerance, it is from the alcohol causing poor sleep.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself. In anthropology we call this "confirmation bias."

 

I've kept a journal the whole time I've been going through this mess - 24 months and counting - and it's full of entries like "feel horrible; probably shouldn't have [eaten so much][drank those beers][gone jogging so far][etc.]" which all seem to make sense in the short-run. But when looked at across 24 months and in finer detail, and even applying statistical formulas I learned in math courses, I can find no correlation between anything and anything. Not consistently, anyway. A hangover certainly makes however-I-feel worse, and exercise usually makes however-I-feel better, but as for what causes waves and windows they seem to pretty much come and go as they choose. ( r=0.0000, p<.01  )

 

..... except sleep. If I don't get enough sleep I find that I suffer greatly, especially the second day after. And yep, I have also for-sure noticed that if I drink the symptoms it triggers tend to be those of deep-sleep deprivation. So whether alcohol worsens or prolongs GABA_A-receptor downregulation may or may not be true, but it also seems like a moot point for those of us with hair-trigger nervous systems.

[[li...]]

 

Just gonna have to pitch in on the side of Whoopsie. As there seem to be no rules on this trip we can all only speak from personal experience and a s far as booze goes this is what happened to me.

 

I'm 33 months off now and still suffering many symptoms. During my taper I used alcohol unwittingly as a substitute for the benzos and I'm sure that has something to do with my prolonged withdrawal. At Christmas last year I decided to risk a couple of drinks even though I knew it might be harmful. I just wanted to do something normal like everybody else. This is a common reaction here it seems when we are feeling a little better. I had two glasses of wine. This had no immediate impact but, as some others have said, about four days later I had terrible physical symptoms and some dr and dp and depression. The chronic symptoms lasted a couple of days but I was left in a sort of wave for the next couple of months.

 

It seems like even a small amount of alcohol kicks up one hell of  mess in my nervous system and elsewhere. No mater how much we may wish it otherwise, alcohol is like petrol to the flames of this Godawful plague we're stuck with.

 

I don't think there's much point in philosophising or trying to enlarge an individual experience in to the general as everybody seems to be different. Nonetheless, be warned, alcohol can have a terrible effect on withdrawal. 

[[Bi...]]

Here's a simple solution. Don't drink it once you feel better. If you crave it that bad, then wait 3-6 years after. It's not that hard!

[[br...]]

I agree, my friends all keep asking me why I haven't drank in almost 2 years. I tell them "If only you guys knew the mess that this medication has caused. Its not as simple as mind over matter and there are a lot of things going on in my body that a drink would pretty much screw up at this point."

 

One of my friends pretty much wants me to start smoking POT which I quit 3 years ago. Just don't get it. They think replacing one substance with another is the solutions to problems.

 

My goal, as crazy as this may sound, is to never drink or do anything type of drug again in my life. It's going to be super hard, but at this point, it's the best course of action.

[[Bo...]]

It seems like the people I'm reading about that have a hard time after drinking were on some kind of benzo for an extended amount of time. I'm sure the amount of time it takes for your CNS to heal enough to handle alcohol  is relative to how long and the amount of benzos taken. 3 to 6 year seems like a reasonable amount of time for someone who used for 10 plus years, but not for someone under a year.

[[Wh...]]

Whoppsie -

Glad to see you were on an Island, that's so awesome!  I plan on doing a really cool celebration as well.  Sorry about the setback too, it's so insane that it can happen but we see it.

Were you able to fly home with no issues and what type of symptoms did you have? Just curious, were you functional like working,etc..?

 

I've seen a lot of people on here & other places that were fine drinking with no ill effects after withdrawal, I too personally hate to see scenarios like this b/c I 1000% look forward to enjoy life like I used to and that will include fine wine & brews.  This is entirely my opinion as I feel deprived of everything as many of you do. 

 

The alcohol is so individual b/c I saw a member here who was drinking whiskey & doing illegal drugs during and after his taper and he was healed in ~6 months.  It's so crazy.  I would want some serious recourse towards the dr. or pharma if the improper long term prescription of xanax literally changed my chemistry so that I can't tolerate alcohol or caffeine among other things after.

 

Hi inw, sorry it took me some time to reply, I've been really bad lately and so it's hard to talk.  Today suddenly alot better, hope so much that it continues.  You asked about the flight home, I was fine but thoroughly exhausted when I got home as it was a red eye flight.  The next day is when I got hit again with all my usual former w/d symptoms.  This lines up with the 4 days later that others have talked about.

 

No, I have not worked thoughout this ordeal, no way and I don't know how anyone could in my condition.  I was able to drive and take care of a household but that is all and pretty pathetically at that.

 

Yes, I have no idea who will be affected the way I was by alcohol but just wanted to throw out the warning that it could be you.  I now realize that people are going to do what they're going to do regardless of the reported experience of myself and others.  It won't be me that gets hurt by what people choose to do.

 

I want to be normal too and not have to worry about having a beer on a hot summers day or a glass of wine with a nice meal out.  I definitely know that I have a very bad reaction to any accidental injestion of MSG which lasts for the following day so I'm going to be restricted in that too but I don't know about for "always".  I don't know for "always" on the alcohol either but God help me if I try again much further down the road.  This is ridiculous and beyond devastating what these drugs have done to us.

[[er...]]

Hey All,

A couple of true facts shared with me ,the 1st was  a story provided to me by a retired mental health researcher Phd. who counseled benzo withdrawal folks before the internet.

He had a client went thru long withdrawal 2 years I think.fully recovered 5 years later she had a glass of champagne at a wedding she went back into really harsh withdrawals for weeks after.

 

Second a well respected Naturopath Dr.I met with years ago when this started for me told me with Neurological Dysregulation regardless of cause full recovery takes 3-5 years after symptoms have abated.Meaning when symptoms are gone consider it a remission of sorts,many of us may need more time to become fully pre-benzo neurologicaly speaking.

 

Good Advice here on this thread.

 

thank you so much for the informations.

3~5 years is a very long time. sigh. do not even know whether i could live that long.  :'(

 

 

 

 

 

I was told also 3 to 5 years 

[[...]]

Hey All,

A couple of true facts shared with me ,the 1st was  a story provided to me by a retired mental health researcher Phd. who counseled benzo withdrawal folks before the internet.

He had a client went thru long withdrawal 2 years I think.fully recovered 5 years later she had a glass of champagne at a wedding she went back into really harsh withdrawals for weeks after.

 

Second a well respected Naturopath Dr.I met with years ago when this started for me told me with Neurological Dysregulation regardless of cause full recovery takes 3-5 years after symptoms have abated.Meaning when symptoms are gone consider it a remission of sorts,many of us may need more time to become fully pre-benzo neurologicaly speaking.

 

Good Advice here on this thread.

 

thank you so much for the informations.

3~5 years is a very long time. sigh. do not even know whether i could live that long.  :'(

 

 

 

 

 

I was told also 3 to 5 years 

 

Thanks for the feedback, yea it's insane that symptoms can come after so long.  Did the dr's try to give you another SSRI or something else?  I'm 10.5 months out but still can't do whatever I want b/c I came down w/ agoraphobia like many along w/ dizziness, fatigue, dp/dr, etc.. 

 

I always wonder about anyone who tried another drug just to become stable but I also read that it's hard for anything to counteract benzo withdrawal so i would bet the symptoms may breakthrough.  I think a CNS depressant that doesn't affect GABA may be the only thing that could help

[[Co...]]

Well I've gotta say that this is a depressing thread.  Perhaps the truth, but the damned truth hurts sometimes?

 

I am still in taper.  Doing well for the most part, except that last night, my squeeze served some sparkling wine with dinner, and I had a wave about two minutes after my first sip.  It was not a painful experience, just a large sized headache with a throb or two.  I retired to the upstairs for half-hour after dinner. 

 

So this is a sign of things to come after I take my last dose perhaps in summer?  No booze?  Yuck. 

[[ce...]]

Well I've gotta say that this is a depressing thread.  Perhaps the truth, but the damned truth hurts sometimes?

 

I am still in taper.  Doing well for the most part, except that last night, my squeeze served some sparkling wine with dinner, and I had a wave about two minutes after my first sip.  It was not a painful experience, just a large sized headache with a throb or two.  I retired to the upstairs for half-hour after dinner. 

 

So this is a sign of things to come after I take my last dose perhaps in summer?  No booze?  Yuck.

Not at all true. Many people recover to the point they can drink on occasion again.  I took benzo's for many years and have fully recovered and can have a drink now with no repercussions.  I'm not saying that drinking doesn't cause symptoms for some people down the line, but most people have been able to drink again with no trouble.  Just my take on it.

[[Co...]]

^ thanks !

[[Br...]]

Sorry about the double-post, but I'm skeptical of flare-ups "just happening" once the first hellish part of withdrawal has ended. Looking back, the first five or six months of my withdrawal were infernal, and there really were flare-ups during that period which seemed to have no reasonable cause.

 

Hello QueenScarlett.  I think you're right that it's important (if difficult) to make sure there is true causality rather co-incidence.

 

More than once I've noticed something I took caused a benzo wave but later it turned out to be nothing more than a co-incidence.

[[Pe...]]

If you are able to drink alcohol with no consequences, you are lucky. I wish I could have the odd beer. I think for most that have had very bad withdrawals, it will take a long time for our brains and nervous systems to fully recover.

[[Iw...]]

  Im a lil over 14 months off and ive had 2 seperate occasions where ive tried alcohol. I had a beer at 6 months off thru me into a 2 week wave and i tried half a beer last week and so far i have noticed ive been gettin worked up A LOT easier. prolly a mini wave im in now. For the most part im 90%- 95% healed. But i do tend to get worked up sometimes from  work and everyday life. wonder when that goes away?  Dont think ill be trying alcohol for at least another 6 months.

[[af...]]

Oh Whoopsie. I am so sorry for your set back. I wanted to thank you for posting this. I wish I had had this info to mull over last summer! I thought I would be ok with half a beer when were at the beach...NOPE! Then I tried champagne on New Years...That didn't work either. I was going to try again this summer but the more I think about what "could" happen the more I am convinced that I do not need it or want it anymore. I gave up coffee and all caffeine a year ago---then all alcohol too. I wasn't a big drinker but I love a cold beer or margarita on a hot summer night as well as a glass of red wine with dinner. It used to depress me thinking I would never be able to again and now I realize more and more that I am happy without it and what could happen could be really really bad so why not just give it up. I think Libby posted on here a while back (different thread) that she too had issues. It's getting easier to be ok with not having it. It took guts to post this. I can tell you care a lot about others otherwise you wouldn't have said anything. So THANK YOU for caring about all of us here and speaking up. I do hope you are doing better.

Here's to healing!

Afighter