The Klonopin Klub

[[re...]]

Hello, everyone -

 

I've gotten so far behind!  I can't keep up, I'm afraid, but I note that there are a number of newcomers--welcome!--as well as some folks not heard from so much recently, like Colorado Chick.  Brian also checked back in recently.  It's nice to hear from people who haven't been around so much lately.  I want to greet everyone, but just can't do it individually.  We got back from traveling, there was the usual pile-up of stuff to be dealt with . . . you know.

 

I do want to say in particular to those of you worried about permanent damage that this is a typical fear entertained by people dealing with Klonopin and withdrawal from it.  It can be really hard to believe that whatever symptom(s) is/are plaguing you most are not some irreversible unpleasantness that the drug has inflicted on you.  But the truth is that healing happens; the difficulty is that it can be part of the adverse psychological effects of the drug and the process of withdrawing from it that you find this hard to believe--your fears loom large.  Try to remember that to a considerable extent the drug itself is doing this to you, magnifying your fears.  Try to find your center, breathe, and see if you can find a vein of reassurance to draw on. 

 

As many of you know, I'm saying all this from a pretty much fully-healed place.  I was in hell eighteen months ago, and much of the time I worried desperately that the hell was permanent, that there was no way out.  It's true that the only way out is through (if you'll pardon the cliche) . . . but in the end it's still out.  I got there, many others have, and you will, too.  Persevere, and know that friends are here to help.

 

Good night, all -

 

Peace,

 

Rek

[[Co...]]

rek,

 

Thanks for that. I have thought about permanent damage so many times. My memory is terrible. So terrible that it scares me. I do something and the next day I have no memory of it all all. It is a mix of w/d and prior chemo. What a toxic mix.

Thanks for the positive post.

 

CC

[[ca...]]

Hi! I've been progressing on my taper, but it has been terribly slow. I am currently on a very small dose, but I seem to be hyper sensible to clonazepam.

 

Since September, my taper has been: 0,125 - 0,113 - 0,1 - 0,088

 

11 days ago I went from 0,088 mg to 0,075, and today something weird happened to me: I felt I was losing my breath and couldn't breathe more (feeling asphxiated), and started getting very hot (it is important to say I was not hyperventilanting...I was quite calm definitely different from a panick attack).

 

Question 1: Is this normal?

 

Question 2: Does it make any sense to switch to Diazepam at this stage? (I feel very uncomfortable each time I make a dose reduction, and these reductions are very small!)

 

Question 3: At this level of dose, is it worth taking a bit more pain, but end this sooner? (let's say, move to 0,05 and then finish off?...this number is equivalent to the 1mg diazepam dose in Ashton).

 

Best regards, and a lot of energy for all of you!

 

 

[[ho...]]

Greetings K Klub,

 

I have been away from the forum since just after Christmas. A wave hit. I think I see a pattern here... I hide out when I'm not feeling well. I think it is because of the depression and trouble with connecting my thoughts. Sometimes I justt log on and read, other times I occupy myself with youtube videos and TV til it passes. Last night I got caught up with all the posts here since my absence.

 

Welcome to all the new K Klubbers I find this thread to be very supportive and caring.

The best advice I can offer is:

1. Taper slowly... it is gentler on your CNS.

2. Educate yourself concerning withdrawal sx... "Parker's paper" "What is happened In Your Brain" is a detailed account of sx and why they are happening. For many, FEAR is a big part of w/d. It was very helpful to me to discover that FEAR is in fact a sx. Part of w/d. Once I realized that my fear was withdrawal and not real... it allowed me to take the next step.

3. Acceptance... this is hard, but once you come to terms with your situation and accept that it will be a process, you will begin to find peace in it.

I think it is natural to want to "just get this over with" but slow tapering is going to get you there in better shape when it's time to jump.

 

I celebrated 6 months of freedom on Jan. 1st. I happened to be experiencing a wave at the time. I get a bit depressed, feel achy and tired, have sleep issues and a fuzzy brain. Even so I have progressed (healed) tremendously. A year ago today I was in acute w/d after cutting my dose by 50%. Duh... I didn't know. I found myself in Benzo Hell, scared out of my mind. Thankfully I found BB, learned that I would in fact level out in time and then be able to SLOWLY taper off the remaining .5mls. At 6 months out I have most of my life back. I know that the remainder will come back in time. I have seen many sx drop off never to return. The remaining sx are MUCH easier to handle now. Time is our friend, we will all heal.

 

cartolo what you are describing happened to me too when I got lower in my dose and a few times after I jumped. I had read here that others experienced this sx too and that eased my mind. Just another sx to add to the mix, yuck. I can't advise about a crossover. I liquid titrated off K all the way down to zero. It is very common to really feel your cuts as you get lower and lower. My advice is to taper down to "fumes", as Njoy would say. Maybe try giving yourself a bit more time between cuts. Best of luck to you.

 

Friday13 Hang in there. It took 6 weeks for me to begin to stabilize. It will happen for you too. There just isn't any way to predict when. I would wait til you start feeling better to continue with your taper. I was on 1mg. for 4 months, not that long either. Wishing you wellness.

 

To Njoy, rek, Colorado Chick, brain, thetrader, panicnomore, Silthrim, peace2 and all others , sending warm thoughts, hugs, peace and wellness to ALL.

I am happy and proud to be a part of this wonderful Klub. All of you are in my prayers. It's nice to see that many are getting out, working, living life. Be kind to yourselves.

 

blessings,

hopeful2013

[[re...]]

Hi, Hopeful, and hi to everyone!  And thanks, Hopeful, for your own upbeat and heartening input--it's energizing!

 

Colorado Chick, I understand about the memory thing--my own memory just ain't what it used to be, at least partly as a function of age, but I feel as though things fall into place better now, seventeen months out from benzos, so here's hoping the same will be true for you as soon as possible.  I'm sure the benzos are interfering with your memory function, and that therefore this symptom will pass as you get free of their influence.  Hang in there.

 

I hope everyone is keeping warm, especially in the areas where the cold has really sunk its claws in.  It's bad enough where we are, and we don't have the worst of it.

 

If anyone out there has, like me, poor circulation in the feet, there are these microwavable slippers (they call them "booties") you can get at Bed, Bath & Beyond, and probably other places, too.  I know this isn't strictly relevant to benzo recovery, but on the other hand it's something for general comfort in cold and inhospitable weather.  If you happen to be the kind of benzo-recoverer I was who finds herbal teas soothing, I think warm feet and a hot cup of tea might be a good thing.

 

That, and Hopeful's advice in her last post, which I think is very sound.

 

Take good care of yourselves, everyone -

 

Peace,

 

Rek

[[ho...]]

rek, those slippers sound heavenly and also relevent to my sx. I have what feels like nerve pain in the bottoms of my feet. This happened to me last summer when I got near the end of my taper and lasted about a month. It came back again a couple weeks before Christmas. My daughter gave me some Air Walk slippers that help but the microwavable ones sound awesome. As soon as this freezing cold leaves the Mpls. area I am going out to get some.. I've been patiemtly waiting to walk on that hot beach sand in Negril...3 more weeks and I'm there!

 

blessings,

hopeful2013

[[Co...]]

hopeful,

 

Happy New Year! I am sorry that you had a wave that put you down. BUT...congratulations on your 6 month anniverary. I hope you are feeling better. I am in a good place right now. Snail taper and doing ok. Hoping to ward off the s/x that have plagued with me every cut. hang in there. You deserve to feel better.

 

Best from Colorado :smitten:

[[ho...]]

Thanks Colorado,

 

And you too my friend deserve to feel well. The snails pace worked for me. Slow but sure. I'm pulling for ya.

much love and blessings,

hopeful2013

 

[[br...]]

Hey KK:

 

It's cold in NYC again today.  Just wanted to check in.  It's day 9 of my cut from .75mg K to .625mg K.  No bad w/d symptoms so far.  A little anxiety here and there.  A little derealization here and there.  My TMJ (jaw) is acting up again (clicking and popping and uncomfortable).  I'm trying not to look for symptoms because if they are coming, I will know when they arrive.  I don't have to look for them; they usually find me.  So just trying the one day at a time philosophy.  I am home sick from work today due to an unrelated sinus infection.  Hopefully it will be a speedy recovery.

 

So I have been thinking about how this taper might go.  My plan was to stay at .625mg K for another couple months to really stabilize.  Then taper from .625mg to .5mg.  I wanted to avoid the overwhelming w/d symptoms (namely high anxiety, panic attacks and persistent heart palpitations) that I experienced when I had a failed taper directly from .75mg to .5mg a couple months ago.

 

I got thrown a curve ball yesterday.  My insurance plan works with a script for a 3 month supply of meds and sends a 3 month supply in the mail.  I received a 3 months supply of Klonopin in .25mg K Wafers (Not Tablets) in the mail yesterday.  The Wafers are individually sealed and dissolve in your mouth.  They can not be cut in half (nor quartered) like the .25mg K Tablets.  It was an error between my psychiatrist and the mail order pharmacy.  My last 3 month supply had been ordered in the .125mg K Wafers, which I mistakenly thought could be halved and quartered into even smaller doses.  I told my psychiatrist that for the purposes of tapering the .125mg K Wafers were not helpful and that I wanted my dose in the .25mg K Tablets instead.  Well to my surprise I received .25mg K Wafers yesterday.  I did not even know the Wafers came in .25mg K.  It is bizarre.  Being that Klonopin is a controlled substance, it's difficult to exchange like say a mail order sweater in the wrong size.  The mail order pharmacy told me that my psych has to specify Tablet or Wafer on the next script to distinguish between the two forms.

 

So I sort of freaked out yesterday.  Anyway I counted out that I had 45 single doses of the .125mg K Wafers from my last order; in addition the current addition of a sink full of .25mg K Wafers.  So I figured out that I could start using a combination of the .125mg K Wafers and the .25mg K Wafers to maintain my .625mg K daily dose.  I take a morning dose of .25mg K Wafer, an afternoon dose of .25mg K Wafer and a nightly dose of .125mg K Wafer, totaling .625mg K daily.  The only snag with this method is that I run out of the .125mg K Wafers in 45 days.  I will be left with only the .25mg K Wafers, which can not be further cut.  I would then be forced to taper from .625mg K daily to .5mg K daily (taking 2 daily doses of the .25mg K Wafers).  This was more or less my plan but it sort of takes away the option of holding at the dose of .625mg K any longer than 45 days from now.

 

So to clarify,  I tapered from .75mg K to .625 mg K last week.  This is a cut of 15%.  Then roughly 2 month from that last cut, I will taper from .625mg K to .5mg K.  This will be a cut of 20%. 

 

I think this seems manageable.  I can stabilize for several months or more at .5mg K daily (being that I have a large supply of the .25mg K Wafers anyways - I need to use up the .25mg K Wafers before I can receive the much more helpful .25mg K Tablets).

 

After all this K Wafer nonsense is over and I am stabilized at .5mg K daily, I hope to taper by using the .25mg K Tablets.  The .25mg K Tablets can be halved into .125mg K.  Then the .125mg K halves can be halved again into .0625mg K doses.  I believe that the .0625mg K doses will give me some wiggle room to complete my taper (by the end of 2014?). 

 

Any advice?

 

Hope all are well.

 

Brian

[[da...]]

Hi Y'all from Texas,

I would like to post here. One year out c/t from K. Just testing to see if my new avatar will post. Thanks.

[[th...]]

Hi Y'all from Texas,

I would like to post here. One year out c/t from K. Just testing to see if my new avatar will post. Thanks.

 

Good for you!

It works.

 

How do you feel after one year?

[[Wo...]]

Good afternoon K club!

 

Hopeful, I have a question for you since I'm doing the daily liquid taper too. I'm 10 days in and having lots of anxiety now, so I'm going to hold. In your experience, did you get worse symptoms as the 10 days went along, and did the 4 day holds help very much? Also, It sounds like you're doing well 6 months out and that's inspiring. Right now, I feel trapped but am looking forward to a time when I'm getting better, and not worse. Thanks in advance.

 

To everyone: I'm sending positive thoughts and prayers to those who are feeling good, and those who are feeling not so good.

 

-John

[[ho...]]

Hi Wondernova,

 

I am assuming you are mixing the .5 mg tablet into 100 mls. liquid. If this is correct, and you have removed 10 mls. from you dose on day 10.... this is 10% of your dose. So if you contonue to take the 90 mls. for 4 more days, that will gove you  a 10% reduction in 2 weeks. This is the rate I tapered at.

 

Usually by day 10 I was feeling it. It usually did ease up by the time I should start the next 10 day "round" of cuts. Sometimes it didn't ease up til I was a couple days into the next round.

 

Keep in mind, there are still some sx while tapering. The goal is to taper at a rate that is tollerable. I was able to stick to a 10% schedule. Some can only do 5% or 7% in a 2 week time frame. You can adjust as you go. Also you can hold longer if real sick.

 

Hope this helps. I' m happy to answer any questions if I can. The road seems long but you can do it. I suggest you write down every reduction so you know where you are. Trust me, it's very easy to lose track.

 

blessings,

hopeful2013

[[da...]]

Hi Y'all from Texas,

I have been off K for one year and have had agoraphobia since March 2013. I have not left my small apartment since then. That was 2 months into my c/t. I still have waves and windows. In waves I have head pressure. I don't feel like doing anything for myself including dishes. I have not done my dishes for weeks. I am sure my mother thinks I am a total slob and I guess she would be right. I just am apathetic and watch TV 24/7. Before all this I never watched TV and was interested in just about everything. Now that is all I do and I am not interested in anything. I used to read all the time and loved studying history. Now I never read anything. So you see I am not back to myself. I guess I have just given up trying. I am also very depressed. I thought I would be much much better by now. I am getting better, but it is very very slow. Any other Texas out there?

[[re...]]

Good morning, all -

 

Hopeful, I hope the "booties" work for you, when you get them--mine are making this bitter weather distinctly more tolerable.  Hope they can help you with the pain as well as the cold--I'm sorry that you're having such pain to begin with!

 

Brian, what a ridiculous mixup with the wafers--and I can see how the system would make it pretty much impossible for you to reverse the error.  It sounds as though you've worked out a good interim solution; I hope something comes through before the 45 days are up to take care of you at that point.

 

Danny-o, I'm sure I speak for all of us when I say my heart goes out to you.  Since you're still having such troubles a year out, I have some questions for you.  Do you manage to exercise, even if right now you can't go out?  How is your nutrition?  Are you eating well--by which I mean avoiding highly processed foods, too much sugar, alcohol, maybe caffeine?  These things can have a significant effect on your mental health.  Have you tried any supplements?  I can't swear that omega-3 (in therapeutic, i.e. huge, doses) has cured depression for me, but my impression is that it has helped, and I don't think it can hurt.

 

Oops--must go, back shortly -

 

Peace,

 

Rek

[[re...]]

OK, sorry about that--I was borrowing my husband's gizmo and he needed to take it with him when he left.  Now I'm on the regular computer.

 

So, to continue--Danny-O, the thinking behind my question is that if you can find any way to take greater control of your own overall well-being, perhaps you could begin to climb out of the depression and the sense of defeat that seem to be afflicting you.  Maybe you're already doing the things I've mentioned--I don't know.  The theme I always come back to is that self-empowerment, to the extent it can be achieved, may be a useful tool in combatting the corrosive effects and after-effects of benzo use.  Actually, to start with you should congratulate yourself for getting OFF those things--that is a great accomplishment, and a testament to your own strength.  Now maybe it's a matter of figuring out how to direct that strength toward self-healing in the wake of the benzos.  I think you can do it--try small steps, maybe?  A new exercise plan, a carefully prepared and highly nutritious meal--I know it can be hard to enact these things when you don't even feel like getting out of bed or up off the couch, but . . . well, if you can manage it, sometimes once you're in motion things start to feel better fairly quickly.  Easier said than done, I know, I know.  But come here for encouragement--you'll be cheered on by friends here. 

 

Wondernova, thank you for the positive thoughts--right back atcha!

 

Wishing everyone windows today -

 

Peace,

 

Rek

[[co...]]

Please take me in as a member who cannot go lower than 0.5mg per day.

[[ho...]]

Hi cosmicgreen,

 

Of course you can join us. Welcome  .

 

Could you explain more about your situation so that we know better how to support you? How long we you on K? Have you tapered down to the .5mgs and from what dose? Do you have a doc. working with you? What if any taper method did you use?

 

Some do have a tough time with the lower doses but it can be done. We recommend a SLOW taper. Some  members dry cut, other liquid titrate (that's what I did), either way, freedom is possible.

 

Let us know how we can help.

 

blessings,

hopeful2013

[[co...]]

Thanks.

 

I've been using BZD little bit more than 2 years but constantly for 1 year. I was first using alprazolam up to 1mg per day, then switched to lorazepam 2.5mg per day. In the beginning of October, psychiatrist put me on clonazepam 2.0mg (as drops) then taper off 0.1mg every 2 days. I cannot make it less than 0.5mg at the moment and I am still on that dose. I try to reduce my dose but anxiety and physical symptoms are giving me hard time. I am even not sure that anxiety is the original one I had or BZD induced. I really don't know what to do.

[[ho...]]

cosmicgreen,

 

Many members have found that the ( last bit ) of K is the hardest to get rid of. This is probably because as you get toward the end, the percentage of your reductions is actually greater then when you began. Does this make sense?

I am not a math person, so I can't tell what your actual reduction percentage is right now but I do see that you have some options here.

Since your doc seems to be working with you on a taper, you could:

 

See if he will change your R/X to reflect a slower rater of taper from this point til you can jump. or

You could hold between cuts to level off some before moving forward, or

You could switch over to pill form of .5mg K and make your own liquid to taper daily but more slowly.

 

Is your doc wise to Ashton and the recommended 5 to 10% reductions every 7 to 14 days? If not you may want to print off that part of the manual, bring it with you along with a plan you feel comfortable with. Hopefully your doc will allow you to control your taper rate.

 

I think the anxiety you have is very likely w/d. It is very common while tapering but can be managed well by the rate you taper. I never had anx. pre-benzo but sure did experience it while in acute w/d and some milder but manageable anx. during my taper. Hope this helps.

 

blessings

hopeful2013

[[...]]

Hi all!  Just checking in.  Welcome to all the newcomers.  You've come to the right place.  I was going to wait a few months till after I was done w/ the K to start my N taper but I think I will begin in a week or so.  I'm not sure if that's a good idea or not... I wanted some N to help w/ the K but now I want some K to help w/ the N(eurotin).  I'm not convinced those are rational thoughts but you have to begin somewhere.  I go to the N board and get so scared.  I had no idea those people suffered so much.  I just want to get started.  I've been having a little more trouble sleeping lately and still headaches on a pretty regular basis but not debilitating... so, I'm grateful for that.  Otherwide, things aren't too bad.  I'm at .019 K.  That feels good.  It won't be too long before I kiss this stuff good bye for good.  I've been reading your posts and staying in the loop.  None of you are ever very far from my thoughts.  I am getting busier.   Danny-O:  I was confined to my house for about 3 months last year.  I got involved w/ ACT, a kind of Cognitive Bahavioral Therapy.  It worked great.  I still have to be careful about interacting w/ people... my CNS is so fragile, but i can get out to get groceries and see my children.  Drove 60 miles a couple of wks ago to see my mom.  That was my most extensive trip.  It was all good.  All I can say is, it passes.  Sounds like you must have some support to get you food or you live in an urban area where they can deliver it... just keep watching TV or whatever you need to do to pass the time because you will read again and get out again and although I'm not convinced my cognitive function will ever be the same, so much else is so much better and my cognitive function is sure a lot better than it was when I began this journey.  to all.  Njoy

[[ho...]]

Njoy,

 

It is so encouraging that you are getting out more and LIVING. I don't  know anything about N but want to wish you well on getting off. Uggh, the things we go through. Glad there is a board for it here though where you can get support. All my best to you.

 

blessings,

hopeful2013

[[Wo...]]

Thanks for getting back to me so fast Hopeful. I actually have a liquid from the pharmacy that is 1ml=.1mg, if that makes sense. It's the same, except I remove .1ml instead of 10ml. I realized I went from 5ml to 4ml in less than 2 weeks, and that is 20%, so there is the problem. My Doc, who is actually a N.P. of medicine, insists that my problem is the anxiety of being with out the drug, and not really withdrawal. Needless to say, I no longer believe him. I'm going to hold for at least a week, then I'm sticking to the 10% every 2 weeks rule from now on. Lesson learned! Thanks again for your input!

[[...]]

Wondernova:  I expect that kind of fear might last 3-4 wks, not a year or more.    :tickedoff:  These docs are so cavalier.  As I've said in the past, I can't sell plants out of my front yard w/o a license... how do these people practice?  The terrible thing about that whole problem for me is, I will never trust them again... and there may be a time when I'll really need a doc.  First they put me us this stuff for reasons outside prescribing parameters and then they just leave us hanging because they have no idea about what they are doing.  It hurts too think we are so dispendable.Njoy

[[Wo...]]

Njoy, I totally agree with you. I've been with my current Health Care provider for 6 years now, (I don't know if we're aloud to say who they are), but there is a consistent pattern of them prescribing drugs immediately for whatever it is that is ailing me, instead of trying to address the root cause of problems. I'm talking about physical ailments as well. It's very frustrating because I don't have the option of changing provider. I'm trying to stay away from that frustration though, because it just adds to the negativity and I end up dwelling and feeling worse.

 

Peace,

 

John