GABA Receptor Healing Techniques

[[Da...]]

Haven’t been here in a while.  Wondering what the latest info is regarding the healing of damaged receptors?..     thanks much.    

[[An...]]

I personally do not think anything but time away from the thing or things that caused the damage will work, including healthy lifestyle things to facilitate healing. You can't be eating junk 24/7, not exercising, be under constant stress, smoking, drinking too much booze, etc. and expect to feel well only because you are off benzos. If you are doing the aforementioned things despite being off benzos, you will continue to feel crummy IMO. The human body is amazing and is always trying to save us by repairing the damage we do to it but you must stop doing the thing or things that cause damage. Otherwise, the damage exceeds the body's ability to restore and repair and you will become and stay sick despite the benzo stoppage.

[[bw...]]

Leafy greens. Meditation.

[[An...]]

I agree @[bw...]. I eat lots of leafy greens + I meditate daily.👍

[[De...]]

Posted on health matters

[[...]]

The things I'd like to see researched for this are the following. They're listed in order of how I believe they will perform in clinical trials, based on their mechanisms of action and existing anecdotal data: 

• The peptide BPC-157. It's been studied and appears to counteract benzo tolerance and withdrawal, possibly by repairing damaged GABA and other (e.g., histamine) receptors. It can be taken orally and is available as a supplement in the US. It's not cheap. 
• Hyberbaric Oxygen Therapy (HBOT). There is anecdotal data and case studies of it improving protracted withdrawal symptoms. There are clinics that provide sessions. Units can also be purchased for home use. The cost for a unit is about $5000 USD. Ear barotrauma is a risk. 
• Earthing/Grounding. It seems implausible, but there is significant clinical data to support its efficacy for wound healing, including diabetic neuropathy. I would like to see a clinical trial of people using the bed mats that go under fitted mattresses. Both during and after tapers. This is a relatively inexpensive, one-time purchase treatment. It uses no electricity. This vendor is the original vendor and has an impressive no questions asked return policy. The testimonials for improving sleep are impressive. 
• The peptide ARA-290. I don't believe it's been studied for receptor repair, but it has a lot of data for neuro repair. It needs to be administered via subq injection, although there may be future intranasal formulations. It's very pricey and would be accessed through a doctor who prescribes peptide treatments. 
• Flumenazil. In simple terms, this theoretically works by "waking up" damaged receptors by doing the opposite of what benzos do. So when you stop the administration, your natural baseline receptor state is more active. This is accessed via clinics. 
• Imidazenil. This is a research compound and a novel benzodiazepine of sorts. It's somewhat related to flumenazil but can be taken orally and appears to have a better safety profile. This is not realistic to try to source or trial, sadly. 

[[fu...]]

[[...]]

@[fu...] - I've been taking 250 mcg, 3x/day of BPC for more than a year. I'm not having any adverse reactions. I tapered up slowly, with at least a week in between dose increases. I took it for several months a couple years ago and had no problem discontinuing it then. I really don't want to discontinue it when I'm done my taper (because of some of the health benefits I've read in the medical journal articles), but I will probably cut back my dose to once or twice per day, eventually, if I don't have protracted symptoms to manage. 

Edited November 6, 2023 by [...]

[[Da...]]

Kats.    Is BPC a medication ordered through a prescription?    Just read a small amount about it.    Very unclear data.    What are you experiencing and are you tapering?    Thanks in advance.   

[[fu...]]

Also, is it dangerous in terms of cell mutation, cancer or anything in the long term?

[[...]]

Oral BPC is a peptide that is available as a supplement in the US. It is classified differently in different countries. In some countries it is still considered a research compound. It is also prescribed by peptide doctors in the US to be made by compounding pharmacies for injectable administration. 

In terms of the cancer question, I chased that down, too. This well-referenced blog post about "How does BPC-157 Work" breaks it down more clearly. It's one of the better articles about BPC that's available, even though it has a positive spin because it's from a peptide vendor. 

I get most worried about getting authentic BPC than about BPC itself. There is a lot of fake/bad BPC out there. Apparently one brand was caffeine pills and not BPC. If it's too cheap, it's probably not real. This is the BPC that I like best.

Other considerations include:

• Is it the right formulation for oral use? Arginate not acetate salt.
• Does it have salcaprozate sodium (SNAC)? That's a GI-permeability enhancer to help absorption. SNAC can cause leaky gut injuries which is part of what we're trying to fix if we have GI-tract issues

When I was deciding whether to try it, these things were a big part of my decision:

• It has no LD50.
• It is a peptide. Peptides are made up of (only) amino acids. It is also a fairly short peptide. (This doesn't mean that all peptides are going to be safe, but AI software can better predict if they might not be). 
• It is derived from gastric juice. 
• A lot of athletes have taken it for performance enhancement. If it caused problems, I feel like it would have become less popular instead of more popular. Its popularity and efficacy led it to be banned as a performance enhancing drug as of the beginning of 2023. (I think this article is written to scare people. Especially when compared it to all the expert doc blog posts). 
• I believe benzos are more dangerous than BPC, so if I need BPC for a few years to get off benzos safely, I'm OK with that risk benefit calculation.
• I was literally starving to death before I started taking it. I lost 65 pounds. It helped me to be able to eat again and gain some weight back and also no longer be malnourished.
• I have MCAS and GI-tract issues. That might be why I'm a super-responder to it. It may not work as well for someone who doesn't have those issues. 

I'm not making any recommendations here. Please do your own research. I do not believe it would help everybody. Things are never that simple. 

But hope this write up is helpful for everybody who reads it. 

[[...]]

@[Da...] @[fu...] - meant to tag you on the above. Hope the info is helpful. 

[[fu...]]

Thank you for sharing all this! Do you think it could help with CFS/CFS-like symptoms from benzo tolerance/withdrawal?

Did you felt better soon after the First dose?

[[...]]

@[fu...] - In my experience, yes, it helped a lot with fatigue and I felt a difference after the first dose. But I started at a low dose and worked my way up over several weeks. I got more improvement after a few weeks at the higher doses. 

Just my opinion, but I think BPC is more likely to help CFS symptoms when the fatigue is being caused directly by the benzos. But this is because benzos themselves also can cause CFS-like symptoms. 

It also can help with fatigue from POTS, because that is often driven by MCAS and BPC can help with MCAS.

Glad you found the replies helpful. Hope you start feeling better soon! 

[[Da...]]

[[Na...]]

Just to be clear on a point above - BPC 157 isn't derived from gastric juice in the sense that gastric juice contains this peptide.  It is a peptide based on a protein found in gastric juice. Peptides are typically smaller than proteins and what they did when they created BPC 157 is they copied certain features found on a particular protein shown to have certain biological effects. 

Some studies (mainly in rats) report that BPC is anxiolytic (anxiety reducing), though some users of the compound report that it is anxiogenic (anxiety generating). Just be aware that the effect on anxiety may not be predictable. 

Examine.com had a decent write up on it - BPC-157

I have tried it in the past and don't believe that I got a strong effect one way or the other. I do however know one person that reported he tried it and that it really jacked up his anxiety.

My opinion would be to start small and work your way up if you decide to give it a go.

[[...]]

@[Na...] - Thanks for sharing the Examine write up. It's good and balanced. Saving it! :-)

You're also right that I could have done a better job of clarifying that "derived from gastric juice" comment. I almost didn't write that bullet point because of the debates about that. 

In case others are interested in that debate, my understanding of the "derived from gastric juice" statement is that they identified a peptide fragment within a gastric juice protein and then optimized it to be stable as a stand-alone fragment. The process they used to stabilize it is the basis for BPC's patent: "The technical problem underlying the present invention is to provide BPC peptides in more stable form and a diagnostic and/or pharmaceutical composition comprising BPC peptides exhibiting improved stability and at least the same pharmaceutical activities as the BPC peptides themselves."

The patent gets into how they made the changes, altering the amino sequence, to increase stability, not to increase potency. The potency of BPC is higher because the dose is much higher than what would occur naturally, if it was the natural form of it. 

That's another reason to start small and slow. 

Edited November 7, 2023 by [...]

[[we...]]

Hey @[...] , can you please link to case studies regarding HBOT and withdraw syndromes pleases.

I would put flumazenil at the top of the list to be frank. It's the one compound that has been shown in vitro and animal studies to instantly recouple the positive allosteric modulator sites. There is also this pilot study by ladder et al in HUMANS with 'persistent withdraw symptoms' showcasing very positive results. Unfortunately the reduction in symptomatology lasted for a few days post treatment. This wouldn't be long enough to reverse epigentic changes.

It would be great to see a treatment protocol go on for 6+ weeks along with other compounds to boost neuroplasticity. I would suspect that may be enough to make some substantial changes (Well, at least in the gabaergic system). What hell is Benzo Information Coalition up to? 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by [we...]

[[...]]

@[we...] - I used to agree with you about Flumenazil as a potential treatment. But after chatting with several people who did the treatment, the results don't seem to be durable.

I think a treatment formulated for a longer-term oral administration would be more likely to be successful. Something that could work a bit like LDN, except for GABA receptors. 

And, as requested, here's a deidentified HBOT testimonial from a clinic that previously had them posted on their website. For some reason they no longer have them posted there. I'm not sure why. I actually bought a HBOT unit, based on the testimonials. But my ears couldn't take it (barotrauma). I hope to try again in the spring. I think the HBOT data for other neurological injuries is compelling enough to make it worthy of a BIND clinical trial. 
 

Quote

 

Pre-Hyperbaric

My name is First last. I am a 32 year old male who has had Protracted Benzodiazepine Withdrawal Syndrome for more than two years now. My condition is not uncommon to many individuals who have been prescribed benzodiazepines and stopped taking them.

Although there is much speculation as to what benzodiazepines actually do to the nervous system to cause it such trauma, the symptoms are well known (see the Ashton Manual at www.benzo.org.uk). Here are a few that I have had over the past two years:

• Insomnia
• Panic Attacks
• Generalized Anxiety
• Sensory Hypersensitivity
• Depersonalization
• Derealization
• Aggression
• Hallucinations
• Perceptual Distortions
• Problems with Balance
• Digestive Problems
• Severe Muscle Symptoms

When I came to Facility Name one month ago I had been slowly improving over the course of months. I had just started rehabilitating my ultra-tense muscles with a program of weights. I still had much tightness in my abdomen and my neck and was getting little sleep at nights. Often I felt sick to my stomach. I still felt unable to go back to work.

Post-Hyperbaric

I have just completed my course of twenty treatments at Facility Name Treatment Center. I have noticed several improvements:

1. I am now able to fall asleep at an acceptable time and I am able to wake up early. Before if I tried to get up early I would aggravate my symptoms.
2. I noticed a decrease in tension in my muscles every time I came out of the hyperbaric chamber that would last for several hours. In general, my muscular tension, which was severe, has decreased about 15-20%. This has enabled me to be much more active.
3. My rehabilitation program at the gym has gone really well. I had been athletic for years, but I have never seen such a consistent improvement in my performance. Every single workout I was able to increase intensity and weight. Usually this is a gradual process that is not entirely linear. For example, in the past I would often have many mediocre workouts mixed in with my good workouts.
4. After I have completed my workouts, I feel almost no muscle soreness. This has never happened to me in my life, and previous to my condition, I had done martial arts for six years and lifted weights for fifteen years.
5. I have definitely noticed an improvement in my general sense of well being. I just feel better, more optimistic and more energetic.
6. I have noticed a significant increase in the growth of my hair and nails.
7. I have lost about an inch of abdominal fat. 
8. Perhaps most importantly, I now feel like I am able to return to work. I cannot express how significant that is to me, both financially and to my self esteem. Previous to my condition I had never taken a sick day in fifteen years of full and part time employment. Once my nervous system was damaged by the benzodiazepines I have been unable to work for over two years.

To conclude, I still feel soreness in my neck and abdomen, but it has lessened. Enough to return me to a more normal life. I will no doubt return for maintenance treatments. 

 

 

[[we...]]

@[...] Thanks for the response. Can I have a link to their website? We can use the waybackmachine to read previous testimonies hopefully.

I see how HBOT can work as a useful adjunct- decreasing inflammation, increasing neurogenesis, but we are still left with telling the brain WHAT to change. I haven't seen one person on this forum (with long term issues) get any results from HBOT, which makes sense from my perspective since we are dealing with epigenetic changes.

The fact that flumazenil has gotten any results is remarkable in it self. There hasn't been any clear signal of effectiveness in ANYTHING else.  It's a great starting point - just need to work out the very important details - including safety. 

 

[[Pa...]]

@[...] Great feedback here. In regards to “grounding” or “earthing” it can be done by sticking your bare feet in the grass or laying in the grass too. I got some benefits from it in the warmer weather. I’m leery of the mats…not bc they are a gimmick or won’t work. I’ve just read accounts from non benzo folks feeling wired if they use them too long. they do advise easing into it. I saw benefits starting at 20min. 

Edited February 26 by [Pa...]