Need some help to start liquid tapering Valium 4 mg

[[Sh...]]

Hey everyone,

 

Can anyone please help me ? I've got no idea where to start.

I've on Diazepam since Start December 2015 ... cut my way already till 4 mg by dry tapering. But now for the next, i'd like to switch to liquid tapering because i'm to scared of to big side effects and read this is the best way to minimalize.

 

So I've switched from Xanax 0.5 Xr to Diazepam 10 mg, so 4 mg now and trying to stay here for 14 days now.

 

Dose: I'm taking 4 mg of Diazepam in the morning.

Tablets: 2 times 2 mg in the morning

I'dd like to go to the 10 proc but i don't know what's best ? What's best cut of/day ... 2 weeks ?

 

Please somebody help me how to do this ? I'm scared of doing something wrong.

Thanks a lot

 

 

 

[[Cr...]]

The link in my signature contains one method that's portable and easy to measure.

[[Mo...]]

Hi again.

 

Here is an example for you to use if it's what you're looking for.

 

So, you take your first dose of 2 mgr. All in tablets / pills , as you're doing now.

 

Then, when you're ready for your next dose of 2 mgr...

You do not take the full 2 mgr in pills but :

- take 1 mgr in tablet / pill , as you usually do.

- dissolve a 1 mgr tablet in 1 ml of vodka ( again, this is really a tiny amount. You will ingest more alcohol when you drink a glass of juice ) and add 99 ml of water.

- you now have 100 ml liquid Valium, containing 1 mgr Valium.

 

For the first day, drink all of it. You now have taken 4 mgr Valium that day total.

 

The next day you will take your usual 2 mgr for your first dose.

For the second dose, you take your usual 1mgr tablet and you make another batch of liquid by dissolving 1 mgr tablet in 1 ml vodka, ass 99 ml water and you have your 100 ml, which is the same as 1 mgr .

 

Now, every day following, you will drink less of the liquid , while you still keep taking the rest of your dose in tablets.

 

If you want to cut 0,5 mgr in two weeks ( which is the same as 1 mgr every 28 days), then you will reduce your liquid intake by 3.5 ml DAILY.

 

So, day one, you drink 96.5 ml. (100 ml minus 3.5 ml)

Day two you drink 93 ml

Day three you drink 89.5 ml

Day four 86 ml

Day five 82.5

 

And so on...

 

At one point  you will reach zero and you can now do the same for your other dose.

 

This means you're now taking 2 mgr in tablets for your first dose.

And 1 mgr for your second dose. You have reduced 1 mgr per liquid method.

 

So, you can now start dose 1 , doing the same.

1 mgr in tablet and 1 mgr in liquid, makes 2 mgr.

Repeat the process of reducing the liquid as described above.

 

And for your second dose ( which you've already reduced) you now just take 1 mgr in tablet.

 

 

you can cut as fast or big or slow as you want.

 

for example :

Reduce 100ml by 7ml per day = 14 days to reduce 1mg

 

Reduce 100ml by 4ml per day = 25 days to reduce 1mg

 

Reduce 100ml by 3.5ml per day = 28 days to reduce 1mg

 

Reduce 100ml by 3ml per day = 33 days to reduce 1mg

 

Reduce 100ml by 1ml per day = 100 days to reduce 1mg

 

i hope I didn't make it sound complicated . It's actually simple.

 

You'll need a few syringes, 10 ml , 3 ml and 1 ml I think...

And then some empty glad jars such as for baby food,

 

You can actually make a few batches ahead.

 

This is the method in Diaz-Pam signature, here is the link . She really worked that one out well and a lot of people use it.

 

Here is the link to there

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=110496.0

[[Di...]]

Moodle pretty much said everything I was going to say...lol...  The links to this method are shown below in my signature.

 

The thought of doing a liquid taper is probably pretty scary, but it really is easy once you've done it a couple of times. We've never had a failure yet..lol... Just take your time to read all the steps and maybe even practice for a while by just making up the liquid but not reducing anything for a while.

 

You can ask any questions you want on either of those threads or on the valium support thread. http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=96753.0

[[Sh...]]

Hej, thanks already for all your suggestions and answers but I have to do it with milk or water ... I don't drink alcohol and I don't tolerate it. How do I do this. I use the 4 mg diazepam just in the morning and not in 2 parts of the day. I ve got pills of 5, 2 , 2.5,  2,  1.5 and 1 and 0.5.  So I just use the 4 mg in the morning and nothing more.

Can someone explain in an easy way how to do this ? I'm in day 5 of my 4 mg and want to stay here for 10-14 days or till stabilised.

I really need an easy explination how to do this ... I'm not to good in figures right now. My husband will try to help me figure things out but I really want to do this the right way... maybe in a daily reduction... or how you do this... stay in this for a day or a couple of days ? Sorry that i'm making things perhaps harder than it is but haven't got enough sleep and really need to understand to do it correctly fe with the starting figures and how to calculate... Thanks in advance ! I would really be relieved ! Grtz x

[Guest [ch...]]

You're doing great so far. What Moodle said is exactly what I would have said. I'm doing a very similar taper as you (see my signature). You're just a couple stages ahead of me - I'm currently at 5mg Valium/day. I plan to switch to a liquid titration soon since it's more accurate when you need to measure out fractional doses like 4.5mg. I'll be using a recipe similar to what Moodle describes.

 

1ml of vodka is all you need to dissolve the pill. That is a tiny tiny tiny amount. Then you add 99ml water. The amount of alcohol in the resulting mix is negligible.

 

Take care,

 

Chessplayer

[[Sh...]]

But need to do things without the alcohol ? Use milk or water but no vodka to dissolve ? Can somebody put the steps in a simple way ? Or a a YouTube link with the exact amount of milk... I really sound stupid now but I need an explination stepwize.  I saw some movies with fat milk  without alcohol on YouTube but still don't now how to use it my way how much milk for 4 mg ..... how much reduction when ? ... Sorry for all the trouble of explaining ! I sound like the nutty professor !

[Guest [ch...]]

The question is what does Valium dissolve in. I know it dissolves in alcohol.  I think it will also dissolve in full-fat milk.

Obviously if you use the milk method you'll need to store the unused solution in your refrigerator.

I prefer the alcohol/water mix since your daily dose can easily be carried in small water bottles and stored at room temperature.

Easier if you need to take it with you e.g. when travelling.

 

It does *not* dissolve in water.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Chessplayer

[[Sh...]]

Thanks ! Then I rather use milk. But how much ? How do i do this with the 4 mg pills... if I need to lower...  Can anybody explain steps to do this... how much milk... how much of the pill for a morning dose when you're starting at 4 mg.. I need the steps what I need, how much milk, what do I do with the pills, how do I mix...how do I take the dose of.. what do I drink... how long do I stay on the same dose if i do daily reduction... ?  I've never did this before... and am scared to do something wrong... it really doesn't seem so easy to me.. when you're used to just take a pill... 

[[bu...]]

You're not going to "drink" alcohol, your going to use it as a solvent to create a dilute liquid med.  The amount of alcohol involved is less than a in a glass of fruit juice, and far less than you would simply absorb from your mouthwash.

 

But if you really are adamant about the alcohol, then use propylene glycol...readily availavbe from Amazon, or many large pharmacies.

[[Mo...]]

But need to do things without the alcohol ? Use milk or water but no vodka to dissolve ? Can somebody put the steps in a simple way ? Or a a YouTube link with the exact amount of milk... I really sound stupid now but I need an explination stepwize.  I saw some movies with fat milk  without alcohol on YouTube but still don't now how to use it my way how much milk for 4 mg ..... how much reduction when ? ... Sorry for all the trouble of explaining ! I sound like the nutty professor !

 

If you look in the signature of Diaz-Pam, you will find the method for both vodka, liquid Valium and MILK.

I do agree with Builder about propylene glycol. It's a solvent.

Thing with milk is that you can't see anything which really bothered me and yes, Valium is milk soluble. You would have to use a full fat milk. The milk fat will keep the valiu suspended but you will have to mix REALLY well before you draw out your cuts. And then you have the issues of not seeing because of milk not being transparent. Also.. Shaking and stirring can create a vortex and bubbles and particles stick to the side of your mixing container, so IMO you'd be more consistent dosing otherwise. You'll also need to refrigerate it at all times.

Whereas the other methods and solvents...not.

I'm not trying to worry you, just explaining WHY.

 

But you asked for step wise explanation for milk.

 

It's the same as what I described above,

 

You drop 1 mgr tablet in 100 ml of milk and let it dissolve for a good amount of time

 

You would then do the same as with above described vodka method,

You pick the amount you'd like to cut.

 

Replace 0.5 of your dose with the liquid.

So, you'll take 3.5 mgr in pills and the 100 miliLITER ( =0.5 mgr Valium) to make up 4 mgr.

 

Then you use the liquid portion of your dose to reduce from,

 

How much do you want to CUT? 0.5 every three weeks or so?

If you would reduce 4.5 ml a day ( taking 4.5 ml less each day ) then you'd be cutting 0.5 mgr in 22 days, for example.

 

If we don't know the amount you want to cut, we can't say how much to take less...

 

 

[[Cr...]]

Honestly, it's not a requirement to dissolve it. I used just water and glycerin (for taste) for months without issues. I just had to shake the bottle really well first to mix it up. 

[[Di...]]

Just read these two links. Pretty much all the information you need is there for milk, liquid valium or vodka.

 

Valium daily taper-Milk or Liquid Valium

Valium daily taper-Vodka

 

[[Sh...]]

Honestly, it's not a requirement to dissolve it. I used just water and glycerin (for taste) for months without issues. I just had to shake the bottle really well first to mix it up. 

 

Thanks so much for the explanation ! I actually don't know... how much to take off ? Don't know what's best... I' d like to have a way not to have much symptoms and be able to do things iike sports : running or.. dancing.. walking.. cycling... I was a really sporty type. Would be so great to be done with everything when the holidays start in July. Do I make a daily cut or what do I do... I got really scared after stopping a short working benzo with 25 proc. / week and my mind went completely nuts. Don't want this anymore. So what's a good tempo to go to handle everything ? From 4 to 3.8... for a few days or what shall I do ? As soon as I know a tempo to start from and how to do it ... my husband and I can figure things out.  Maybe a schedule how to reduce in how many days ?

[[Sh...]]

Okay, decided to go for the vodka liquid reduction.... want to start a daily reduction... so i've got my 10 proc on 14 d... that's like 3.9 for a day or 3 3.8 for a day or 3 .. 3.7 for a day or 3 and 3.6 for a day or 3 That's a good solution ?

My hubby's gonna make the calculations and a power point. This is a good thing to start from then ?

Greetz and already thanks to everybody who answered and helped me on my way !

Big kiss x

[[Cr...]]

Good on your hubby for doing that! 

[[...]]

hI sHAKIEMARIE, Please find the Daily microtapering support cause we have the same situation now im stucked at 3 mg so scared bec. of bad symptoms. 

 

Regards,

mcm

[[Mo...]]

Okay, decided to go for the vodka liquid reduction.... want to start a daily reduction... so i've got my 10 proc on 14 d... that's like 3.9 for a day or 3 3.8 for a day or 3 .. 3.7 for a day or 3 and 3.6 for a day or 3 That's a good solution ?

My hubby's gonna make the calculations and a power point. This is a good thing to start from then ?

Greetz and already thanks to everybody who answered and helped me on my way !

Big kiss x

 

No, going from 3.9 to 3.8 to 3.7 is WAY too fast.

You don't go " for a day or three" on liquid.

You cut EVERY day, but tiny tiny amounts.

 

If you need more detailed advice or help with math, please joint the micro taper group.

The link is right here

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=135284.0

 

You will need to convert your cute to mililiters now, but you'll get used to it quickly.

 

You will need to decide how MUCH you want to cut. Let say 0.5 mgr in three weeks, total.

I don't know how much you can handle or what you're comfortable with.

I'd try the micro taper group.

[Guest [ch...]]

Cutting .1mg per day is a bit too fast - you will have cut .7mg in 1 week which is 17.5%. Ashton says to cut no more than 10% every 1-to-2 weeks.

 

IMO you could cut .1mg every 2 days, i.e. a daily sequence like 4,3.9,3.9,3.8,3.8,... Or if you can measure to a resolution of .05, then you could equivalently cut .05mg each day, so the sequence would be 4,3.95,3.9,3.85,3.8,... Either of these would keep you within Ashton's guideline of cutting no more than 10% per week. Note as you get lower you'll have to adjust the cuts downward to stay within the guideline.

[[Sh...]]

Cutting .1mg per day is a bit too fast - you will have cut .7mg in 1 week which is 17.5%. Ashton says to cut no more than 10% every 1-to-2 weeks.

 

IMO you could cut .1mg every 2 days, i.e. a daily sequence like 4,3.9,3.9,3.8,3.8,... Or if you can measure to a resolution of .05, then you could equivalently cut .05mg each day, so the sequence would be 4,3.95,3.9,3.85,3.8,... Either of these would keep you within Ashton's guideline of cutting no more than 10% per week. Note as you get lower you'll have to adjust the cuts downward to stay within the guideline.

 

Chessplayer, you decided already how to do your daily taper... ? Untill now my symptoms were pretty bareable ! Would it be an option to do a daily taper on 5 proc for 10 days instead of 14 ? I'm now on day 8 of my 4 mg and feeling pretty fine... or should I take the safer option ?  What are you planning to do and what are your complaints so far ?

[Guest [ch...]]

I'm doing a cut-and-hold taper. See my signature for my recent schedule. I don't have a fixed timeframe for how long I hold - I play it by ear depending on how I'm feeling. You'll see in my signature I had holds as short as 3 days; I just intuitively felt that would be OK early in my taper. As I get lower I've been slowing that down. When I feel it's time for my next cut, I do so. So right now I have been holding at 5mg/day for 5 days, and I'm feeling fine, slept great last night, so I'm going ahead with my next cut to .45mg tonight. Note how I had been cutting 1mg each time 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, but now that I've reached 5 it's time to reduce the cuts to .5mg (re-adjusting to keep the cuts around 10% of current dose). This means I'll have to start dissolving the damn pills tonight; as long as my doses were integral amounts I could get by with cutting in half the 2mg pills, but once you go to fractions of a mg you need liquid for accuracy.

 

This is my second taper so I'm experienced at it by now. My first taper failed because of some disasters at the end leading me to reinstate. This time I will succeed. This time I have an endgame plan.

 

Feel free to PM me if you want further 1-1 advice. I'm always happy to make new BB friends.

 

Love,

 

Chessplayer

[[Sh...]]

Thanks.... i did cut and hold till now in between 7 and 10 days... usually my offer days were day 3 or day 5... till now it was easy 4 mg so 2 times 2 mg in the morning and that was it.... difference between 5 proc in 10 days or 14 days : for 5 proc in 10 days :  3.98  3. 96 and so on but for 14 days is 3.99, 3.97, 3.96 .... so i'm still doubting.... now it's going reasonably well so would try on 10 days ? Or am I taking to much of a risk ?

Thanks already heaps !

Grtz

I'll keep in mind when I need advice, got to decide pretty soon now. Already tried to quit short working benzo 25 proc / 7days NOT A GOOD IDEA... so that's why i'm more cautious this time !

Sh x

[Guest [ch...]]

Oh, typo in my last message, I meant to say I'm cutting to 4.5mg Valium tonight (not .45!) (still thinking in Ativan units since that's what I crossed from!)

[[...]]

Hello BBs friends!  Can I use just water to titare my Diazepam  tablet,  coz Im planning to go to Daily Microtaper. I couldnt bear to use vodka or milk to titrate coz I have stomach ulcer.

Im stuck on 3mg D due to s/x

 

was cutting.5 every 7days the second cut hits me to stuck at 3mg.

 

Next cut i will try liquid titration using my diazepam tablet and try to reduce 4ml everyday that takes 25 day to reduce 1ML OF dIAZEPAM

 

THANKS. MCM

 

 

[[bu...]]

Hello BBs friends!  Can I use just water to titare my Diazepam  tablet,  coz Im planning to go to Daily Microtaper. I couldnt bear to use vodka or milk to titrate coz I have stomach ulcer.

Im stuck on 3mg D due to s/x

 

was cutting.5 every 7days the second cut hits me to stuck at 3mg.

 

Next cut i will try liquid titration using my diazepam tablet and try to reduce 4ml everyday that takes 25 day to reduce 1ML OF dIAZEPAM

 

THANKS. MCM

 

Some folks have used water successfully, but most cannot.  It is a fact of physical chemistry that valium is NOT water soluble, or at best, poorly soluble.

 

Milk will not irritate you ulcer...its often recommended as a home remedy for ulcers.

 

You would never need more the 2ml vodka (.8ml) alcohol.  Your tummy will never even know that tiny amount is even there. 

 

The other option is propylene glycol.

 

Or you can just stay on your benzo.