Need some help to start liquid tapering Valium 4 mg

[[Sh...]]

Yes, that's exactly my plan. Thanks for your reply!

 

I think going out for a bike ride or walk would be helpful for me too... if it weren't so *cold* here!!!

Can I come out to California and stay with you for a while? <kidding>

 

Hope things continue to go well for you.

 

Love,

 

Chessplayer

 

Huhu don't think you'll be to happy in Belgium... it's also freezing here... but when it's dry and the sun shines i'm outside... the head also needs some 'happiness'. I even went walking in the rain ! 

[Guest [ch...]]

Oh right, it's Belgium. Yeah, cold there too.

 

I'm thinking of heading down to Jamaica for a while. That might help...

[[Sh...]]

Spare me a hammock when you're there ! 

[Guest [ch...]]

Absolutely. I am heading down March 13. I have a place to stay, free! You are welcome to join me.

 

[[...]]

Hi Sh, you said your taking melatonin for sleep aid, what mg you're taking and how many days before it works, is it help for you to get to sleep?  I have my prescription here as well but had'nt try it yet coz im not sure if it works for me. My Doc says I need to take .5mg an hour before going to sleep and probably I need to start taking for about 10 days before it start working. is this true. In your own opinion.  or anyone had taken it if it helps, i could start my melatonin too.

 

how long can we take just in case its addicted or not? im not sure too.

 

mcm

[[Sh...]]

Hey M,

 

I used it for about a week 2 mg one hour before i went to sleep... but didn't wanna make a habbit of it ... so I stopped after a week... wanted to fall asleep by myself... only when there are days and days of no sleep I will take one and see what happens... otherwise i'm counting on the air outside and some mild sports to find my sleep and some same rituals at night. Nothing heavy just chill some music, hot bath, some yoga, watching tv ... Don't want to take anything for sleeping anymore when it's not necessary... i'm counting on my evening habits to find my sleep. Like i said some bodyrelaxing exercises in my bed helps to.

Today felt really headachy and some nausea when i got up... had a busy day yesterdag and I think i feel this today ! The headache went away after a morning walk.. but the nausea 's still here. Though went through with my first cut. 18 days of 4 mg is enough so hoping this goes well on 3.98 today.

Wish me luck !

Sh x

[[...]]

Thanks Sh, me too im trying to sleep without anything but the 2mg at night can still affect me but light only, i woke up after 2 hrs and couldn't go back to sleep again or else very light sleep. dont know what to do anymore, i dont have nausea at the moment but ihave like pressure in my head all the time and tinitus etc. i have nervousness as well, but i think this is all withrawal symptoms so Im trying to ignore, Dont know if anyone experience the same, excessive hairfall and many more.  I might try my melatonin if needed.  hope will get better soon.

 

thnks for all the people who's posting and never get tiredof helping in this forum.

MCM

[[Sh...]]

Today 2nd day of part pill part liquid : from 4 mg to 3.96 mg in 2 days... before 4 days of 4mg in pill & liquid and 14 days just pills of 4 mg. Friday day 4 of pill and liquid had a really great day... then started the daily taper... I slept okay for 2 days but lots of nausea... is this normal... ? It can't be of going to fast since I'm going .02 mg/day... is this getting used to the liquid or am i going to fast (before with pills less problem) or do i just have a few bad days ? Should I go on at 3.94 tonight or should i hold already though i'm just started... Thanks already  ! Grtz Sh x

[[...]]

Today 2nd day of part pill part liquid : from 4 mg to 3.96 mg in 2 days... before 4 days of 4mg in pill & liquid and 14 days just pills of 4 mg. Friday day 4 of pill and liquid had a really great day... then started the daily taper... I slept okay for 2 days but lots of nausea... is this normal... ? It can't be of going to fast since I'm going .02 mg/day... is this getting used to the liquid or am i going to fast (before with pills less problem) or do i just have a few bad days ? Should I go on at 3.94 tonight or should i hold already though i'm just started... Thanks already  ! Grtz Sh x

 

If symptoms are increasing you are going too fast, but one day is usually not enough to make that determination.  FWIW, I would not have begun at .02mg/day.  I probably would have chosen .015mg/day at your dose, as a starting point.

[[Sh...]]

Yes  ut before i took 0.5 of.. came fro. 4.5 to 4.. had symptoms but reasonbly mild... thiz afternoon the nausea is gone.. but los of otber buddies ld me that at this point .02 isn t that bigh to ztart from and that i still could change after 3 or wben things get tough.  It s still  like Ashton 5 proc in 1p days or .maybe more. .. So wbat do i do go to 3.94 and see how tomorrow goes ? I hoped a daily taper would calm me down more but now i m getting affraid.

[[...]]

I tried to reduce 2.5ml a day and see after 2 weeks If I can handle it, for now I'm on the 4th day of taking liquid Diazepam oral solution for MT, and tablet at my evening dose. Still the same symptoms I think it's to early for me to comment. I'm just hoping this daily MT will work better than Cut and hold. We need to admit that while on tapering we need to suffer but we'll try to reduce the symptoms by finding out what way we taper that suits us.  And by that I want to give a credit to all the people who's helping us in this forum base in their experience.  Dazpam, Builder and everyone there.  Thank you for all your help and advise.  Mcm

[[Mo...]]

Yes  ut before i took 0.5 of.. came fro. 4.5 to 4.. had symptoms but reasonbly mild... thiz afternoon the nausea is gone.. but los of otber buddies ld me that at this point .02 isn t that bigh to ztart from and that i still could change after 3 or wben things get tough.  It s still  like Ashton 5 proc in 1p days or .maybe more. .. So wbat do i do go to 3.94 and see how tomorrow goes ? I hoped a daily taper would calm me down more but now i m getting affraid.

 

I agree with SG that one day is probably too soon to feel a cut, even if it was too big.

You might be feeling the transition to liquid , over the cut, is what i am guessing.

This issue has been discussed many times on the boards: that transferring to liquid can be felt as a small cut by some people.

I know it has been argued that it ,theoretically , makes no sense. As the amount of drug is the same. But also that the liquid can likely have a different absorption rate OR that we just worry too much about it and anticipate problems.

I myself did feel it. And i am not alone in it. We feel what we feel, for whatever reason.

 

If you are doubting it, you can just skip your cut today and then go to 94 tomorrow. And take your 96 today.

Do you shake/ swirl well?

 

 

[[Sh...]]

Thanks sweetie,

 

I think i'm doing things right.. making my 100 ml fat milk... put my 1 ml Diazep in another bowl put some milk over it.. it's already a capsule so the powder is already there. i swearl it a bit and put it in my other can.. again some milk over, a few times till there's nothing left. Then I leave it standing for about 10 minutes,  swirl with a wooden spoon back and front... wait for the bubbles to go out and then with a 10 ml... i pull out 2 ml so that i 've got 98. Then i put it in my fridge till morning... take my 2 mg pill and half of a 2 (1) still swirl it a little bit and then drink it. I still put some water afterwards in it to make sure i've had everything.

Maybe i'm worrying to much but i never had a nausea day the whole day like yesterday.. mostly morning but would pass after breakfast.. this afternoon the nausea is gone, went for a little walk... just a little bit of pain under my chest but that i can stand.

Maybe it's a good idea to stay here for one day.. still not going to tell my husband though.. cauz he already thinks i'm going so slow.

Thanks sweety for helping my out ! Talk to ya laterz !

Sh x

[[Mo...]]

Thanks sweetie,

 

I think i'm doing things right.. making my 100 ml fat milk... put my 1 ml Diazep in another bowl put some milk over it.. it's already a capsule so the powder is already there. i swearl it a bit and put it in my other can.. again some milk over, a few times till there's nothing left. Then I leave it standing for about 10 minutes,  swirl with a wooden spoon back and front... wait for the bubbles to go out and then with a 10 ml... i pull out 2 ml so that i 've got 98. Then i put it in my fridge till morning... take my 2 mg pill and half of a 2 (1) still swirl it a little bit and then drink it. I still put some water afterwards in it to make sure i've had everything.

Maybe i'm worrying to much but i never had a nausea day the whole day like yesterday.. mostly morning but would pass after breakfast.. this afternoon the nausea is gone, went for a little walk... just a little bit of pain under my chest but that i can stand.

Maybe it's a good idea to stay here for one day.. still not going to tell my husband though.. cauz he already thinks i'm going so slow.

Thanks sweety for helping my out ! Talk to ya laterz !

Sh x

 

Yes, people who never have done this do not realize the enormous pressure they put on us when they say we go too slow. They just cant know... And it is your body and you know whatbyou can handle.

It is difficult when our loved ones cant help us with this, isnt it?

 

So, did i read correctly that you stirr and switl it and then wait a while for some bubbles to settle?

Because your liquid isnt a true solution. You will probably have to draw out your dose right after stirring or it may settle again.

I am curious as how others do this with their milk.

 

As has been said many times before: consistency is probably more important than accuracy.

At the end of your 100ml, you still have cut 1 mgr. and you can try to make it as accurate as is possible, of course but again, i dont think you are feeling a cut of 0.02 in a day...

 

Nausea is very common, it happens to me on and off. And some days i just ate banans and grapes and then some more when i felt it settle a littlr bit at night. This can " just" come and go. It is such an icky feeling.

 

What i would do is make some sort of schedule/ spreadsheet and write down each day what i have cut. Sometimes we just...forget If we cut and where we are at. And on top of that, you will see your dose go down on paper, which was a good boost for me.

 

 

Try to not panic over it. Easier said than done. Perhaps things just need to settle a bit more.

[[bu...]]

 

 

Yes, people who never have done this do not realize the enormous pressure they put on us when they say we go too slow. They just cant know... And it is your body and you know whatbyou can handle.

It is difficult when our loved ones cant help us with this, isnt it?

 

So, did i read correctly that you stirr and switl it and then wait a while for some bubbles to settle?

Because your liquid isnt a true solution. You will probably have to draw out your dose right after stirring or it may settle again.

I am curious as how others do this with their milk.

As has been said many times before: consistency is probably more important than accuracy.

At the end of your 100ml, you still have cut 1 mgr. and you can try to make it as accurate as is possible, of course but again, i dont think you are feeling a cut of 0.02 in a day...

 

Nausea is very common, it happens to me on and off. And some days i just ate banans and grapes and then some more when i felt it settle a littlr bit at night. This can " just" come and go. It is such an icky feeling.

 

What i would do is make some sort of schedule/ spreadsheet and write down each day what i have cut. Sometimes we just...forget If we cut and where we are at. And on top of that, you will see your dose go down on paper, which was a good boost for me.

 

 

Try to not panic over it. Easier said than done. Perhaps things just need to settle a bit more.

  Actually diazepam mixed with milk does a form a true, uniformly distributed solution.

 

Diazepam is lipid-soluble, ("fat-soluble").  It dissolves in milk fat (or other fatty liquids), to form  solution, as differentiated  from a suspension.

[[Sh...]]

Thanks both ! My milk has 8 % fat. After i dissolved the powder in the milk I sturr.. leave it standing for 10 minutes... afterwards I sturr it again and then when most bubbles are gone I immediately take out what I don't need. Even in the morning i sturr it again and drink the last parts while putting a little bit of water in it. So that's the way to go then ?

My husband already made a spreadsheet and every day i'm putting a big line in fluo through my list.. gives me like you said the feeling I'm doing something in the right direction.

Maybe tomorrow I'll stay on my 3.96 and if i feel confident i move on to 3.94.

Thanks a lot

Sh x

[[Mo...]]

 

 

Yes, people who never have done this do not realize the enormous pressure they put on us when they say we go too slow. They just cant know... And it is your body and you know whatbyou can handle.

It is difficult when our loved ones cant help us with this, isnt it?

 

So, did i read correctly that you stirr and switl it and then wait a while for some bubbles to settle?

Because your liquid isnt a true solution. You will probably have to draw out your dose right after stirring or it may settle again.

I am curious as how others do this with their milk.

As has been said many times before: consistency is probably more important than accuracy.

At the end of your 100ml, you still have cut 1 mgr. and you can try to make it as accurate as is possible, of course but again, i dont think you are feeling a cut of 0.02 in a day...

 

Nausea is very common, it happens to me on and off. And some days i just ate banans and grapes and then some more when i felt it settle a littlr bit at night. This can " just" come and go. It is such an icky feeling.

 

What i would do is make some sort of schedule/ spreadsheet and write down each day what i have cut. Sometimes we just...forget If we cut and where we are at. And on top of that, you will see your dose go down on paper, which was a good boost for me.

 

 

Try to not panic over it. Easier said than done. Perhaps things just need to settle a bit more.

  Actually diazepam mixed with milk does a form a true, uniformly distributed solution.

 

Diazepam is lipid-soluble, ("fat-soluble").  It dissolves in milk fat (or other fatty liquids), to form  solution, as differentiated  from a suspension.

 

Huh?

Thanks for clearing that up, Builder and for catching that.

How come that when you dissolve a pill in vodka and ads water, it creates a suspension but when yiu dissolve in milk, its a solution.

I always understood that only the Roxane is a true solution.

 

Sorry, Shakemarieke.

 

Its a good thing this is on the boards.

 

[[bu...]]

 

Huh?

Thanks for clearing that up, Builder and for catching that.

How come that when you dissolve a pill in vodka and ads water, it creates a suspension but when yiu dissolve in milk, its a solution.

I always understood that only the Roxane is a true solution.

 

Sorry, Shakemarieke.

 

Its a good thing this is on the boards.

 

 

Because diazepam is soluble in alcohol, and the solution created by adding diazepam to alcohol can then be diluted with water (that's called an aqueous solution)  And it creates a true solution in full fat milk because it is lipid (fat) soluble Diazepam is also soluble in propylene glycol.  It is NOT soluble in water (or only poorly soluble in water.)

 

Roxane Oral Solution is basically diazepam dissolved in propylene glycol, and then diluted with water.  Roxane Intensol is diazepam dissolved in alcohol (and PG), the diluted with water.  Both are true, stable, uniformly distributed solutions.

[[Mo...]]

 

Huh?

Thanks for clearing that up, Builder and for catching that.

How come that when you dissolve a pill in vodka and ads water, it creates a suspension but when yiu dissolve in milk, its a solution.

I always understood that only the Roxane is a true solution.

 

Sorry, Shakemarieke.

 

Its a good thing this is on the boards.

 

 

Because diazepam is soluble in alcohol, and the solution created by adding diazepam to alcohol can then be diluted with water (that's called an aqueous solution)  And it creates a true solution in full fat milk because it is lipid (fat) soluble Diazepam is also soluble in propylene glycol.  It is NOT soluble in water (or only poorly soluble in water.)

 

Roxane Oral Solution is basically diazepam dissolved in propylene glycol, and then diluted with water.  Roxane Intensol is diazepam dissolved in alcohol (and PG), the diluted with water.  Both are true, stable, uniformly distributed solutions.

 

Thanks Builder.

 

One more question?

 

I always understood that my compounded liquid, which was valium powder only, in almond oil, was a supsension. Why is that? Doesnt the fat from the oil, dissolve the valium and then make it a suspension?

 

 

[[bu...]]

 

Huh?

Thanks for clearing that up, Builder and for catching that.

How come that when you dissolve a pill in vodka and ads water, it creates a suspension but when yiu dissolve in milk, its a solution.

I always understood that only the Roxane is a true solution.

 

Sorry, Shakemarieke.

 

Its a good thing this is on the boards.

 

 

Because diazepam is soluble in alcohol, and the solution created by adding diazepam to alcohol can then be diluted with water (that's called an aqueous solution)  And it creates a true solution in full fat milk because it is lipid (fat) soluble Diazepam is also soluble in propylene glycol.  It is NOT soluble in water (or only poorly soluble in water.)

 

Roxane Oral Solution is basically diazepam dissolved in propylene glycol, and then diluted with water.  Roxane Intensol is diazepam dissolved in alcohol (and PG), the diluted with water.  Both are true, stable, uniformly distributed solutions.

 

Thanks Builder.

 

One more question?

 

I always understood that my compounded liquid, which was valium powder only, in almond oil, was a supsension. Why is that? Doesnt the fat from the oil, dissolve the valium and then make it a suspension?

 

 

The diazepam dissolves in the almond oil, as almond oil is essentially 100% fat.  The fact that it dissolves means it goes into solution.

 

Solution means its stable and uniformly distributed.  Under normal conditions, it will not readily seperate from the solvent, it won't sink to the bottom, and it won't float to the top. 

 

Did you ever try to stir sugar into a glass of iced tea?  It won't matter how long you stir it, the sugar will continue to sink to the bottom.  The sugar is not soluble in the cold liquid.  If you really stir it vigorously, it will temporarily suspend in the tea, but it soon will collect in the bottom of glass again.

 

So here in the South, where iced tea is the national drink,  we start with a simple syrup.  We stir the sugar into boiling water, and it dissoves in the hot water.  Since the sugar is dissolved, it is now in solution.  We then mix that solution in our tea, and it remains in solution.

 

[[Ja...]]

Do you think almond milk is an ok thing to dissolve the Valium tablet in?

I am not a fan of milk and don't drink dairy.

But my almond milk has 2.5 mg of fat as opposed to 9mg of full fat milk.

Just afraid my stomach will react to the milk so I bought almond milk.

I tested it and used a crusher to crush the 1mg tab.

I couldn't handle the Roxane solution. It felt toxic to me and my body reacted negatively to it. I took it yesterday.

Just want to get this party started

Thanks

I also bought soy milk and regular milk. Am willing to try all of them and start this micro taper.

[[Mo...]]

 

Huh?

Thanks for clearing that up, Builder and for catching that.

How come that when you dissolve a pill in vodka and ads water, it creates a suspension but when yiu dissolve in milk, its a solution.

I always understood that only the Roxane is a true solution.

 

Sorry, Shakemarieke.

 

Its a good thing this is on the boards.

 

 

Because diazepam is soluble in alcohol, and the solution created by adding diazepam to alcohol can then be diluted with water (that's called an aqueous solution)  And it creates a true solution in full fat milk because it is lipid (fat) soluble Diazepam is also soluble in propylene glycol.  It is NOT soluble in water (or only poorly soluble in water.)

 

Roxane Oral Solution is basically diazepam dissolved in propylene glycol, and then diluted with water.  Roxane Intensol is diazepam dissolved in alcohol (and PG), the diluted with water.  Both are true, stable, uniformly distributed solutions.

 

Thanks Builder.

 

One more question?

 

I always understood that my compounded liquid, which was valium powder only, in almond oil, was a supsension. Why is that? Doesnt the fat from the oil, dissolve the valium and then make it a suspension?

 

 

The diazepam dissolves in the almond oil, as almond oil is essentially 100% fat.  The fact that it dissolves means it goes into solution.

 

Solution means its stable and uniformly distributed.  Under normal conditions, it will not readily seperate from the solvent, it won't sink to the bottom, and it won't float to the top. 

 

Did you ever try to stir sugar into a glass of iced tea?  It won't matter how long you stir it, the sugar will continue to sink to the bottom.  The sugar is not soluble in the cold liquid.  If you really stir it vigorously, it will temporarily suspend in the tea, but it soon will collect in the bottom of glass again.

 

So here in the South, where iced tea is the national drink,  we start with a simple syrup.  We stir the sugar into boiling water, and it dissoves in the hot water.  Since the sugar is dissolved, it is now in solution.  We then mix that solution in our tea, and it remains in solution.

 

 

AHA! 

I got it.

 

This is very helpful. Thanks for the analogy.

 

Now I want iced tea ( no sugar, though)

 

Thanks,

 

Moo

[[Sh...]]

Okay, my cylinder finally arrived today ! So I can use that one now.

Today I held on to 3.96 mg. The nausea is still there... till now I slept wel... it's just that damn nausea.. but i do eat... it's a strange kind of nausea... but it's the nausea i know since i started to get used to benzo's . What do I do now ? I  so much want to move forward and don't want to get the feeling that i'm staying at the same amount... especially when i'm still around 4 when i go lower i understand it can take some more time but didn't had much trouble before... and 02 isn't that much since it's in the 5 % range in 10-12 days.. ?

Grtz Sh x

[[...]]

Hi Sh, how are you? i hope youre doing well with your taper.

 

MCM

[[Sh...]]

Hey MCM,

 

How are you ?

I switched today to 3.84 mg... Meanwhile i'm getting the hang of the daily taper in full milk.  I still feel things but till now the're manageable... you feel the discomfort but still able to go out for a walk... yesterday I drove my daughter to dance class... that's a bit of my problem... a bit hard to go out and do things alone... a scare that is still with me since my first taper which was way to fast. But some days i feel up to it and drive ! I have good moments where it feels like i'm myself again... those aren't to long but i enjoy when they are there. I also feel that I go less... some shaky hands, some headaches, a bit of nausea, 2 days with less sleep.. but my iPod relaxation music and mindfullness helps me with that to calm down. The only thing i miss is motivation at home that i can do this... and that doesn't Always make it a easy ! But for that I find support here !

You're still at 3 ? How does it go ? Ready to start... don't be scared to switch ! You can do this !

Grz

Sh x