How do I do a liquid taper off lorazepam

[[je...]]

A part of me wants to say, that while I am still on the drug, how am I healing or getting better?  Am I just not prolonging the whole withdrawal process by getting my brain used to a lower dose...just to suffer again when I reduce again?

I don't mean to be difficult!  I just want to understand this so I can accept it as part of the process.

 

This is a very good question because I know when we realize what these drugs do, our first instinct is we just want to get off as fast as possible. You are healing by slowly letting your brain learn how to function without these drugs. Your brain is used to and dependent on a certain dose. If you yank it away you are essentially collapsing the whole foundation your brain is relying on to function on a daily basis. Think about it as a home renovation. If you make big reductions it's like demolishing the entire home and building from scratch. The home is not liveable (you cannot function). However, if you make small reductions you are renovating room by room. You can still live in the house and use it (function), you just have one or two rooms that are currently under renovation.

 

Either way you renovate you home, by completely demolishing it or do it room by room, you have the same outcome. The problem however is, if you demolish it, you cannot use it in the meantime. That's what happens if your reductions are too big, you cannot use your brain or body as the symptoms are too severe. When you slowly reduce you are still healing gradually because every time you reduce your brain now has to adapt to a lower dose. I experienced both. I made a 75% and 50% reduction and I was in benzo hell. I couldn't function at all and was in bed for days. When I then updosed and started tapering slowly I was able to resume my life to some level of benzo normality - I could attend to my family, work, look after my kids, go to their events, etc. It still wasn't easy but I preferred that over being disabled. 

[[Pa...]]

Absolutely perfect explanation jelly baby. 

[[El...]]

Thank you everyone!!  When all the "experts" speak...I guess I need to listen.

You have all certainly put the fear of God in me so I will be careful about making cuts from now on.

But I am still uncertain about stability.  Presently, I can cook meals, I can keep the house tidy (to a degree), I can do laundry and wash dishes, I can take care of my grandson when my kids need me to...  I do function.  It is just that I am nauseaus/vomiting a lot of the time, suffer frequent insomnia, I have trouble exercising because of the nausea/vomiting, and have odd aches and pains.  I just sort of push through it...reminding myself that this will someday pass.  But, I just don't see those things going away at any great rate during a taper.  But, should I wait to see if they do?

Thank you all once again.

[[je...]]

It sounds to me like you are stable. Stable doesn't mean you feel good. In fact most of the time when I was stable I was feeling miserable. I felt like I was constantly unwell, just that off feeling. Sometimes I even wondered how the hell I was going to make it through a working day. I still feel like this in recovery.  As long as you are able to able to function you are stable. It will become easier with time to understand this and distinguish your patterns. Unfortunately feeling good or normal is seldom part of our vocabulary. If you're lucky you'll have a window where you'll experience this for a brief period.  But eventually normality and feeling good will return once we've recovered.

[[El...]]

I saw the doctor today.  He wants me to cut .25 mg every two weeks from now until the end!  He said that I was over the worst of withdrawal and the rest would be smooth sailing!  He perscribed me enough Ativan so that I should be at 1.25 mg when I see him again in four weeks.  Then he will reduce me again to .75 mg the next month....then .25 mg the next month...then jump the next month. Isn't that way too fast?  I tried to tell him that from what I have read, the end is the hardest and I am risking my health by going too fast.  I want to listen to my body....should I again start looking for a new provider?

[[to...]]

I saw the doctor today.  He wants me to cut .25 mg every two weeks from now until the end!  He said that I was over the worst of withdrawal and the rest would be smooth sailing!  He perscribed me enough Ativan so that I should be at 1.25 mg when I see him again in four weeks.  Then he will reduce me again to .75 mg the next month....then .25 mg the next month...then jump the next month. Isn't that way too fast?  I tried to tell him that from what I have read, the end is the hardest and I am risking my health by going too fast.  I want to listen to my body....should I again start looking for a new provider?

 

Wow - you are correct, that is WAY too fast.  Each cut would be getting higher and higher percentage wise, 1.75 to 1.50 is 14% cut and the next one would be 1.5 to 1.25 which is a 16.66% cut, they keep getting higher from there.  It is recommended to only cut 5-10% every 7-14 days and that is only if you are doing ok with the cuts.  This doctor does not understand how this works.  It is apparent that he does not understand benzo's since he switched you from xanax to Ativan and it appears that he increased the dose.  There is nothing smooth about the schedule he wants you to go by.  I just had a new doctor want me to get off xanax by changing me to clonazepam and get off in 12-16 weeks and then saw his notes that said 7 weeks.  NO WAY!  I will stick to xanax as it is the devil I know.

 

You are doing the right thing by questioning the doctor and understanding that listening to your body is the right thing to do.  If this doctor will not let you go at a safe taper speed, if it were me, I would 100% find another doctor.

 

I have a psychiatric nurse practitioner who prescribes my medication and let me go at my own pace with my taper.  (Doctor tried to take over and I said NO)    This might be a better way for you to go. 

 

This is a website where you can locate one near you if you want to look into that. 

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/psychiatrists?search=Psychiatric%20Nurse%20Practitioner  you can put in your zip code and find someone near you

 

I am glad you are looking out for yourself! 

 

Take care and good luck to you!

[[je...]]

I agree with tolnbltp. These proposed cuts are very big and fast. It would probably be better if you could get someone else to prescribe. I'm sorry.

[[El...]]

I am now on 2 waiting lists for doctors or PA's that seem to support a reasonable taper.  Meanwhile, I am going to proceed as I feel I can...with the hope that my present provider will support me until I can switch.  Thanks for your input!

As you can see from my profile, I am dosing 7 times per day.  I am currently tapering 1 dose of 0.125 mg down to 0 mg which will take me to 6 times per day dosing.  I am finding this very difficult.  Has anyone else had a problem eliminating a "small" dose (as compared to the overall amount of ativan that I am taking) without awful withdrawal symptoms?

[[je...]]

Gosh, seven doses is a lot. It might be worth it to consider a cross over to Valium if your interdose withdrawal is that bad.

[[...]]

I am speaking from the heart here.

 

I want you to consider something.

 

I have been on this forum for 5 years and I never met anyone doing 7 doses a day.  I think you doing 7 doses per day is a key indicator that you are suffering from anxiety or OCD.  I am not a doctor but I want you to know, once I started treating my intense anxiety with an SSRI, I realize the benzo was just a terrible bandaid/mistake.  My core problem was I needed an SSRI.

 

That said, I want you to know, the first 4 weeks taking an SSRI (Citalopram) actually made my anxiety worse.  That is how they work.  Around week 6 it starts to treat the anxiety and I am seeing it now.  IT IS WORKING. 

 

Have you ever considered an SSRI?

[[El...]]

I appreciate what your are saying and I thank you.  But, yes, I was on one for several years as recommended by my doctor.  Really did not notice that they made a difference during that time and the doctor and I agreed that I stop them.  I had no trouble stopping them...no anxiety, insomnia, etc.

The reason I take 7 doses is because if I take anything more than 0.375 mg of ativan at a time I end up vomiting profusely and am continually nauseaus.  Even 0.375 mg is pushing it...often I have extended periods of dry heaves at that dose.  The medication just makes me very sick when taken in large amounts.  I have lost about 25 pounds since starting ativan because of the vomiting.  I never had a vomiting problem when on xanax.  It just seems to work better for me to have smaller doses, but that means I have to have more dosages to get to the needed amount as I taper (unless I taper a lot faster, which I don't think is a good idea!).  I hope that makes sense.

I really do not want to switch to a different benzo.  I am having reasonably good luck tapering ativan.  I just don't want to introduce a new element (I would actually have preferred to stay on xanax...but new doctor would not allow or perscribe it).

With my tapering of this 0.125 mg dose, I am experiencing severe headaches and my insomnia has re-emerged with a vengeance..  that was what I was wondering about.

Thank you all for caring enough to reply!

[[je...]]

Thanks for clarifying that EllieM. If it's not interdose withdrawal then there's no need to consider crossing over.

 

You might want to post your question to Withdrawal Support (during your taper) as I think you’ll get more eyes and replies there. I only dosed once a day so have no experience with it.

[[El...]]

Can I ask a silly question?  How did you weigh out such small quantities in your taper?  Unless you buy a scientific scale, most scales I have found only go to 0.001 grams.  So, how do you weigh in mg?

[[El...]]

I should add, how did you weigh with such accuracy on a gram scale?

[[je...]]

Most jewelers scales can weigh in mg. You just need to change their weight setting.

[[Bo...]]

Ellie, it’s ok for it to be .001g….. you just start from what 1tabket weighs in grams and work your percentage reductions from that.

 

Example, my .5mg Klonopin tablet was .168g….I reduced .001g every day for awhile and then started reducing .001g every 2-4 days as I got lower and was trying to stay at 10% drop over a month of current dose.

 

Once I got to .18mg I changed over to compound liquid for more accuracy, but the gram scales can be helpful for most to go all the way form, just can be tedious and hard even tablets are tiny (some people add microcrystalline filler to homemade capsules with their crushed benzo powder but you’d have to ask here for more details in separate thread if you want to consider that route.

 

Compound liquid helped me and def was a nice change not having to shave and weigh…. But need a reputable compounder (PCAB and PCCA), and it’s pricier than tablet option.

 

Wishing you well on your taper journey.

[[El...]]

Thanks for your clarification!  For some silly reason I was assuming a .5 mg pill would weight .5 mg.  Now I understand it is .5 mg of medication and the rest fillers.

Did you have a problem switching to the compounded liquid?  I reduced a .125 mg dose recently to go from 1.75 mg to 1.625 mg using a liquid lititation.  I was quite ill during the entire time.  I seem to be sensitive to a liquid (water) suspension vs the pill form.  Is a compounded version easier to transion to?

Thanks for your help.  I guess I need to order myself a scale!

[[je...]]

Ellie, it’s ok for it to be .001g….. you just start from what 1tabket weighs in grams and work your percentage reductions from that.

 

Example, my .5mg Klonopin tablet was .168g….I reduced .001g every day for awhile and then started reducing .001g every 2-4 days as I got lower and was trying to stay at 10% drop over a month of current dose.

 

Once I got to .18mg I changed over to compound liquid for more accuracy, but the gram scales can be helpful for most to go all the way form, just can be tedious and hard even tablets are tiny (some people add microcrystalline filler to homemade capsules with their crushed benzo powder but you’d have to ask here for more details in separate thread if you want to consider that route.

 

Compound liquid helped me and def was a nice change not having to shave and weigh…. But need a reputable compounder (PCAB and PCCA), and it’s pricier than tablet option.

 

Wishing you well on your taper journey.

 

Thanks for helping out Boges. I clearly had a brain fart there!