Restarting Generic Klonopin taper

[[se...]]

Appreciate all the feedback. This is really a wonderful supporting forum. Today at .068 mg and morning was rough. Symptoms tapering a bit. Not sure if cortisol, or I still question the impact of taking the remeron for sleep and its effect. Sleep has been good.

 

Couple of tweaks I am going to make. Will agitate the liquid instead of stirring. Basically, moving the stirring rod back/forth and side to side several times.

 

When I make a batch I put the tablet in a drop or 2 of water to start the breakdown process and then add the milk and agitate. Wonder if I should tweak this process?

 

My liquid dose today is 13.4 ml. I pull one 10 ml of liquid and consume and I had been pulling another 10 ml and then pressing the plunger down to 3 ml. Not sure why with approach. Possibly losing some medication via residue on the syringe. So now will just pull 3ml straight.

 

I also use a 1 ml syringe to get my increment amount. The 1 ml syringe has been a pain because I have challenges getting an air bubble out.

 

Still refining my approach.

 

seeking.

[[Li...]]

I’m glad your symptoms are easing a bit, seekingtoheal.  That’s an encouraging sign.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would continue to “jump start” the tablet dispersion process by adding a known-quantity of water to the tablet(s) before you add the milk.  (Back in the days when I was experimenting with homebrew liquids made with 80 and 151 proof vodka and water, I observed an interesting phenomenon — the higher the water content in the vodka, the more quickly/thoroughly the tablets dispersed.)

 

The Withdrawal Project has tips for dealing with air bubbles at:

 

https://withdrawal.theinnercompass.org/taper/using-syringes

(Scroll down the page to the “Additional Layperson tips for using syringes” section.)

 

PS Thank you again for continuing to document your discontinuation journey so we all may learn from your experience.

 

 

[[je...]]

I get rid of air bubbles in my 1ml syringe this way:

 

I draw more liquid than my required dose. Then I tap the syringe with my fingers to move the air bubbles to the top. I then push the excess liquid and air bubbles out the syringe until I get to my required dose.

[[sl...]]

I get rid of air bubbles in my 1ml syringe this way:

 

I draw more liquid than my required dose. Then I tap the syringe with my fingers to move the air bubbles to the top. I then push the excess liquid and air bubbles out the syringe until I get to my required dose.

 

Are you using a syringe adapter Jelly Baby? I can't see this technique working without one.

 

I think buddies who don't have a syringe adapter, such as when making a mixing a milk suspension in an open jar, would need to draw excess liquid into their syringe and then turn the syringe tip-up and gently tap the cylinder and push the plunger to squeeze the bubble out of the tip (it could be messy and a paper towel might help); then return the syringe over their volume of liquid and dispense any excess liquid until the plunger is at their desired dosage amount.

 

Syringe adapters are the bees-knees, btw. 

[[je...]]

No I don't. I started this process without an adapter three months ago and seem to manage without any mess or fuss. I can appreciate that it has its benefits though.

[[sl...]]

No I don't. I started this process without an adapter three months ago and seem to manage without any mess or fuss. I can appreciate that it has its benefits though.

 

Thanks for clarifying. I'm truly impressed.

 

When you "tap the syringe to move the air bubbles to the top", is this with the syringe tip-up?

When you push "excess liquid and air bubbles out the syringe", is this over your medicine bottle?

[[je...]]

No I don't. I started this process without an adapter three months ago and seem to manage without any mess or fuss. I can appreciate that it has its benefits though.

 

Thanks for clarifying. I'm truly impressed.

 

When you "tap the syringe to move the air bubbles to the top", is this with the syringe tip-up?

When you push "excess liquid and air bubbles out the syringe", is this over your medicine bottle?

 

It's actually quite easy tapering without the adaptor cap and not as complicated as you think. I just draw up the liquid from the bottle and wipe off the small amount of excess liquid on the outside of the syringe. Then I point the tip upwards, tap the air bubbles to the tip, and push the rest of the liquid back into the bottle.

 

I just assumed most people are doing the same because it is so easy.

[[sl...]]

Thanks Jelly Baby; now I'll have to try this... 

[[En...]]

I worked in healthcare so I've drawn and prepared a wide variety of meds over the years, but it was generally a needle penetrating a self-sealing vial top and then injecting into an IV or self sealing port on some sort of IV bag.  For home use, I can't say enough about these syringe adapters that slownsteady suggested.  I switched a while back from vodka to OraPlus/OraSweet (because too much of the vodka was finding it's way into V-8 juice with seasoning and celery added  :laugh:)  As my dose is getting lower, I feel way more confident now that I am actually getting the dosage that I want.

[[se...]]

Good day all. Wishing all well.

 

Couple updates on feedback, my approach, and symptoms as it goes now.

 

First it has gotten harder for me to keep dropping 0.001 mg a day. In the last 25 days on 3 separate instances I have mantained dose for several days each time.

 

The drug will be fighting me all the way but I have come this far and see the end in sight and will keep going.

 

Today I will be at 0.062 mg. I am targeting a January completion hopefully. Jelly Baby's suggestion for removing air bubbles works to perfection, thank you.

 

With the milk liquid approach my base liquid is 100 ml. When I started liquid titration at my dosage amount at that time the consumption amount was 24ml. I decided on a 3-day rotation cycle because very little was left in the jar after 3 days. I am going to switch to 4 days because there is still a little over 50 ml left in the jar after 3 days. (for example today I take 12.2 ml)  I also have 40+ pills left so should have plenty but will try a 4-day rotation and see how it goes.

 

Symptoms wise include aches, CNS really amp'd up, burning/tingling over body, my tinnitus in my right ear which started me down this path now I have in both, but the sounds are different. I can only hope it will calm down as I continue to heal.

 

Sleep remains good with the nightly klonopin dosage + 7.5 mg remeron + 10 mg fast dissolve melatonin + 20 mg slow dissolve melatonin. In no way would I recommend this and wish I never started the remeron but it has helped. But considering at one time I was taking most of this (minus remeron) with either ambien or lunesta I will take it.

 

My goals are to phase out klonopin, give some time for continued recovery and work on phasing out the remeron and lowering the dose of melatonin. I do not take any other drugs and only over the counter allegra, a nasal sprary (non-steroid) and a multivitamin.

 

As a bit of 2021 reflection I feel like I have been digging myself out of this hole for 2021 but am trying to celebrate my progress (kudo's to all buddies as I celebrate you as well) and know that I have come this far and know the finish line is not when I am done but ever so closer as I keep going).

 

I appreciate all that have provided feedback, suggestions, and content that I have read that has helped me along the way. I hope this thread helps someone someday, not for just my experience, but for the great dialouge and feedback others have provided on this thread.

 

For those of you who read this I appreciate your time and understand with differences what you are dealing with and going through. I am not checking out from the forum just taking a bit of time to reflect back.

 

thx.

 

Seeking

 

[[sl...]]

Thanks for the update Seeking!

 

Wow that's a lot of melatonin. I love your flexible but prioritized plan for moving forward. Congrats on all your progress. We'll be here for you; thanks for being here for us. 

[[se...]]

Thanks slow, appreciate that.

 

To all, I can attest at least from my perspective the lower I have gotten the harder it is getting and the numbers I am tracking support that. My dose yesterday was 0.060 mg.

 

I have been dropping 0.001 mg a day which equates to a 2 ml liquid drop for me every day. When I calculate the daily percentage drop I am in the 1.6% to 1.7% reduction amount range. So a little over 10 days that would be a 16.5% drop which is a rapid pace.

 

My dilemma is suffer and push on at this pace or instead of doing a 2 ml daily drop change to a 1 ml daily drop which would put me dropping around 0.8% a day or around 8% every 10 days with where I am at dosage wise. Slowing down means getting off this drug will take longer.

 

My dosage right now is 12 ml. The end seems so close but so yet far away.

 

seeking

[[se...]]

12/13/21 Status Update

 

Hi all. I wish to all my thoughts on this tough journey we all have.

 

I am really struggling. I have held some and have not been able to drop much. Today according to my chart I am at .0585 mg of klonopin. Every little change affects me and holding does not seem to help.

 

I am questioning the consistency of the milk titration approach I am doing. My method is to withdraw the amount I need to consume based on a schedule. I use a 8 oz canning jar, glass stirring rod, and a 10 ml syringe and a 1 ml syringe. Every evening I take out the jar and use the rod to agitate my suspention to try to distribute the drug. I then w/d carefully and ensure no bubbles and I try to stay consistent but really do not know how much I am consuming. I was trying to do .001 mg a day but have switched to .0005 mg a day now.

 

I am wondering should I just try to stop at this dose, try to make a solution with propylene gycol instead.

 

appreciate any feedback.

 

thx  seeking.

[[ca...]]

I'm sorry you are struggling 

[[se...]]

Thank you casper. As all know this is so very hard.

 

12/25/21 status:

 

Today I plan to drop again to 0.053 mg. I find myself watching the percentage cuts likely more often than I should. I have spent the last two weeks holding dosage more than dropping which is discouraging to me, but I continue to press forward. I know this process is not linear.

 

My crux is part of me is telling me just stop at this dosage and hope I do not get slammed with heavier withdrawal symptoms and move forward. The other part of me is scared that I will get hit with heavier withdrawal symptoms and relapse. This is a decision I have yet to make

 

My symptoms mainly and it is hard to predict a cycle are burning/tingling throughout my body and basically feels like my head is going haywire. I definitely believe that when my symptoms are in high gear my tinnitus is much louder.

 

In a way I feel like I have had somewhat of a relapse. On about 4 or 5 different occasions over the past week or so and a half I took a lunesta sleep pill to help me sleep. I knew better. Most of the occasions it was 1.5 mg but on a couple of different occasions it was a full 3 mg pill. I never did it on successive nights but no that is a path I should not go down.

 

Wishing all a happy time of year and a brighter new year.

 

seeking.

[[sl...]]

Hi seekingtoheal,

Maybe discard the drugs in your house that you don't want to take (assuming they're yours)?

 

You know my opinion about taking time when tapering; if your sense is to hold a little longer and all it's going to cost you is time, I think that's worth listening to.

[[se...]]

Thanks Slow, always appreciate your insight and feedback.

[[se...]]

End of year update

 

Hello all. Happy early New year.

 

I thought I would post a year end status update as I have been tapering for a year. I have made progress to get off this drug and I think the liquid milk titration has helped me taper since I got to 0.121 mg.

 

But I think I hit a wall at 0.075 mg on 11/9/21. I have had to hold at dosage several days and my target daily drop dosage of 0.001 mg I have at times had to lower that to 0.0005 mg a day.

 

I know you have to follow your symptoms and everyone is different. My symptoms remain the same, amp'd up nervous system and at times feel like my head is going haywire. Looking at the daily drop percentage for a 0.001 mg cut at my dose it is around 2% so if I look at the data trying to drop 0.001 mg at this dose way exceeds the percentage recommendations.

 

I am still questioning my taper approach. I try to be consistent in my approach but feel every minute cut. It makes me wonder is it just I am sensitive or my tapering approach.

 

Part of me still thinks about switching to Propylene Glycol (no alcohol) as I understand it will generate more of a solution versus a suspension but the other part of me wonders switching at this point to another liquid type will bring its own sort of challenges. The disadvantage of the milk approach for me is I cannot see the drug particles so even though I shake/agitate/stir vigorously I really do not know how much I am consuming.

 

Well wishes to all.

 

seeking.

 

 

[[Li...]]

Greetings, seekingtoheal.  If you do decide to make a homebrew clonazepam liquid with regular tablets and propylene glycol, please be advised there are unresolved issues regarding the ‘recipe’ you may have read about here on the forum.

 

Fyi, the professionally formulated, commercially manufactured oral clonazepam solution (aka Rivotril drops/liquid) available in several countries (but, regrettably, not the US) includes the following ingredients: pure clonazepam powder, propylene glycol, glacial acetic acid, saccharin sodium, peach flavor, and brilliant blue FCF.

 

Source:

Rivotril 2.5mg/mL Oral Solution (manufactured by Roche)

https://www.nps.org.au/medicine-finder/rivotril-tablets

[[se...]]

Thanks. I was thinking about doing 100 ml as I am doing with milk.

 

Basically about 1 ml of PG to dissolve the teva klonopin tablet and adding 99ml of distilled water.  As I understand PG gets me towards more of a solution versus a suspension.

[[se...]]

Hello all and Happy New Year.

 

It is time for me to make a revision to my liquid approach. I feel like I have hit a wall. My approach was using 1 0.5 mg klonopin tablet with 100 ml of whole milk and either dropping 0.001 mg or 0.0005 mg a day. According to my schedule I am at 0.051 mg but I really question what dosage I am at. I could be at more or less.

 

My thoughts as to possibly why:

 

1. I question the solubility of the pill in milk. I understand it is more a suspension based approach. I use a touch of water to start the break down and then add milk..everything seems to dissolve but unsure. I know it works for many and worked for me awhile but I may be more sensitive.

 

2. By doing 1 0.5 mg pill to 100 ml of milk I was doing a concentration of 0.005 mg/ml which is 20x less that the generally noted 0.1 mg/ml.

 

3. I use an 8 oz jar for my batch. When I shake or agitate I really do not know how distributed the drug is getting before I consume. I try to be consistent but really do not know.

 

My revised plan

 

Anyone please poke holes into it...would be much appreciated.

 

1. I am switching to propylene glycol to try to create more of a solution.

2. I am revising my concentration. I plan to make a batch using 2 0.5 mg tablets and 10 ml of PG/water (2 ml of PG/8 ml of water). This will give me the 0.1 mg/ml concentration.

 

My Plan:

 

Measure out 2 ml of PG and 8 oz of distilled water and put into a 30 ml glass jar with 2 0.5 mg klonopin tablets to dissolve. Then I will taper down using a revised schedule.

 

thanks,

 

seeking

 

 

[[se...]]

Hello all. My PG experiment lasted one day. I tried on two different occasions to dissolve a teva 0.5 mg table in food/pharma grade that I bought. On both occasions I waited several minutes and the tablet barely started dissolving, whereas in water in a few minutes the tablet was completely dissolved.

 

So I went back to whole milk. I decided to drop from 0.050 mg to 0.045 mg as I had been constant for awhile. I need to stop looking at drop percentages and track via my symptoms.

 

My symptoms remain constant. My nervous system is most impacted with a slight burning/tingling over my body and my right ear tinnitus seems like in my whole head and sometimes my head feels like it is haywire. Not sure what normal feels like anymore.

 

The last month for me has been frustrating. I have only dropped from 0.058 mg to today at 0.043 mg. At least I am still heading in right direction but progress has been slow.

 

Sleep has been ok. I have been constant on the 7.5 remeron and the 20 mg slow dissolve melatonin and the 10 mg fast dissolve melatonin. At least most of the time 6+ hours of sleep. Too much melatonin but one thing at a time. I did on a couple of occasions take against my better judgement a lunesta but never consistent and only did on 3-4 occasion and not lately.

 

My viewpoint right now is that I will not taper all the way down. My goal is 0.025 mg and then plan to jump I hope. Seems so close. I am at 8.6 ml of liquid and my calculations put 0.025 right at 5 ml. Seems so close but yet so far away.

 

I hope my feedback and experiences may one day help others.

 

thx to all who provide support from the site admins, moderators, and all of the buddies.

 

seeking.

[[Li...]]

Hello, seekingtoheal.  Thank you for keeping us posted on your taper.  Your feedback and experiences will indeed help others.

 

The last month for me has been frustrating. I have only dropped from 0.058 mg to today at 0.043 mg.

 

That would be a 25%+ decrease over approx. 30 days.  Is it possible this taper rate is faster than your CNS can comfortably handle? 

[[Pa...]]

I'm sorry to hear you're not doing well but we very much appreciate you documenting your journey, its unfortunate that you're the subject of this cruel experiment.

[[se...]]

Thanks Libertas. I have no doubt you are right. I am at the point where frustration sets in. I feel like I am relatively close to being able to jump but it seems like I have hit a snail's pace and I have been pushing.

 

Pamster thank you for the feedback. Yes it is. I know others have it easier and others have it more difficult. So want to be done.

 

thx

 

seeking