Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[ed...]]

Wow I don't even know what PG is and other short forms even mean. 

  PG = propylene glycol, a very widely used food/pharmaceutical solvent/ingredient.  Available at major pharmacies, specialty food stores, or Amazon.

Hey builder. My idiot pharmacist told me that Valium will dissolve in water and I could titrate it that way. I disagreed and told him I wanted to make a solution and asked about PG. He said PG probably wouldn't work but every question I asked, he had to run to his computer to look up the answer. I just want to make sure PG will work as I'm looking at starting liquid titration and already have the PG. thoughts?

 

Well, it works for Roxane Labs,  the US's largest manufacturer of liquid V!

 

Yes, it absolutely works, even for home-made liquid V.

 

Maybe your pharmacist should consult this manual that pharmacists use to mix liquid meds:

 

"Diazepam has a solubility in water of 0.05mg per mL; 41mg per mL in 95% ethanol and 17mg per mL in propylene glycol.  In aqueous solution diazepam is relatively stable at pH 4 - 8 with maximum stability at about pH 5.1,2  Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

 

http://www.pharminfotech.co.nz/manual/Formulation/mixtures/diazepam.html

 

Does this mean that 1mg of Diaz WILL turn into a solution with 20ml of water (1 / .05mg)?

[[Va...]]

Wow I don't even know what PG is and other short forms even mean. 

  PG = propylene glycol, a very widely used food/pharmaceutical solvent/ingredient.  Available at major pharmacies, specialty food stores, or Amazon.

Hey builder. My idiot pharmacist told me that Valium will dissolve in water and I could titrate it that way. I disagreed and told him I wanted to make a solution and asked about PG. He said PG probably wouldn't work but every question I asked, he had to run to his computer to look up the answer. I just want to make sure PG will work as I'm looking at starting liquid titration and already have the PG. thoughts?

 

Well, it works for Roxane Labs,  the US's largest manufacturer of liquid V!

 

Yes, it absolutely works, even for home-made liquid V.

 

Maybe your pharmacist should consult this manual that pharmacists use to mix liquid meds:

 

"Diazepam has a solubility in water of 0.05mg per mL; 41mg per mL in 95% ethanol and 17mg per mL in propylene glycol.  In aqueous solution diazepam is relatively stable at pH 4 - 8 with maximum stability at about pH 5.1,2  Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

 

http://www.pharminfotech.co.nz/manual/Formulation/mixtures/diazepam.html

 

Does this mean that 1mg of Diaz WILL turn into a solution with 20ml of water (1 / .05mg)?

 

That's the way I understand it. I plan on dissolving 2mg in 2ml of PG and adding 18ml of water. If I'm wrong on this, hopefully someone will correct me.

[[bu...]]

 

 

Well, it works for Roxane Labs,  the US's largest manufacturer of liquid V!

 

Yes, it absolutely works, even for home-made liquid V.

 

Maybe your pharmacist should consult this manual that pharmacists use to mix liquid meds:

 

"Diazepam has a solubility in water of 0.05mg per mL; 41mg per mL in 95% ethanol and 17mg per mL in propylene glycol.  In aqueous solution diazepam is relatively stable at pH 4 - 8 with maximum stability at about pH 5.1,2  Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

 

http://www.pharminfotech.co.nz/manual/Formulation/mixtures/diazepam.html

 

Does this mean that 1mg of Diaz WILL turn into a solution with 20ml of water (1 / .05mg)?

  Well, yes.  But please note the last statement in my quote:

 

" Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

I would certainly choose to make (or use) a solution that starts with an established effective solvent.

[[ed...]]

 

 

Well, it works for Roxane Labs,  the US's largest manufacturer of liquid V!

 

Yes, it absolutely works, even for home-made liquid V.

 

Maybe your pharmacist should consult this manual that pharmacists use to mix liquid meds:

 

"Diazepam has a solubility in water of 0.05mg per mL; 41mg per mL in 95% ethanol and 17mg per mL in propylene glycol.  In aqueous solution diazepam is relatively stable at pH 4 - 8 with maximum stability at about pH 5.1,2  Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

 

http://www.pharminfotech.co.nz/manual/Formulation/mixtures/diazepam.html

 

Does this mean that 1mg of Diaz WILL turn into a solution with 20ml of water (1 / .05mg)?

  Well, yes.  But please note the last statement in my quote:

 

" Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

I would certainly choose to make (or use) a solution that starts with an established effective solvent.

 

I see. Yes, an ideal solution would certainly start with an established effective solvent. Though I'm just surprised by the fact that a solution can be made with water only.  Everything else I've read on BB has stated that water only serves as a suspension rather than as a solution. Interesting and good to know in a pinch. I can't tolerate even trace amounts of alcohol and my system rejected pharma grade LV. Just happy to know that on travels, I don't always have to be attached to a refrigerator/milk.

[[bu...]]

 

 

Well, it works for Roxane Labs,  the US's largest manufacturer of liquid V!

 

Yes, it absolutely works, even for home-made liquid V.

 

Maybe your pharmacist should consult this manual that pharmacists use to mix liquid meds:

 

"Diazepam has a solubility in water of 0.05mg per mL; 41mg per mL in 95% ethanol and 17mg per mL in propylene glycol.  In aqueous solution diazepam is relatively stable at pH 4 - 8 with maximum stability at about pH 5.1,2  Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

 

http://www.pharminfotech.co.nz/manual/Formulation/mixtures/diazepam.html

 

Does this mean that 1mg of Diaz WILL turn into a solution with 20ml of water (1 / .05mg)?

  Well, yes.  But please note the last statement in my quote:

 

" Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

I would certainly choose to make (or use) a solution that starts with an established effective solvent.

 

I see. Yes, an ideal solution would certainly start with an established effective solvent. Though I'm just surprised by the fact that a solution can be made with water only.  Everything else I've read on BB has stated that water only serves as a suspension rather than as a solution. Interesting and good to know in a pinch. I can't tolerate even trace amounts of alcohol and my system rejected pharma grade LV. Just happy to know that on travels, I don't always have to be attached to a refrigerator/milk.

 

 

You might want to do a google search on almost everything you read on any message board.  Youl'll note I often append a link or other documentation to many of my posts.

 

JMHO

[[...]]

Well, it works for Roxane Labs,  the US's largest manufacturer of liquid V!

 

Yes, it absolutely works, even for home-made liquid V.

 

Maybe your pharmacist should consult this manual that pharmacists use to mix liquid meds:

 

"Diazepam has a solubility in water of 0.05mg per mL; 41mg per mL in 95% ethanol and 17mg per mL in propylene glycol.  In aqueous solution diazepam is relatively stable at pH 4 - 8 with maximum stability at about pH 5.1,2  Stability and solubility is increased in mixed solvent systems of water, ethanol and propylene glycol."

 

 

http://www.pharminfotech.co.nz/manual/Formulation/mixtures/diazepam.html

 

Does this mean that 1mg of Diaz WILL turn into a solution with 20ml of water (1 / .05mg)?

 

That's the way I understand it. I plan on dissolving 2mg in 2ml of PG and adding 18ml of water. If I'm wrong on this, hopefully someone will correct me.

 

All good stuff.  I'll just add that since the solubility of V in water is .05mg/ml you need a bare minimum of 20ml to keep each mg dissolved.  That's 40ml to keep a 2mg tablet dissolved.  I'd recommend way overdoing that and using 100ml just to create an error margin.

[[ed...]]

So if all goes according to plan, I should be at an even 5mg of Diaz early next month. Since 8mg, I've pretty much always had a degree of chills or varying free floating anxiety.  I keep on going on (slowly) regardless. Does anyone have any thoughts on me chilling for 2 weeks and relaxing at 5mg as a 2/3 of the way off present to myself?

 

Do I risk running into problems with a 2 week hold?  The only reason I have any confidence in a hold is that there have been a couple of times over the past several months where I did a 3 day hold and it really allowed me to feel better (80-85%).

 

Thanks for your thoughts,

Ed

[[ba...]]

Ed, I think you've been very diligent and made great progress without lolly gagging  : my vote is that you give yourself that '2/3 prezzy.' Taking a brief respite at this point may even allow your brain body some time to catch up a smidgeon; ultimately, you might find you actually get OFF somewhat faster-and with less sxs!-by coming up for air soon.

 

One of the mods has a good tag line about "letting recovery come to you." I pushed through my first taper (a LITTLE info is a dangerous thing, sigh), and after I'd made significant inroads I totally crashed . Not that that's going to happen to you , but I think perhaps you've already intuited your need for a lil' vacay from tapering.

 

I had a feeling I should slow down at week 3 of following Ashton's rigid c/o schedule, but got a bit obsessed with charging ahead; a few days later I couldn't get outta bed, and had to take a few weeks off before starting over. You are sooo NOT clueless like moi i.e. don't be freaked out by MY miscues, please !

 

You're just doing so well, why not give yourself a break? Listen to that little voice, and you can pick up the pace again anytime . In the long run, you'll be out globetrotting before you know it, with a well-deserved coddle/prezzy that will give you the strength et al. to cross the finish line in good shape.

 

And congrats again on your taper thus far !

[[bu...]]

So if all goes according to plan, I should be at an even 5mg of Diaz early next month. Since 8mg, I've pretty much always had a degree of chills or varying free floating anxiety.  I keep on going on (slowly) regardless. Does anyone have any thoughts on me chilling for 2 weeks and relaxing at 5mg as a 2/3 of the way off present to myself?

 

Do I risk running into problems with a 2 week hold? The only reason I have any confidence in a hold is that there have been a couple of times over the past several months where I did a 3 day hold and it really allowed me to feel better (80-85%).

 

Thanks for your thoughts,

Ed

  No, a 2 week hold will not cause any problems at all. 

 

I did several 2-4 week holds to accomodate travel plans and had no problems.

[[...]]

Since I've reached 3,75 mg of diazepam, (On bad days)  I've started having trouble breathing! I can't seem to be able to breath deeply thru Lungs have be checked out several times. and naturally they can't find anything!! I've been on hold for over a month now. hoping that if I stabilize this may go away ?? Has anyone had this type of WD sxs, and is it normal??

 

[[Ki...]]

Maybe thats an adaptation both up and downwards? Thats around the same point I was at when I started having trouble breathing but I was switching from xanax and going up on valium. I dont know why, but it stopped after about 2 weeks. I cant see why it would do it going down but then again nobody could figure out why it did it to me going up either... I hope you get some good advice on that.

[[Mo...]]

Since I've reached 3,75 mg of diazepam, (On bad days)  I've started having trouble breathing! I can't seem to be able to breath deeply thru Lungs have be checked out several times. and naturally they can't find anything!! I've been on hold for over a month now. hoping that if I stabilize this may go away ?? Has anyone had this type of WD sxs, and is it normal??

 

Air hunger is something not that uncommon ;I've read it often. At some point in my taper I had it ,too.

I felt I couldn't get enough air and sometimes had to stand up to feel I could get more air.

 

What helped was doing the yoga pose called " child pose ". Just google it for images. It helped me feel I was breathing better in that position. ( I'm not doing yoga at all but someone on here recommended this pose and I tried it. It seemed to give me more air for the time being )

Anyway, it can't hurt.. And it's not difficult.

 

For me it went away eventually, I don't recall how long but it didn't stay that long. A few weeks?

 

Maybe if you do a search on " air hunger " on here ?

 

I hope,you'll feel better soon.

[[Ho...]]

Since I've reached 3,75 mg of diazepam, (On bad days)  I've started having trouble breathing! I can't seem to be able to breath deeply thru Lungs have be checked out several times. and naturally they can't find anything!! I've been on hold for over a month now. hoping that if I stabilize this may go away ?? Has anyone had this type of WD sxs, and is it normal??

 

I had this symptom very badly with Xanax during interdose withdrawals. Now that I've crossed over and tapering from Valium I get it off and on throughout the day, depending where I am in my cut cycle. But it's much milder than what I experienced on Xanax. Anyway, I think it's a pretty normal withdrawal symptom. One of the more scary ones I think.

[[...]]

This whole WD thing started when I was on Tavor 4.0 mg( Lorazepam ) for over a year. Because of the short half life of Tavor, switched to Valium/Diazepam 40 mg. It was supposed to be easier to get off of Actually, it was until I got to 5mg, then all these strange side affect started happening!! It seems that I've come full circle, and I am having the same side affect that I was having on Tavor!! I'm still holding to see if maybe I will stabilize??? But, I just want to get off this stuff, and start healing!!

 

Thanks for the responses, it is really nice to be associated with a good support group that is going thru the same things you are!! After trying over 20 Doctors, I've given up on them!! They really don't know how to handle this type of WD!!

 

Take care and hope to read your success stories soon.

[[bu...]]

This whole WD thing started when I was on Tavor 4.0 mg( Lorazepam ) for over a year. Because of the short half life of Tavor, switched to Valium/Diazepam 40 mg. It was supposed to be easier to get off of Actually, it was until I got to 5mg, then all these strange side affect started happening!! It seems that I've come full circle, and I am having the same side affect that I was having on Tavor!! I'm still holding to see if maybe I will stabilize??? But, I just want to get off this stuff, and start healing!!

 

Thanks for the responses, it is really nice to be associated with a good support group that is going thru the same things you are!! After trying over 20 Doctors, I've given up on them!! They really don't know how to handle this type of WD!!

 

Take care and hope to read your success stories soon.

  You started healing when you made your first reduction.

[Guest [ch...]]

dvd, what you are experiencing is the same thing I noticed. My taper goes completely smooth, no symptoms, until I get to a low amount and then the symptoms appear. I'd recommend holding at 5mg for a while and hopefully the symptoms will subside. Then do the rest of it 5=>0 very slowly. Best wishes and good luck!

Love,

Chessplayer

[[Va...]]

This whole WD thing started when I was on Tavor 4.0 mg( Lorazepam ) for over a year. Because of the short half life of Tavor, switched to Valium/Diazepam 40 mg. It was supposed to be easier to get off of Actually, it was until I got to 5mg, then all these strange side affect started happening!! It seems that I've come full circle, and I am having the same side affect that I was having on Tavor!! I'm still holding to see if maybe I will stabilize??? But, I just want to get off this stuff, and start healing!!

 

Thanks for the responses, it is really nice to be associated with a good support group that is going thru the same things you are!! After trying over 20 Doctors, I've given up on them!! They really don't know how to handle this type of WD!!

 

Take care and hope to read your success stories soon.

  You started healing when you made your first reduction.

[[ed...]]

dvd, what you are experiencing is the same thing I noticed. My taper goes completely smooth, no symptoms, until I get to a low amount and then the symptoms appear. I'd recommend holding at 5mg for a while and hopefully the symptoms will subside. Then do the rest of it 5=>0 very slowly. Best wishes and good luck!

Love,

Chessplayer

 

Slowly?  You went from 6mg to 3.5mg in 3 weeks! I WISH I could do slowly at that pace. 

[Guest [ch...]]

Guilty as charged

 

I tapered fast as long as symptoms did not appear. I had no symptoms at all down to ~3.5mg.

Once symptoms appeared, I slowed the taper down.

 

I recommended to dvd that she slow down at 5mg because she said she started experiencing symptoms at that point.

 

Chessplayer

[[ed...]]

Guilty as charged

 

I tapered fast as long as symptoms did not appear. I had no symptoms at all down to ~3.5mg.

Once symptoms appeared, I slowed the taper down.

 

I recommended to dvd that she slow down at 5mg because she said she started experiencing symptoms at that point.

 

Chessplayer

 

Yeah, I was just goofing around with you. I'm getting hit pretty hard just north of 5mg myself. So strange because only 3 days ago I was counting on being at an even 5mg and holding in just under a week. Now I'm in holding pattern at an odd dosage. So frustrating, no to mention emotionally/physically difficult right now.  I never knew I could be so cold in my own skin.

[[Ki...]]

Before I knew about these things I was self tapering from about .75x and 5 ambien- in a 4-5 mo period I was down to just guessing .10 x and 2 ambien and my whole world fell apart one day. No notice either, everything was awesome. I had taken CoQ 10 that morning and thought it was that. I didnt sleep for a week and hallucinated all the time, I really thought I was dying. After a USELESS doctor visit I took .75 X and 5 mg ambien just so I could sleep and the world was my friend again. Until I got on here I never knew I went into withdrawals. Benzos alone are bad enough but benzos without education are REALLY bad.

[[Mo...]]

Guilty as charged

 

I tapered fast as long as symptoms did not appear. I had no symptoms at all down to ~3.5mg.

Once symptoms appeared, I slowed the taper down.

 

I recommended to dvd that she slow down at 5mg because she said she started experiencing symptoms at that point.

 

Chessplayer

 

Yeah, I was just goofing around with you. I'm getting hit pretty hard just north of 5mg myself. So strange because only 3 days ago I was counting on being at an even 5mg and holding in just under a week. Now I'm in holding pattern at an odd dosage. So frustrating, no to mention emotionally/physically difficult right now.  I never knew I could be so cold in my own skin.

 

Ed, when I was int he midst of tapering it was 98 degrees outside and I was shivering under a duvet.

I got a heating throw , similar To this one

http://www.amazon.com/Sunbeam-Microplush-Heated-Throw-TSM8US-R788-32A00/dp/B008BF2SRE/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1459452984&sr=8-10&keywords=Heating+throws

 

Man! That helped. I could just lay on the couch and have this blanket one me or around my shoulders and tummy and get warm all the way through. I could not get warm on my own.

I also used it on top of my duvet for 10 minutes before bed.

 

Just sharing a little something that worked for me..

 

[[Ho...]]

Guilty as charged

 

I tapered fast as long as symptoms did not appear. I had no symptoms at all down to ~3.5mg.

Once symptoms appeared, I slowed the taper down.

 

I recommended to dvd that she slow down at 5mg because she said she started experiencing symptoms at that point.

 

Chessplayer

 

Yeah, I was just goofing around with you. I'm getting hit pretty hard just north of 5mg myself. So strange because only 3 days ago I was counting on being at an even 5mg and holding in just under a week. Now I'm in holding pattern at an odd dosage. So frustrating, no to mention emotionally/physically difficult right now.  I never knew I could be so cold in my own skin.

 

Ed, when I was int he midst of tapering it was 98 degrees outside and I was shivering under a duvet.

I got a heating throw , similar To this one

http://www.amazon.com/Sunbeam-Microplush-Heated-Throw-TSM8US-R788-32A00/dp/B008BF2SRE/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1459452984&sr=8-10&keywords=Heating+throws

 

Man! That helped. I could just lay on the couch and have this blanket one me or around my shoulders and tummy and get warm all the way through. I could not get warm on my own.

I also used it on top of my duvet for 10 minutes before bed.

 

Just sharing a little something that worked for me..

 

Ooh I need the blanket.  Chills have plagued me my entire taper so far.  I've been wondering if I'll be the only person in the world wearing fleece pajamas to bed all summer.

[[Mo...]]

Guilty as charged

 

I tapered fast as long as symptoms did not appear. I had no symptoms at all down to ~3.5mg.

Once symptoms appeared, I slowed the taper down.

 

I recommended to dvd that she slow down at 5mg because she said she started experiencing symptoms at that point.

 

Chessplayer

 

Yeah, I was just goofing around with you. I'm getting hit pretty hard just north of 5mg myself. So strange because only 3 days ago I was counting on being at an even 5mg and holding in just under a week. Now I'm in holding pattern at an odd dosage. So frustrating, no to mention emotionally/physically difficult right now.  I never knew I could be so cold in my own skin.

 

Ed, when I was int he midst of tapering it was 98 degrees outside and I was shivering under a duvet.

I got a heating throw , similar To this one

http://www.amazon.com/Sunbeam-Microplush-Heated-Throw-TSM8US-R788-32A00/dp/B008BF2SRE/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1459452984&sr=8-10&keywords=Heating+throws

 

Man! That helped. I could just lay on the couch and have this blanket one me or around my shoulders and tummy and get warm all the way through. I could not get warm on my own.

I also used it on top of my duvet for 10 minutes before bed.

 

Just sharing a little something that worked for me..

 

Ooh I need the blanket.  Chills have plagued me my entire taper so far.  I've been wondering if I'll be the only person in the world wearing fleece pajamas to bed all summer.

 

Ohhhh..no. You're not the only one. I was shivering and cold all the time. Even when it was hot out.

My extremities were feeling like I spent a few hours in the freezer and I couldn't get warm.

 

Sometimes I was hot and cold alternatively and felt like those chills you get when sick. But never a temperature.

 

This blanket is awesome. I don't have the exact same one but comes down to the same thing. It has three settings and after having it on high for a few minutes , it's warm enough to put it to low setting and stay warm. It was like slipping into a warm bath...

[[Ho...]]

Guilty as charged

 

I tapered fast as long as symptoms did not appear. I had no symptoms at all down to ~3.5mg.

Once symptoms appeared, I slowed the taper down.

 

I recommended to dvd that she slow down at 5mg because she said she started experiencing symptoms at that point.

 

Chessplayer

 

Yeah, I was just goofing around with you. I'm getting hit pretty hard just north of 5mg myself. So strange because only 3 days ago I was counting on being at an even 5mg and holding in just under a week. Now I'm in holding pattern at an odd dosage. So frustrating, no to mention emotionally/physically difficult right now.  I never knew I could be so cold in my own skin.

 

Ed, when I was int he midst of tapering it was 98 degrees outside and I was shivering under a duvet.

I got a heating throw , similar To this one

http://www.amazon.com/Sunbeam-Microplush-Heated-Throw-TSM8US-R788-32A00/dp/B008BF2SRE/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1459452984&sr=8-10&keywords=Heating+throws

 

Man! That helped. I could just lay on the couch and have this blanket one me or around my shoulders and tummy and get warm all the way through. I could not get warm on my own.

I also used it on top of my duvet for 10 minutes before bed.

 

Just sharing a little something that worked for me..

 

Ooh I need the blanket.  Chills have plagued me my entire taper so far.  I've been wondering if I'll be the only person in the world wearing fleece pajamas to bed all summer.

 

Ohhhh..no. You're not the only one. I was shivering and cold all the time. Even when it was hot out.

My extremities were feeling like I spent a few hours in the freezer and I couldn't get warm.

 

Sometimes I was hot and cold alternatively and felt like those chills you get when sick. But never a temperature.

 

This blanket is awesome. I don't have the exact same one but comes down to the same thing. It has three settings and after having it on high for a few minutes , it's warm enough to put it to low setting and stay warm. It was like slipping into a warm bath...

 

Thanks, Moodle.  I'm going to get one