Tenacious Tinnitus Club – Ear Pressure, Noise and Hyperacusis

[[Dr...]]

Ativan Side Effects

 

Serious:

Irregular or fast heartbeat

Difficulty swallowing or breathing

Fever

 

Are you sure you want to use this to treat a heart attack? Especially if it takes an hour or more to begin to act. 

[[do...]]

Why would tinnitus get louder after supper and until I go to bed?

[[xe...]]

Why would tinnitus get louder after supper and until I go to bed?

 

can you make it louder by moving your jaw around or jutting it forward? If there's jaw involvement, then seeing it get worse from eating wouldn't be unusual. Additionally, what you're eating could factor in; sugary drinks for example seem to set mine off.

 

Past a point though there's no real rhyme or reason to it, and even if it's a jaw thing, knowing that isn't helpful unless you're going to be extreme and switch to a liquid diet.

 

I was enthusiastic about 'liquid diet' until I found out that it didn't mean just living off of beer :-p

[[ih...]]

I had hyperacusis for the first half of withdrawal but not so much tinnitus. The tinnitus kicked in after a bad flu earlier this year, it's loud & high pitched with the occasional siren level surge.

 

Accamprosate does treat it but it's a very unfun med, (gives me constant acid reflux & gastro discomfort.)

 

I'm hoping it will eventually go away again.

 

[[ba...]]

i walked earlier just half a mile that little ammount seemed to do alot for me relieving some of the tinnitus sensitivity to lights &  some benzo withdrawals , i always feel my worsts in the evenings, tonights a good night so far

[[Bi...]]

Ativan Side Effects

 

Serious:

Irregular or fast heartbeat

Difficulty swallowing or breathing

Fever

 

Are you sure you want to use this to treat a heart attack? Especially if it takes an hour or more to begin to act. 

 

I works. When your having a heart attack and you get to the ER the first words you will usually hear is  "10MG ATIVAN PUSH"  then they sick a 6" long needle in your heart with 10mg Ativan in it.  We often go to very remote places where we can't get to a hospital fast.  It could save a life having it handy.  I cringe at he thought of having this crap in my body again BUT one dose will probably not hurt, Beats death.\

 

Also I have an endoscope every few years and they use some kind of benzo I never heard of.  Can't seem to get away from it   But even Ashton says one time use for medical procedures is OK.

[[Bi...]]

I had hyperacusis for the first half of withdrawal but not so much tinnitus. The tinnitus kicked in after a bad flu earlier this year, it's loud & high pitched with the occasional siren level surge.

 

Accamprosate does treat it but it's a very unfun med, (gives me constant acid reflux & gastro discomfort.)

 

I'm hoping it will eventually go away again.

 

Hi Ihope, I just have a flu with high fever a few months ago and I swear it felt like cold turkey to me!  It was SO weird.  I was convinced that our brains must be inflamed in B/W just like we have a fever or something.  They felt so similar and the tinnitus was SCREAMING!  I took aspirin to lower the fever and the tinnitus come down to, very profound effect.  Anti inflammatory's work but they kill your Kidneys.

[[Bi...]]

Why would tinnitus get louder after supper and until I go to bed?

 

can you make it louder by moving your jaw around or jutting it forward? If there's jaw involvement, then seeing it get worse from eating wouldn't be unusual. Additionally, what you're eating could factor in; sugary drinks for example seem to set mine off.

 

Past a point though there's no real rhyme or reason to it, and even if it's a jaw thing, knowing that isn't helpful unless you're going to be extreme and switch to a liquid diet.

 

I was enthusiastic about 'liquid diet' until I found out that it didn't mean just living off of beer :-p

 

Yes that's called MODULATION of Tinnitus.  Here's something I tried.  If I take my hand and push on my forehead real hard my tinnitus SCREAMS, but if I keep pushing the tinnitus gets lower and lower and when I stop it's very low and slowly comes back. What's that all about?  Can we use it to help our selves?  If you see a girl Blonde girl pushing on her forehead one Sunday morning in Cesare's Palace that would be me

[[Dr...]]

I love this. All the talk about pushing the forehead and stretching the jaws etc. I though I was the only person doing these nutty things. Have you also noticed that if you roll your head around to stretch and loosen the neck muscles in certain positions the T will also get louder. But I have noticed that the basic "Bed" of the T is always the same. All of these other things only add another sine wave. For me it is almost always on the left side. Doesn't matter which way I push the skin on the forehead. Or which way I turn my head the sine wave is always on the left. Oh yes, and when I push the skin of the forehead AND open my jaw real wide the volume gets even louder.

Ain't this fun?

[[Ne...]]

Ativan Side Effects

 

Serious:

Irregular or fast heartbeat

Difficulty swallowing or breathing

Fever

 

Are you sure you want to use this to treat a heart attack? Especially if it takes an hour or more to begin to act. 

I am just a physician but I would like to know what E.R. treats cardiac issues with a 10 mg Ativan push. We do use 4 mgs by push for seizures.

[[do...]]

Has anyone investigated the link between tmj and tinnitus?

[[Bi...]]

i walked earlier just half a mile that little ammount seemed to do alot for me relieving some of the tinnitus sensitivity to lights &  some benzo withdrawals , i always feel my worsts in the evenings, tonights a good night so far

 

Me too, I think it's when the glutamate level's rise the highest.  They say taking an afternoon nap can help big time for those evening surges.

[[Bi...]]

Why would tinnitus get louder after supper and until I go to bed?

 

Me too evening is the worst.

[[Bi...]]

I love this. All the talk about pushing the forehead and stretching the jaws etc. I though I was the only person doing these nutty things. Have you also noticed that if you roll your head around to stretch and loosen the neck muscles in certain positions the T will also get louder. But I have noticed that the basic "Bed" of the T is always the same. All of these other things only add another sine wave. For me it is almost always on the left side. Doesn't matter which way I push the skin on the forehead. Or which way I turn my head the sine wave is always on the left. Oh yes, and when I push the skin of the forehead AND open my jaw real wide the volume gets even louder.

Ain't this fun?

  yah,  Tinnutis is like trip alarm, it's a VERY sensitive system by nature and I think about 6 other systems all combine in inferior colliculus.  Modulating my Tinnitus give me a strange sense of relief as it's makes me feel in control 

[[xe...]]

Has anyone investigated the link between tmj and tinnitus?

 

there is a well documented link, but it's a lot less clear how/why it happens. Certainly, TMJ puts your jaw joint under a ton of stress, and the auditory canal is directly behind that joint -- but whether it's a neuromuscular thing or a brain thing or just nerve compression, I have not been able to discern.

 

Things which relax the muscles around my jaw do have some impact on the degree or intrusiveness of my ringing... and I have long thought that was why benzos seemed to help my ringing.

[[Bi...]]

Ativan Side Effects

 

Serious:

Irregular or fast heartbeat

Difficulty swallowing or breathing

Fever

 

Are you sure you want to use this to treat a heart attack? Especially if it takes an hour or more to begin to act. 

I am just a physician but I would like to know what E.R. treats cardiac issues with a 10 mg Ativan push. We do use 4 mgs by push for seizures.

 

It's just something I heard a long time ago from a member here.  Does that sound like a heaping dose Doc?  I'm not planning on sticking a syringe into my heart any time soon so I digress   

 

4mg ativan does not have much effect on me, feels like a few stiff drinks is all so I wonder if 4mg would stop a seizure in me?  10mg makes me super sleepy but still not much effect.  Sometimes I really think years of heavy drinking changed my brain somehow.  Even when I was on 9mg I could still drink whiskey and it had little effect. Looking back on those days make me so frightened now, I could have killed myself!

 

Gaba drugs never had much effect on me BUT quitting them was SO brutal!!  I wonder if that tells any kind of story about my brain?  I too believed I was born Ativan deficient, I really did. I felt more normal on it then off it thinking back.  It's been years now that I felt normal at all so I have lost my prospective probably.

 

I am getting close to cutting 20% of my oxy and it's a piece of cake. Some extra joint pain and that's it. This benzo crap is so much more addictive and it robs our ability fight it mentally which is the worst part.  With the oxy detox you still have your mind to help you put up a wall and fight, the benzo takes even that mental power away from us at times.  This is a tough drug to beat.

 

[[Bi...]]

Has anyone investigated the link between tmj and tinnitus?

 

there is a well documented link, but it's a lot less clear how/why it happens. Certainly, TMJ puts your jaw joint under a ton of stress, and the auditory canal is directly behind that joint -- but whether it's a neuromuscular thing or a brain thing or just nerve compression, I have not been able to discern.

 

Things which relax the muscles around my jaw do have some impact on the degree or intrusiveness of my ringing... and I have long thought that was why benzos seemed to help my ringing.

 

That's why my doc put me on Baclofen. He said my neck and jaw muscles where like stones.  Now they are soft and relaxed. When I would open my mouth before it sounded like 100 dry sticks snapping, pop, pop, pop, crack,  TMJ??  I wonder if it's that simple?

[[xe...]]

Interesting. My ENT didn't want to give me baclofen because she said it's a very strong drug, has a long list of adverse effects, and she also thought it was "benzo-like" enough that it would cause me the same problems if I took it long term. So, to the extent it works, it's working in a manner somewhat similar to benzos -- GABA mediated muscle relaxation. I know that it binds to GABAb sites instead of GABAa which prevents (or at least mediates) the degree to which it's cross tolerant with benzos... but the same is true of Phenibut, and we've seen a lot of horror stories about that stuff on here, as well. I have also long suspected that the reason Klonopin was so much harder for me to withdraw from than Diazepam is because Klonopin exerts both GABAa and GABAb activity.

 

How often do you take it? Have you noted any impact on your taper? I wouldn't be opposed to trying it some time, very sparingly, but after getting an earful about how dangerous it can be from a doctor I trust, I sort of lost interest.

[[Dr...]]

I have yet to find a doctor I trust.

[[Bi...]]

Interesting. My ENT didn't want to give me baclofen because she said it's a very strong drug, has a long list of adverse effects, and she also thought it was "benzo-like" enough that it would cause me the same problems if I took it long term. So, to the extent it works, it's working in a manner somewhat similar to benzos -- GABA mediated muscle relaxation. I know that it binds to GABAb sites instead of GABAa which prevents (or at least mediates) the degree to which it's cross tolerant with benzos... but the same is true of Phenibut, and we've seen a lot of horror stories about that stuff on here, as well. I have also long suspected that the reason Klonopin was so much harder for me to withdraw from than Diazepam is because Klonopin exerts both GABAa and GABAb activity.

 

How often do you take it? Have you noted any impact on your taper? I wouldn't be opposed to trying it some time, very sparingly, but after getting an earful about how dangerous it can be from a doctor I trust, I sort of lost interest.

 

Well the first thing that scares me about baclofen is that people rarely become tolerant to it.  In my books that could mean stronger addiction but I have no experience withdrawing from it yet. Also the French guy with that book "THE END OF MY ADDICTION" has no plans to ever come off and he is on 200mg for the past 5 years so I have to wonder if it's going to be bad w/d - As far as it working I felt good when I hit the right dose (65mg a day)  there is not sign of tolerance yet which is typical.  As DOC says I feel like I was born baclofen deficient 

 

As far as phenibut it's really complex as at doses over 2 gram a day it hits both gabaA and GabaB sites making a taper difficult has at some lower level in the taper the gabaA is suddenly cut off and your go into a benxo like hell.  If one is very careful to go extra slow at the key moment the phenibut drops off the gabaA receptors a direct taper is possible but still brutal.  I know lot's of people that were on phenibut and our now on valium as it's a better choice.

 

I have looked at Baclopen blogs online and people either hate it or love it and have be on the same dose for 33 years some of them.  The SAME dose with no need to updose. In that way it's a whole lot more stable than a benzo.  Of coarse I'd like to be off all this stuff.  Right now I am tapering Oxycodone and it's very easy if done at a benzo taper speed.  I think the baclofen taper is going to be rougher. 

 

The baclofen did lower my tinnitus but it should not have, make's no sense BUT just maybe the TMJ theory makes sense AND the reason I say that is when I  modulate my tinnitus by twisting my jaw around like a SUPER big yawn it's a TOTAL MATCH to the frequency I hear in benzo withdrawal induced tinnitus!!  If i modulate my tinnitus by pushing on my forehead it's a new frequency SO maybe it's my jaw after all. It's the SAME sound! Coincidence? I do not think so.

Somewhere in this thread I remember someone named the exact condition and a moderator posted notes about it.  I believe there is a muscle that goes from the mouth up to the ear and parallels the auditory nerves.  If that muscle is in spasms we get tinnitus. I wonder?

 

 

[[pe...]]

Ativan Side Effects

 

Serious:

Irregular or fast heartbeat

Difficulty swallowing or breathing

Fever

 

Are you sure you want to use this to treat a heart attack? Especially if it takes an hour or more to begin to act. 

 

I works. When your having a heart attack and you get to the ER the first words you will usually hear is  "10MG ATIVAN PUSH"  then they sick a 6" long needle in your heart with 10mg Ativan in it.  We often go to very remote places where we can't get to a hospital fast.  It could save a life having it handy.  I cringe at he thought of having this crap in my body again BUT one dose will probably not hurt, Beats death.\

 

Also I have an endoscope every few years and they use some kind of benzo I never heard of.  Can't seem to get away from it   But even Ashton says one time use for medical procedures is OK.

 

Hey bird, just wanted to let you know that I had a minor surgical procedure and I told the doctor that I did not want any benzos.  They ended up using propofol instead, which worked well for me.

[[Bi...]]

Ativan Side Effects

 

Serious:

Irregular or fast heartbeat

Difficulty swallowing or breathing

Fever

 

Are you sure you want to use this to treat a heart attack? Especially if it takes an hour or more to begin to act. 

 

I works. When your having a heart attack and you get to the ER the first words you will usually hear is  "10MG ATIVAN PUSH"  then they sick a 6" long needle in your heart with 10mg Ativan in it.  We often go to very remote places where we can't get to a hospital fast.  It could save a life having it handy.  I cringe at he thought of having this crap in my body again BUT one dose will probably not hurt, Beats death.\

 

Also I have an endoscope every few years and they use some kind of benzo I never heard of.  Can't seem to get away from it   But even Ashton says one time use for medical procedures is OK.

 

Hey bird, just wanted to let you know that I had a minor surgical procedure and I told the doctor that I did not want any benzos.  They ended up using propofol instead, which worked well for me.

 

Thanks PD,  I think baclofen is in the same catagory as propofol. I do not know if I screwed myself being on this drug now  

 

But it's a good idea thanks  

I do not go in until next year but I should be off by then (hopefully)  It's weird but when I hear the word propofol now the FIRST thing that pops into my brain is 'Micheal Jackson' and I get so panicky, talk about intrusive thoughts    

[[xe...]]

The baclofen did lower my tinnitus but it should not have, make's no sense BUT just maybe the TMJ theory makes sense AND the reason I say that is when I  modulate my tinnitus by twisting my jaw around like a SUPER big yawn it's a TOTAL MATCH to the frequency I hear in benzo withdrawal induced tinnitus!!  If i modulate my tinnitus by pushing on my forehead it's a new frequency SO maybe it's my jaw after all. It's the SAME sound! Coincidence? I do not think so.

Somewhere in this thread I remember someone named the exact condition and a moderator posted notes about it.  I believe there is a muscle that goes from the mouth up to the ear and parallels the auditory nerves.  If that muscle is in spasms we get tinnitus. I wonder?

 

Well, several studies have found baclofen efficient for tinnitus:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3297816/

Although the lowest effective dose for clear suppression of tinnitus was 3 mg/kg, using the dose adjustment calculation employed by the FDA to calculate human equivalent doses (Regan-Shaw et al., 2007), this was approximately equivalent to 34.1 mg/day for a 70-kg adult. This is above the effective dose of 6–12 mg of l-baclofen reported by Fromm and Terrence (1987) for the treatment of trigeminal neuralgia but is lower than the twice daily 20 or 30 mg doses of racemic baclofen employed by Westerberg et al. (1996) in patients with tinnitus, which were the highest doses used in the second and third weeks of their study (in the first week they used 10 mg twice daily).

 

http://otago.ourarchive.ac.nz/handle/10523/2020

Baclofen alleviated tinnitus like behaviour with the best results achieved at the 5mg/kg dose

 

However, there are also some reports of it causing tinnitus:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24577148

The first case concerns a 60-year-old man who reported tinnitus when he reached a 180 mg/d dose of baclofen after 3 months of treatment. Tinnitus persisted until the dose was reduced to 90 mg/d....

The second case concerns a 45-year-old woman who presented with tinnitus when she reached a 210 mg/d dose of baclofen after 4 months of treatment. Tinnitus persisted until the dose was reduced to 60 mg/d....

HDB may be responsible for the occurrence of severe tinnitus, possibly in a dose-dependent manner. This appears to be coherent with the previously known involvement of GABA-B receptors in the pathophysiology of tinnitus.

[[Bi...]]

The baclofen did lower my tinnitus but it should not have, make's no sense BUT just maybe the TMJ theory makes sense AND the reason I say that is when I  modulate my tinnitus by twisting my jaw around like a SUPER big yawn it's a TOTAL MATCH to the frequency I hear in benzo withdrawal induced tinnitus!!  If i modulate my tinnitus by pushing on my forehead it's a new frequency SO maybe it's my jaw after all. It's the SAME sound! Coincidence? I do not think so.

Somewhere in this thread I remember someone named the exact condition and a moderator posted notes about it.  I believe there is a muscle that goes from the mouth up to the ear and parallels the auditory nerves.  If that muscle is in spasms we get tinnitus. I wonder?

 

Well, several studies have found baclofen efficient for tinnitus:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3297816/

Although the lowest effective dose for clear suppression of tinnitus was 3 mg/kg, using the dose adjustment calculation employed by the FDA to calculate human equivalent doses (Regan-Shaw et al., 2007), this was approximately equivalent to 34.1 mg/day for a 70-kg adult. This is above the effective dose of 6–12 mg of l-baclofen reported by Fromm and Terrence (1987) for the treatment of trigeminal neuralgia but is lower than the twice daily 20 or 30 mg doses of racemic baclofen employed by Westerberg et al. (1996) in patients with tinnitus, which were the highest doses used in the second and third weeks of their study (in the first week they used 10 mg twice daily).

 

http://otago.ourarchive.ac.nz/handle/10523/2020

Baclofen alleviated tinnitus like behaviour with the best results achieved at the 5mg/kg dose

 

However, there are also some reports of it causing tinnitus:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24577148

The first case concerns a 60-year-old man who reported tinnitus when he reached a 180 mg/d dose of baclofen after 3 months of treatment. Tinnitus persisted until the dose was reduced to 90 mg/d....

The second case concerns a 45-year-old woman who presented with tinnitus when she reached a 210 mg/d dose of baclofen after 4 months of treatment. Tinnitus persisted until the dose was reduced to 60 mg/d....

HDB may be responsible for the occurrence of severe tinnitus, possibly in a dose-dependent manner. This appears to be coherent with the previously known involvement of GABA-B receptors in the pathophysiology of tinnitus.

 

 

WOW, did not know there were two types of baclofen!!  Thanks X.

 

They say ONLY the L-baclofen works on the ears.  I wonder if my RX brand is higher in L-baclofen???

 

Found this:

 

Baclofen is available as an approved drug only in racemic form with about equal content of the two enantiomers. In the present paper we show that L-baclofen causes a considerable (40.7%) suppression of the amplitude of the second peak in the click-evoked response from the cochlear nucleus. Bipolar recordings from the external nucleus of the inferior colliculus showed that L-baclofen caused a reduction in the amplitude of three or four distinct peaks in this response. D-Baclofen had no detectable effect on the response from the cochlear nucleus, and had only a slight effect on one component of the response from the external nucleus of the inferior colliculus. The demonstrated effect of L-baclofen on excitation in the ascending auditory pathway indicates that this drug may be a potential treatment for hyperactive auditory disorders such as tinnitus and hyperacusis.

 

REF; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7747912

 

SO NOT ALL BACLOFEN works!!!  This is a major find X!

 

The baclofen brand I take is always from lioresal so I wonder if it has a higher L-baclofen content?  They say the D-baclofen has no effect on tinnitus or hyperacusis at all, very major find!!

 

Thanks X for making me aware of the two different enantiomers of baclofen, one that works on the ears and one that does not. This could be the reason results are so varied, I wonder how consistent they really are in L and D content manufactured by big pharma?

 

THANKS X  :smitten:

 

[[Ne...]]

 

Thanks PD,  I think baclofen is in the same catagory as propofol. I do not know if I screwed myself being on this drug now.

 

Dear Lisa, Baclofen is a derivative of GABA and is used to treat spasticity. It main use is as a muscle relaxant.

              Propofol is a short acting intravenous hypnotic anesthetic used for general anesthesia.

They are chemically unrelated and are not related.

Doc