need encouragement , depression high.

[[so...]]

Brief history for those who have not read my posts.  started clonazopam on april 23rd.  titrated thru 4 weeks up to .75 mg. day.  .75mg night given to me for restless leg syndrome.  I am on the .75mg. clonazopam and I take 5 to 10 mg, of oxycodone at nighttime for control of my Rls.  attempting to taper down on this from 10mg to 5 mg.  which I got away with last night, but  unfortunately I have to deal with this disease as well as the withdrawl from the clonazopam, so for the time being the oxy is necessary.    told my doctor,  I wanted off the benzo.s so she had me cut back .25 mg each week for 3 weeks. I include her in the uninformed withdrawl process of getting off of benzo's.  As of this coming tuesday I will have been holding for 2 weeks. at .75mg.    the first 2 weeks were ok, then the crap hit the fan, 2weeks ago tomorrow.  extreme depression , some anxiety.  Was hoping holding for 2 weeks would make things better, but seem to be as bad  or at least the same as when I started holding,  anyone got any encouragement for me.  Should I keep holding or  add in .25 mg and go back to 1mg. to see if my symptoms stabilize. then start titration more slowly... Again , was doing fine thur first 2 weeks, then it caught up with me.  If I hold what is consensus  I will stabilize the symptoms.    for if /when they do stabilize and I feel fairly good thru the day,  I have titration plan in place from .75mg, down , but don't dare start till I feel better.  If I am not going to feel better than I do now , can.;t imagine going thru next 10 weeks like this.  then the post period.  I am 61 years old and planning to retire soon.

 

[[la...]]

Hi, softtail. 

 

Sorry you're feeling poorly -- remember, it is temporary.  (I tell myself that temporary w/d discomfort is better than permanent addiction discomfort.)  And remember, these feelings of depression are the DRUGS.  They're not YOU; they're the DRUGS.

 

I'd hate to see you backtrack and increase the dose since you already paid the dues to make the cut the first time.  I guess that's a decision you'll wrestle with in days ahead; I'm certainly pulling for you in either case.  But let me share what may be evidence against increasing, based solely on my own experience...

 

I kept a detailed log of w/d symptoms early in my taper, and found that after each cut, I'd follow this pattern:  feel weird for a day or two, then feel great for about 7 days, then feel crappy.  It was a predictable 10-day cycle.  After a few of these cycles, I figured out that when I started to feel a bit crummy, it meant it was time to REDUCE the dose again.  The re-emergence of the withdrawal symptoms was due to my declining drug tolerance, and hence the reappearance of my old friend, Interdose Withdrawal.

 

One option to consider would be to make a very small cut and see if it changed things for the better.

 

I'm so envious of your upcoming retirement!  I'm 42 and have a very long way to go!

 

Good luck, and keep the depressed thoughts in perspective.  They're temporary, and you will feel better in the future.

[[Be...]]

Brief history for those who have not read my posts.   started clonazopam on april 23rd.  titrated thru 4 weeks up to .75 mg. day.  .75mg night given to me for restless leg syndrome.  I am on the .75mg. clonazopam and I take 5 to 10 mg, of oxycodone at nighttime for control of my Rls.  attempting to taper down on this from 10mg to 5 mg.   which I got away with last night, but  unfortunately I have to deal with this disease as well as the withdrawl from the clonazopam, so for the time being the oxy is necessary.    told my doctor,  I wanted off the benzo.s so she had me cut back .25 mg each week for 3 weeks. I include her in the uninformed withdrawl process of getting off of benzo's.  As of this coming tuesday I will have been holding for 2 weeks. at .75mg.    the first 2 weeks were ok, then the crap hit the fan, 2weeks ago tomorrow.  extreme depression , some anxiety.   Was hoping holding for 2 weeks would make things better, but seem to be as bad  or at least the same as when I started holding,   anyone got any encouragement for me.   Should I keep holding or  add in .25 mg and go back to 1mg. to see if my symptoms stabilize. then start titration more slowly... Again , was doing fine thur first 2 weeks, then it caught up with me.   If I hold what is consensus  I will stabilize the symptoms.    for if /when they do stabilize and I feel fairly good thru the day,   I have titration plan in place from .75mg, down , but don't dare start till I feel better.   If I am not going to feel better than I do now , can.;t imagine going thru next 10 weeks like this.   then the post period.   I am 61 years old and planning to retire soon.

 

 

Softtail -

 

I decided to taper because I was severely depressed, softtail.  It is one of the known side effects of being on benzos, as well as withdrawal.  It was hard to basically taper on faith that I would feel better later and then hang on but that did work for me.  I really didn't have the option of increasing my dose, though, so the decision was easy to make.  Not everyone feels better reinstating a previous dose but it is up to you whether to try it.  If you don't feel better at 1mg/ day, what then?  You'd still need to get off the drug, right?  BTW, stabilizing just means that you aren't deteriorating; you could still feel depressed and be stabilized enough to taper.  I wonder if your upcoming retirement could be a source of any of the depression?  Or is this something you are planning to really enjoy?  I was happy about it for about 2 weeks but then missed so much about my work life including my friends at work.  It can be a very tough life change IMO.

 

BTW, it can be quite a process for Colin to develop a schedule for you so if you don't know for sure the date you will start titrating or the amount you will be titrating from, it would be good to go back and amend your titration schedule request.  Just about everyone who tries titration loves it, if that's a word you can apply to anything to do with tapering off a drug. 

 

p.s.  Unless you have to taper off the oxy now, it's usually best to taper just one drug at a time.  Your sleep could well be affected when you are tapering the clono so staying at the same level of oxy at night should help with that.

 

 

[[sp...]]

Hi

I fast tapered off ativan under doctors instructions (had been on1mg for 8 months along with various antidepressants which I also came off at same time).  I had been having supposed panic attacks I now know was interdose w/d sxs from an antidepressant I had been on for some time.  Having come off the ativan I have sunk into big black holes off and on throughout the w/d process, but recently at 23 mths off, these are becoming less intense and not as long in duration.  I went through times of wanting to end it and feeling really low and sad, now im just sad I cant get on with my life but I really want to now! 

All I can say is trust me - that it does all pass and you have to just keep going until it gets easier. 

love Spring xx

[[Bl...]]

Softtail -

 

p.s.  Unless you have to taper off the oxy now, it's usually best to taper just one drug at a time.  Your sleep could well be affected when you are tapering the clono so staying at the same level of oxy at night should help with that.

 

The opiates on top of the klonopin make the depression seem a lot worse. You mention that you take from 5-10mg of oxycodone a night.  I would stay with one dosage and not switch between the two.  The oxycodone, opiates, mess with your dopamine levels, which directly affect your moods.  I learned this the hard way.  I used to take various opiates for pain.  I did not know enough about the addiction and side effects of taking them.  They can cause insomnia, as well as the klonopin withdrawal.  If you have/get bad insomnia, you may want to try taking the oxycodone in the morning, so it will wear off a bit by night when you need to sleep.  Some opiates are time-release pills and can not be cut in half. If you split time-release opiate pills, you run the risk of an overdose.  If you are splitting pills, you should call a pharmacist and make sure it is ok to split them.

 

As mentioned in a previous post, you do need to always remember that it is the drugs that are causing the depression.  Maybe write that on a big sheet of paper and stick it on your wall where you will see it often.  I was so 'impressed' at the severity of the depression when I was getting off the klonopin and fentanyl at the same time.  These drugs can really mess people up. 

 

Good Luck

[[so...]]

Beeper and blue ridge. 

 

I have Restless leg Syndrome.  that was the reason my neurologist started me out on the clonazopam,  to treat my rls.

You probably know little about this disease, but its an uncontrollable urge to move your legs.  I was on requip and that quit working after about 4 years.  thats how I started down this clonazopam road.    unfortunately , the Clonazopam probably helped as sleep aid, but did nothing for my symptoms. 

Since I had to get off the requip, I had to add in the oxycodone to relieve the rls symptoms    I take 7.5 mg. per night for relief.  thats it.  I slleep pretty well with this regimine,  But my mood swings during the day are all over the place .  Currently at 1mg per day clonazopam, and 300 mg wellbutrin , but depression is still very high. 

under care of psychiatrist,  who i want to get to have me taper off the clonazopam, but he is under the impression that the clonazopam is not my depression problem,    oh well ,

I tried to get back into forum to  get Colin to do a taper schedule for me down from 1 mg.  but site seems to be down .. Is it or am I looking in wrong place.

want to start titration after next Monday.

any feedback here.

[[ha...]]

I think Colin has been gone and is due back tomorrow.  I think he will have a back-log, so be patient.

 

Many doctors don't think that benzos cause depression.  They are wrong.  I was never clinically depressed before I got on benzos.  And within 6 months of being on Klonopin I made a suicide attempt.  So, yes, benzos cause depression.

 

hawk

[[el...]]

Softail,

 

I was put on klon for severe chronic insomnia, and within a week or two I developed clinical depression. That stayed with me for the three or four months that I took it. It lifted about halfway though my taper and has never returned.

 

I had RLS too, quite badly two years ago from iron deficiency. (still have occasion bouts now and then, just to remind me how nasty it is.) I do know a lot about it, if you have any questions. If you need medication for relief, opiates are a good choice when the parkinsons drugs aren't an option. I"m glad you are getting some relief with the oxycodone.

 

I  pm'd you a website, not sure if you got it. http://www.rlshelp.org/. The site was a lifesaver fro me. The doctor there who runs the site actually recommends methadone in severe cases where nothing else has brought adequate relief.  

[[so...]]

eljay, good to hear from you on this subject.  I have idopathic rls, which means it was hereditary .  I was tested for iron and the range is from 26 to 319 or thats the numbers my gp said the range was i came in at 156.   

the rls is under very good control with the oxycodone.  more than I can say taking the 1mg of clonazopam.

I am all over the place with this ,  depression ,  I never had anxiety or insomnia in my life  .  Still don't really have insomnia, but did when my symptoms were real bad with the rls.    Now as I sit here writing , I am having trouble getting a deep breath,  I guess you would relate this to anxiety which for all I know was brought on by the clonazopam.  oddly enough the clonazopam was prescribed by neruologist for my rls,  Just the oxy and a good antidepressant probably would have done it.  The whole time I was titrated up on the clonazopam I was suffering depression , so I do believe there is an underlying problem beyond just the clonazopam, but do want off of it.

see my shrink next monday, and want to work with him on titrating off the stuff.

softtail

[[so...]]

saw the shrink on monday the 20th and he agreed to discontinue the clonazopam, but he believes it has nothing to do with my depression.  He has been practicing for a long time , and considered a very good shrink, but I don't believe he is at all up to date on how hard getting off benzo;s can be for some of us.  He told me to drop the 1mg dose out over just 1 week.  I told him I could not do this , cause I was very sensitive to its effects, so he agreed to let me do it at my own pace.  down to .9 mg as of today.

[[...]]

Softtail,

 

Congrats on titrating the first 10 percent.  You and I are titrating at the same rate. We are traveling the same windy road together.  You will be done before you know it.  Keep on truckin'.

 

Tim

[[so...]]

TC had any bad experiences yet at the 10% rate,  I did 10% for the first week and things are managable, but thought I would slow down to 1% per day to see if this little extra 3 day period would  reduce the chances of bad wd's.

you getting any increased symptoms since you got to .625.

 

[[...]]

Hello..hello...

 

The withdrwal symptoms have been fairly mild and they seem to come and go without any rhyme or reason.  I am down to .50 mg today and plan to slow my taper down a bit when i reach .25 mg.  At that point, I will probably slow down to 1 percent a day. 

 

At the beginning of my taper, I was unsure if 10 percent a week was too fast.  Some advised me that it was too fast, others that I could go faster.  I just sort of trail and errored it at 10 percent.  So far, so good.  I think 1 percent a day is still a pretty good clip...at seven percent a week.  Doesn't matter if you get off the drug in 10 weeks or 100 days, as long as you get off safely and have a soft landing.

 

How are things going for you so far, I saw you were down in the .8's now.

 

Tim

[[so...]]

hey Tc,  glad to hear you hit the half way mark,  you still titrating with water,  I am still using the milk , but get a bit ansy , only because I can't really see any of  the poison I remove , so I always wonder if I am really removing it.  I know alot of people have gone the milk route and actually indicate it suspends the particles better, but when you remove something you can't really see, its a bit tough  , and you just have to believe you are getting the right amount out.  So far the road has been pretty smooth.  last 2 days pretty mild.  down to 17 % tonight will hit 20% Sunday night.  motorcycle trip planned for next thursday thru Sunday,  thru virginia shanandoah valley and pennsylvania , gettysburg area,  hope 2 things happen.  one no rain.  its kinda crappy if you have to ride in the rain all day.  showers accepted, and second  , will be at the 25% mark by Thursday, so will hold at that level thru sunday, so I don't have to take the titration equipment with me.  Can cut the .75 mg of clono by hand for those 4 days.

keep me informed on how your doing under the .5mg mark.

John

[[mu...]]

Hi ST,

 

Glad the doctor is working with you.  I'm having a lot of depression with my w/d too. 

 

I had RLS for about six months when I was 31.  It coincided with a fibromyalgia/chronic fatigue flare up that last for a year.  My RLS happened at night when I was trying to sleep.  My sleep was really messed up and that was way before I started on benzos.  The RLS was no fun.  I didn't take anything for it and it eventually went away.

 

How is it I never heard of RLS until I had it and then I started hearing about it all the time?  Strange.

 

Hope you feel better!

 

Jane

[[Mi...]]

Hi ST,

 

Just wanted to send you a hug!

 

Missy

[[...]]

ST,

 

A motorcycle trip?  Man..that sounds fun.  I hope you have a great time on the trip.

 

I know what you mean about the milk vs. water titration.  I am still sticking with the water, but I think most people do use milk.  You seem to be doing really well.  We are going to be celebrating your halfway point in no time. 

 

Tim

[[so...]]

yea, looking forward to trip.  I am staying with the milk for now, since it seems to have worked for a number of people,  Just wish ,like I said , I could see some of those little particles go down the drain  and take my symptoms with it.